Maybe Steely Resolve is better? I know you cant untap your dudes because they have shroud but at least it protects from STP/Abrupt Decay....even jitte!! Also it's green so you don't have to splash another color.
Problem is that the sideboard is already tight as it is..what do you remove? The miracles hate is very much needed as well as the 6-7 discard. Another problem is that what if all your guys die before you draw it? I would say you would need to dedicate at least 2 SB slots for something like this.
I don't think steely resolve is any better than absolute law: it doesn't protect arbor or symbiot, prevents you to untap elfs,... But most of it, you do not want to enter cards like that vs decay.deck: they will enter their removal as golgari charm, ... And may even have less than 4 decay post board.
The only MUs I would like Steely resolve are patriot delver, UR delver and burn. And versus the two last, I prefer Absolute law by far (being able to attack and block > need for W).
Energy Storm is also an interesting option as it shuts down delver too.
for the jund versions of this deck (ruric etc) what do we think of slaughter games vs combo and decks with 1 card strategies vs us (for example: terminus, punishing fire, emrakul). 4 mana is easy to get, altho the RB might be tough if there's any disruption (it would require a DRS+fetch, 2 fetches, or a fetch+birchlore...)
just a thought.
oh and is absolute law better than energy storm? it's not as annoying to pay for obv, but storm stops delver hits and burn to the face..
It's nice but with steely resolve you gonna lose all these interactions which elves provide to each other.
I think that these interaction are our power. The energy storm is cool but how many turn can we keep alive?
We have to keep alive the energy strom and the same turns we have to advantage our board, i think it's kind dificult.
My Current board is
4x Abrupt Decay
2x Pithing Needle
3x Thoughseize
2x Cabal Therapy
1x Null Rod
2x Absolute Law
1x Gaddock Teeg
Against Miracle i have
4x Abrupt Decay
2x Pithing Needle
1x Null Rod
1x Gaddock Teeg (at this current metagame which swords to plowshares was
decreased more n more because of reb, teeg cut jace, force, terminus and entreat.)
Mother of God! Titania!
BFF with Sylvan Safekeeper and Crop Rotation
Edit: Ok. ok. I buy the green commander deck ... still want a foil titania :(
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It's BFF with fetch. Or Zuran Orb/Wasteland + Crucible of Worlds.
So sad she costs 5 mana.
Oh well... Fetch -> Crop Rotation -> Fetch never looked so good.
I really wish she either wasn't a creature or had Hexproof. Could be pretty could vs Miracles. End-of-turn, 5/3.
The seven cardinal sins of Legacy:
1. Discuss the unbanning ofLand TaxEarthcraft.
2. Argue that banning Force of Will would make the format healthier.
3. Play Brainstorm without Fetchlands.
4. Stifle Standstill.
5. Think that Gaea's Blessing will make you Solidarity-proof.
6. Pass priority after playing Infernal Tutor.
7. Fail to playtest against Nourishing Lich (coZ iT wIlL gEt U!).
Crop Rotation into Karakas with Lightning Bolt/Plowshares on the stack xD
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Considering that Argoth has been destroyed a long time ago, she probably did a pretty shitty job.
The seven cardinal sins of Legacy:
1. Discuss the unbanning ofLand TaxEarthcraft.
2. Argue that banning Force of Will would make the format healthier.
3. Play Brainstorm without Fetchlands.
4. Stifle Standstill.
5. Think that Gaea's Blessing will make you Solidarity-proof.
6. Pass priority after playing Infernal Tutor.
7. Fail to playtest against Nourishing Lich (coZ iT wIlL gEt U!).
I think i love this...not sure if it would work, but it makes me happy. Anyone have an informed opinion on its viability?
Easy enough to add a taiga, if you arn't already (I have ruric as my only red, so am not running taiga at the moment). You are less than likely to get it out before turn three though, so wouldn't be useful against all of the single card strategies (looking at you, grapeshot and turn one show and tell).
A question I asked earlier and din't get a response to, has anyone tried coat of arms? I assume it is unplayable, and that another cratterhoof would do you better in most cases, but if anyone has tried it, I would love confirmation that it sucks.
Most combo decks already die or face grave difficulties from a resolved NO. Killing them with a 4 drop is not the problem here, it's that we're slower to resolve that kill spell because we need time to establish a board and have a harder time incorporating disruption.
Figuring our a way to incorporate disruption that doesn't disrupt our buildup process or a way to make us more explosive seem like better bets.
Originally Posted by Lemnear
Go back to the blue splash and run 4 Mystic Remora in the sideboard? That'll teach 'em to cantrip like a madman into their combo pieces. They cantrip like silly, we fill our hand and go "Yaaaay Glïiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiimpse" FTW?
Legacy Champs was fun went 6-4 with the following list.
Creature (30)
2 Birchlore Rangers
2 Craterhoof Behemoth
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Elvish Visionary
3 Heritage Druid
3 Nettle Sentinel
4 Quirion Ranger
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Ruric Thar, the Unbowed
1 Scavenging Ooze
4 Wirewood Symbiote
1 Wren's Run Packmaster
Spells (11)
4 Glimpse of Nature
4 Green Sun's Zenith
3 Natural Order
Land (20)
2 Bayou
2 Dryad Arbor
2 Forest
4 Gaea's Cradle
1 Pendelhaven
1 Misty Rainforest
4 Windswept Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
Sideboard (15)
4 Abrupt Decay
1 Elderscale Wurm
1 Natural Order
1 Progenitus
2 Pithing Needle
1 Null Rod
1 Sylvan Library
4 Thoughtseize
Didn't actually use that Sylvan Library all day although I liked the 4th Decay.
Won against
Burn with treasure cruise.
G1 Guide + Eidolon + burn gets me
G2-3 Natural order for Elderscale Wurm gets there.
BUG with treasure cruise
G1 take some early delver beats and my glimpse got forced but natural hoof gets there
G2 Natural Order for progenitus
Death and Taxes
G1 Turn 3 natural order hoof
G2 Turn 4 natural order Progenitus gets there.
Enchantress
G1 glimpse turn 2 but fizzle and don't draw a Natural Order. Goes nuts playing enchantments drawing cards and assembling Rest in peace Helm to mill me out.
G2 Natural order hoof on turn 3 before he gets going.
G3 Natural ORder hoof on turn 3 before he gets going.
RU Delver 1 with treasure cruise
G1 Hardcast Ruric Thar on turn 3 with ability to pay for Daze and no force so scoops.
G2 Take huge damage turn 2 but Natural Order for Elderscale Wurm turn 3 takes it. he cast treasur cruise but it didn't matter.
RU Delver 2 with treasur crusie.
G1 Natural Order for Ruric Thar gets there
G2 get killed on his turn 3 to the multiple swift spear, multiple probe cruise silliness.
G3 Natural Order for Elderscale Wurm gets there.
Lost
BURG Delver
G1 has force my natural order and get beat by 1 then 2 delvers in short order.
G2 has force for my glimpse and another force for my natural order get in some beats early but then he gets deathrite and deathrites me out before I draw anything.
Deathblade
G1 opponent wins die roll and has turn 1 fetch deathrite, turn 2 clique took my glimpse and turn 4 clique gets a jitte turn 3
G2 opponent has turn 1 thoughtseize takes my glimpse, turn 2 stoneforge, turn 3 cage didn't get an Abrupt Decay before he had jitte online.
Elves mirror
G1 he wins the die roll and hoofs me first.
G2 I thoughtseize him turn 2 and take glimpse, I glimpse turn 3 but fizzle but have Natural order in hand for turn 4kill. he top decked glimpse and glipses and kills me on his turn 3.
Nic fit
G1-2 get therapied and lose my glimpse/natural order + don't draw anything relavent before he kills me.
Elderscale wurm was pretty good vs burn and RU Delver like I thought it would be. Didn't play any Miracles all day so did not use Sylvan Library but every other card got use. Didn't miss the blue splash since I did not play against any blue based combo, painter or belcher.
Would sideboard Umezawa's Jitte be worth considering for creature match ups? Was thinking it would been good in most of the match ups I lost.
@Henocules
You do have less explosives Glimpse hands drawing some of the non-elves instead of the 4th Herritage Druid and Nettle Sentinel but the contingency plan of having Ooze and Packmaster for grindy matches or Ruric against decks like storm to win is worth losing some of that explosiveness.
@Julian23
Nice that is pretty sweet, I prefer promo visionary for the art though. Just like I prefer the Promo Reclamation Sage even though it is not foil.
@Darth Obiwan
I have played agaisnt Show and Tell and Painter and wanted a 3rd Forest at times too.
I also tend to have a bad luck drawing the Progenitus as well but it is good against the Swords to Plowshares match ups.
Elderscale won me 3 matches against Burn and 2 RU Delver at Legacy Champs.
@Jx
If you run into fast combo the blue splash for Swan Songs is pretty sweet. a single 2/2 flyer doesn't really matter that much when your plan is to hoof them or get Ruric Thar. I actually dislike Therapy since you can guess wrong while Thoughtseize always takes a card and I hate sacrificing my elves since that goes against hitting critical numbers for hoofing. If your seeing alot of Oops all Spells though you want to run a combo deck with Force of Will like Reanimator or Sneak and Show.
@starfox
You don't really fill your grave yard fast enough for Treasure cruise to be good and even in game 2 Miracles tucks all your stuff with Terminus and Plowshares exiles. If you want to draw cards run Edric. I can see running Probe for information but you have to cut a land and something else for it and I rather know I have the land or combo peice rather then an unkown card off the top.
@Freyalise
5 Mana is too much for what this does.
@Gravesifter
I agree that this is a bit too expensive. Would be great at 4 mana.
@PaulJordan
Verus UWR delver with equipment and Cruise I board
+1 Null Rod, +2 Pithing Needle, +4 Abrupt Decay, +1 Progenitus, +1 Natural Order,
-2 Nettle Sentinel, -2 Heritage Druid, -2 glimpse of nature, -1 Craterhoof Behomoth, -1 Ruric thar, -1 Quiron Ranger
I run slightly different main deck with Ruric Thar and Packmaster maindeck with only 3 Natural Orders. Ruric is bad because they have Swords to Plowshares you want to be Natural Ordering for Progenitus unless you have enough elves in play for the kill through possible swords on the hoof.
What is Essense Warden against? Burn is likely to burn your Warden before you get to much value out of it. Elderscale Wurm is the card you want if you really want to beat burn. Although Ruric Thar does a decent job too.
@Absolute Law
Tried this awhile ago back when the White splash was the way to go with for the Mirror Entity and I found it really didn't help that much versus burn. They might burn a key elf with the Absolute Law on the stack and then just proceed to burn you. You either had your Natural Order or got burned out. Where Absolute Law does help is against Pyroclasm but I see more Golgari Charms and Zealous Persecution then I see Pyroclasm.
@Titania
5 mana bolt bait no thank you.
I assume the rolled back time till when Titania was still alive cause she kinda failed and died and Argoth got destroyed.
@Shagstagman
Slaughter Games requires two off colors and is too slow versus fast combo at 4 mana. It is a good option versus Terminus but is there really that many miracles? Maybe if you played in Europe but I played 0 miracles at Eternal weekend. Not sure I like Taiga just to cast Ruric either. Pendelhaven gives you more reach vs Miracles can make an elf survive a golgari charm or zealous persecution.
@Jamie7keller
Coat of Arms is bad because it costs 5 and can get destroyed as an instant when you rather just Natural Order for Craterhoof and just win that turn.
@Echelon
Issue with Mystic Remora is that the cumulative upkeep interferes with developing you board for the kill.
Not if you drop it T2 (we probably are on the play game 2 anyway) and just let it die T3 or T4... Mana is the one thing we always have enough of after our first turn and investing 1 mana to keep it up during 2 of our opponents' turns seems decent enough. You can use it to draw into Mindbreak Trap when your opponent's going off - he can play all the discard he wants but he'll never know if you've drawn a second copy or not (yay, mental games). And if that silly fish causes him to wait 2-3 turns before going of, you might have had the time to Hoof him to death already.
Very slick look :)
Come on. With Remora on the table you simply switch the sequencing of your discard to get around MBT. You also underestimate how Remora times your mana in the early turns (aka the timeframe you want it against combo). Only in Vintage with all the mana-artifacts, you can break the symmetry of landdrops/upkeep as you need a turn 1 DRS/GSZ or a fast Cradle to get going till turn 4.
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