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Thread: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

  1. #1921
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    I ain't hatin' - but, you cray-cray, yeah, haha.
    The upside of BURG was definitely being able to utilize DRS as an additional 1-drop threat that enabled you to either have the mana for deploying a Goyf and keeping up permission, while also being able to play Goose and additional tools like Decay, Discard, you name it. Adding Gurmag + Goyf + TNN in a deck and then trimming stuff like Wasteland and adding more midrange stuff like Night's Whisper and LftL in the main feels really janky. I've always felt that the more you lean towards midrange, the less effective the tempo plan becomes compared to dedicated tempo decks.

    I'm not saying this is terrible, since there are definitely cases where RUG runs out of gas and your version of BURG goes a little more on the grindy side, for example. It just doesn't look like a tempo deck.
    I would even go so far as saying that DRS was the core principle for running BURG. To me, BURG was always RUG Delver with DRS, pretty much. Leaner, more 1-drop creatures and access to discard / specific tools RUG could never use.

  2. #1922
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    Quote Originally Posted by DemolitionColorScheme View Post
    I ain't hatin' - but, you cray-cray, yeah, haha.
    The upside of BURG was definitely being able to utilize DRS as an additional 1-drop threat that enabled you to either have the mana for deploying a Goyf and keeping up permission, while also being able to play Goose and additional tools like Decay, Discard, you name it. Adding Gurmag + Goyf + TNN in a deck and then trimming stuff like Wasteland and adding more midrange stuff like Night's Whisper and LftL in the main feels really janky. I've always felt that the more you lean towards midrange, the less effective the tempo plan becomes compared to dedicated tempo decks.

    I'm not saying this is terrible, since there are definitely cases where RUG runs out of gas and your version of BURG goes a little more on the grindy side, for example. It just doesn't look like a tempo deck.
    I would even go so far as saying that DRS was the core principle for running BURG. To me, BURG was always RUG Delver with DRS, pretty much. Leaner, more 1-drop creatures and access to discard / specific tools RUG could never use.
    I get what you're saying but I'm not trying to build strictly worse Canadian (which is what BURG Thresh was). I want to play 4 Colour Delver as I always have which was as an aggressive blue-jund style deck. You could say "why don't you play a mid-range deck and cut delver" and the answer to that is that Delver and Daze/Wasteland beat combo decks and if I was happy to lose to combo I would main Goblins and sell my 40 duals. Is 3 Wasteland correct? I don't know. I would like to be able to do some testing but someone stole the tarns off my modo account so I can't even test the deck online Maybe 4 will show itself to be correct, we shall see.

    Burg Thresh could never be a better RUG because RUG has the "full shroud" plan - cut all delvers and rely on really sticky threats like Mandrills, Goose and TNN that are impossible to remove with bolt/push/decay and in the case of the latter two, plow. BURG could never do that and so a game plan built around "make DRS stick and then do rug things" felt a bit silly to me because DRS would always die and you obviously cannot progress to step two when you have failed to complete step one.

    Regarding Night's Whisper and Loam: Canadian players are currently playing a maindeck Loam so I would suggest that Loam is not so antithetical to the Delver plan as you suggest. The mana is no doubt sketchy so there is an obvious reason to play Loam but! I would not play Loam if it was just to make the mana work. The card works brilliantly with Brainstorm and Wasteland so it's equal parts reactive and proactive i.e the perfect Delver card.

    We have seen different variations of Night's Whisper/Painful Truths type cards in Delver with the DTT Grixis Delver lists and later with the Ben Friedman/Jarvis Yu Snapcaster BURG Delver lists. I never played the DTT Grixis Lists (played against them plenty and lost a lot) and my first Delver deck had 2 Snapcaster Mages main and 2 Painful Truths in the sideboard. Raw card-advantage spells work so well with the Delver plan that I could probably write a whole article on it. Maybe even a book! "Understanding Painful Truths" lmao.
    Quote Originally Posted by nedleeds View Post
    Dat 1/1 with built in pump. Watch out Griselbrand here comes lizard mid range.
    Quote Originally Posted by Von View Post
    Is this a troll or are gobbos really dtb?

  3. #1923
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    Hello? Is there anybody in there?

    I innitially thought 4c Delver was completely dead with the banning of DRS but I think it might have a place in today's meta given the rise in Pteramander Delver, DnT, and the uptick in control decks (Blade, Miracles, Grixis).

    The idea here is to play Abrupt Decay and have just enough red to support 4 Bolts mainboard and a couple of blasts in the board OR just enough green to support 3 Decays main and perhaps 1-2 sb options.

    What do you guys think is the best approach?
    Do you know what assuming does? It makes an ass out of you and me.
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  4. #1924
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    Quote Originally Posted by Qweerios View Post
    Hello? Is there anybody in there?

    I innitially thought 4c Delver was completely dead with the banning of DRS but I think it might have a place in today's meta given the rise in Pteramander Delver, DnT, and the uptick in control decks (Blade, Miracles, Grixis).

    The idea here is to play Abrupt Decay and have just enough red to support 4 Bolts mainboard and a couple of blasts in the board OR just enough green to support 3 Decays main and perhaps 1-2 sb options.

    What do you guys think is the best approach?
    God yes, let's get this deck going again.

    Lately I've been playing BUG Delver (for the same reasons you outlined as a reason to play BURG) to solid 3-1's at our local events and I find it to be very well positioned... with that said, I miss slinging Beta Bolts at people's domes for lethal and especially now without DRS, it's sometimes very difficult to get that last point of damage across.

    I think you may be on the money when you say:
    Quote Originally Posted by Qweerios
    The idea here is to play Abrupt Decay and have just enough red to support 4 Bolts mainboard and a couple of blasts in the board OR just enough green to support 3 Decays main and perhaps 1-2 sb options.
    My initial lists had Goyfs and that stretched the deck too much into Green as the primary colour. Borrowing from your idea, I've drafted a quick list that is essentially U/B Delver with small splashes.

    //Creature (10)
    4 Delver of Secrets
    3 Gurmag Angler
    3 True-Name Nemesis

    //Instant (21)
    3 Abrupt Decay
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Daze
    4 Force of Will
    4 Lightning Bolt
    2 Spell Pierce

    //Sorcery (7)
    4 Ponder
    3 Thoughtseize

    //Tribal Enchantment (2)
    2 Bitterblossom

    //Land (20)
    1 Badlands
    4 Polluted Delta
    4 Scalding Tarn
    2 Tropical Island
    3 Underground Sea
    1 Verdant Catacombs
    1 Volcanic Island
    4 Wasteland

    SB: 1 Ancient Grudge
    SB: 1 Cindervines
    SB: 2 Diabolic Edict
    SB: 1 Darkblast
    SB: 2 Flusterstorm
    SB: 1 Grafdigger's Cage
    SB: 1 Life from the Loam
    SB: 1 Marsh Casualties
    SB: 2 Pyroblast
    SB: 2 Surgical Extraction
    SB: 1 Sylvan Library
    Last edited by Stevestamopz; 05-06-2019 at 01:15 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by nedleeds View Post
    Dat 1/1 with built in pump. Watch out Griselbrand here comes lizard mid range.
    Quote Originally Posted by Von View Post
    Is this a troll or are gobbos really dtb?

  5. #1925
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    Nice list! It looks a lot like what I've been working on. I haven't been able to play much MtG lately due to work but the little I've done I've been rocking RUG or Grixis Delver with success (I never stopped slinging my beta bolts).

    How is this brew working out for you? I feel like squeezing 3 Pyromancers in there and call it a day... Let's get to work!

    First, given that we want to play Decay, we will want either black or green as our main complement to blue. I think we agree that the deck should be primarily UB given that black has the most to offer compared to green in terms of both main and side cards. I also think Grixis Delver, now without DRS, is a good comparison point for a core splashing green. Grixis has slowed down a lot since the banning and still retains a strong aggro-control plan without being the fastest Delver deck out there.

    Here's what I am aiming for:

    The classic Delver shell with 4 Delver, 4 Daze 4 FoW, 4 BS, 4 Ponder because those cards are essentially the essence of Delver;
    A 4 Bolt 3 Decay removal suite because I think it is the best possible combination of versatile removal pre-board in today's meta;
    A minimum of 2 Pierce and 2 TS as disruption against combo;
    At least 2 Gurmags and 2 TNN to go big;
    20 lands because we will likely want to make our first 3 land drops. I think 4 Wastelands, 9 Fetches, and 7 Duals is the way to go because 9 fetches gives you exactly one per opener.

    This totals 8 threats (not enough), 27 spells (anything more should be 1-2 Preordain IMO), and 20 lands (enough). For the remaining cards I suggest 5 threats:

    -A 3rd TNN because we already have 20 lands.
    -At least 1 mainboard Bitterblossom because the card is amazing against all sorts of control and depths strategy. Playing multiples alongside Thoughtseize can be difficult (even impossible) so I wouldn't advise more than 2 copies.
    -No more than 2-3 Pyromancers to smooth the curve and allow us to go wide. You only need 1 early Pyro to swarm a board and going wide is better than going hard against the swarm of control decks we see lately. I usually don't want to see 2 in my opener.

    From this I get:

    Threats (13)
    4 Delver of Secrets
    3 Young Pyromancer
    3 True-Name Nemesis
    2 Gurmag Angler
    1 Bitterblossom

    Spells (27)
    4 Lightning Bolt
    3 Abrupt Decay
    2 Thoughtseize
    2 Spell Pierce
    4 Daze
    4 Force of Will
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Ponder

    Lands (20)
    4 Wasteland
    4 Polluted Delta
    4 Scalding Tarn
    1 Misty Rainforest
    2 Underground Sea
    2 Volcanic Island
    2 Tropical Island
    1 Badlands


    Pretty much a standard Grixis list squeezing 3 Decays and a green splash...
    I think working a proper sideboard will be the real challenge for this deck. I think the only green I'll pack in the SB will be 1 Grudge and 1 Golgari Charm, the rest should be standard Grixis stuff. I know I will be testing a pair of Tyrant's Scorn against Marrit Lage...
    Do you know what assuming does? It makes an ass out of you and me.
    Get it...? Ass, u, me?

    ... ffs I was trying to be funny...

  6. #1926
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    I spent my free time today working on a theoretical SB and a brief map for this beauty. Here's what I got:


    3 Surgical Extraction
    3 Pyroblast
    2 Flusterstorm
    2 Tyrant's Scorn
    1 Ancient Grudge
    1 Dismember
    1 Grafdigger's Cage
    1 Umezawa's Jitte
    1 Bitterblossom


    3 Surgical and 1 Cage is my go-to GY-hate package post DRS ban for Delver decks. Surgical flips Delver, costs 0, works with Thoughtseize against Combo decks, and most importantly is one of our best lines of defense against PFire and Loam from Lands. Cage is the best hoser at CMC 1 for Dredge, Reanimator, Elves, Storm and fringe Cabal Therapy decks (Nic Fit and Zombardment). I would play a 2/2 split but I respect Lands too much in my meta.

    3 Pyroblast because I want a strong Miracles, Grixis, Stoneblade, and PteraDelver matchup. I have no answer to TNN so I intend on countering it. I find Pyroblast to simply be a must-have against Strix and gives me a huge supply of removal for Ptera and Delver. Now that I have Decay against CB and B2B I can use Pyroblasts to win counter wars and keep Miracles' card advantage in check (AK and Snap). I can't think of a better way to dominate UW Control decks with 3 Pyros and 3 Decays and so many resilient threats.

    2 Flusterstorm is the cheapest, highest quality counterspell against combo decks. This card is mostly a concession to Reanimator (Chancelor) and Storm. It's also great against Grixis control (KCommand, Deluge, Casualties, Hymn, Snapcaster), a strict upgrade to Pierce in Delver matchups, and can come in against Miracles.

    2 Tyrant's Scorn is a godsend against Marrit Lage, Reanimator, Smothers small creatures, and can save ours from removal. I find this card more widely applicable than Edict effects and can't wait to test it out.

    1 Ancient Grudge against Batterskull and as a 4th quick answer to Chalice. I was debating between KCommand and Grudge but I opted for Grudge as an edge against DnT and equipments in general.

    1 Dismember because I wanted an answer to Gurmag and Eldrazi and a 5th 1CMC removal spell that was easy to cast in a 4c deck. I originally had a Strix in that slot but I went for the cheaper and easier to cast option instead.

    1 Umezawa's Jitte because if there was ever a Delver deck that could go above with Jitte, it is definitely this one. I wanted a versatile and powerful lategame bomb to take over DnT and Eldrazi in the advent that we need to catch up. Jitte can mount a comeback against an active Mom, a TNN, and an Eldrazi board with the added benefit of shutting down Elves. Jitte is usually quite mana intensive for a Delver deck but the fact that it is colorless, that we have 20 lands to support it and that a lot of our creatures are disposable puny 1/1s makes Jitte a sound choice. I find Jitte both more versatile and powerful than Marsh Casualties or Golgari Charm.

    1 Bitterblossom that I couldn't fit in the main in order to really drive those control matchups home.

    Here's a few matchups I took the time to map with this SB, starting with the top3 Aggro decks:

    UR Delver
    -1 Bitterblossom -2 Thoughtseize, -2 Spell Pierce, -4 Force of Will
    +3 Pyroblast, +2 Flusterstorm, +2 Tyrant's Scorn, +1 Dismember, +1 Umezawa's Jitte

    This way we can really take control of the matchup by removing most of our life loss and overwhelm them with a total of 13 removal spells and a Jitte

    DnT and Maverick
    -4 Force of Will, -2 Spell Pierce
    +2 Tyrant's Scorn, +1 Ancient Grudge, +1 Dismember, +1 Umezawa's Jitte, +1 Bitterblossom

    With plenty of answers to creatures and artifacts we should be able to ride any of our evasive threats to victory in time if we can simply make consistent land drops.

    Eldrazi
    -1 Bitterblossom, -2 Spell Pierce, -2 Thoughtseize/Daze (Draw/Play)
    +2 Tyrant's Scorn, +1 Ancient Grudge, +1 Dismember, +1 Umezawa's Jitte

    With plenty of ways to interact with fast lock pieces, Dismember and Scorn to deal with big Eldrazis, all we need to do is land a Gurmag or TNN and ride it to victory.

    Top 3 Control decks + Lands:

    Miracles
    -4 Lightning Bolt, -2 Wasteland
    +3 Pyroblast, +2 Flusterstorm, +1 Bitterblossom

    Now with Decays, Bolts don't really have any place in that matchup as we can easily beat Mentors and have enough Pyroblasts to handle most of their permanents and card advantage. Wastelands lose a lot of value here when their plan involves B2B and playing around soft counters. Daze is probably the next worst card but at least it pitches to Force, buffers Flusterstorm and commands respect in the early turns when landing a Pyromancer or Blossom is crucial.

    Stoneblade
    -4 Force of Will, -3 Wasteland
    +3 Pyroblast, +2 Flusterstorm, +1 Ancient Grudge, +1 Bitterblossom

    Given the fair nature of this matchup where you have to deal with creature threats and don't have to contend with sweepers as much, I value Bolts over Force of Will in order to control Batterskull and race TNN. Just like Miracles, Wasteland doesn't have many targets here.

    Grixis Control
    -4 Lightning Bolt, -3 Abrupt Decay, -1 Tropical Island
    +3 Pyroblast, +2 Flusterstorm, +1 Ancient Grudge, +1 Dismember, +1 Bitterblossom

    Removal is virtually worthless in this matchup as it is all about controlling Strix and preventing incremental advantages from burying you. Pyroblast, Flusterstorm and Blossom are all great here. Grudge acts as repeatable Strix removal when on the Gurmag/Delver plan, and Dismember takes care of their fringe Gurmag/Kess.

    Lands
    -4 Daze, -2 Thoughtseize
    +3 Surgical Extraction, +2 Tyrant's Scorn, +1 Bitterblossom

    Scorn and Blossom gives us a good chance against Marrit Lage and hopefully we can Extract Loam or Wasteland and get to play a game.

    Against various combo decks:

    Sneak and Show
    -4 Lightning Bolt, -3 True-Name Nemesis, -1 Bitterblossom
    +3 Surgical Extraction, +3 Pyroblast, +2 Flusterstorm

    I bring in Surgicals here because they can have a much bigger impact than a TNN. I also keep Decays postboard against the popular Blood Moon, Artisan, and Sphere of Resistance.

    Depths
    -4 Lightning Bolt, -1 Tropical Island
    +2 Flusterstorm, +2 Tyrant's Scorn, +1 Bitterblossom

    Answers to Marrit Lage, Decays for Needle and Safekeeper.

    Storm
    -3 Abrupt Decay, -1 Bitterblossom, -2 Tropical Island
    +3 Pyroblast, +2 Flusterstorm, +1 Grafdigger's Cage

    No need for green in this matchup.

    Reanimator
    -1 Bitterblossom, -4 Lightning Bolt, -3 Abrupt Decay, -1 Tropical Island
    +3 Surgical Extraction, +2 Flusterstorm, +2 Tyrant's Scorn, +1 Grafdigger's Cage

    Elves
    -4 Daze, -2 Spell Pierce
    +2 Tyrant's Scorn, +1 Dismember, +1 Grafdigger's Cage, +1 Umezawa's Jitte, +1 Bitterblossom

    Plenty of reach, blockers, and removal.
    Do you know what assuming does? It makes an ass out of you and me.
    Get it...? Ass, u, me?

    ... ffs I was trying to be funny...

  7. #1927
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    Quote Originally Posted by nedleeds View Post
    Dat 1/1 with built in pump. Watch out Griselbrand here comes lizard mid range.
    Quote Originally Posted by Von View Post
    Is this a troll or are gobbos really dtb?

  8. #1928
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    Quote Originally Posted by Stevestamopz View Post
    Haha I wonder where he got the idea! :P

    Identical maindeck and the sideboard is a dead giveaway!

    Anyways I am happy for his results and that the deck works out for somebody else.
    Do you know what assuming does? It makes an ass out of you and me.
    Get it...? Ass, u, me?

    ... ffs I was trying to be funny...

  9. #1929
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    Wrenn and Six seems like a great addition that can help 4C and the mana denial package work together.

    Here is the list that I will be giving a go this week. Let me know if I've made any glaring mistakes as I am still new to brewing decks.

    //Land
    3 Misty Rainforest
    3 Polluted Delta
    3 Scalding Tarn
    2 Tropical Island
    3 Underground Sea
    3 Volcanic Island
    4 Wasteland

    // Sorcery
    4 Ponder
    2 Thoughtseize

    //Instant
    2 Abrupt Decay
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Daze
    4 Force of Will
    4 Lightning Bolt
    1 Spell Pierce

    // Creature
    4 Delver of Secrets
    3 Dreadhorde Arcanist
    2 Tarmogoyf
    2 Young Pyromancer

    //Planeswalker
    2 Wrenn and Six



    // Sideboard
    1 Assassin's Trophy
    1 Bitterblossom
    2 Chain of Vapor
    2 Cindervines
    1 Hydroblast
    1 Null Rod
    2 Pact of Negation
    2 Pyroblast
    1 Snapcaster Mage
    2 Surgical Extraction


    Let me know if you think there is a better list, but this seemed like a solid jumping point for bUrg.

    Thanks!

  10. #1930

    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    Quote Originally Posted by Skebunkler View Post
    Wrenn and Six seems like a great addition that can help 4C and the mana denial package work together.

    Here is the list that I will be giving a go this week. Let me know if I've made any glaring mistakes as I am still new to brewing decks.

    //Land
    3 Misty Rainforest
    3 Polluted Delta
    3 Scalding Tarn
    2 Tropical Island
    3 Underground Sea
    3 Volcanic Island
    4 Wasteland

    // Sorcery
    4 Ponder
    2 Thoughtseize

    //Instant
    2 Abrupt Decay
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Daze
    4 Force of Will
    4 Lightning Bolt
    1 Spell Pierce

    // Creature
    4 Delver of Secrets
    3 Dreadhorde Arcanist
    2 Tarmogoyf
    2 Young Pyromancer

    //Planeswalker
    2 Wrenn and Six



    // Sideboard
    1 Assassin's Trophy
    1 Bitterblossom
    2 Chain of Vapor
    2 Cindervines
    1 Hydroblast
    1 Null Rod
    2 Pact of Negation
    2 Pyroblast
    1 Snapcaster Mage
    2 Surgical Extraction


    Let me know if you think there is a better list, but this seemed like a solid jumping point for bUrg.

    Thanks!
    I hope you mean force of negation in the board. I think you run too many lands for s tempo deck but maybe you need that to not get color screwed? Could some if the duals be the new cycler duals? I think you’re missing out on blacks best threats, Angler, as well and I’m not sure how good arcanist actually is in a list that is not dedicated.

  11. #1931
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    I too have been working on finding a deck to abuse W&6. Obviously it's great for greedy mana-base decks but it does a hell of a lot for a 2 mana investment.

    Went 3-1 yesterday with my list below at it's first running.

    UB Midrange ft Ninja of the Deep Hours: 2-0
    UB Shadow: 2-1
    Dragon Stompy: 1-2
    Infect: 2-0

    The Dragon stompy matchup was very close, I blitzed him in game 1 (turn 4 kill), he locked me out in game 2 while I was stuck on 1 land and in game 3 I couldn't finish him off after he resolved an Ensnaring Bridge. I managed to counter the next couple of lock pieces but couldn't find any of my 3 Decays or my Grudge/Cindervines to blow the Bridge up and close out the game and I eventually ran out of countermagic for his Moons. Not complaining, but just explaining that this deck isn't any weaker to Blood Moon or Chalice than Grixis/RUG, it's actually stronger against those sorts of decks because you have so many answers + countermagic (you obviously just have to draw them lol).

    //Creature (12)
    4 Delver of Secrets
    2 Gurmag Angler
    3 Tarmogoyf
    3 True-Name Nemesis

    //Instant (22)
    3 Abrupt Decay
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Daze
    4 Force of Will
    4 Lightning Bolt
    3 Spell Pierce

    //Planeswalker (2)
    2 Wrenn and Six

    //Sorcery (4)
    4 Ponder

    //Land (20)
    1 Badlands
    4 Polluted Delta
    4 Scalding Tarn
    3 Tropical Island
    2 Underground Sea
    2 Volcanic Island
    4 Wasteland

    SB: 1 Ancient Grudge
    SB: 1 Bitterblossom
    SB: 1 Cindervines
    SB: 1 Dismember
    SB: 2 Golgari Charm
    SB: 2 Pyroblast
    SB: 2 Surgical Extraction
    SB: 1 Sylvan Library
    SB: 3 Thoughtseize
    SB: 1 Tormod's Crypt
    Quote Originally Posted by nedleeds View Post
    Dat 1/1 with built in pump. Watch out Griselbrand here comes lizard mid range.
    Quote Originally Posted by Von View Post
    Is this a troll or are gobbos really dtb?

  12. #1932
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    Validating what you guys have been saying--about W&6 facilitating greedy mana bases, among other things--a 4-Color Delver list with Wrenn and Six won the recent MTGO Challenge.

    // Planeswalker (3)
    3 Wrenn and Six

    // Creature (12)
    4 Delver of Secrets
    2 Dreadhorde Arcanist
    4 Tarmogoyf
    2 True-Name Nemesis

    // Sorcery (6)
    4 Ponder
    2 Thoughtseize

    // Instant (19)
    3 Abrupt Decay
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Daze
    4 Force of Will
    4 Lightning Bolt

    // Land (20)
    1 Badlands
    4 Polluted Delta
    4 Scalding Tarn
    3 Tropical Island
    1 Underground Sea
    3 Volcanic Island
    4 Wasteland

    // Sideboard
    SB: 1 Thoughtseize
    SB: 1 Ancient Grudge
    SB: 1 Diabolic Edict
    SB: 1 Hydroblast
    SB: 1 Liliana's Triumph
    SB: 2 Plague Engineer
    SB: 3 Pyroblast
    SB: 2 Surgical Extraction
    SB: 1 Sylvan Library
    SB: 2 Winter Orb

  13. #1933
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    Since the spoiling of W6, BURG has been on my mind. To echo my previous post, I think the key element to make BURG viable will be to keep the 4th color to a minimum. The main difference from last time is that W6 pushes us primarily into red and green. Therefore BURG is back to RUG splash black for Decay instead of Grixis splash green for Decay. I think the main question regarding this deck from now on will be "to Mongoose or not to Mongoose".

    I think Mongoose and Goyf are in a pretty good spot right now if you consider backing them up with W6. The combination of Mongoose, TNN, W6 pre-board and Bitterblossom postboard sounds nightmarish for all the control decks in the meta right now. Furthermore, the combination of W6, TNN, Goyf, Bolts, and Decay pre-board is enough to handle most Aggro and Stompy decks out there. Having access to 4 colors against combo has always been a huge boon against any Combo deck post-board so I think it's safe to say that we can cover that.

    This is where I'm at right now:

    Creatures (13)
    4 Delver of Secrets
    4 Nimble Mongoose
    3 Tarmogoyf
    2 True-Name Nemesis

    Spells (26)
    4 Lightning Bolt
    3 Abrupt Decay
    3 Spell Pierce
    4 Daze
    4 Force of Will
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Ponder

    Other (2)
    2 Wrenn and Six

    Lands (19)
    4 Wasteland
    4 Scalding Tarn
    4 Polluted Delta
    3 Tropical Island
    2 Volcanic Island
    1 Underground Sea
    1 Badlands

    Sideboard
    2 Bitterblossom
    2 Plague Engineer
    2 Force of Negation
    2 Surgical Extraction
    2 Pyroblast
    1 Ancient Grudge
    1 Liliana's Triumph
    1 Dismember
    1 Tormod's Crypt
    1 Nihil Spellbomb


    I try to play as little black cards as possible so that I am not reliant on any early Underground Sea. This is why there is no Thoughtseize (Spell Pierce is great right now anyway) and only 19 lands. Black is there for Decay, post-board Bitterblossom against control decks, a single Edict effect against Marrit Lage (combined with Blossom against Depths), and for Plague Engineer which is quite an amazing card. All the other black cards have an optional black cost such as Surgical Extraction, Dismember, and Nihil Spellbomb which are usable with only colorless mana.

    I am looking forward to seeing other variants poping up! This deck is great...
    Do you know what assuming does? It makes an ass out of you and me.
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  14. #1934

    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    Quote Originally Posted by Qweerios View Post
    Since the spoiling of W6, BURG has been on my mind. To echo my previous post, I think the key element to make BURG viable will be to keep the 4th color to a minimum. The main difference from last time is that W6 pushes us primarily into red and green. Therefore BURG is back to RUG splash black for Decay instead of Grixis splash green for Decay. I think the main question regarding this deck from now on will be "to Mongoose or not to Mongoose".

    I think Mongoose and Goyf are in a pretty good spot right now if you consider backing them up with W6. The combination of Mongoose, TNN, W6 pre-board and Bitterblossom postboard sounds nightmarish for all the control decks in the meta right now. Furthermore, the combination of W6, TNN, Goyf, Bolts, and Decay pre-board is enough to handle most Aggro and Stompy decks out there. Having access to 4 colors against combo has always been a huge boon against any Combo deck post-board so I think it's safe to say that we can cover that.

    This is where I'm at right now:

    Creatures (13)
    4 Delver of Secrets
    4 Nimble Mongoose
    3 Tarmogoyf
    2 True-Name Nemesis

    Spells (26)
    4 Lightning Bolt
    3 Abrupt Decay
    3 Spell Pierce
    4 Daze
    4 Force of Will
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Ponder

    Other (2)
    2 Wrenn and Six

    Lands (19)
    4 Wasteland
    4 Scalding Tarn
    4 Polluted Delta
    3 Tropical Island
    2 Volcanic Island
    1 Underground Sea
    1 Badlands

    Sideboard
    2 Bitterblossom
    2 Plague Engineer
    2 Force of Negation
    2 Surgical Extraction
    2 Pyroblast
    1 Ancient Grudge
    1 Liliana's Triumph
    1 Dismember
    1 Tormod's Crypt
    1 Nihil Spellbomb


    I try to play as little black cards as possible so that I am not reliant on any early Underground Sea. This is why there is no Thoughtseize (Spell Pierce is great right now anyway) and only 19 lands. Black is there for Decay, post-board Bitterblossom against control decks, a single Edict effect against Marrit Lage (combined with Blossom against Depths), and for Plague Engineer which is quite an amazing card. All the other black cards have an optional black cost such as Surgical Extraction, Dismember, and Nihil Spellbomb which are usable with only colorless mana.

    I am looking forward to seeing other variants poping up! This deck is great...

    I'm really liking your starting point, I'm also wanting to splash black but still work around the reactive game-play of RUG. Here's where I was starting out.


    Creatures (13)
    4 Delver of Secrets
    4 Nimble Mongoose
    2 Tarmogoyf
    2 True-Name Nemesis

    Spells (26)
    4 Lightning Bolt
    2 Abrupt Decay
    2 Spell Pierce
    3 Stifle
    4 Daze
    4 Force of Will
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Ponder

    Other (2)
    2 Wrenn and Six

    Lands (19)
    4 Wasteland
    4 Scalding Tarn
    4 Polluted Delta
    3 Tropical Island
    2 Volcanic Island
    1 Underground Sea
    1 Badlands

    Sideboard
    2 Plague Engineer
    2 Force of Negation
    2 Surgical Extraction
    2 Pyroblast
    1 Ancient Grudge
    2 Liliana's Triumph
    1 Grafdigger's Cage
    1 Sylvan Library
    1 Cindervines
    1 Spell Snare


    Stifle is one of the reasons why I love RUG and I think it's very important to be able to protect from opposing Wastelands with this manabase. I look forward to testing this and figuring out where it needs to go. I really like the Dismember in the board, I used to run 2 so I might adjust to your removal setup.

  15. #1935
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    Qweerios's Avatar
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    I too enjoy Stifle in these lists but I don't like reactive blue spells when I play with Badlands. I also find it difficult to justify a black splash for 2 Decays.
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    Get it...? Ass, u, me?

    ... ffs I was trying to be funny...

  16. #1936
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    The best black spell is Plague Engineer that you gain access to form the splash, imo. TS is whatever and Decay is just a nice hedge in the MD.

  17. #1937
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    Quote Originally Posted by eldub View Post
    The best black spell is Plague Engineer that you gain access to form the splash, imo. TS is whatever and Decay is just a nice hedge in the MD.
    Check out this thread, it sounds like this deck might be more up your alley: http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...-Tempo-Thresh)
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  18. #1938
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    4C Delver mirror in the finals of the MTGO Legacy Challenge, sounds like kentaro_hokori had quite a run -- apparently not losing a single game in the swiss (GWP 1.0000) and going 6-1 in games in the Top8. 20-1 in Games played!

    Looks like Gurmag vs Arcanist in the tertiary threat slot and just a few cards +/- in the SB difference between the two lists.

    4C Delver also took down MKM Frankfurt, also sporting Gurmag: https://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=31337&iddeck=268536

    Unfortunately he was later DQ'd for cheating. Hope he eats a lifetime ban. http://series.magiccardmarket.eu/201...qualification/
    Last edited by eldub; 08-05-2019 at 12:41 PM.

  19. #1939
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    If someone would like to do even a basic primer on the newer deck please let me know. It feels odd putting this with an opening post talking about DRS in the DTB section.
    It is better to ask and look stupid then keep your mouth shut and remain so.
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  20. #1940
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    Re: [Deck] bUrg Tempo

    With Canadian Threshold straying from Mongoose and Stifle in favor of W6 and Arcanist, and BURG keeping black to a minimum for 2 Decay and maybe Gurmag, the two decks are pretty similar. It's a bit like comparing UW Stoneblade to UWr Stoneblade (2 Bolts main and Pyro/Moon SB) at this point. Given how RUG moved away from Stifle-tempo-Mongoose with W6 and how BURG is not really BURG anymore without DRS, I think the two decks can safely merge into a new archetype based on the combination of Delver + W6.

    If we can come up with a name that isn't as lame as "Midrange Delver", "4c Delver" or "Delver and Six", I am willing to make a primer on the 4c/RUG Delver/W6 archetype. It's always been my competitive deck of choice in Legacy and I've been on it since DRS was spoiled.
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