What do you guys think of this list off of the Melbourne Eternal Masters Legacy Event? Barbarian Ring was before my foray into the format so I've no experience using it or seeing it played.
Code:Lands: (19) 4 Bloodstained Mire 4 Wooded Foothills 10 Mountain 1 Barbarian Ring Creatures: (10) 4 Goblin Guide 4 Eidolon of the Great Revel 2 Grim Lavamancer Non-Creature Spells: (31) 4 Lightning Bolt 4 Chain Lightning 4 Rift Bolt 4 Lava Spike 4 Price of Progress 4 Searing Blaze 4 Fireblast 2 Sulfuric Vortex 1 Sensei's Divining Top Sideboard: (15) 3 Relic of Progenitus 3 Smash to Smithereens 3 Vexing Shusher 2 Pyrostatic Pillar 1 Grim Lavamancer 1 Barbarian Ring 1 Sulfuric Vortex 1 Searing Blood
Same here. That list caused minor changes to my deck, to accommodate the slower play style his list requires.Originally Posted by Lyle Hopkins
I'm the guy who won Eternal Masters, so obviously I quite like that list.I'll try my best to give some mindset as to why I ran that list, although I'm happy to answer anything I missed out on.
This list was tailored more towards an assumed Miracles-heavy meta, which is why the list is slower than the Burn lists coming out nowadays. (The lists running Monastery Swiftspear seem to be more tailored to an OmniTell-heavy metagame; those lists trade late-game resiliency for killing them more often on Turn 3, whereas I feel much more comfortable playing both the "Hope I dodge Omni-Tell" and "Hope I get paired up against Miracles" games.) Unfortunately, I didn't get to play against any of the Miracles players, so my use of Barbarian Ring was very limited. I think I used it once in the 6 rounds of Swiss (ID'd in the 7th round), and can't remember using it in the Top-8. I played against two Omni-Tell players; winning against my Round 2 opponent, who FoW'd my Vexing Shusher on a mull to 6, and losing to Joe Fox in Round 5, who had a decent Game 1 hand.
Sensei's Divining Top is the real deal though. After looking at Yusuke Shimizu's list, it was obvious that this is what my list needed; I cut out a land for it. Between raw card selection gained from looking at the top 3, using fetchlands to shuffle to find cards that you need/clear cards you don't need, and playing nicely against your opponent's mid-game discard spells (typically through drawing better in the midgame), as well as being useful against Liliana of the Veil/Jace, the Mind Sculptor, Sensei's Divining Top enables greater success in the late game. You end up having more gas in the late-game through increased card selection (which increases the overall card quality of your hand), and can even steal games more often with finishers like Price of Progress/Fireblast by finding them more often.
About the only thing I'd change in that list is to take out a Mountain for the ninth fetchland, to further maximize the synergy with Searing Blaze, Grim Lavamancer and Sensei's Divining Top.
Ouch, he must have been mad about that after the fact.
Not going to lie, my shit-eating grin when I said "It resolves." probably didn't help. He took that loss pretty well.
My round 3 opponent was saltier though (playing Shardless BUGw, splashing for Meddling Mage and other stuff I didn't see). Game 3, the board state was as follows:
Opponent: 15 life, 4 tapped dual lands, Liliana of the Veil (on enough counters to make me sac a creature), Tarmogoyf (6/7 at that time)+Deathrite Shaman (tapped) + Meddling Mage (played that turn to name Rift Bolt), one card in hand. He might have had one more creature on board, but I was basically dead on board.
Me: 8 life, 3 lands in play (one tapped Mountain, one untapped Mountain, one fetchland), suspended Rift Bolt, Sensei's Divining Top, two cards in hand (Lightning Bolt and Fireblast)
I'm basically on the Price of Progress or bust game plan. I spin Top the first time, don't find it. I crack my fetchland, and spin the Top again. Whiff again, but find another fetchland to keep my chances alive. I draw the fetchland for my turn (leaving Rift Bolt in exile), and I crack it to spin the top again. I find Price of Progress on the top of my library, and draw it with a Top activation. Smack him for exactly lethal with Price of Progress+Lightning Bolt+Fireblast.
He was quite salty at the end of the game (understandably so), although we both agreed that whatever Meddling Mage named was irrelevant. (Price of Progress is my only out there, and I can hit it with either Rift Bolt or Lightning Bolt if it names anything troubling)
Has anyone started testing Molten Vortex? I'm planning on grabbing a play set to test.
IMHO it is strictly worse than top in burn deck, dont need to test it.
Well, I probably won't get a play set, but I'll probably use three as a replacement for Grim to see what it does and how it does it. It might not be a worse top deck compared to Grim.
It does nothing on its own, It is horrible topdeck as well and even more horrible in multiples, you will see:) You want to play your lands ASAP because of tax counters and fireblasts.
It is good only if your are terribly flooded (or maybe with loam) and in that case shocks will not you win the game, really wasted money on that card, buy top or sudden shocks:)
I do know how to pilot the deck and I have little hopes for it, but I would want to see if its actually a viable replacement for Grim Lavamancer.
You don't actually want to play all of your lands. Usually stopping at three or four is a good call to keep the rest in your hand. You never want to give your opponent the reign to do whatever they want without a precaution. Plus having lands in your hand necessitates Searing Blaze.
Burn decks have been doing good lately at any SCG Legacy tournaments!
Good Job!
TJB
http://deartiyopaeng.blogspot.com/ <---- (updated) MTG related blog. ^_^
TES: 102nd out of 2000 players at GP Kyoto 2015 (Legacy)
UR Storm: 37th of 950 players at GP Guangzhou 2016 (Modern)
Has anyone done any testing with Day's Undoing?
That's probably a better question to ask in Modern Burn threads. It's much more difficult to convince Legacy Burn to splash any colors.
I didn't even think about that in this deck. Someone up for testing it? I'll be testing Molten Vortex for the time being.
I'm fine sticking with my current 75, although if Melbourne's meta ends up with more Omni-Tell, I might try the Swiftspear version.
I think that Day's Undoing is reasonably strong in a RGu(x) Modern list, with a bunch of 1-drop Burn spells and Day's Undoing to refuel on Turn 3. Can't convincingly jam this in Legacy Burn though, as it would both eat into the finisher slots, as well as the notion of giving your opponent 7 fresh cards to kill you with also seeming quite bad.
I don't think Molten Vortex is strong enough in Burn in general, as it eats into the Grim Lavamancer/Sensei's Divining Top slots. I don't think that there is enough feasible activations in a match to outweigh the performance that either Grim Lavamancer or Sensei's Divining Top gives. Seems breakable enough in Modern/Legacy in a Lands shell though.
Of all the origins cards i think molten vortex is the closest to playable. I think if it sees play it will be out of the board. Congratz to all the burn players that have been top 8'ing recently. Anyone going to eternal weekend?
I'm definitely not going to Eternal Weekend. I have one event I'm going to this year and it's GP Tacoma!
I top eight at the CFB forty eight man "$1K event" beating two Omnitell, GW 12-Post, and Aluren, losing to Reanimator in the swiss and getting knocked out by Omnitell in the quarter finals. I made one mistake the entire tournament and it was in the quarter final against Omnitell game two. I should have cast Vexing Shusher instead I casted two Rift Bolts on suspend. I lost that match with him on two life. I should have looked at the end game, but instead just looked at the short term. I don't think I would have won the match, but it's still something I want to note to myself for future games.
GGs won be the matches against Omnitell in the swiss, and PoP killed 12-Post. That 12-Post was a very interesting build, using Suppression Field to halt aggro, and that Kithkin legend that stops X and four CMC spells. I raced Aluren, and gave him his first loss to Burn ever. Felt pretty good, but kind of bad since he was a friend. Reanimator went like usual, just ran me over. This is a match up I have given up on though, so it was expected. The second Omnitell match, the guy telegraphed that he had Leyline of Sanctity and dropped it before I said I'll keep. my initial seven would have stomped, but it was all spells that targeted. I mulled to six keeping Grim, GG, Eidolon, PoP, and two lands. I drew into two other PoPs while he had two Ancient Tombs in play. He needed a single Island and he would have started rolling.
Same main deck as before, but here's the side:
2 Tormod's Crypt
3 Vexing Shusher
1 Searing Blaze
3 Smash to Smithereens
3 Sudden Shock
1 Sulfuric Vortex
2 Mindbreak Trap
I wish I could remember details, but again, this is the best you're probably going to get out of me.
Some changes I would have made if I knew the meta before hand was take out a Smash, Sudden Shock, and the Mindbreaks to put two Swiftspear and two Searing Blood into the side. I saw absolutely no Storm decks, no D&T, but there were BUG decks of various kinds all over the place. I saw maybe two Miracles decks, a deck that just needs to fall off the face of the planet. Omnitell really is a deck that's taking off in popularity at this store, and I'm assuming elsewhere as well. My only suggestion against Omnitell is add as many creatures as possible for constant damage. I know if I was able to find similar hands I had against the previous Omni decks, I feel like I would have won it.
Any questions? I feel like I can answer those.
Bit late to this, haven't really been playing Legacy lately.Same here. That list caused minor changes to my deck, to accommodate the slower play style his list requires.
I'm the guy who won Eternal Masters, so obviously I quite like that list.
The top is interesting, I kind of like the idea of a slower but more resilient list. How do you feel about Magma Jet to find Top? Would you rather just run more Tops instead?
The deck plays a good handful of cards that are currently legal in standard -- but not even the standard burn decks play Magma Jet
I'll be playing Burn at Eternal Weekend tomorrow. I've finally switched over to Swiftspears - for more speed in the Omnitell matchup. I've cut the Sulfuric Vortex's completely, which I'm OK with, with a playset of Smash to Smithereens in the side.
I had been running some Flame Rifts in the side to bring in when Searing Blaze is dead, but wanted some more SB slots for Pyrostatic Pillars. So I've replaced Vexing Shushers with Exquisite Firecraft - I think they can fill both the shusher and rift roles. We'll see.
I've tried SDT in a couple tournaments and did not like it at all. Especially not in place of the 20th land. In the games where I drew top, I wanted more lands so I could be spinning AND casting spells.
In the matchups where you want to max out searing spells, I actually like Searing Blood more - hence 3 Blaze man / 4 Blood side.
My list for tomorrow:
1 Arid Mesa
3 Bloodstained Mire
10 Mountain
3 Scalding Tarn
3 Wooded Foothills
4 Chain Lightning
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Fireblast
4 Goblin Guide
1 Grim Lavamancer
4 Lava Spike
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Price of Progress
4 Rift Bolt
3 Searing Blaze
Sideboard:
3 Exquisite Firecraft
2 Pyrostatic Pillar
2 Relic of Progenitus
4 Searing Blood
4 Smash to Smithereens
f7eleven:
I think you are better off just accepting that Omnitell and yardbased strategies are bad matchups, because they will allways be an uphill batlle for burn no matter what you do.
Its better to focus on and strenghten other matchups you can make favourable.
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