Yet To Be Broken Cards

[Rush80]

I am wondering about cards (Legacy playable) which have minimal use in Legacy nowadays but people feel they have a great potential if and when additional cards are printed.

I suggest to have a Thread about this topic if it has not been address yet.

Possible examples are:
Force of Savagery
Helix pinnacle
Mayael's Aria
Mortal Combat
Lich's Mirror
Phage the Untouchable
Transcendence
One with nothing
Naked Singularity
Divine Intervention
Goblin Game
Scornful Egotist
Battle of the Wits
Biovisionary
Near-Death Experience
Test of Endurance
Lich
Hatred
Cadaverous Bloom

Please find below a link for Alternate Win/lose Conditions cards
http://wiki.mtgsalvation.com/article/Alternate-win_card

Perhaps you may choose to contribute to this thread suggesting cards with great potential: "the Yet to be broken cards" (YTBB).

[Nihil Credo]

I don't see the point of this thread, other than listing your pet cards and saying "oh I wish Wizards would print something to make them good!", which is just white noise.

Magic is such a complicated game that nearly every card more complex than a vanilla has a chance of being broken by the right card; this is neither interesting nor useful information. Would Grindstone have been mentioned in a thread like this, before Painter's Servant was printed? Even if it did, would it have stood out compared to hundreds of other cards equally as unlikely to become combo pieces?

I'm not locking this thread yet, but only on the off-chance that I am wrong or missing something.

[(nameless one)]

I have toyed with Naked Singularity (with Welder) before. If you can get both to stick, you will win the game but so can Welder + Sundering Titan/Mindslaver.

The problem was the deck's dependency to Goblin Welder.

Shouldn't Goblin Game be banned? I feel like it suffers from Shaharazad Syndrome.

[apple713]

I am wondering about cards (Legacy playable) which have minimal use in Legacy nowadays but people feel they have a great potential if and when additional cards are printed.

I suggest to have a Thread about this topic if it has not been address yet.

Possible examples are:
Force of Savagery
Lich's Mirror
Phage the Untouchable
One with nothing
Naked Singularity
Scornful Egotist
Battle of the Wits
Biovisionary
Near-Death Experience
Test of Endurance
Lich
Hatred
Cadaverous Bloom

Please find below a link for Alternate Win/lose Conditions cards
http://wiki.mtgsalvation.com/article/Alternate-win_card

Perhaps you may choose to contribute to this thread suggesting cards with great potential: "the Yet to be broken cards" (YTBB).

Actually im just gonna stop here (and not finish what i was writing) cause your wasting everones time...

Divine Intervention - this card forces a draw....WTF do you expect to break about it? a 0-0-X record?



The problem with those cards is that most are too mana intensive for legacy.

Helix pinnacle
Mayael's Aria
Goblin Game

To time intensive

Mortal Combat
Transcendence

[catmint]

It might not be a competitive discussion, but why not let people speculate about crazy combos. I don't think locking this thread is appropriate. There have been a lot MUCH more crappy threads which have not been threatened to be locked. If this is a start to a more restricive moderation so the quality of the forum is increased I would appreciate it, but then moving it to "casual" is also an option.

To the topic: can't thik of anything that makes lich even a tier3 combo.

[noahgs]

Why are we being so harsh on this and calling it a waste of time, It makes for good conversation and the decks of tomorrow may be comprised of some of these little gems.

[evanmartyr]

I've always thought that there were a few hidden gems waiting to be exploited. The card that immediately leaps to mind is Didgeridoo. Just needs a huge, game-ending Minotaur or Changeling, or some card (some card better than Conspiracy, rather) that turns all your huge, game-ending monsters into a Minotaur.

Really, anything that references a tribe and does something potentially powerful or unique is a pretty good candidate for this thread. I'm not sure most of the alternate win cons belong here, since they're not looking for an engine, per se, they're looking for a fragile and very specific board state (Near-Death Experience? Ugggggh.). Force of Savagery is the one in your list that I didn't know about.

Darksteel Reactor, actually, I'd throw in the list. It's not horrifically expensive, mana-wise, it's durable, it wins immediately upon the condition being met (not during your upkeep like a lot of the others) and it doesn't require you to do anything other than flop around on top of the opponent for 20 turns (or less, if you have some way to charge it like Energy Chamber, Power Conduit, Surge Node, or Coretapper. So until we get the reverse version of Vampire Hexmage, which I doubt will show up anytime soon, it'll be a weird build-around card.

Test of Endurance seems fine, but most decks that care about life gain either don't generate nearly enough extra life to get that high or have a much easier way of winning (Any version of Soul Sisters or Zombardment that's successful in Legacy will just kill your opponent rather than bother with a 4cc enchantment).

[thefringthing]

Won't this just be a list of every unplayable Johnny rare?

[JanoschEausH]

I once played around with Near-Death Experience, Blood Celebrant, Academy Rector, Plunge into Darkness and Diabolic Intent. Was fun. But nowhere near competetive.

[Rush80]

To All,

thank you for sharing your feeling about being full-of-wonders on this Thread. This make you wonder-full as the Game itself.


In this Thread, I suggest to avoid looking to combo-cards amongst the one printed which work now but we are open to speculation about possible cards which may interact nicely.

For example:

To the topic: can't thik of anything that makes lich even a tier3 combo.

Assuming the following card: { WW Stairs to Heaven: Sorcery. You gain 20 life. You lose the game at the beginning of your the next upkeep }.
You may not exclude Wizards print a card which allow you to gain a significant amount of life.

On Divine Intervention: It is the only card which allows you to intentionally draw.
Now consider this upcoming card, which Wizard may print (remember that in this game it is possible to draw intentionally or not):
{ B Tipping Point: Enchantment. When you cast Tipping Point you lose 6 life. If the game ends in a draw; you win. }

On Mana and Time Intensive cards for Legacy: yes these card looks intensive until they are not:
Omniscience, Hive Mind, Grieslebrand, Emrakul and many Bombs are perfect example of cards played now in Legacy.

To Nihil Credo: I share your concern about any card being a possible Bomb if new enabling-card is printed.
However we may identify now specific themes that certain cards have which may create synergy with new cards as they are printed:
Divine Intervention is an example, Force of savagery another one being the only creature with a significant power and zero toughness.

I still remember how Chaos Orb used to be use in Type 1...

Wonders and Imagination

[Tao]

You can significantly reduce the list by removing cards that CANNOT be broken or that simply have better alternatives already.

For example even if you get Force of Savagery to work, it will still be not much better than Knight of the Reliquary so what is the point. Same for Biovisionary. Control four KotRs at the beginning of your upkeep and you win the game as well. LED is strictly better by a million times compared to One with Nothing. Mortal Combat is way to restrictive in deck building and Divine Intervention isn't breakable by definition.

[Rush80]

To All,

thank you for sharing your feeling about being full-of-wonders on this Thread. This make you wonder-full as the Game itself.


In this Thread, I suggest to avoid looking to combo-cards amongst the one printed which work now but we are open to speculation about possible cards which may interact nicely.

For example:

To the topic: can't thik of anything that makes lich even a tier3 combo.

Assuming the following card: { WW Stairs to Heaven: Sorcery. You gain 20 life. You lose the game at the beginning of your the next upkeep }.
You may not exclude Wizards print a card which allow you to gain a significant amount of life.

On Divine Intervention: It is the only card which allows you to intentionally draw.
Now consider this upcoming card, which Wizard may print (remember that in this game it is possible to draw intentionally or not):
{ B Tipping Point: Enchantment. When you cast Tipping Point you lose 6 life. If the game ends in a draw; you win. }

On Mana and Time Intensive cards for Legacy: yes these card looks intensive until they are not:
Omniscience, Hive Mind, Grieslebrand, Emrakul and many Bombs are perfect example of cards played now in Legacy.

To Nihil Credo: I share your concern about any card being a possible Bomb if new enabling-card is printed.
However we may identify now specific themes that certain cards have which may create synergy with new cards as they are printed:
Divine Intervention is an example, Force of savagery another one being the only creature with a significant power and zero toughness.

I still remember how Chaos Orb used to be use in Type 1...

Wonders and Imagination

[spg]

Won't this just be a list of every unplayable Johnny rare?

I think most of the cards mentioned are likely unplayable Johnny rares, but you never know. Here are a few that I think about occasionally. They may not be candidates for being 'broken', but they might get good depending on which decks/metagames emerge:

Teferi's Response - I've tested this in the past and it's a huge blowout... when it works. Doesn't work very often though. For about 3 seconds when Deathrite Shaman started getting popular I thought this card was going to be sick tech - of course it doesn't work though.
Hunting Grounds - Needs a lot to go right to be good. If it could get the extra turn from Emrakul would be a lot better... Needs a lot to go right to be good.
Arboria - Weird Moat variant. Good with planeswalkers?
Strategic Planning - Was played in Vintage Welder decks for a short time, might find a niche home in a Legacy deck that wants to get cards into the graveyard without losing card advantage. Costs a fortune (in paper).
Tithe - I've played with this card before and it can be really strong. It can also be played in response to breaking a fetchland to get the greater effect. The primary weaknesses is that it makes mulligan decisions very difficult, and doesn't DO anything.
Artificer's Intuition - I've always loved this card and have been waiting for it to be usable. As far as I know there's no artifact Squee.
Necrologia - Competes with Ad Nauseum, might be better in some weird circumstances? Doesn't restrict deck construction casting costs as much.

[clavio]

Trained Armodon

[Julian23]

I don't know if anyone remembers the Deck but I played a Troll Divine Intervention in Wacky Deli.

[theillest]

This list needs more limited resources.

[Tao]

I think most of the cards mentioned are likely unplayable Johnny rares, but you never know. Here are a few that I think about occasionally. They may not be candidates for being 'broken', but they might get good depending on which decks/metagames emerge:

Teferi's Response - I've tested this in the past and it's a huge blowout... when it works. Doesn't work very often though. For about 3 seconds when Deathrite Shaman started getting popular I thought this card was going to be sick tech - of course it doesn't work though.
Hunting Grounds - Needs a lot to go right to be good. If it could get the extra turn from Emrakul would be a lot better... Needs a lot to go right to be good.
Arboria - Weird Moat variant. Good with planeswalkers?
Strategic Planning - Was played in Vintage Welder decks for a short time, might find a niche home in a Legacy deck that wants to get cards into the graveyard without losing card advantage. Costs a fortune (in paper).
Tithe - I've played with this card before and it can be really strong. It can also be played in response to breaking a fetchland to get the greater effect. The primary weaknesses is that it makes mulligan decisions very difficult, and doesn't DO anything.
Artificer's Intuition - I've always loved this card and have been waiting for it to be usable. As far as I know there's no artifact Squee.
Necrologia - Competes with Ad Nauseum, might be better in some weird circumstances? Doesn't restrict deck construction casting costs as much.

Now those are some good ones. I like.

Also: Izzet Charm - great card in RUG decks with Loam

[Barook]

This list needs more limited resources.

That would wreak havoc in Standard.

But in Legacy, where most decks operate in the 2-3 mana range? Not so much.

@Tithe: Weathered Wayfarer is the overall better card.

[Tammit67]

I came here expecting people to be discussing engines and shells that are a card or two away from being really powerful and format defining like goblin welder or artificer's intuition or worldly tutor or sword of the meek/thopter foundry. You know, a bunch of really powerful effects that don't have a competitive home.

Was wholly disappointed.

[Koby]