[Deck] ANT (Ad Nauseam Tendrils) Storm Combo

[Namida]

Or you are a beast or japan players are bad. So many 2-0 its not easy.

My experience has been that most Japanese players have little to no experience against Storm (Omniscience is the most popular combo deck by far). I'm not even a good Storm player and I get a ton of free wins from people just not knowing what's going on, so I figure someone who actually knows what they're doing would do pretty well here.

[Jonathan Alexander]

1 Chrome Mox
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
1 Sensei's Divining Top

1 Ad Nauseam
4 Brainstorm
3 Cabal Ritual
4 Dark Ritual
1 Rain of Filth

1 Island
2 Swamp
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Polluted Delta
1 Tropical Island
2 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island

4 Cabal Therapy
2 Duress
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Infernal Tutor
1 Past in Flames
4 Ponder
2 Tendrils of Agony
1 Thoughtseize

Sideboard:
3 Dread of Night
3 Abrupt Decay
2 Chain of Vapor
3 Flusterstorm
2 Krosan Grip
1 Bayou
1 Tendrils of Agony

4-0 + ID today. Liked the list, but the third Tendrils might not be needed right now. Not sure about Top either. Could be Cabal Ritual, could be Preordain.

[Ancestral]

kai congrats om that run, and very impressive results against hard matchups :D

And 166 for a gpt legacy?? when it´s the next flight to japan?!?

[sawatarix]

Some impressions i have had during the tournament:

- I really really like the 2 Past in Flames Build. It feels so good to execute the combo while having Past in Flames in your hand because it gives you an additional backup in case something gets countered.

-I'm not 100% sold on Top main. There are matchup where the card really shines (Heavy discard decks) while it sucks in others. I boarded it out too often so I might cut it.

- Ad Nauseam is such a bad card ! I know it's somewhat ironical because I was so confident about the 2 Ad Nauseam list during spring 2014. I played this card 3 times in total from approximately 16-18 lifepoints. I had to pass the turn 2 times and i killed myself one time. Especially with only 3 Lotus Petals It's maybe time to say goodbye to my old friend.

-If i cut Ad Nauseam entirely from my 75 there is still the need for a very fast engine against decks like Elves/Death&Taxes/Burn/Mirror/Combodecks ingeneral. Maybe it's time to welcome back an card which got an reprint last year: I'm talking about Ill-Gotten Gains.

-3 Empty the Warren are Nuts against Miracle

-Still try to fit in a bayou in the 75...


That's about it. Tell me what you think or your experience with Ill-Gotten Gains

[KevinH]

Some impressions i have had during the tournament:

- I really really like the 2 Past in Flames Build. It feels so good to execute the combo while having Past in Flames in your hand because it gives you an additional backup in case something gets countered.

-I'm not 100% sold on Top main. There are matchup where the card really shines (Heavy discard decks) while it sucks in others. I boarded it out too often so I might cut it.

- Ad Nauseam is such a bad card ! I know it's somewhat ironical because I was so confident about the 2 Ad Nauseam list during spring 2014. I played this card 3 times in total from approximately 16-18 lifepoints. I had to pass the turn 2 times and i killed myself one time. Especially with only 3 Lotus Petals It's maybe time to say goodbye to my old friend.

-If i cut Ad Nauseam entirely from my 75 there is still the need for a very fast engine against decks like Elves/Death&Taxes/Burn/Mirror/Combodecks ingeneral. Maybe it's time to welcome back an card which got an reprint last year: I'm talking about Ill-Gotten Gains.

-3 Empty the Warren are Nuts against Miracle

-Still try to fit in a bayou in the 75...


That's about it. Tell me what you think or your experience with Ill-Gotten Gains

Why play IGG when there's PIF? Also, can't you just play more Tendrils instead of EtW?

[Megadeus]

IGG is your "quick" way to win the game against the combo decks. Like Ad Nauseam. Seems pretty fine actually

[sawatarix]

I keep Pif in my deck of course.
With Iggy we can combo off with only 1 ritual+led+tutor while Pif needs either 2 Infernal Tutors or 2 Rituals.

2-3 Tendrils are also fine against Miracle but Empty allows us to create dudes without wasting ressources (rituals) and with a lower stormcount. For example Brainstorm+Probe+Petal+Empty -> 8 Dudes which is really threatening against miracle with only 2-3 sweepers left in their deck.And we still keep around 5-6 cards in hand to combo off again soon.

[KevinH]

How does or make your combo matchup better? Making them discard a ton of cards seems irrelevant since you're winning if you're casting it anyways, right?

[sawatarix]

Yeah but unlike Ad Nauseam i don't kill myelf.

[KevinH]

How is your life total being pressured against the combo matchups?

It seems irrelevant anyways since when you're casting any of these spells (PiF, IGG, Ad Nauseum) you should be winning the game anyways...

Didn't realize you were cutting AN for IGG either, its just redundant when you have PiF though...

[sawatarix]

Actually not.
Ad Nauseam is not a safe kill. As i wrote before, I played this card 3 times in total from approximately 16-18 lifepoints. I had to pass the turn 2 times and i killed myself one time. Thats not what you wanna do against combodecks. Pif is a safe kill but you need more ressources. Iggy needs the fewest and is superfast plus a safe kill.

[Megadeus]

Safe against non blue at least

[sawatarix]

Safe against non blue at least

well against sneakshow and reanimator we bring in xantid swarm anyway so that should'nt be a problem at all.

[Megadeus]

Sure. I mean against DnT/Elves is pretty fine and fast. I think AN is fine against combo though. I'm on the 2x PiF plan and I simply board out a PiF for AN.

[Togores]

How does the deck work vs turn 1 death rite shaman? Or if the opponent plays rest in pieces? Beimg allmoat all in on a graveyard deck dosnt seems too cool for me. i know pif is always a better kill. But...

[nevilshute]

Interesting to hear you mention IGG Kai. I can see how AN becomes even worse with only 3 petals. I still like it against combo. I'm running 4 petals though. Against Show and Tell decks I will usually board:

-1 swamp
-1 past in flames
-1 empty the warrens
-2 duress
-1 cabal ritual

+1 ad nauseam
+1 chain of vapor
+2 xantid swarm
+2 flusterstorm

[Jonathan Alexander]

Interesting to hear you mention IGG Kai. I can see how AN becomes even worse with only 3 petals. I still like it against combo. I'm running 4 petals though. Against Show and Tell decks I will usually board:

-1 swamp
-1 past in flames
-1 empty the warrens
-2 duress
-1 cabal ritual

+1 ad nauseam
+1 chain of vapor
+2 xantid swarm
+2 flusterstorm

You should board out Therapy over Duress because you never want to miss. It's also not always clear what you have to go for with Therapy when you don't know their hand. Therapy also doesn't really work if they have Brainstorm or Dig Through Time in their hand.
Sure, Therapy can nab multiple cards and has synergy with Xantid Swarm, plus you can use it to get hellbent. Still, Duress is the clear winner to me.
Also, I don't like boarding out lands in general. Can't think of a single matchup where I go below 15. You might want to consider boarding out Top. The games are too short for it to be really good.


Further, on that whole Ill-Gotten Gains vs. Ad Nauseam thing, that's just insane. I honestly don't think the deck is even playable without Ad Nauseam anywhere in the 75. You can get away with not having it maindeck, but after boarding, when people have tons of interaction, you really need a way to win just from few cards. This is what Ad Nauseam does.

[jjrotzo]

I played my first tournament with ANT yesterday and received a savage beating, sometimes due to bad plays but often I did neither draw a fast kill nor see any way to grind the games out that I've lost. Nevertheless I still want to become a storm trooper.

As I am writing this, a certain Greek proverb comes to my mind:

"One who goes unpunished never learns."

Maybe you can give me some advise on the matches listed below. I played a stock list including Grim Tutor and my SB looked like this:

3 Abrupt Decay
2 Chain of Vapor
2 Flusterstorm
2 Xantid Swarm
1 City of Solitude
2 Dread of Night
1 Massacre
1 Burning Wish
1 Tendrils of Agony

Round 1 - Miracle
G1: I duress SDT on the play and see two FoW, but he topdecks another Top immediatly anyway and I get CBTop-locked
Out: Swamp, Cabal Ritual, Petal, 2 Preordain, Duress, Cabal Therapy In: 3 Abrupt Decay, City of Solitude, 2 Xantid Swarm, Tendrils
G2: At one point I am one mana spell short from the combo. Right there his Vendilion Clique during my draw step takes away my Infernal leaving me with Tendrils in hand, adding 1 to my storm count, and giving me another Ritual for the kill.
G3: After freeing myself from CB Top twice, I try to go off on the last extra turn, but he has FoW on a bottleneck Cabal Ritual
0-1-0

Round 2 - Burg Delver
G1: Delver + DRS beat me with massive counter backup
Out: Preordain, Petal, Grim Tutor In: City of Solitude, Chain of Vapor, Burning Wish
G2: I strip his counters and go off with Ad Nauseam from 13 Life and two mana floating, flipping land, LED, LED, LED, Infernal for the win
G3: Probe shows double Force, double Spell Snare und his Delver trigger reveals Flusterstorm. Without any discard in sight and facing lethal damage I go off with Tendrils in hand, but of course he has Stifle as well
0-1-1

Round 3 - MUD
G1: He goes Mulligan to 6, then Ancient Tomb, Spirit Guide, Trinisphere on the play ... Fold
Out: Grim Tutor, 2 Preordain, 1 Duress, 1 Cabal Therapy In: 3 Abrupt Decay, 2 Chain of Vapor
G2: Another first turn Trinisphere, that I can decay this time. However he follows up with Metalworker into Platinum Emperion + Chalice@1 I don't find Decay + Chain in time
0-1-2

Round 4 - Death&Taxes
G1: Blind Therapy hits Thalia, second Therapy hits Revoker. She topdecks and deploys another Thalia Turn 3 and beats me to death.
Out: 3 Duress In: 2 Dread of Night, 1 Massacre
G2: Revoker nails two LEDs in my hand, Port and Waste cut me from black mana, and Revoker + Batterskull beat me to death in spite of two Dread of Night in play (which were necessary to get rid of Canonist).
0-1-3

Round 5 - Canadian Threshold
G1: Without discard, I run into Stifle facing lethal Delver damage
Out: Preordain, Petal In: City of Solitude, Chain of Vapor
G2: I answer his first turn Needle on LED (oops) with a PiF-Kill involving double LED
In: 2 Xantid Swarm Out: 1 Duress, 1 Cabal Therapy (I saw Pyroblast + 2 Needles, so I thought, maybe he had boarded out Bolts)
G3: After First Turn Delver into Dazing Therapy and Forcing City of Solitude, he still has double Daze + Stifle to stop me. I think I made a mistake here when I played the non-Dazeproof Therapy instead of using an excess Infernal to get a second Therapy next turn.
0-1-4

Losing two preboard games because I didn't have any tools to get rid of a permanent was particularly annoying. What's the best way to tackle this problem?

A) 1 Chain of Vapor in the Main. If nothing else, it acts as a storm engine combined with artifact mana

B) 1 Burning Wish instead of Grim Tutor Main + Bounce in the Side. Can get Tendrils too. (Please note, I want to stick to ANT, not TES)

C) Ignore it. Sh*t happens.

Thanks for your help!

[nevilshute]

Losing two preboard games because I didn't have any tools to get rid of a permanent was particularly annoying. What's the best way to tackle this problem?

A) 1 Chain of Vapor in the Main. If nothing else, it acts as a storm engine combined with artifact mana

B) 1 Burning Wish instead of Grim Tutor Main + Bounce in the Side. Can get Tendrils too. (Please note, I want to stick to ANT, not TES)

C) Ignore it. Sh*t happens.

Thanks for your help!

I think you'll find most ANT players going for option C. Alternatively option B. I go with C myself. I don't like Burning Wish all that much in ANT.

[Togores]

Interesting to hear you mention IGG Kai. I can see how AN becomes even worse with only 3 petals. I still like it against combo. I'm running 4 petals though. Against Show and Tell decks I will usually board:

-1 swamp
-1 past in flames
-1 empty the warrens
-2 duress
-1 cabal ritual

+1 ad nauseam
+1 chain of vapor
+2 xantid swarm
+2 flusterstorm

Duress >>>> than therapy vs a show deck.

I usualy sb like this against show:
+3 xantid
+2 fluster
+0-2 chain (depending on how leyline does)

-2 therapy
-1 swamp
-1 preordain
-2 sensei
( other options -1/2 cabal-3rd therapy -1/2 petal)

Usualy this works well.