[Article]Eternal Europe: M14 Brew Review

[Mon,Goblin Chief]

You know how these work by now I think :)

http://www.starcitygames.com/article...ew-Review.html

Enjoy!

[Megadeus]

Shit I got the same idea for a white weenie deck I've been brewing and our lists are a bit similar. I forgot about vial however. Meekstone T1 T2 sovereign seems powerful

[Deviruchi]

Interaction of Young Pyromancer + Quiet Speculation + Cabal Therapy blew my mind ^^ . Thank you for another good article Carsten.

[lyracian]

Counter-slivers got better but I am not convinced it is better than Merfolk. It still suffers with the problems of trying to cast FoW...

I am more interested in the Red Striking Sliver putting First Strike and an extra lord into a Jund or RUG slivers deck looks promising.

[Zombie]

Sliver tokens? NO(Legion/Megantic Sliver)

[Parcher]

1. Substitute all mentions in article of "Cabal", or "Cartel" plus [deck] with "Meandeck".
2. Compare to any Stephen Menendian article circa 2007-10.
3. Profit?

[TsumiBand]

Interaction of Young Pyromancer + Quiet Speculation + Cabal Therapy blew my mind ^^ . Thank you for another good article Carsten.

Blimey, that's a good catch. O______O

I knew those Quiet Specs would matter. Someday.

It is a *little* weird that SFM gets mentioned re: Young Pyromancer - but doesn't show up in your White Weenie list. I may have just missed something somewhere, but I think that Elspeth is pretty easily replaced by SFM. Maybe even some of those Serra Avengers come out in favor of SFM and +1 Batterskull - as long as we're monopolizing Meekstone, I would submit that Batterskull + Jitte + SFM is sturdier technology Serra Avenger + Elspeth, IMHO.

[Barook]

I agree that the WW list lacks the SFM package.

Pyromancer + Quiet Speculation looks pretty awesome. Good catch. One could also think about combining Speculation with Lingering Souls and/or Faithless Looting.

[TsumiBand]

I agree that the WW list lacks the SFM package.

Pyromancer + Quiet Speculation looks pretty awesome. Good catch. One could also think about combining Speculation with Lingering Souls and/or Faithless Looting.

Yeah, I'm really digging this. It might be worthwhile to scope the other 'cheap as free' Flashback spells as well. As long as it's a Grixis list, Dread Return is kinda sorta free but pretty steep, even with Young Pyromancer in effect.

It's bad bad bad but a RUW list might giggle about Battle Screech creating a fuck-billion tokens. I think Lingering Souls is probably just better, but that's implicitly 4 colors, and no one would eeeever do that.

Can't overlook Deep Analysis either; if Sign in Blood is borderline good enough, DA is probably somewhere in the good-enough zone too.

Quiet Spec -> triple Lava Dart for the lulz? It's like 7 damage counting your tokens + Young MC Pyromancer. I'm totally kidding. But maybe I'm not. Plus it would be amazing to +9 your goddamn Kiln Fiend for the low low cost of "don't have any land".

[HammafistRoob]

Constructive criticism below, not trying to go in dry on your article or anything.

Why would you use Fauna Shaman in slivers? Seriously? Ever heard of Homing Sliver? Instant speed matron, minus the 1/1 body, would fill the same roll much better since you don't have to pray Shaman lives for a turn.

Also please never compare anything to Timewalk again. Nothing in Legacy except Brainstorm and Force are anywhere near the power level of Timewalk, and I'm sick of hearing people say "loltimewalk in legacy". For UU you get an extra untap step, draw step, 2 extra main phases, and an extra combat step. Oh and you get ahead by a land drop. Just a request, you can continue to mislead players if you want by making blatantly false comparisons.(BTE being compared to the great 'walk? You blew my mind)

I do actually like the Quiet Speculation+ Young Pyromancer tech. Seems worth exploring to me just because I love Cabal Therapy.

Also, Xathrid Necromancer and Dark Supplicant WILL spawn another crazy Blood Artist deck in Standard. Yay mono black!!

Who is your editor? I'd gladly take that position if possible, even though I know it isn't. Point being, new editor.

[alphastryk]

Quiet Spec for Lava dart seems not terrible somehow. Is there some way to abuse the Pyromancer tokens + Quiet Spec + Dread Return?

Something to keep in mind with quiet spec - are Intuition or Entomb just better in the situations?

[Barook]

Yeah, I'm really digging this. It might be worthwhile to scope the other 'cheap as free' Flashback spells as well. As long as it's a Grixis list, Dread Return is kinda sorta free but pretty steep, even with Young Pyromancer in effect.

It's bad bad bad but a RUW list might giggle about Battle Screech creating a fuck-billion tokens. I think Lingering Souls is probably just better, but that's implicitly 4 colors, and no one would eeeever do that.

Can't overlook Deep Analysis either; if Sign in Blood is borderline good enough, DA is probably somewhere in the good-enough zone too.

Quiet Spec -> triple Lava Dart for the lulz? It's like 7 damage counting your tokens + Young MC Pyromancer. I'm totally kidding. But maybe I'm not. Plus it would be amazing to +9 your goddamn Kiln Fiend for the low low cost of "don't have any land".

That 4 color part sounds bad, but on the other hand, Lingering Souls only costs when put into the yard with Speculation and you could also Brainstorm away stuck copies in your hand before using Speculation.

Dread Return sounds like the danger of cool things, but who knows? What if you run an Intuition package? Fatty of choice, Faithless Looting and Dread Return - no matter what they'll give you, you just flashback/cast Looting in the next turn (or in the same turn if you have enough mana). At that point, you should have enough creatures around thanks to tokens to flashback Dread Return to reanimate your fatty. Brilliant.

[HammafistRoob]

Seems MUCH worse than Entomb+any Reanimation spell. I'm not sure being a slow graveyard deck will get you even 1 round in a serious environment.

[Megadeus]

Seems MUCH worse than Entomb+any Reanimation spell. I'm not sure being a slow graveyard deck will get you even 1 round in a serious environment.

Aggro Loam does fine.

[Barook]

Seems MUCH worse than Entomb+any Reanimation spell. I'm not sure being a slow graveyard deck will get you even 1 round in a serious environment.

It would suck as a main strategy, but why not as a plan B? Intuition can still grab you normal stuff. Faithless Looting might be worth running anyway with Pyromancer and flashback spells, so you would sacrifice 1 slot for Dread Return and 1-2 slots for fatties of choice. Considering you would run both Brainstorm AND Looting for filtering, sacrificing those few slots for potential blowouts doesn't sound too bad.

Question is what fatties are worth running? Iona? Griselbrand? Elesh Norn? (hooray for pumping out 3/3 tokens)

Edit: On another note - Intuition with Snapcaster Mage + Unearth might have some potential as well.

[TsumiBand]

It would suck as a main strategy, but why not as a plan B? Intuition can still grab you normal stuff. Faithless Looting might be worth running anyway with Pyromancer and flashback spells, so you would sacrifice 1 slot for Dread Return and 1-2 slots for fatties of choice. Considering you would run both Brainstorm AND Looting for filtering, sacrificing those few slots for potential blowouts doesn't sound too bad.

Question is what fatties are worth running? Iona? Griselbrand? Elesh Norn? (hooray for pumping out 3/3 tokens)

Edit: On another note - Intuition with Snapcaster Mage + Unearth might have some potential as well.

Vintage Fish lists flirted with Tinker->somethingBig as an escape hatch for a while. This reminds me of that, only instead of a 2-card combo I suppose it's a lot more than that. But I think you're right, one is incidentally playing Faithless Looting anyway, so going to get Dread Return + somethingBig + FL isn't all that weird and might actually be quite strong.

[Gheizen64]

You seriously want to build around a worse Fecundity?