I've took painter to an event Sunday, and had a blast. The only thing I did differently is I ran 3 Firebolt, 1 Seal of Fire. It's not reusable, but it is tutorable. I liked it.
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Hey guys,
I currently have a fairly standard iPainter deck, but I generally play more casual matches (don't want to expend too money for a casual deck) and want to tweak the deck a bit. The blood moon strategy isn't too useful when playing casual matches, and I kind of want to weaken the deck a little. I thought about throwing in some Lightning Dragons because I like the art and because it's not a very good card.
I've also thought about putting in more than 1 welder and maybe throw in some tangle wire or something of that nature.
But I'm open to any suggestions, thanks.
If you wanna weaken the deck, get rid of the Moon effects?Originally Posted by Indent
Yes, I was thinking of substituting the moon effects with something else.
Take the discussion here and post a link.
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/f...d-Budget-Forum
You want to make the deck weaker but it's too similar to the other thread derailments of 'how can I build without recruiters'
This thread is for fine tuning optimal builds and testing for competitive events.
In short though, water down the combo or run a worse one like Kiki twin, run some bad recruiter targets for fun, and don't focus on locking your opponents out of the game
I placed 2nd in a 48 man tourney using this list:
4 Painter's Servant
4 Simian Spirit Guide
2 Magus of the Moon
2 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Jaya Ballard Task Mage
2 Koth of the Hammer
4 Grindstone
3 Sensei's Divining top
4 Blood Moon
3 Lightning Bolt
4 Pyroblast
2 Red Elemental Blast
10 Mountain
4 City of Traitors
4 Ancient Tomb
1 Blood stained Mire
1 Arid Mesa
1 Wooded Foothills
Sideboard
3 Ensnaring Bridge
2 Pyroclasm
1 Ratchet Bomb
1 Red Elemental Blast
4 Thorn of Amethyst
1 Mindbreak Trap
1 Manic Vandal
1 Vexing Shusher
1 Phyrexian Revoker
Match ups
Esper Stoneblade (win 2-0)
Sneak and Show (win 2-0)
Dredge (win 2-1)
Sneak and Show (loss 0-2)
Merfolk (draw)
Miracles (win 2-1)
Quarterfinals
Patriot (win 2-0)
Semifinals
Merfolk (win 2-1)
Finals
Elves (loss 0-2)
Nice one :) How did the 2 MB Koth behave? :)
I'm going to GP Paris next weekend. After seeing Seth an Kap'n do well with the deck at a SCG Open, I decided to give the white splash another shot. I did want to address the issues I had with it, namely the mana consistency. I think the white splash is really strong if you can consistently cast the white cards. It also gives you some great additional sideboard options.
I've taken the lists from Kap'n and Seth and took what I liked from each of them. I also added some white mana sources (6 fetch, 2 plateau and 3 petals). I really don't want to lock myself out of casting the awesome options I bring in - is it blasphemous to run 3 petal / 2 SSG? Petal has been great for me to cast white spells even with a blood moon out.
I really liked the RIP + Helm combo out of Seth's board. I'm gladly upgrading my Crypts to RiP (I didn't like the crypt that much anyway), and the alternate win-con is just one extra slot from there. I also cut a firebolt for an extra Thorn as I encounter a lot of Storm players over here. I chose to run the 3rd Thorn over a Trinisphere because I really want to be able to play it on turn 1.
This is what it currently looks like, anything I should consider changing?
// Creature (16)
2x Goblin Welder
4x Imperial Recruiter
1x Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
1x Magus of the Moon
4x Painter's Servant
2x Phyrexian Revoker
2x Simian Spirit Guide
// Artifact (11)
2x Ensnaring Bridge
4x Grindstone
3x Lotus Petal
2x Sensei's Divining Top
// Land (20)
4x Ancient Tomb
4x Arid Mesa
3x City of Traitors
1x Great Furnace
4x Mountain
2x Plateau
2x Scalding Tarn
// Instant (9)
3x Enlightened Tutor
4x Pyroblast
2x Red Elemental Blast
// Enchantment (4)
4x Blood Moon
// Sideboard (15)
1x Ensnaring Bridge
1x Ethersworn Canonist
3x Firebolt
1x Grafdigger's Cage
1x Helm of Obedience
1x Koth of the Hammer
1x Manic Vandal
3x Rest in Peace
3x Thorn of Amethyst
I ran 4 petal / 1 ssg on Sunday. I liked the extra petals given I ran 3 welders. 3/2 seems fine
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You forgot the 4 Imperial Recruiters :) Nice finish I was your 2nd round opponent lol
I might consider adding a basic Plains.
Currently playing:
Imperial Painter
One of the few Painter players in SoCal...
I don't think you need a basic plain. Only once over the past 16 rounds of sanctioned play did I need a white source with E tutor in hand. But I had a moon and was able to leverage that for the win. Once you practice with the deck you will get good at when to fetch, what to fetch, and when to slam moon. Against unknown opponent I will rarely play first turn moon anymore. I may cut the great furnace for a mountain. The last two times I played I always held my breath when I played it and passed the turn. Wasteland is everywhere and I lost my last 3/4 games due to wasteland on furnace. Too risky I think right now. Stabalizing the mana while allowing E tutor to function is most important. I don't feel that the minimal interactions with Welder are worth it. I only run two welders though.
More thoughts to follow and a report from the last event. Work has just been brutal.
Seth
…no matter how much you think you love somebody, you’ll step back when the pool of their blood edges up too close.
Anyone going to the GP this weekend? I'd like to discuss a few ideas with people attending.
Some of my friends sell records,
some of my friends sell drugs.
I'll be at the SSG Open in Somerset this weekend.
Simian Spirit Guide Open??? What's that? :O
So, I am new to this forum and have just caught myself up through the previous several pages. I am a long-time legacy player, best known for playing dredge, but this deck has interested me lately. I like the potential lock-outs and linear strategy. I just finished buying the deck (albeit with the foil I.R.'s and some other foil pieces, couldn't find originals anywhere). I'm noticing there is a lot of potential variation on the deck. I do really like the idea of the white version with a couple of tutors. I just have a couple questions:
1. Why not more petals instead of monkeys? this way you are more likely going to be able to play your tutors. Is it just the surprise factor of the monkey?
2. As for alternate win cons, I'm seeing Koth, stoneforge package, RIP/Helm combo and potentially lodestones. Some lists are playing multiples of these which seems like too much dilution. I like the idea of Koth as it gets around a bridge in play and it's a Planeswalker, so it's a little harder to deal with in legacy. But stoneforge and Helm combo are tutorable, which is nice. I like the idea of comboing off of a miracle player's RIP as well. I also noticed that the guy who T8ed the SCG only had one Koth in the SB, so is it even necessary?
3. What's the general thought on welder? In my little testing so far it seems really strong in response to removal of combo pieces. I'm currently running 3, which is more than most it seems. Just wondering why it's not more popular.
4. Any more ideas on the jund matchup? And how would anyone ever beat burn? Witchbane Orb?
5. bridge vs peacekeeper? replacing one bridge for the tutorable peacekeeper seems strong but wondering what people's experience has been? Too easy to get rid of? that would be my biggest concern.
6. 19 land and 5 extra mana sources the general consensus? Is it heresy to not play any monkeys, that is 20 land and 4 petals?
Thanks for your help. You guys seem to have invested a lot of time into the deck so I appreciate your feedback.
Well...
1) Personally, I think it's the respectable players own choice, how he runs the split. The good thing about SSG is, that it doesn't get countered (I don't know if this is why we play it). But for my own experience: The SSG provides the opportunity to make a red FoW :D
2) I can't really talk about the white version, since I only played it once and i thought it was horrible, but i'm gonna try out the Lodestone situation and i'll post results, when i've done some tourney's with them in a couple of weeks time :)
3) I've never been a fan of it, especially now, with so much -1/-1 around (Golgari Charm/Zealous persecution), but for sure, if you can build your deck, so you can protect the little goblin fella, his potential is as powerful as in some vintage decks :)
4) I'd say either Leylines in the SB or Thorn effects (maybe even Trinispheres). As long as you set them back a couple of turns, i would think, we'd have the advantage? :)
@drude1- SSG and petal are very close. The key is that sometimes he is a mana source, a shitty beater, a chump blocker, and tutorial at that. That is why some amount of them are needed. Goblin Welder is the strongest single card in the deck. It is sort of a role player for us but in terms of absolute power it is the only potential broken card in the deck. As a result you should run some. He invalidates counters, removal, or soaks up targeted removal to save your more important creatures. I will often times throw him out first bc good players know to fear him and if the Fow him then you know the coast is clear for painter and friends. I often times let people kill him and rarely protect him. Even though he is super strong you don't really need him.
Peacekeeper is there as a tutor able answer to elves, dredge, empty the warrens, and Eldrazi game one. Sometimes you can't dump your hand fast enough to hope bridge protects you there. She does however. I have always liked her, won many times bc of her, and she I'd easily sided out in games where she doesn't matter. RIP isn't so much an alternative win as the best graveyard hate you can play. I threw a singleton Helm in bc why not, and sometimes you can win with it. But RIP is important bc it murders dredge, reanimator, and allows you to ignore Eldrazi when going through the combo. Being able to E tutor inresponse to Cabal Therapy for it is especially satisfying.
I will say all I said about Lodestone is that it is an interesting idea. I made a post a while back about why tutoring for narrow hate is a bad strategy. Tutoring for RIP against graveyard decks is good bc if it sticks the game is over. Tutoring for a piece of disruption against storm is less good bc it slows them down but you decreased your speed, consistency, and didnt actually move yourself closer to victory. At least Golem is a credible threat and the ability to put pressure on storm and the like is nice. Not sure if he is worth it or fast enough though. As an aside, Wizards was super lame for printing such a dumb card. Mark Rosewater is an asshat.
Seth
…no matter how much you think you love somebody, you’ll step back when the pool of their blood edges up too close.
But Seth...
The beauty about the lodestone is that you get to cast the combo without penalty :D
That's not his point. The tutor you cast finding lodestone could have been used to find the other half of the combo is.
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