[Deck] Deadguy Ale (B/w Confidant)

[Star|Scream]

Tim, have you been testing with and/or against misstep? There's 14 1 drops in the main

[Tim the Enchanter]

Tim, have you been testing with and/or against misstep? There's 14 1 drops in the main

Not at all. I'm not going to GP Providence so I decided to spend all my time testing the current deck and trying to optimize it for what I would actually be playing against.

Personally I don't think MM is going to be as huge as most people think. I'm usually a terrible judge of new cards power though so take it with a grain of salt. I think it's good and will see play but honestly Spell Snare is much more of a concern but even that isn't too big of a deal.

[Anthem]

Not at all. I'm not going to GP Providence so I decided to spend all my time testing the current deck and trying to optimize it for what I would actually be playing against.

Personally I don't think MM is going to be as huge as most people think. I'm usually a terrible judge of new cards power though so take it with a grain of salt. I think it's good and will see play but honestly Spell Snare is much more of a concern but even that isn't too big of a deal.

From my limited personal experience, it becomes the most annoying when you're playing Deadguy against Countertop or Merfolk. The ability to stop a first turn Mother or Vial or Duress/IoK/etc without needing a land drop or losing card advantage a la FoW is really a slap in the face as far as tempo is concerned.

[Leto]

Played yesterday against Merfolks with MM, and it ranges from pretty annoying to gamebreaking mainly because of Misssteped Swords. Thats huge against Deadguy as you need to pick their Lords or get stomped

In the matches yesterday, Phyrexian Crusader made a pretty good figure. Maybe he IS the right Threat for the Deck, he is well protected, works really good with our Equips and and is good in attacking/stalling. Maybe the deck needs just a bit more adjustment then
-3 Nighthawk
+3 Crusader
to let him really kick ass. Need to think more about this^^

[Tim the Enchanter]

I like Mirran Crusader better than Phyrexian because he works with everything else at actually killing the opponent. Pro-green and black seems pretty good especially if StP is less played due to MM. If he connects once with a SoFI its 8-12 damage with the possibility of killing 2 dudes.

I think we may need to test GftT if MM proves to be whateveryone else says it will. I tried it in a non-Vial build and absolutely hated it. With Vial it might be a little better but testing is required.

[Star|Scream]

Not at all. I'm not going to GP Providence so I decided to spend all my time testing the current deck and trying to optimize it for what I would actually be playing against.

Personally I don't think MM is going to be as huge as most people think. I'm usually a terrible judge of new cards power though so take it with a grain of salt. I think it's good and will see play but honestly Spell Snare is much more of a concern but even that isn't too big of a deal.

I want you to know my question wasn't hype-based. I know the card will see play and in some way will affect the format. Just wondering if it's been tested against. Seems bad in this deck due to all the 1 drops already. We'll see.

What about dismember? It kills most of what stp does, with a few reanimator targets aside, and it can be paid for to avoid the lifeloss. Without thoughtseize it may be doable.

[Star|Scream]

Not at all. I'm not going to GP Providence so I decided to spend all my time testing the current deck and trying to optimize it for what I would actually be playing against.

Personally I don't think MM is going to be as huge as most people think. I'm usually a terrible judge of new cards power though so take it with a grain of salt. I think it's good and will see play but honestly Spell Snare is much more of a concern but even that isn't too big of a deal.

I want you to know my question wasn't hype-based. I know the card will see play and in some way will affect the format. Just wondering if it's been tested against. Seems bad in this deck due to all the 1 drops already. We'll see.

What about dismember? It kills most of what stp does, with a few reanimator targets aside, and it can be paid for to avoid the lifeloss. Without thoughtseize stealing life it may be doable.

[Leto]

I think we may need to test GftT if MM proves to be whateveryone else says it will. I tried it in a non-Vial build and absolutely hated it. With Vial it might be a little better but testing is required.

We NEED Turn 1 removal in some matchups (thinking of Goblins for Example) and GftT is no replacement in that case without secure ways to play it on your first turn.

I like Mirran Crusader better than Phyrexian because he works with everything else at actually killing the opponent. Pro-green and black seems pretty good especially if StP is less played due to MM. If he connects once with a SoFI its 8-12 damage with the possibility of killing 2 dudes.

Don't think that StP will be played less cause of MM, only thing is that it looses some points compared to other removal. Still its the best Spotremoval Legacy has. I mentionend the things you said about Mirran Crusader right after he got spoiled in this thread. The Problem he has are his cmc. The deck needs mostly black and he has Double-W. Difficult to get when your Opponent plays Wastelands (the chances he doesnt play them are rather small)

[Anthem]

We NEED Turn 1 removal in some matchups (thinking of Goblins for Example) and GftT is no replacement in that case without secure ways to play it on your first turn.



Don't think that StP will be played less cause of MM, only thing is that it looses some points compared to other removal. Still its the best Spotremoval Legacy has. I mentionend the things you said about Mirran Crusader right after he got spoiled in this thread. The Problem he has are his cmc. The deck needs mostly black and he has Double-W. Difficult to get when your Opponent plays Wastelands (the chances he doesnt play them are rather small)

I'd say that Mirran Crusader fits pretty nicely in Hate Crimes (the Deadguy variant posted earlier with mostly white creatures). I'll try testing it as a 3-of. Connecting with it while it has a equip is practically the game. I agree that cutting StP for GftT isn't in Deadguy's best interest overall. Decks that run MM are still a minority to the rest of the format, and it hurts us everywhere else.

[Richard Cheese]

Mental Misstep is like terrorism - if you change the way you build decks just because it exists, the control players have already won.

As for crusaders, Mirran is a house with equipment, but easy to kill, while Phyrexian is practically indestructable and just as fast of a clock, but he's just not a team player when it comes to killing people. I really really want to be able to run him, but unless you're going to go with a bunch of sub-par infect creatures, it just doesn't seem worth it.

[Leto]

teamwork is fairly overrated when one can do the job ;)


I will try a little more with him, I hesitated really long, but he impressed me in the 4-5 games I played with him enough to give him a chance

[bokwinkle]

There is something to be said for a guy for 3 mana that can get the job done by himself. That means a T1 Ritual into him can be a very fast game. If he goes into the Nighthawk spot (in my build above) then I could cut persecutors for an 8-card mystic package - then he does play well with others, because the equipment gets there. There is even potential to start cutting other bears (such as gatekeeper in my build) for cards like Mental Misstep and more discard spells.

I suppose it's worth testing, although it seems as though it could be a tad inconsistent.

[Tim the Enchanter]

It's been my experience that even a 7 card Mystic package is way too much. I think 5, maybe 6, is ideal. With any more you just end up with a handful of equipment you're waiting to play and equip while your opponent pulls away in board position.

[Richard Cheese]

Quick question - can you use SFM's activated ability to sneak in something like Piston Sledge and have it attach to a creature immediately?

Edit: Also, Tim are you thinking of finding a spot for Puresteel Paladin in your list?

[JustPAT4]

Quick question - can you use SFM's activated ability to sneak in something like Piston Sledge and have it attach to a creature immediately?

Of course. If you somehow have a spot in your list for Piston Sledge its ability will trigger once it enters the battlefield, regardless of how it got there.

[Anthem]

Of course. If you somehow have a spot in your list for Piston Sledge its ability will trigger once it enters the battlefield, regardless of how it got there.

A card that I'm really considering is Batterskull. Using SFM to cheat in a 4/4 Lifelink to block is really good, and the rare case of attaching it to a creature is nuts. Dark Confidant frowns a little, but if people can justify running Tombstalkers then this one-of should be just fine. I wouldn't know what to trade it for, though.

[bokwinkle]

It's been my experience that even a 7 card Mystic package is way too much. I think 5, maybe 6, is ideal. With any more you just end up with a handful of equipment you're waiting to play and equip while your opponent pulls away in board position.

I'm with you here. I guess I'm just trying to force the 3 drop infect double striker...when in reality there isn't a reason to.

[Tim the Enchanter]

Edit: Also, Tim are you thinking of finding a spot for Puresteel Paladin in your list?

Puresteel Paladin looks great on paper but he's not disruptive, there are plenty of times that I may not have 2 other artifacts and there just isn't room for him. I'd be slightly more tempted if he at least had first strike, but right now the only room for a non-disruptive creature is taken up by Avenger, who is about 100% better than Puresteel Paladin.

I'm with you here. I guess I'm just trying to force the 3 drop infect double striker...when in reality there isn't a reason to.

Um... you know the one Crusader has infect and the other has double strike right? Neither have both. For my build the white one would work much better, but I'm already getting ww for Serra Avenger.

[Solar Ice]

Played a few games with Tim's list and I have to say that I felt naked without discard. One has very few ways to disrupt the opponent and to not have any information on what your opponent is holding kind of feels like you're walking in the dark. it is also particularly dangerous against any Combo deck (that includes Show and Tell-type decks). I love the Mystical plan though. There has to be a way to fit in a set of Thoughtseize somewhere.

[Star|Scream]

well you do have temporoary instant-speed discard/exile, and you have mom to protect them. This deck doesn't play like deadguy. It's something completely different. I like it.