If your deck became completely inferior in the format...

[ntropy]

To reply to the OP and the thread in general; The decks I play tend to hide in the corners of the meta and never really get the attention required to have elements banned. I did shed a tear when I had to disassemble Full English Breakfast when Survival got the axe. As far as metagames shifting to make a deck worse - I'm happy to set aside a favorite while the hate cools off. This is a deep format, and I have multiple favorites. Chances are, old favorites can come around again in an updated form or as part of a new deck.

As far as Goyf goes - I remember when the discussion was how to include it in every deck, it's nice to see the format recovering finally. It's a strong card, and it took a few years to adapt to its presence, but it no longer dominates every game. On a related note, I remember when Psychatog was the only creature being talked about, and that went away, so things change...

[Ellomdian]

As far as Goyf goes - I remember when the discussion was how to include it in every deck, it's nice to see the format recovering finally. It's a strong card, and it took a few years to adapt to its presence, but it no longer dominates every game. On a related note, I remember when Psychatog was the only creature being talked about, and that went away, so things change...

It's funny, I was just looking at a Tog list (circa 2005) and wondering how much better Shriekmaw would be with Dr. Teeth than FtK ever was.

I think the biggest issue is that SnT has honed the format to such a sharp point around it, you can't afford not to play optimal efficiency strategies, and RUG prays on that. If the format had more breathing room, I feel like the sheer efficiencies of Goyf would start to be less essential.

[TheInfamousBearAssassin]

As far as Goyf goes - I remember when the discussion was how to include it in every deck, it's nice to see the format recovering finally. It's a strong card, and it took a few years to adapt to its presence, but it no longer dominates every game. On a related note, I remember when Psychatog was the only creature being talked about, and that went away, so things change...

The two aren't remotely comparable. Psychatog had to be built around. Strong creatures in general used to have to be built around. Goyf is literally stuck into random decks. And correctly so.

It's funny, I was just looking at a Tog list (circa 2005) and wondering how much better Shriekmaw would be with Dr. Teeth than FtK ever was.

I think the biggest issue is that SnT has honed the format to such a sharp point around it, you can't afford not to play optimal efficiency strategies, and RUG prays on that. If the format had more breathing room, I feel like the sheer efficiencies of Goyf would start to be less essential.

This is an extremely tedious argument, and a rather egotistical one, albeit in a typical way. It's very natural and understandable for us to want to feel like we are more evolved than those that went before because we have access to better technology; that because we have iPads and the cavemen didn't, we're better and smarter than they were. And of course we're not. We're just the comparative beneficiaries of time. So it is with metagames. It is not now more or less the case that "you can't afford not to play optimal efficiency strategies," whatever that's actually supposed to mean. There is in fact still, as there was, room to make suboptimal choices- economies are certainly never totally efficient.

[nedleeds]

I own cards. I don't own decks. The question doesn't really make sense to me.

[Fossil4182]

I'm hesitant to build what appear to be overly powerful decks in Legacy. I owned and was invested in both Reanimator and Survival of the Fittest when both were banned. It was a very souring experience. Since I unloaded a significant part of my collect, I typically invest in one deck and play it for several months then rotate it out when I get board. I have a few side decks that I loan out to people that are tier 1.5 or tier 2 (Manaless Dredge, White Trash, & Burn), but usually play something like BUG, or RUG.

I've had some interest in picking up Omni-Clash for a while, but I won't follow through because of past experiences. It's not even that I think its necessarily the best deck. I just get the feeling that Show and Tell has a target on it and the DCI will ban it soon.

The second biggest complaint I have about Legacy (and Magic in general) is the opaque nature of the DCI's decision calculus for adding cards to the Banned and Restricted. As a subsection of this complaint, I also find it annoying that the DCI doesn't more liberally unban cards, especially cards that have been banned "recently". For example, there have been really powerful cards printed in recent sets that are excellent answers to Survival of the Fittest based strategies: IE Deathrite Shaman, Cage, Rest In Peace, Surgical Extraction, etc.

[Dzra]

I've said this before, but let's look at the list of actual creatures that are commonly played in the format. Defining for a moment an "actual creature" as one that:

1) Is primarily meant to be used in combat, and

2) Is relevant affected by being removed.

The list used to be really large in Legacy. It is really large in Standard, a format with much less deck diversity than Legacy and a much smaller cardpool. It is basically:

Tarmogoyf
Delver of Secrets
Tombstalker
Nimble Mongoose
Knight of the Reliquary
Scavenging Ooze

I'd go so far as to say that KotR and Ooze probably don't belong in this category since they do have a lot of application outside of combat. Although really, we should add Geist of Saint Traft to this list since it is purely combat. Serra Avenger is another solely combat creature that sees play, as well as every creature in Affinity. To be fair, Stoneforge probably falls into the same in-between category as KotR and Ooze as a "creature that is mostly used purely for combat purposes, but has some utility outside that."

True aggro decks like Zoo used to exist in Legacy, but if any deck can splash Goyfs in and have an answer for every non-Goyf threat, then the strategy really isn't viable. Goyf is an evolutionary dead end unless and until they push the power curve on creatures up to where there's multiple viable combat threats in different colors at different costs; which they seem understandably reluctant to do. But until they give all creatures a free +1/+1 post dev, Goyf will be a problem in Legacy.

When Goyf happened, sure it took the format by storm. Like some have said though, it's not like getting rid of Goyf will make Wearbear or Mystic Enforcer good again. Most likely, it'll just spell the doom of Green-based tempo decks. The card pool has gotten much deeper and there is just no going back from that. New printings are creating new, and more importantly, faster archtypes all the time. Reanimator, ANT, and Show and Tell are all relatively new decks when compared to Wearbear. They have nothing to do with Goyf, but all help spell the doom of slow, non-interactive creatures. New cards get printed and Legacy takes and uses the best of them.

Really, this is just a game and the moral of the story is: If you are having fun playing the game, then why does it matter if your creatures' have additional text on them? If having more dynamic creatures means that you can't enjoy the game then I'm sorry, but I think that you're probably in the minority. If you are looking for a format that generally revolves only around combat and where you are rewarded for playing a smattering of inefficient (but flavorful beaters) then you should try more Limited. Everyone gets nostalgic about their early kitchen table experiences. Legacy (and even Modern) will never go back to the days of Mystic Enforcer, and even though I think it's a bit sad, I also think the game is far better for it.

As a subsection of this complaint, I also find it annoying that the DCI doesn't more liberally unban cards, especially cards that have been banned "recently". For example, there have been really powerful cards printed in recent sets that are excellent answers to Survival of the Fittest based strategies: IE Deathrite Shaman, Cage, Rest In Peace, Surgical Extraction, etc.

I agree with this.

[bjholmes3]

I will take this thread as an opportunity to say that if anything happens to my Storm combo deck the week after I get it, like Lion's Eye Diamond getting banned, say, that will be the day that this will happen.

That is all.

[Bed Decks Palyer]

I own cards. I don't own decks. The question doesn't really make sense to me.

Do you own Brand?

[rockout]

I played landstill for about 2-3 years straight back in 2007ish. Every month grinding people out and loving life. When merfolk became the flavor of the month and I had so many problems beating the deck consistently I started to play bad decks to try to stay competitive but never had the same win percentage as before. I'm not saying that's the reason I play less legacy now, but it sure made me super annoyed I couldn't play the one deck I really enjoyed anymore. It still sits in a box on my dresser waiting for a chance to make a comeback, it all honestly, it probably could compete against all the midranged crap going around now.

[Dzra]

The thing is that decks are always coming and going. Different strategies will be better next month than they were this month. Take that mono Red Painter deck that's been getting good lately. That deck wouldn't see the light of day if Shardless BUG weren't so big at the moment. That doesn't mean it isn't a great deck right now, but it might not be so hot a month from now.