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Thread: [Deck] DeathBlade

  1. #41
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    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    @Zombie: thanks for the hint. I will bring in my hatebears against elves next time...

    @ all: what is your opinion on Dimir Charm? Has anyone else tested the card so far?

    I think it is a nice all round card that can act as additional disruption and removal which is great, especially for those lists without FOW.

    Oppinions?

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    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    Quote Originally Posted by bob2008 View Post
    @ all: what is your opinion on Dimir Charm? Has anyone else tested the card so far?

    I think it is a nice all round card that can act as additional disruption and removal which is great, especially for those lists without FOW.

    Opinions?
    First of all it is great to see this thread moved to the DTB section. Let's keep pushing this archetype forward!

    As far as Dimir Charm is concerned, it like most of the other charms gives us three options, each for a slightly steeper cost than what would be paid for a card with just a single mode. That being said, all of the modes on Dimir Charm can be useful. The first mode counters Miracles, Vindicates, Show and Tells, plenty of combo pieces in Storm decks among others. The second mode kills loads of legacy viable creatures... some would include SCM, SFM, Dark Confidant, non-flipped Delvers, pretty much every non-KotR threat in Maverick as long as there isn't an active Mom... non-active Moms... and many more. The last mode actually can function as two separate modes, in that you can target yourself to dig deeper for answers or to clear land from the top of your deck or you can manipulate the top of your opponent's library to ensure that they cannot flip a delver, cannot Miracle a spell, kill themselves with a Bob, or are just drawing a blank on their next turn. The card is incredibly versatile and even though it may be more mana than any single mode would cost as a stand alone card, the flexibility is awesome. Making two mana shouldn't be too hard with this deck either. I would say that it is worth a shot. It might not be right for your specific meta game but it certainly is a strong option to consider.

  3. #43
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    Re: Deathblade

    Quote Originally Posted by Sturtzilla View Post

    I would wager that Decay stays in the deck as it is really flexible and deals with a very large swath of the threats that you will encounter. As far as the mana base, that is an area that probably needs some investigation. There is likely a configuration that is more stable that what is currently being played and still offers access to all 4 colors. That is what we may need to figure out!

    This weekend I played with 2 Decays MD while still having the 3 basiclands in the deck. It worked out well.
    3-0 finish, played against Goblins (2-0), Belcher (2-1) and Death and Taxes (2-0).
    As you can imagine against two of those decks the basics were awesome. The D&T player had Thalia and 2 Wastelands by turn 3, while I assembled Plains, Island and Swamp. Felt good...

    My manabase was the same as in my previous post but +1 Bayou

    3 Underground Sea
    2 Tundra
    1 Scrubland
    1 Bayou
    1 Tropical Island
    2 Wasteland
    1 Swamp
    1 Plains
    1 Island
    4 Polluted Delta
    3 Marsh Flats
    3 Flooded Strand

    I think this is still a greedy configuration but at least more stable than the “all-nonbasic-manabases” we see so often.... Basically I took out the Karakas and lowered the Wasteland count....

    Questions:
    Anybody else testing a list with basics? What are you experiences?
    How important is Wasteland in this deck? Of course Punishing Fire is an argument... + insane plays with DRS on T1 and T2 but I am still not sure if this is where you want to be with this deck...

    Regards,
    Bob

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    Re: Deathblade

    Quote Originally Posted by bob2008 View Post
    My manabase was the same as in my previous post but +1 Bayou

    3 Underground Sea
    2 Tundra
    1 Scrubland
    1 Bayou
    1 Tropical Island
    2 Wasteland
    1 Swamp
    1 Plains
    1 Island
    4 Polluted Delta
    3 Marsh Flats
    3 Flooded Strand

    Questions:
    Anybody else testing a list with basics? What are you experiences?
    How important is Wasteland in this deck? Of course Punishing Fire is an argument... + insane plays with DRS on T1 and T2 but I am still not sure if this is where you want to be with this deck.
    I have been a bit curious as to whether or not this deck can function with a few basics in the mana base. Your configuration seems pretty decent. I may have to give it a shot this week. I have not done any testing with basics yet, but it is certainly an area that needs to be explored. Wasteland is probably not essential, but playing it in tandem with Deathrite Shaman is very strong. Being able to remove an opponent's land and still being able to remove it on the following turn to make more mana is a great edge to have. Wasteland does give us some extra ways to interact with decks with lands like Grove of the Burnwillows, Creeping Tar Pit, and Karakas. These may be minor advantages beyond the ability to mana screw an opponent, but they still are upsides.

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    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    I used to be completely sold on basic lands over wastelands until I found the matchup against Maverick to be almost unwinnable because I could not kill Maze of Ith.

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    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    Quote Originally Posted by Shinwei View Post
    I used to be completely sold on basic lands over wastelands until I found the matchup against Maverick to be almost unwinnable because I could not kill Maze of Ith.
    This is a fair point. The meta at my LGS usually has one Aggro Loam deck and occasionally a Lands deck. With that in mind, I think it is worth considering both Wastelands to take out problematic lands (like you have mentioned, Maze of Ith, among others). However these decks both try to Wastelock opposing players. I think this warrants the testing of some number of basics. This also brings up and interesting point... as Deathblade is a deck that both fears and uses Wastelands, maybe we should give Life from the Loam a shot in the sideboard. Being able to recur Wastelands is very powerful in a few match ups. Additionally it could help in the grindy match ups where opponents are trying to deny our land/mana resources. I may give this a try over the next couple weeks as well. Thoughts?

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    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    What do you guys think about playing 4 Strix over Bob? He guarantees an extra card unless countered (unlike Bob), he flies with equipment, he's sort of creature-removal, and he's FoW fodder.

    Bob CAN net you more than 1 card (he can also net you zero), he swings for 2, he only requires 1 coloured mana.

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    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    Quote Originally Posted by Teluin View Post
    What do you guys think about playing 4 Strix over Bob? He guarantees an extra card unless countered (unlike Bob), he flies with equipment, he's sort of creature-removal, and he's FoW fodder.

    Bob CAN net you more than 1 card (he can also net you zero), he swings for 2, he only requires 1 coloured mana.
    Baleful Strix is a solid card; however, it is not on the same power level as Bob. Strix may allow for some 2-for-1ing, in that it replaces itself and either gets removed or trades up, but Bob requires an immediate answer (a 1-for-1) from your opponent. Unanswered you will begin to get so far ahead on cards that you will likely be able to answer anything that they try to do. I think Strix is a solid card and if you want to try testing him out, go for it. It would be great to hear your results.

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    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    So I played my Deathblade list that you can find below to a 3-0-1 finish at locals last night. I tested out a 3 basics mana base and also tried out some new sideboard options. So here is my list:

    4 Deathrite Shaman
    4 Stoneforge Mystic
    1 Snapcaster Mage
    1 Vendilion Clique
    3 Geist of Saint Traft
    4 Brainstorm
    1 Ponder
    2 Thoughtseize
    1 Inquisition of Kozilek
    4 Swords to Plowshares
    1 Umezawa's Jitte
    2 Abrupt Decay
    1 Detention Sphere
    3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
    1 Batterskull
    3 Force of Will
    3 Polluted Delta
    4 Flooded Strand
    1 Misty Rainforest
    2 Marsh Flats
    1 Island
    1 Swamp
    1 Plains
    3 Underground Sea
    2 Tundra
    1 Tropical Island
    1 Scrubland
    1 Bayou
    1 Creeping Tar Pit
    2 Wasteland

    Sideboard
    3 Nihil Spellbomb
    2 Flusterstorm
    1 Spell Pierce
    1 Inquisition of Kozilek
    1 Disenchant
    2 Meddling Mage
    1 Abrupt Decay
    1 Oblivion Ring
    1 Vindicate
    1 Notion Thief
    1 Force of Will

    Round 1: Life from the Loam/Pox [2-0]

    I won the die roll and led off with a fetch. I wasn't sure what my opponent was playing so I wanted to leave Brainstorm open to hide the good stuff in my hand. He played a swamp and passed. I Thoughtseized him on turn two and still had a land up to be able to Brainstorm. His hand was Hymn, Hymn, and lands. So I took a Hymn and passed. He Hymned me during his turn. I Brainstormed in response hiding a Geist and a Jace. Leaving a bunch of lands and creature removal spells in my hand. He hit a fetch and a Swords. I took my next turn and played Geist. The following turn was a Jace and that was all she wrote for that game.

    Sideboarding: -4 Swords to Plowshares, +1 Abrupt Decay, +3 Nihil Spellbomb

    Game two turned into more of a grind as my opponent was able to get the Life from the Loam engine online. This made the decision to include 3 basics really awesome as I wasn't ever really under the threat of being Wasted out of the game. This game went to the end of the round as he had multiple factories to block my small value guys with. The game ended with my Jace at 9 loyalty and double Deathrite removing spells from his graveyard.


    Round 2: Bant Slivers [2-0]

    I won the die roll and got off to a Deathrite start. My opponent played land and passed. I was able to fetch and play a Stoneforge finding Batterskull. My opponent's next turn was fetchland (Trop and Tundra) and Predatory Sliver. I tapped my Deathrite and removed his fetch to Swords the guy at his EoT. I played a land and passed. He made a land and a Winged Sliver... which seems suboptimal when compared to Galerider Sliver. I made an EoT Batterskull. I began to bring the beats for 4 lifelinked over the next few turns while my opponent swung back with a 1/1 flyer. Gamed ended with Deathrite doming him after I made it to like +30 life.

    Sideboarding: -2 Thoughtseize, -1 Inquisition of Kozilek, -3 Jace, +1 Abrupt Decay, +1 Vindicate, +1 Oblivion Ring, +1 Disenchant, +1 Spell Pierce, +1 Force of Will; I was really kicking myself for cutting the Engineered Explosives and Verdicts from my board at this point.

    Game 2 I was on the draw and kept double fetch, double Deathrite, Brainstorm, Geist, and Swords. Turn one for my opponent is land and pass. Mine was fetch, find USea, and cast Deathrite. He plays a second land and plays a Predatory Sliver. I land a turn two Geist. He plays a third land, casts a Muscle Sliver and attacks for 3. I gladly take the 3. My next turn was Swords on the untapped Sliver and crash for 6. I second main phased a Brainstorm which found me a fetch and an Abrupt Decay. So I played the land for turn and put the Decay in hand to kill the next threat. The game ended up going fairly deep... I got him pretty low and was able to Deathrite him out after a suicidal Geist attack a few turns later.


    Round 3: Affinity [2-1]

    This match went basically the same as the Slivers match. I was able to get two games where I had a better board position and was able to attack with Geist/Deathrite for enough to win. Game two I top decked land for 4-5 straight turns before my opponent managed to find an Etched Champion to start killing me with. Our game three was pretty awesome as we were both being hyper aggressive... at one point we were each at one life. He did not have the Galvanic Blast to kill me. I did have double Deathrite and was doming him and gaining life each turn. This was enough to get me the win.

    Sideboarding: -2 Thoughtseize, -1 Inquisition of Kozilek, -3 Jace, +1 Abrupt Decay, +1 Vindicate, +1 Oblivion Ring, +1 Disenchant, +1 Spell Pierce, +1 Force of Will; Why did I cut those Engineered Explosives and Verdicts from my board?


    Round 4: Painter Combo

    As we were the only 3-0's, my opponent and I decided to split the prize pool. We both ended up taking $40 in store credit. Not bad for an evening of slinging Legacy.

    Overall, I think the maindeck is pretty solid. The basics were pretty nice in the Pox/Loam match up. I did feel that a lot of the time I was drawing just land after land after land. This could have been an artifact of poor shuffling or it might be right to cut a land from the deck. I was running the 24 land configuration. Maybe I cut a fetch and add a second Ponder. What do you guys think about that?

    As far as the sideboard goes, I really misjudged where the meta would be this week at my lgs. Next week I will be packing some Engineered Explosives and Supreme Verdicts. I think that would help with all of the non-Pox matches I had last night. I am continually underwhelmed by the Notion Thief in the sideboard. I realize that it is very strong versus combo decks that need to do a lot of manipulation, but I have yet to bring it in and have it change the course of a game. Anyway thanks for reading! If you have any suggestions please let me know!

  10. #50
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    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    Thanks for your report. Very nice read.
    Glad to hear that the basics served you well.
    I like the basics too - especially because I often face RUG on the other side of the table.
    Think you can easily go down to 23 lands. Given that you want at least 2 wastelands I would suggest cutting the Tar Pit ... Even if it is a great card it really shines against opposing Walkers... Hmmm, Walkers.... difficult...

    @ N.Thief: So far I have not been impressed with Notion Thief either – sometimes there is just no window to play him... A few weeks ago Shardless BUG was really cold to him but now most lists bring in Golgari Charm and /or Disfigure so they can handle him easily... Anyway, I will continue to test him. If Jace wars become a real issue it might even be justified to play 2 copies...

    @ B.Strix: I love this card – IMHO 2-3 copies should be somewhere in the 75... No matter if you play Bob or GoST

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    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    Quote Originally Posted by bob2008 View Post
    Glad to hear that the basics served you well. I like the basics too - especially because I often face RUG on the other side of the table.
    Think you can easily go down to 23 lands. Given that you want at least 2 wastelands I would suggest cutting the Tar Pit ... Even if it is a great card it really shines against opposing Walkers... Hmmm, Walkers.... difficult...
    I think the cut down to 23 lands will be fine. I was leaning more towards cutting a fetch land. The Wastes can really help out against problematic lands, just help you set back opponents, and are great in tandem with Deathrite. As for the Tar Pit I haven't been real impressed with it. Although I have not had to face many mirror matches or games with lots of walkers. So I think I may leave it in for the time being.


    Quote Originally Posted by bob2008 View Post
    @ N.Thief: So far I have not been impressed with Notion Thief either – sometimes there is just no window to play him... A few weeks ago Shardless BUG was really cold to him but now most lists bring in Golgari Charm and /or Disfigure so they can handle him easily... Anyway, I will continue to test him. If Jace wars become a real issue it might even be justified to play 2 copies...
    I have found that as a 1-of, I don't find him when I want him. Also to be able to realistically play him, you want a turn 1-2 Deathrite so you can flash him in a turn early. Every time I have cast him, he has been a 3/1 body with basically no text. Sometimes he does draw out counters or removal which is good. The few times I have had him stick in play, his text has been irrelevant. I am not sure on him, but I will test him out for another week or two.

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    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    So I have decided to play deathblade because stoneblade is awesome, and so is deathrite shaman. Here is what i'll be testing:

    4 Stoneforge
    4 Deathrite Shaman
    2 Snapcaster
    1 Vendilion Clique
    2 Geist of St. Dude
    3 Jace the Mind Dude

    4 Swords to Plowshares
    4 Brainstorm
    2 Inquisition of Kozilek
    2 Thoughtseize
    3 Force of Will
    1 Vindicate
    2 Lingering Souls
    1 Ponder

    1 Batterskull
    1 Jitte
    1 Engineered Explosives

    3 Underground Sea
    2 Tundra
    1 Scrubland
    1 Tropical Island
    1 Karakas
    9 Fetchlands
    1 Plains
    1 Swamp
    1 Island
    2 Wasteland

    I might be wrong, but Lingering Souls is just such a good card that I can't imagine cutting it. It gives the deck so much reach against every deck trying to do fair things, and helps Stoneblade attack from a different angle, while pressure planeswalkers (Todd Anderson mentioned this deck suffers from the new walker rule, and I think Souls will help that). The Split between that and Geist is a bit of hedging, as they're both powerful in different contexts, and the game you're playing can sort of be shaped around that. I want to find the space for the 3rd snapcaster, but I don't want to overload my 3 drop spot, and i'm not sure what to cut. Engineered Explosives and Vindicate are just an out to the weird things that come up, and EE always does work for me. AS for the lands, i'm only running 22 because that's what stoneblade/shardless bug runs. It's possible that it's wrong, but it works in those decks and it's the best frame of reference I have, so i'll see where it takes me. Basics are awesome, so that's that.

    Any input? Is this list sub-optimal?

  13. #53

    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    @ Sturtzilla: I love your list. I have been testing it, so far I think I am 3 cards different than you, but it plays like a dream. I play a Supreme Verdict and an EE main, as well as only 23 lands and it's been epic. I'm sticking to this list and I think it's actually really close to being optimal. People shouldn't be afraid of a 4-c manabase, it's not insanely greedy. Sure, recurring wastes are probably the end of my winning, but I highly doubt that it's because it's a 4-c list. My 2 green duals would be another basic Island and a Karakas if I didn't go for the 4-c splash, and that really doesn't do a lot in the recurring waste scenario. Props to the list.

    -ABC

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    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    What is everyone's line of attack on sideboard options against turbo eldrazi? I have a few local players sporting it and it seems like a near impossible match-up for deathblade

  15. #55

    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    I have been playing the bob variant over geist. How important do you guys value FOW in the main?(dont really wanna flip a FOW to bob) My meta seldom has combo. More of miracles, shardless bug and tempo decks.

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    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    Quote Originally Posted by the_ob3lisk View Post
    What is everyone's line of attack on sideboard options against turbo eldrazi? I have a few local players sporting it and it seems like a near impossible match-up for deathblade
    More wastelands, maybe surgical to hit clouposts? Post is just naturally very good vs most other fair decks.
    They are a bit soft to wasteland which is why they run MB Pithing Needle.
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    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    Quote Originally Posted by the_ob3lisk View Post
    What is everyone's line of attack on sideboard options against turbo eldrazi? I have a few local players sporting it and it seems like a near impossible match-up for deathblade
    It's your bad matchup :) You shouldn't be preparing for this match up as it is a minority. However if it runs rampant then major changes to the deck must be done or play another deck

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    Quote Originally Posted by the_ob3lisk View Post
    What is everyone's line of attack on sideboard options against turbo eldrazi? I have a few local players sporting it and it seems like a near impossible match-up for deathblade
    During my BUG Delver days, sinkhole/ surgical/hymn was brutal against turbo. Just a thought
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    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    Quote Originally Posted by learntolove6 View Post
    So I have decided to play deathblade because stoneblade is awesome, and so is deathrite shaman. Any input? Is this list sub-optimal?
    I think the list looks like a fine starting point. I will say that you probably don't want 3 Snapcasters. I started with 2 main and 1 boarded a ways back. That number just shrank overtime. Two is fine but don't be afraid to cut him. I think there is a lot of hedging in your list. Do you want to be aggressive or controlling? Also don't forget about Abrupt Decay. It is baller. Give you list a few runs and just start tweaking it. That is really the best way to do things.


    Quote Originally Posted by Secretly.A.Bee View Post
    @ Sturtzilla: I love your list. I have been testing it, so far I think I am 3 cards different than you, but it plays like a dream. I play a Supreme Verdict and an EE main, as well as only 23 lands and it's been epic. I'm sticking to this list and I think it's actually really close to being optimal. People shouldn't be afraid of a 4-c manabase, it's not insanely greedy. Sure, recurring wastes are probably the end of my winning, but I highly doubt that it's because it's a 4-c list. My 2 green duals would be another basic Island and a Karakas if I didn't go for the 4-c splash, and that really doesn't do a lot in the recurring waste scenario. Props to the list.

    -ABC
    Thank you for the kind words but I am probably not the one who deserves the credit. The list I posed a bit ago [http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...l=1#post740952] was a hybridization between Anderson's most recent list and some comments that Bob2008 had suggested to make the deck a bit more resilient to Wastelands. So I guess it has been a community effort. I am glad the deck is working well for you. I think the mass removal main is a bit counter productive as we play a lot of creatures, but if you meta is very aggro heavy, could be the correct call.


    Quote Originally Posted by mike1987 View Post
    I have been playing the bob variant over geist. How important do you guys value FOW in the main?(dont really wanna flip a FOW to bob) My meta seldom has combo. More of miracles, shardless bug and tempo decks.
    When I was running Bob, I would guess the average damage I would take from him before winning (or being way ahead on cards) or he would be killed was 3-4. I never flipped a FoW. I don't think it is worth worrying about. The majority of the deck is 1-2 converted and we play a lot of lands... so you aren't going to be doming yourself that bad. And if you flip a FoW once in awhile, that would be the cost of greatness.


    Quote Originally Posted by the_ob3lisk View Post
    What is everyone's line of attack on sideboard options against turbo eldrazi? I have a few local players sporting it and it seems like a near impossible match-up for deathblade
    This is not a matchup that I have much experience with. I would agree that you shouldn't really devote too much time and/or sideboard space to it as it is a fringe deck. Disrupting their mana base would be my first idea. So possibly running a Life from the Loam or two to chain Wastelands would be decent. I also like the Surgical Extraction idea here.

  20. #60

    Re: [DTB] DeathBlade

    Well, at the risk of being strewn across the *message* board, I am going to share my list. It's tuned to my metagame, again, IT'S TUNED TO MY METAGAME, which happens to be LOTS of Stoneforge, but here it is:

    Creatures: 12
    4 DRS
    3 Stoneforge Mystic
    1 V. Clique
    4 Geist of St. Traft

    Spells: 26
    1 Umezawa's Jitte
    1 Batterskull
    4 Swords to Plowshares
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Force of Will
    2 Spell Pierce
    1 Misdirection
    1 Inquisition of Kozilek
    1 Thoughtseize
    1 Elspeth, Knight Errant
    3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
    1 Engineered Eplosives
    1 Supreme Verdict
    1 Abrupt Decay

    Land: 22
    4 Flooded Strand
    3 Polluted Delta
    1 Misty Rainforest
    1 Marsh Flats
    1 Windswept Heath
    2 Wasteland
    2 Tundra
    1 Underground Sea
    1 Scrubland
    1 Tropical Island
    1 Karakas
    1 Creeping Tar Pit
    1 Plains
    1 Island
    1 Swamp

    SB: 15
    2 V. Clique
    2 Flusterstorm
    2 S. Extraction
    1 Sword of Feast and Famine
    1 Inquisition of Kozilek
    1 Thoughtseize
    2 Abrupt Decay
    4 Leyline of Sanctity

    Anything you see that seems amiss should be noted. Let me know if you disagree with any of my choices, but I haven't lost for many, many matches other than against Omni-Tell, and that's a matchup I do feel it's okay to lose to, however frustrated I get. It's my worst matchup, and I know it.

    -ABC

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