[Deck] ANT (Ad Nauseam Tendrils) Storm Combo

[H]

while i would snapkeep this one:

lotus petal
lotus petal
dark ritual
lion's eye diamond
duress
duress
brainstorm

I'll apologize for the newb question, I am currently finishing up my playset of Infernal Tutors so I am looking at trying my hand with a Storm deck. I've decided this one would probably be the most straight forward to start with.

My question is, how would you play out the hand above? Do you Petal into Duress, then Petal in to Brainstorm if the cost is clear? Or do you break it up over two turns and gain the extra draw phase? Thanks for any help.

[sawatarix]

against elves i would crack 1 petal for brainstorm immediately, if you get a manasource+tutor you win.
but land+ponder/preordain is also fine to grab deeper through the deck.
duress is a card i would fire off around turn 2/3 to get rid of flusterstorm or natural order.

[H]

against elves i would crack 1 petal for brainstorm immediately, if you get a manasource+tutor you win.
but land+ponder/preordain is also fine to grab deeper through the deck.
duress is a card i would fire off around turn 2/3 to get rid of flusterstorm or natural order.

Thanks for the quick response. I think this might be the hardest part of playing Storm initially, is properly judging these kinds of opening hands, at least for me. Thanks again for the help.

I think I will start with your recent list, probably with a slight change in the board to align better with my local meta.

[phazonmutant]

Sloshthedark has been advocating Lightning Bolts for a while and I've tried them in the board a couple of times. They're alright, probably better than the third Chain of Vapor, but it's difficult to justify bringing them in unless you know there will be a ton of hate bears, and it's not very maindeckable. I was thinking that maybe Grapeshot has a place in the main of a Grim Tutor build. TES has played it as a 2-mana Arc Lightning that also happens to kill them for a long time, so why not play it in ANT? It's a good way to take care of hate bears, buy time, and it's not totally preposterous to get 20 storm with Past in Flames.

Also I went 4-1 in the GP Portland Sunday legacy event with Carsten Kotter's build of ANT (minus a Chain and Decay for 2 Bolts). I liked the Tops much more than I thought I would, although I'm still not sold on Ad Nauseam. I wonder if another Past in Flames might be better (a friend swears by 2 PiF). I had forgotten how much fun storm is. I'm definitely shelving BUG Delver for a bit. Having that Grapeshot would have been clutch against a BUG Delver opponent - he discarded my Empty early and ate it with Deathrite, then I was only able to Tendrils him down to 1 with lethal on board. Another way to win would have got there.

[Togores]

Congrats!

Thats why I side in vs drs+discard decks the random burning wish from the side. So you have a second tendrills if one gets removed o fired fast. Also i dont like empty vs bug delver drs helps too much to race the goblins. We are not Tes that we can make so easyly a t1 8-12 goblins. But as stated lately I think the empty plan is not so good anymore. And I prefer pif, or second tendrills plan vs them.

[sawatarix]

speaking of burning wish, i have also an idea for the deck:
playing a singleton burning wish in the maindeck instead of the 7th discrad spell.
it is one of the best cards post ad nauseam and can grab a lot of answers against any kind of deck.
at least it can also fetch an discard spell from the sideboard so cutting a discard spell for it seems the best.

playing burning wish while still having access to many cantrips like preordain and senseis devining top should be worth testing.
what do you think?

ps: if you have tested it so far, please let me know about your results.i'm not a fan of a big wishboard so i'm thinkin about just 3-4 slots: 1 tendrils of agony,empty the warrens,thoughtseize,void snare.

[lordofthepit]

Sloshthedark has been advocating Lightning Bolts for a while and I've tried them in the board a couple of times. They're alright, probably better than the third Chain of Vapor, but it's difficult to justify bringing them in unless you know there will be a ton of hate bears, and it's not very maindeckable. I was thinking that maybe Grapeshot has a place in the main of a Grim Tutor build. TES has played it as a 2-mana Arc Lightning that also happens to kill them for a long time, so why not play it in ANT? It's a good way to take care of hate bears, buy time, and it's not totally preposterous to get 20 storm with Past in Flames.

Also I went 4-1 in the GP Portland Sunday legacy event with Carsten Kotter's build of ANT (minus a Chain and Decay for 2 Bolts). I liked the Tops much more than I thought I would, although I'm still not sold on Ad Nauseam. I wonder if another Past in Flames might be better (a friend swears by 2 PiF). I had forgotten how much fun storm is. I'm definitely shelving BUG Delver for a bit. Having that Grapeshot would have been clutch against a BUG Delver opponent - he discarded my Empty early and ate it with Deathrite, then I was only able to Tendrils him down to 1 with lethal on board. Another way to win would have got there.

If you need to find situational one-ofs more than once per game (which can generally only be found with Grim Tutor since you can't count on casting a hellbent Infernal more than once in a game), it's probably worth going the TNT route with Burning Wish or just going with TES.

[Togores]

speaking of burning wish, i have also an idea for the deck:
playing a singleton burning wish in the maindeck instead of the 7th discrad spell.
it is one of the best cards post ad nauseam and can grab a lot of answers against any kind of deck.
at least it can also fetch an discard spell from the sideboard so cutting a discard spell for it seems the best.

playing burning wish while still having access to many cantrips like preordain and senseis devining top should be worth testing.
what do you think?

ps: if you have tested it so far, please let me know about your results.i'm not a fan of a big wishboard so i'm thinkin about just 3-4 slots: 1 tendrils of agony,empty the warrens,thoughtseize,void snare.

Before putng the bruning in the side i tested it main with a side like you said. but a pyroclams instead of the non existing snare. The proble was that usualy the card in the main was nothing but and extra thoughseize for 3 mana in g1. So I shaved to to the side. Wish void snare may be better testing required but as I said was not really great to have to fetch the volcanic to get a thoughseize.
May be playing the badlands it gets better giving it another try is never worng.

[Sloshthedark]

speaking of burning wish, i have also an idea for the deck:
playing a singleton burning wish in the maindeck instead of the 7th discrad spell.
it is one of the best cards post ad nauseam and can grab a lot of answers against any kind of deck.
at least it can also fetch an discard spell from the sideboard so cutting a discard spell for it seems the best.

playing burning wish while still having access to many cantrips like preordain and senseis devining top should be worth testing.
what do you think?

ps: if you have tested it so far, please let me know about your results.i'm not a fan of a big wishboard so i'm thinkin about just 3-4 slots: 1 tendrils of agony,empty the warrens,thoughtseize,void snare.

I used to run that like 2 years ago (along and w/o Grim Tutor) and prefer just the GT (which goes well with EtW main)... you feel like 7 discard spell is too much or the 7th is the weakest card (I'd cut apreordain prior to that)? a sweeper is still better than a void snare imo

btw. I'm starting to test 2GT 2PIF 2TOA EtW build for Ovino... 3:1 today, mostly irrelevant matchups

[sawatarix]

@Slosh: Having access to 6 tutor cards seems decent, have you ever thought about rain of filth instead of lotus petals?could be helpful for big tutor chains.

[P-E]

@Slosh , with your ovino build you tend to Grinding Station ^^

Maybe a build with 3 grim 4 infernal or even 4/4 ahaha

[Sloshthedark]

Sloshthedark has been advocating Lightning Bolts for a while and I've tried them in the board a couple of times. They're alright, probably better than the third Chain of Vapor, but it's difficult to justify bringing them in unless you know there will be a ton of hate bears, and it's not very maindeckable. I was thinking that maybe Grapeshot has a place in the main of a Grim Tutor build. TES has played it as a 2-mana Arc Lightning that also happens to kill them for a long time, so why not play it in ANT? It's a good way to take care of hate bears, buy time, and it's not totally preposterous to get 20 storm with Past in Flames.

Also I went 4-1 in the GP Portland Sunday legacy event with Carsten Kotter's build of ANT (minus a Chain and Decay for 2 Bolts). I liked the Tops much more than I thought I would, although I'm still not sold on Ad Nauseam. I wonder if another Past in Flames might be better (a friend swears by 2 PiF). I had forgotten how much fun storm is. I'm definitely shelving BUG Delver for a bit. Having that Grapeshot would have been clutch against a BUG Delver opponent - he discarded my Empty early and ate it with Deathrite, then I was only able to Tendrils him down to 1 with lethal on board. Another way to win would have got there.

Well I found it very maindeckable, nearly every deck has a relevant target (and BS, you know), I also thought about Grapeshot, but 2 mana and sorcery is not something I'd like to be doing or GT for it..

once again 2 Pif and never look back...

@Slosh: Having access to 6 tutor cards seems decent, have you ever thought about rain of filth instead of lotus petals?could be helpful for big tutor chains.

I did play it few times (long ago with MD Ad Nauseam I believe), do not remember any significant situations, In actual build I have 3 LP already and still want to be fast... I have to admit it's sort of unexplored card as a one of it's hard to tell how relevent /cumbersome it is when the upsides should show in actual gameplay

@Slosh , with your ovino build you tend to Grinding Station ^^

Maybe a build with 3 grim 4 infernal or even 4/4 ahaha

I hope to be better then Grinding Station =) for me it's a natural evolution... it plays out the same as Ant (8vs7 is a cornercase), but with better lategame and obv. no flipping... btw. I do not understand why Grinding Station doesn't MD EtW ... basically I'm plaing with 2nd GT, 2nd Toa, Bolts and STD ratio... wondering if the 2 GT aren't too much lifeloss /and play Thoughtseize vs. versatility....and if that can make SB better... actually which SB configuartion will that be will be hardest

[Togores]

Tomorrow im gonna play ant in a paralel evet with th wcqc. 4 usea for the champ. :O

Im having problems with my side.
I expect rug and bug delever allong with uw control decks like blade or miracles.
Most of a fair envourment but dont wanna loose vs combo there will be also dredge and so.

With my 2 sensei build.

3 decay
3 xantid
2 masaacre
2 chain of vapor
1 tendrills
1 burning
2 fluster

That was my aide beffore.
I have 1 spot left and wanna include
2 carpets
1 more chain of vapor

Opinions?


btw KAI here is a rug t shirt that i saw in a shop last week. May be interested.

http://fr.spf.com/es/tienda/producto...rugged-0243442

[Tom T]

Tomorrow im gonna play ant in a paralel evet with th wcqc. 4 usea for the champ. :O

Im having problems with my side.
I expect rug and bug delever allong with uw control decks like blade or miracles.
Most of a fair envourment but dont wanna loose vs combo there will be also dredge and so.

With my 2 sensei build.

3 decay
3 xantid
2 masaacre
2 chain of vapor
1 tendrills
1 burning
2 fluster

That was my aide beffore.
I have 1 spot left and wanna include
2 carpets
1 more chain of vapor

Opinions?


btw KAI here is a rug t shirt that i saw in a shop last week. May be interested.

http://fr.spf.com/es/tienda/producto...rugged-0243442

I think Flusterstorm isn't that great in that meta you described except for maybe BUG Delver. I think Pyroblast may be better against the RUG/UWR Delver decks and also countering Counterbalance/Clique. Also, why would you play multiple Chain of Vapor in that meta, you already have Massacre against hate bears. Tormod's Crypt is pretty narrow, but really cool against Dredge. If you expect a lot of reanimator or storm, you can also add some Surgical Extraction to your sideboard.

So I think:
3 Decay
3 Xantid
2 Massacre
1 Tendrils
1 Burning
1 Pyroblast
1 Chain of Vapor
1 Tormod's Crypt

and

2 Carpet of Flowers (these get wrecked by BUG delvers Golgari Charm btw, and against RUG you have few things to board out and Pyroblast is better imo)

or

2 Pithing Needle (I think this card is really good against Bug Delver, because the best plan against discard-decks is Ad Nauseam or late-game Past in Flames, and this way you can stop their Deathrite Shamans.)

or

2 Surgical Extraction and drop the Crypt for a Pithing Needle

[sawatarix]

btw KAI here is a rug t shirt that i saw in a shop last week. May be interested.

http://fr.spf.com/es/tienda/producto...rugged-0243442

thx dude but i have seen cooler shirts :D

@your sideboard:
sounds like carpet of flowers and young pyromancers could do a great job !would include them both in your sideboard.
i don't know how essential your burning wish and your second tendrils is but i would cut them for pyrodudes.
carpet of flowers are not a must, only if you have trouble with delver decks.
notice that ant has already perfect tools to beat delver decks all day long without them.

[Sloshthedark]

I agree with the Pithing needle and Pyro, Carpet is just miserable do nothing... I don't think you need anything against dredgw but winning the dieroll

[Togores]

We are like 56 ppl
Im now undefeated after round 4. Just draw draw and top and the just win the underground sea playset :D
Defeated
2-1 burn
2-1 rug carpet was mvp
2-1 jund
2-0 taxes

At the end i played this side
1 massacre
1 burning
1 tendrills
3 xanrid
3 decay
2 chain
2 carpet
2 fluster



Thanks for help guys^^

[CabalTherapy]

If you expect a lot of reanimator or storm, you can also add some Surgical Extraction to your sideboard.

I played 2 Extractions against Storm and Reanimator some time ago. Now I am running one Extirpate in the side to accompany my 2 Flusterstorms against these decks.
Extirpate can also be nice against Miracles where you can mess around with their on-top-of-library-cards or simply remove their Balance, FoW, whatever.

[Tom T]

I played 2 Extractions against Storm and Reanimator some time ago. Now I am running one Extirpate in the side to accompany my 2 Flusterstorms against these decks.
Extirpate can also be nice against Miracles where you can mess around with their on-top-of-library-cards or simply remove their Balance, FoW, whatever.

I chose Surgical because against Miracles you already board in a lot of cards. And the rest of the decks you either want turn0 interaction against dredge/reanimator/storm or play it during your combo-turn for free extra storm or hellbent-ness.

[CabalTherapy]

I chose Surgical because against Miracles you already board in a lot of cards. And the rest of the decks you either want turn0 interaction against dredge/reanimator/storm or play it during your combo-turn for free extra storm or hellbent-ness.

In contrast to TES our deck does not have strict board plans/ SB in general (see Carsten's latest article where he boards in 4 Decays).
Against all of these decks one would play Petal/LED thus having access to mana. It is subject to testing but I guess that Split Second is the big difference here.