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Thread: [Primer/Deck] Burn

  1. #1541

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Bomat is the card advantage this deck needed. A winning list with it? You can also go up to 3 Searing Blaze in order to clear the path for additional sweetness

  2. #1542

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Quote Originally Posted by Poron View Post
    Bomat is the card advantage this deck needed. A winning list with it? You can also go up to 3 Searing Blaze in order to clear the path for additional sweetness
    After (now) 30 matches I really believe in Bomat. This is the list Im currently running:


    19 LANDS
    3 Barbarian Ring
    4 Bloodstained Mire
    9 Mountain
    3 Wooded Foothills

    18 CREATURES
    4 Bomat Courier
    4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
    4 Goblin Guide
    2 Grim Lavamancer
    4 Monastery Swiftspear

    23 INSTANTS and SORC.
    4 Chain Lightning
    4 Fireblast
    4 Lava Spike
    4 Lightning Bolt
    3 Price of Progress
    4 Rift Bolt

    Sideboard:

    (=> depends on your meta. I use this sideboard online. The 3 Sudden shock may seem strange, but so far Im happy. But my sideboard is a work in progress)

    3 Sudden shock
    4 Faerie Macabre
    2 Sulfuric Vortex
    4 smash to Sm.
    2 Pyrostatic Pillar


    today I lost against reanimator. he killed and reanimated my bomat, attacked me and drew 2 fresh cards while he discarded his Iona and reanimated it with his drawn cards

    another side effect: if you have to mulligan (for example to 4), a bomat is even stronger, because you empty your hand turn 2 and can refill turn 3 with 3 new cards! :-)
    Last edited by josch6083; 09-01-2018 at 04:09 PM.

  3. #1543
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    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Quote Originally Posted by Poron View Post
    Bomat is the card advantage this deck needed. A winning list with it? You can also go up to 3 Searing Blaze in order to clear the path for additional sweetness
    Card is awful. Burn doesn't need card advantage at all. The challenges this deck faces has nothing to do with card advantage. Bomat is the exact opposite of what this deck needs. The card may be good in some Grixis Delver lists, but it's not even close to what Burn wants to be doing.
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  4. #1544

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Quote Originally Posted by Hanni View Post
    Card is awful. Burn doesn't need card advantage at all. The challenges this deck faces has nothing to do with card advantage. Bomat is the exact opposite of what this deck needs. The card may be good in some Grixis Delver lists, but it's not even close to what Burn wants to be doing.
    Burn needs

    or or
    Instant
    The next time a big dumb thing is pooped onto opponent's battlefield, a lot of damage goes to that player's dome

  5. #1545
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    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Quote Originally Posted by Hanni View Post
    Card is awful. Burn doesn't need card advantage at all. The challenges this deck faces has nothing to do with card advantage. Bomat is the exact opposite of what this deck needs. The card may be good in some Grixis Delver lists, but it's not even close to what Burn wants to be doing.
    why not? burn hasn't put up any serious results in a long long time. it can't hurt to try. if he says he's putting up some okay results then it merits some testing. otherwise people are just playing the same deck that has been going on for around 5 years. at the worst, it goes back to that same old boring list.
    -rob

  6. #1546
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    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Quote Originally Posted by Hanni View Post
    Card is awful. Burn doesn't need card advantage at all. The challenges this deck faces has nothing to do with card advantage. Bomat is the exact opposite of what this deck needs. The card may be good in some Grixis Delver lists, but it's not even close to what Burn wants to be doing.
    This x1000. I was attempting to be gentle, but my post earlier said essentially the same thing. If you are bored with the most efficient damage-producing cards in mono-red burn, pick up another deck. That's what burn will always be.
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  7. #1547
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    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Quote Originally Posted by mistercakes View Post
    why not? burn hasn't put up any serious results in a long long time. it can't hurt to try. if he says he's putting up some okay results then it merits some testing. otherwise people are just playing the same deck that has been going on for around 5 years. at the worst, it goes back to that same old boring list.
    Burn will always be 'that boring old list'. If you want to try some synergies that have risk but also potentially better damage output (black vise, shrapnel blast, thunderous wrath) and a way to set them up, then go for it. But the principle is the same: the most damage for each mana/card you spend possible. Once you stray from that, no amount of outlier results will contradict it.
    I am counted amongst legions of the unrighteous
    who dread not being immersed in pits of fire

  8. #1548

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Nice feedback! For everyone who is against Bomat: I am pretty sure you never tried it. I played over 50 matches so far and dont want to miss this card anymore. And how openminded to say, that burn is what it is. Every type of deck changes. Look at all the decks over the last 5 years. And burn changed too. Figure of destiny, flame rift, hellspark elemental, keldon maurauders .... all cards, that rotated out of the deck, because other cards filled that spot better.

    Yesterday I played a match, where I played Goblin guide, Swiftspear and Bomat in turn 3! my opponent killed Bomat right away and lost to a pumbed up swiftspear and guide. Bomat is always the card that gets countered, no matter what else you might play. Blocking Batterskull without getting them life and so on. There are soooo many advantages of this card. It always hits for at least 2 damage and in about 60-70% of the matches it draws me extra cards. and its great if you have to mulligan cause you get your cards "back". Im really surprised that this community is so stubborn to be open for new things.

    You really should try things before you prejudge new ideas.

  9. #1549
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    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    You can posture all day long about this, it's not about trying new cards. If you mix shit and soap does it make the shit clean or the soap dirty? You need to ask yourself why you're mixing shit into soap in the first place.

    I would never, in a damage race, kill Bomat instead of Guide or Swiftspear. I would evaluate which threat will do the most damage and treat it accordingly. Killing Bomat seems wrong to me, and bad players don't make cards good. Of course they lost to a pumped up Swiftspear and Goblin Guide...he killed the wrong creature. *Not* being dead is more important to me than Burn drawing extra cards, coming from both sides of the coin (as a long time burn player and having played against it many times.)

    It's like Storm playing Concentrate. Yes you draw 3 extra cards. That's good for storm, right? Not when you could be actually killing the opponent with all that mana. Mana/damage ratio efficiency is so important to Burn because it's essentially a slow combo deck.
    I am counted amongst legions of the unrighteous
    who dread not being immersed in pits of fire

  10. #1550
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    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    http://www.hareruyamtg.com/en/k/kD00618O/

    top 4 in a 39 man event. i have no context, just the list:

    1 Barbarian Ring
    4 Bloodstained Mire
    5 Mountain
    5 Snow-Covered Mountain
    4 Wooded Foothills
    19 Lands
    4 Bomat Courier
    4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
    3 Goblin Guide
    1 Grim Lavamancer
    1 Monastery Swiftspear
    13 Creatures
    4 Fireblast
    4 Lightning Bolt
    4 Price of Progress
    4 Chain Lightning
    2 Exquisite Firecraft
    4 Lava Spike
    4 Rift Bolt
    2 Ensnaring Bridge
    28 Spells

    SB:
    3 Faerie Macabre
    2 Sulfur Elemental
    1 Crash
    2 Searing Blaze
    2 Smash to Smithereens
    1 Anarchy
    2 Pyrostatic Pillar
    2 Sulfuric Vortex
    15 Sideboard Cards

    keep testing this card :) . i'm sure it's fine, especially in the slower matchups where it really puts you over the top.

    (was looking over this list a bit more, bomat is really cool with ensnaring bridge)
    -rob

  11. #1551

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Bomat is just great. Couple of damages almost surely and 2-3 new cards when they are needed.

    It needed some kind of evasion though

  12. #1552

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    I think there is something to the Bomat Courier thing. You can check what's under it with fetches as well before cracking.

    In regards to killing the thing with the most damage. What does more damage, a swiftspear, or the bomat courier with 2 bolts and a fireblast tucked under it? Both have potential in different situations.

    I'll pick em up and test them next time I do Burn.

  13. #1553

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Swiftspear is not the alternative to Bomat. Searing Blaze or something else might be

  14. #1554

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Quote Originally Posted by Poron View Post
    Swiftspear is not the alternative to Bomat. Searing Blaze or something else might be
    i was replying to people killing the bomat over a swiftspear in game

  15. #1555

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Noah Walker plays 4x Bomat courier since the ban of DRS. Seems like the card is getting more attention lately. Looking whats under Bomat by fetching is just too nice.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HbX3J2-0kCU

  16. #1556
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    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Arclight Phoenix 3R

    Creature - Phoenix 3/2

    Flying, haste

    At the beginning of combat on your turn, if you cast three or more instant and/or sorcery spells this turn, return Arclight Phoenix from your graveyard to the battlefield.

    This one can be good against control matchups.
    ---
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  17. #1557

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Quote Originally Posted by Chronatog View Post
    Arclight Phoenix 3R

    Creature - Phoenix 3/2

    Flying, haste

    At the beginning of combat on your turn, if you cast three or more instant and/or sorcery spells this turn, return Arclight Phoenix from your graveyard to the battlefield.

    This one can be good against control matchups.
    This doesn't seem like it fits in the deck. Not castable until turn 4. After turn 4 its rare to cast 3+ cards in a single turn, so I think the ability would be hard to activate. Finally control decks main removal is StP, Terminus, and councils judgement, none of which put the card in the graveyard.

  18. #1558
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    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Quote Originally Posted by sunlith42 View Post
    This doesn't seem like it fits in the deck. Not castable until turn 4. After turn 4 its rare to cast 3+ cards in a single turn, so I think the ability would be hard to activate. Finally control decks main removal is StP, Terminus, and councils judgement, none of which put the card in the graveyard.
    Obviously, this is a sideboard card. And there are types of control other than white-mana driven. Also, red doesn't have many creatures with flying and Arclight Phoenix can help to deal a few more points of damage to close the game.
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  19. #1559
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    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    I've played burn for years, mostly in modern but also in legacy, and i think people who are arguing against bomat are being too close-minded. I'm well aware that burn lists seldom change because the best burn spells will probably always remain the same, but bomat courier is not a shitty card like browbeat or things like that. Burn doesn't need card advantage, but if this card advantage comes from a hasty one drop then it might be worth it. I think at least bomat deserves some testing to figure out if we should change our creature configuration, or just add more creatures. Trying cannot hurt.

  20. #1560
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    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Quote Originally Posted by LeoCop 90 View Post
    I've played burn for years, mostly in modern but also in legacy, and i think people who are arguing against bomat are being too close-minded. I'm well aware that burn lists seldom change because the best burn spells will probably always remain the same, but bomat courier is not a shitty card like browbeat or things like that. Burn doesn't need card advantage, but if this card advantage comes from a hasty one drop then it might be worth it. I think at least bomat deserves some testing to figure out if we should change our creature configuration, or just add more creatures. Trying cannot hurt.
    As a modern player you know that Bomat isn't even good enough for the modern burn deck, so why in the name of Chandra's left tit would you use it in Legacy? It's a more powerful format with an even greater need of efficiency. Modern also doesn't have: chain lightning, fireblast, price of progress, or sulfuric vortex. If you can cram the core cards of burn into a legacy deck and then have room after adding those cards then more power to you.

    Honestly, Bomat seems like a trap card. It promises a long term gain at the cost of short term damage output. It might have application in some matchups, but overall it doesn't seem great to me.
    I am counted amongst legions of the unrighteous
    who dread not being immersed in pits of fire

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