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Thread: [Primer/Deck] Burn

  1. #1641
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    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Quote Originally Posted by Ox411 View Post
    has anyone found anything good to do with iona shield of emeria?

    after shes cast.

    some kind of colorless spell? or an effective way to splash something with the sideboard?

    i hate that card so much.

    goblin recruiter is too powerful to be allowed, but iona is just fine?
    Hmm... So, reanimator (only deck I know that has Iona), is just a bad matchup. Typically you want to stop or win before Iona, Shield of Emeria comes into play, there's not really a way to answer that deck once Iona or Griselbrand comes into play. Grim Lavamancer I've felt is pretty effective against Iona if you've had enough early game pressure being able to just start flinging your graveyard at face to finish them off.

    If you're looking for specific splashes, I saw someone recommend Path to Exile, I kind of like Chained to the Rocks since it can hit Emrakul, the Aeons Torn, which Show and Tell is a pretty bad matchup as well. Some folks have found success with 4 Karakas in the side or Leyline of the Void.

    The thing with Burn is that you just have a bunch of matchups you realistically can't beat without specifically packing hate for it, and even with the hate pieces, it's still a really bad matchup. Depending on your meta it could make sense or might not make sense to pack the sideboard hate, I tend to be on the side of just accepting that some matchups aren't worth worrying about (unless it's your weekly local meta, then definitely pack the hate).
    Red Deck Weekly -- I'm bad at magic

  2. #1642

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Hello,
    I'm considering playing the deck for a big upcoming tournament (MKM Paris) - not a budget choice as I do have other decks available, but a meta choice - no slot in the 75 dedicated to the unwinnable S&T/Depths/Belcher-esque MUs, let's just pray & dodge them.
    I'm playing a MD that I want to be redundant (no weird 1-ofs here and there) : 19 lands, 12 creatures (0 Lavamancer), 4 Pop/3 FB, 20 Bolts, 2 Vortices. No Light Up the Stage, i'm really not fond of the card.

    I, however, kind of fail to design a sideboard that's designed to beat especially what I think will be prevalent - i.e. Stoneforge / Karn-Lattice.dec without feeling that I'm overboarding in some MUs.

    - I know that I want 4 graveyard-hates at least. I'm reluctant about the black Leylines, they're the basic expected grave-hate and, for instance, Reanimator will always side Reverent Silence in. I'm considering a 3/1 Surgical/Macabre split, for the 3 Surgical also come in handy vs. Loam strategies, despite being admittedly a "softer" hate.
    - I think I want 4 copies of Smash.
    - I want some number of Exquisite Firecraft, 2-3 seems correct. This card exactly does what I want it to do : beat blue, fair decks. It's also an okay card to side in in MUs where you have dead cards (like the mirror) because, well, it's damage to the face at least.
    - I'm on the fence about Ensnaring Bridge. Siding it in vs cheat-a-dumb-fatty.dec (Sneak, DD) is okayish but won't magically make those good MUs. It's a good card vs. TNN, BSkull, Angler, Eldrazis. I'm wondering whether siding them in vs. UW Stoneblade is a sound choice (keeps TNN/Skull at bay), because in that precise MU I already want 4 Smash and the Exquisites, and I don't have a lot of things to sideboard out - Price of Progress, Goblin Guide on the draw (?). Isn't Ensnaring Bridge "too much" in a SB that's already deep in fighting fair decks?
    - Last cards that round out my SB are 2 copies of Pyrostatic Pillar. I think those are good and here to stay.

    So, to put it shortly, whenever I'm playing Ensnaring Bridge I feel that I have too many cards to side in. Does anyone have a proper sideboarding table - even with a slightly different 75, the idea is rather to see the rationale behind the ins and outs in every MU.
    If not Bridge, what would you see in the sideboard instead ? Not fond of the idea of splashing, I think this comes at too high of a cost - I want Wasteland to read "nonbasic Wastes" and Stifle to read "uh, this could counter a Rift Bolt or a Sulfuric Vortex trigger, why am I playing this shit already" (no interest in playing fetches, I play 0 Lavamancer, 0 Searing Blaze and it's been mathematically proven that the "thinning" is negligible). I also don't like Pyroblast - that's not a card Burn should play. I also have no interest in playing Alpine Moon or *cough cough* Island of Wak-Wak.

    Hf slinging bolts !

  3. #1643

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    I play a very similar deck to the one listed in the last post.
    However,
    - i play 4 luts, and 16 bolts.
    - I play 3 pop, and 4 fireblast.

    We could debate these differences forever, I suspect...

    But sideboards...

    My side is:
    3 graffdiggers cage
    3 ensnaring bridge
    3 smash
    1 vortex
    2 pillars
    3 "something else" right now its volcanic fallout.

    If I'm siding in the cage, I probably lost the first game. So I'm on the play and i mull to the cage, and win. Or i dont get it and loose.

    The bridge is helpful a lot. Reanimation, show and tell sometimes, elderazi, it even helps against small creature decks sometimes, theres lots of games I have 0 cards in hand.

    Smashes are great, sometimes I play with 4 in the side and take out the vortex...

    Vortexes are great. Life gain is such a pain in the ass. Think about it, if EVERY deck you played against Somehow got 25 or 30 life, racing gets so tough. And it helps in long games, or games you cant attack in. My 2 main deck ones are here to stay,but sometimes I think the 3rd is overkill and take it out for the 4th smash.

    If I could play more eidolons I would. Not having a body makes the pillars less attractive so I don't main deck any, but it so effective against a lot of decks to have the extra. Blue decks, elves, monks....

    The something else cards.....I play almost exclusively online. Right now I'm seeing a ton of elves and something with zillions of white monks....the volcanic fallouts are what I like right now.

    The only deck I play against that I feel like is an almost sure loss is dark depths. Occasionally the bridge helps with that, but mostly not. I might get lucky and double fireblast early to win, but mostly not. Occasionally I've put 3 wasteland in my "something else" sideboard slot...they didnt help that much either...if I spend a day playing online,
    I'm sure to play against dark depths 2 or 3 times out of 10. So .I am looking for ideas in this matchup, I might dedicate 3 sb slots to it, if the cards have some use in at least a few other matchups.

    Good one about alpine Moon and island of wak wak ...

    I'd like to hear other peoples side boarding strategies as well.

  4. #1644
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    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    New leyline is pretty good. Not sure if it helps bad matchups but might make some matchups even better. Certainly helps the storm matchup, especially paired with eidolon. If it can deal 4 damage a game or more it should probably have some consideration.
    -rob

  5. #1645

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Quote Originally Posted by Ox411 View Post
    I play a very similar deck to the one listed in the last post.
    However,
    - i play 4 luts, and 16 bolts.
    - I play 3 pop, and 4 fireblast.

    We could debate these differences forever, I suspect...

    But sideboards...

    My side is:
    3 graffdiggers cage
    3 ensnaring bridge
    3 smash
    1 vortex
    2 pillars
    3 "something else" right now its volcanic fallout.

    If I'm siding in the cage, I probably lost the first game. So I'm on the play and i mull to the cage, and win. Or i dont get it and loose.

    The bridge is helpful a lot. Reanimation, show and tell sometimes, elderazi, it even helps against small creature decks sometimes, theres lots of games I have 0 cards in hand.

    Smashes are great, sometimes I play with 4 in the side and take out the vortex...

    Vortexes are great. Life gain is such a pain in the ass. Think about it, if EVERY deck you played against Somehow got 25 or 30 life, racing gets so tough. And it helps in long games, or games you cant attack in. My 2 main deck ones are here to stay,but sometimes I think the 3rd is overkill and take it out for the 4th smash.

    If I could play more eidolons I would. Not having a body makes the pillars less attractive so I don't main deck any, but it so effective against a lot of decks to have the extra. Blue decks, elves, monks....

    The something else cards.....I play almost exclusively online. Right now I'm seeing a ton of elves and something with zillions of white monks....the volcanic fallouts are what I like right now.

    The only deck I play against that I feel like is an almost sure loss is dark depths. Occasionally the bridge helps with that, but mostly not. I might get lucky and double fireblast early to win, but mostly not. Occasionally I've put 3 wasteland in my "something else" sideboard slot...they didnt help that much either...if I spend a day playing online,
    I'm sure to play against dark depths 2 or 3 times out of 10. So .I am looking for ideas in this matchup, I might dedicate 3 sb slots to it, if the cards have some use in at least a few other matchups.

    Good one about alpine Moon and island of wak wak ...

    I'd like to hear other peoples side boarding strategies as well.
    you Should bring 1-3 Pithing needles it helps also in various other matchups ;)

  6. #1646

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    I am currently playing this list:

    4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
    4 Goblin Guide
    4 Monastery Swiftspear
    1 Sulfuric Vortex
    4 Lightning Bolt
    4 Price of Progress
    4 Fireblast
    4 Chain Lightning
    4 Rift Bolt
    4 Lava Spike
    2 Skewer the Critics
    2 Light Up the Stage
    8 Mountain
    4 Arid Mesa
    2 Wooded Foothills
    4 Bloodstained Mire
    1 Scalding Tarn

    SIDEBOARD
    2 Ensnaring Bridge
    2 Faerie Macabre
    2 Pyrostatic Pillar
    3 Smash to Smithereens
    3 Searing Blaze
    3 Exquisite Firecraft

    Is it worth 2 Light Up the Stage or do I put the 4 Skewer the Critics?
    Sulfuric Vortex main (d&t) or side?

  7. #1647

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    I'd like to talk about sunbaked canyon as well.

    My list has been:
    19 mountain
    16 bolts
    12 creatures (eidolon, guide, swiftspear)
    3 pop
    4 fireblast
    4 light up the stage
    2 vortex

    I've been pretty happy with the list, but now that I have 4 sunbaked canyons, I'm interested in going up to 20 lands.
    My first thought was to go down to 3 fireblast.
    My 2 "fringe" cards, luts and vortex have been pretty helpful...
    Luts gives me access to more cards, helps with mana screw, and protects cards from discard.
    I run into alot of life gain when I play online. The vortexes are worth it to me for that alone, the damage is like a bonus.
    I do want to see a fireblast every game, but usually not 2 and never early on.
    Light up the stage and now sunbaked canyon let me see more of my deck in any given game then ever before.

    Is it reasonable to drop a fireblast to fit in the 20th land?
    Or do I stay at 19 lands?

    Thanks for your thoughts.
    Last edited by Ox411; 06-25-2019 at 03:01 PM.

  8. #1648
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    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Hey there folks,

    I've been playing Burn this last months, since Ravnica Allegiance's spectacle cards came out, and I'm really satisfied with it. This last Saturday I finished 3rd at the June edition of the Catalan legacy League (41 players) with this list:

    Maindeck:
    2 Arid Mesa
    2 Bloodstained Mire
    10 Mountain
    2 Scalding Tarn
    2 Wooded Foothills
    4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
    4 Goblin Guide
    4 Monastery Swiftspear
    4 Chain Lightning
    4 Fireblast
    4 Lava Spike
    4 Light Up the Stage
    4 Lightning Bolt
    4 Price of Progress
    4 Rift Bolt
    2 Skewer the Critics
    Sideboard:
    3 Karakas
    3 Ensnaring Bridge
    3 Searing Blaze
    4 Smash to Smithereens
    2 Surgical Extraction

    I played against this matchups:
    Round 1 vs Miracles, won 2-0 (WW), OTD G1
    Round 2 vs Miracles, won 2-0 (WW), OTD G1
    Round 3 vs Death and Taxes, lost 1-2 (WLL), OTP G1
    Round 4 vs 4c Loam, won 2-1 (WLW), OTP G1
    Round 5 vs Miracles, won 2-1 (WLW), OTP G1
    Round 6 vs Stoneblade, won 2-0 (WW), OTP G1. I was paired down so I had to play last round. At least I was 1st seed thanks to that!
    Top 8 vs 4c Loam (same player as Round 4), won 2-0 (WW), OTP G1
    Top 4 vs Miracles (same player as Round 2), lost 0-2 (LL), OTP G1

    I was lucky with my match-ups, not a single combo deck in all day. The rounds I lost was simply because deck stopped working during 2-3 turns (I was mana flooded vs Death and Taxes and in the 1st game vs Miracles in Top4, and in the 2nd one I kept a risky one lander after a mulligan and I never saw the 2nd land).

    I'm really happy with my configuration; I don't think that there is any need to play Sulfuric Vortex maindeck, you should be faster that any life gain (Stoneforge Mystic should die just after hitting the battlefield, and by the time the opponent deploys any Batterskull, he should be already dead). Spectacle cards, especially LUtS, are exactly what the deck needed to keep pressing opponent's life total. Regarding the sideboard, I think right now we need 4 StS; there is a lot of Chalice decks, and they are also extra useful vs Death and Taxes. A lot of my opponents are aware of that I play Karakas sideboard, but you can always sneak a game against Sneak Show/Reanimator/Dark Depths with them (or at least buy a couple ot turns, which should be enough a lot of times). Bridges are also great against Sneak Show and migt be useful against a lot of other decks (even Canadian!). I'm always on the fence about playing 4 Minbdreak Trap or not; this time I decided not to play them and I was lucky (there was 5-6 Storm decks in the tournament). I replaced them with Blazes (I'm not really sold on them, getting landfall when we need it is not always easy) and Surgicals, that I had just sided in vs Loam but never saw them nor need them.

    Now, with the infamous London Mulligan, I think there will be changes to be made, especially in sideboard. I'll play 4 Leyline of the Void for sure, and I'll keep playing 4 Smash to Smithereens, 3 Karakas and 3 Bridges. This left me with just one slot, and I'm not sure how to fill it (right now I'm thinking about 1 Exquisite Firecraft or 1 Surgical Extraction). What is sure is that I'll drop Searing Blaze, so there will no need to play Fetchlands. I'll switch to 18 Mountains and see what happens.

    That's my two cents, thanks for reading!
    Colorless is the new blue
    http://ooh---shiny.blogspot.com

  9. #1649

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    If you have problems with flooding occasionally, why do you believe that dropping fetches is a good idea?

    Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

  10. #1650
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    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Well, I lost 6 games in the whole tournament and only was flooded in two of them, so this is not really worrying me right now. It concerns me more not to micro-mana-screwing myself if I have to fetch (and thus remove a land from the deck) when I'm low on mana. Anyway it is supposed tan the thinning effect of fetchlands is more or less negligible, and I prefer not to opening myself to random Stifles/life loss unnecessarily.

    (I should also say that the idea of playing only 17 Mountains instead of 18 is appealing me)
    Colorless is the new blue
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  11. #1651

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    hows it going?

    im seeing some burn decks that are running a mix of mountains and snow covered mountains.
    there arent any cards in these decks that benefit from the inclusion of snow lands.

    normally i run all the same art (non snow covered) mountains, to help disguise my hand a little when people are looking at it.

    the only rational that ive come across for running a mix of snow and not snow covered is that it helps hedge against someone blindly casting predict targeting me and naming mountain. and since theres really no reason not to, why not use this tiny little bit of possible help?

    does anyone here have any thoughts on this?

    thanks

  12. #1652

    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Quote Originally Posted by Ox411 View Post
    hows it going?

    im seeing some burn decks that are running a mix of mountains and snow covered mountains.
    there arent any cards in these decks that benefit from the inclusion of snow lands.

    normally i run all the same art (non snow covered) mountains, to help disguise my hand a little when people are looking at it.

    the only rational that ive come across for running a mix of snow and not snow covered is that it helps hedge against someone blindly casting predict targeting me and naming mountain. and since theres really no reason not to, why not use this tiny little bit of possible help?

    does anyone here have any thoughts on this?

    thanks
    Hello! The main reason for this (if you look back to DnT running 6 snow plains, and 6 plains, is for the miracles matchup mostly for the card predict. Since you’re running 18-20 lands, if they are all mountains, they have a higher probability to hit because of that.

  13. #1653
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    Re: [Primer/Deck] Burn

    Is Chaos Warp our only answer to things like Leyline of Sanctity or Circle of Protection: Red?
    Looking for whatever catchall answers mono red has
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatWhale View Post
    Gross, other formats. I puked in my mouth a little.

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