[Primer/Deck] Pox

[jredelstein]

How much red mana do i need for splash? I got myself four Bloodstained Mire and one Bloodcrypt. Add a mountain and that is six sources.

Depends on how many red spells you want to play and on what turns, I play 4 verdant, 2 misty, 4 bayou, 1 forest for my GB pox. I play 3 crop rotation 3 abrupt decay, 2 pernicious deed, 2 life from loam for main board green spells. I still sometimes have issues getting color screwed but I don't think I'd add another green source.

[Hardcore]

Thank you! I can use that and work from there.

[hpl324]

http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=16492&iddeck=123419

There are people who try this version ??

[OmniStrata]

http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=16492&iddeck=123419

There are people who try this version ??

Adachi's deck I took and hybridized with Reid Duke's old builds and ended up with a Lands Spells Pox. Empty the Pits is probably the strongest win con in a Pox that doesn't use the GY for anything and can clean out space for a 'clogged' Nether Spirit, but won't work in my Crucible deck since each land I bring back takes away from the zombie count. I guess he just makes the call and 'empties' when he knows the enemy will die in one strike?

[kombatkiwi]

I guess the idea is to use Crucible of Worlds and the high number of lands in order to enable the more powerful 4-drops, (Empty the Pits, the enchantments) but this is fairly at odds with the overall Pox strategy.

Only playing 2 Hymn to Tourach seems awful. 0 copies of Nether Spirit with 0 other creatures? 4 Thoughtseize and 0 Inquisition maindeck?

Beseech the Queen seems reasonable (especially with maindeck utility lands) but overall I think this is a sub-optimal list. Coming 46th in a 72 man event isn't exactly something to write home about.

[OmniStrata]

I guess the idea is to use Crucible of Worlds and the high number of lands in order to enable the more powerful 4-drops, (Empty the Pits, the enchantments) but this is fairly at odds with the overall Pox strategy.

Only playing 2 Hymn to Tourach seems awful. 0 copies of Nether Spirit with 0 other creatures? 4 Thoughtseize and 0 Inquisition maindeck?

Beseech the Queen seems reasonable (especially with maindeck utility lands) but overall I think this is a sub-optimal list. Coming 46th in a 72 man event isn't exactly something to write home about.

Yes, 2 Hymns is BLASPHEMOUS in Poxing strategy. It's the ultimate Card Advantage for 2 mana, I did experiment with a more LD form using Rancid Earth alongside Sinkhole and Wasteland but it just can't be beat. Nothing works better than a turn 2 Hymn and your foe has to Force of Will to save his precious hand. Daze is funnier cause I then do Sinkhole on Turn 3...

I do like the idea of the spell lands though and after testing the sexy Maze of Ith, I've never looked back. Cabal Pit with Maze of Ith and Crucible is true cruelty.

[Hardcore]

My latest decks have not been good at beating miracles. I suspect the reason could be moving away from chalice and towards therapy.
(1cc discard is not that great versus decks with blue cantrips.)

So, my latest build is therefore a chalice deck and the innovation is to run Dark Ritual instead of Chrome Mox.
While that may sound questionable, since the plan is to play chalice on one, the card loss of the mox ramp is worse. It is guaranteed, while the ritual is useful whenever there is no chalice in play.
Also, rituals help cast tombstalker, which is a creature that helps getting upper hand over decks playing decay, and sideboard cards like engineered plague.



4 Bloodghast
4 bloodsoaked champion
2 nether spirit
3 pack rat
3 tombstalker

4 Pox
4 smallpox
4 dark ritual
4 hymn to tourach
4 chalice of the void

15 swamp
4 bloodstained mire
1 blood crypt
1 urborg, tomb of yawgmoth
3 wasteland

[OmniStrata]

My latest decks have not been good at beating miracles. I suspect the reason could be moving away from chalice and towards therapy.
(1cc discard is not that great versus decks with blue cantrips.)

Things will shine brighter once you get that 4th Wasteland. The real reason Chalice has issue is because it's execution is like a combo deck really. [wait what?] Yes, if you do not have Chalice on turn 1-2 to 'Stompy' your opponent's early game spells, they become dead when you draw them late. Pox wants to play with cheap spells due to the sacrificial nature of Wasteland, Smallpox, Pox, etc. Chalice in Pox is working against you since you have Wastelands.

1cc discard is amazing vs. blue cantrips. You're still ripping them down one card since blue cantrips only replace themselves and 1cc discard still hits what you need it to hit. Hymn to Tourach and Smallpox are the ultimate Brainstorm killers. Even better when they try to hide their good cards only to get slapped by my 1-of Ghost Quarter or Extirpate.

My match with my friend's fully powered Miracles deck is now closer to even instead of lose. He has a different approach in that he runs 12+ counter spells on top of 3 SDT, 4 Counterbalance and no creatures.

[Hardcore]

he really should play four SDT.

[Hardcore]

Sorry for the brief reply, but it was late. I'll play today and will keep an eye on the interactions you discussed.

[OmniStrata]

he really should play four SDT.

I was thinking that too, but we've both discovered that there is such a thing as too many SDTs... When I ran Counterbalance as part of my Threshold deck a long time ago, I also ran with 3 SDT cause drawing multiple SDTs are time walks that jam the top of your library at the worst times.

Mono-B Pox can run just 1-2 SDT since it has no way to shuffle the top garbage away. Personally, I'd rather run one Crystal Ball.

[PirateKing]

I have a pretty 'standard' Pox deck that's been collecting dust that I'd like to take more seriously. Serious as in the inclusion of cards like Chains of Mephistopheles, The Abyss, Nether Void & The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale. For reference the list as it is right now:

11 Swamp
4 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Bojuka Bog
4 Mishra's Factory
4 Wasteland
4 Dark Ritual
4 Sinkhole
4 Smallpox
1 Pox
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Innocent Blood
4 Liliana of the Veil
4 Hymn to Tourach
3 Cursed Scroll
2 Nether Spirit
1 Trinisphere
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Toxic Deluge

Sideboard
3 Engineered Plague
3 Ratchet Bomb
2 Duress
3 Pithing Needle
4 Leyline of the Void

So beyond the obvious comparisons, like replacing Trinishpere with Nether Void and Toxic Deluge with The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale, I'm not familiar enough with these cards to correctly place them main deck or sideboard, especially since I anticipate having access to between 0 and 1 copies for reasons.
My first instinct would be to focus on Chains of Mephistopheles first, since the card is cheap and it's effect isn't easily replicated from other cards, but I may be wrong.
Looking for guidance and advice from those here who have experience in 'powered' Pox lists. Thanks

[beez]

That's serious as a heart attack. Most have Chains in the board but a few run it main. Most who have them run Nether Void and The Abyss in the main, but a few choose to run them out of the board depending on the matchup.

[Sara_Anderson]

I run 2 neither void main and 2 chains in the side. I got 33rd out of 151 at scgdfw this past weekend. My losses were to omni show. I feel like once I get a couple of the abyss for my sideboard my matchup will be better.

[Hardcore]

if they run omniscience nether void will screw them already, but for emrakul something like the abyss would be nice.
I recall getting a simple Thorn of Amethyst in play vs omniscience, and that was sweet:-)

[OmniStrata]

There's only 2 reasons you'd lose to a combo deck. I've fought Omni-Show, Sneak-show, ANT, and Dredge (this is the exception). I haven't fought TES yet but I look forward to it. I've only ever lost to dredge combo. I think Charbelcher might beat me, but turn 1 wins are highly unlikely in any case.

1. Your opening draw isn't 'fast disruption'. If you can't do something turn 1 to mess with their spells (1 cmc discard/Dark Ritual Trinisphere, etc.) then they decide to go-off turn 1, you're pretty much dead in the water without any way out.

2. You built your Pox deck with less than twelve 1 cmc spells. We need to be wrecking brains on turn 1-2. This equates to both bad luck and poor counter meta thinking. My meta always has combo decks. If you have so many spells that destroy hands (mind crushing Hymn to Tourachs off of Dark Rituals) then a combo deck really should be a bye auto-win for you.

Emrakul is a joke, unless he has haste or is 'hard-casted' with OmniScience. Innocent Blood, Smallpox, Pox, Liliana, Edicts, etc. Unless your enemy can cast 2+ creatures in a turn, you should be fine.

Granted, these are 'best case' scenarios but I'd also like to think they are the most likely since turn 1 da nutz just doesn't happen often enough. If they did, then everyone would just play turn 1 win decks and walk away with awards.

[OmniStrata]

if they run omniscience nether void will screw them already, but for emrakul something like the abyss would be nice.
I recall getting a simple Thorn of Amethyst in play vs omniscience, and that was sweet:-)

I don't run thorns, but I'd be dropping a Trinisphere/Nether Void for that Show & Tell. I'd also be laughing maniacally as their Omniscience gets reduced to shat

[Hardcore]

Right. Forgot about that manic laughter.

[Hardcore]

For the first time in ages i ran the same deck in two consecutive tournaments. A week ago
i entered with this one:
4 Bloodghast
4 bloodsoaked champion
2 nether spirit
3 pack rat
3 tombstalker

4 Pox
4 smallpox
4 dark ritual
4 hymn to tourach
1 wrench mind
4 chalice of the void

15 swamp
4 bloodstained mire
1 blood crypt
1 urborg, tomb of yawgmoth
3 wasteland

4 Leyline of the void
4 Engineered plague
4 Thorn of Amethyst
3 Ratchet Bomb


Because i didn't faced opponents that played cantrips the chalices were of marginal value. I lost horribly to reanimator. Partly because of inexperience i think.
Also it would have been nice with 1cc discard against it. (he forced my chalice)

Yesterday i picked up the deckbox, that had been on a shelf since last week, exchanged two chalice for engineered plague and went down town.

It worked better this time. I won first round vs burn by heavy poxing. The opponent got mana screwed. The second duel it didn't helped him at all that i played chalice on one.

i was happy with this good start for once, but next lost to a twelve post deck:-( Again. I shouldn't have that persistent problem really and need tune my build now.
Sure, he drew his candelabra both duels but since he could buy more of them there is no point entering games hoping he wont draw them.

i also defeated a goblin deck, partly thanks to main deck plague:-) (drew it as third card, iirc, first duel)

Lastly i lost to a GBW natural order deck. Annoying. Lots of counters messed up my game.

Changes should be small overall,
and i won't do all i am considering below.
Dark ritual have not been of much use. Actions like turn one plague have not been necessary.
Replacing rituals with lands would free up two slots.

Fleshbag Marauder would be nice against show and tell, which the twelve post use to get a titan in play.
It wouldn't be bad main deck either because of all the dudes i have that want to die for me.
I would replace the Pack Rats.

Lastly that 1cc i needed. Perhaps i should go for probe and therapy? (Again.)

[Hardcore]

I think contamination could replace chalice main deck.
For fun there is also Worms of the Earth to put into sideboard.