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Thread: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

  1. #1621

    Re: Eternal Weekend 2018 Legacy Tournament Report ("19th" Place)

    Quote Originally Posted by tped View Post
    Is Traverse used as a another tutor to find ballista or do you use it find more land drops?

    Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk
    Traverse is a tutor. Period.

    Honestly, I've used it to tutor for everything in the deck.
    Ballista is actually not the most common thing I tutor for.
    I'd say Tombstalker, Ballista, or Spellseeker for manipulate fate/removal are the 3 most common tutors, with Tombstalker and Spellseeker for Manipulate the 2 most common lines (I board out Ballista A LOT).

    Traverse is also great in land light hands early or versus decks that punish nonbasics to go get basics. I have considered cutting a BoP or other way to find room for a 2nd traverse, because using it early for basic land is important role, but sometimes I wish I still had a 2nd copy to seek for.

  2. #1622

    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    Great watching you cosmo and great report. I am a big fan of traverse in theory as it’s a ’ponder for land’ in the early game and a threat in the late game.

  3. #1623
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    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    Hey Cosmo, it's nice watching you playing Food Chain at EW. Do you stream or are planning to do in the future ?
    # The Bizarro Super Powers Team - Casting Abyssal Persecutors FTW !

  4. #1624

    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by JackaBo View Post
    Great watching you cosmo and great report. I am a big fan of traverse in theory as it’s a ’ponder for land’ in the early game and a threat in the late game.
    Exactly! I'd say I use it as late game threat 80% of the time, but 20% of the time to get basic land are VERY important when I use it for that. Do wanna find room for a 2nd.

    Quote Originally Posted by maurobad2k4 View Post
    Hey Cosmo, it's nice watching you playing Food Chain at EW. Do you stream or are planning to do in the future ?
    I don't stream, as that requires me to use MTGO. I've never used MTGO. Maybe in the future, but it's hard enough having 1 collection. It's also brutally hard to play food chain on MTGO due to clicking from what I hear, though I rarely ballista people anyway, so maybe it's not as bad for me. Also, work and other life priorities prevent me from playing MTGO. Do I plan on doing it in the future? Probably not, but one never knows... Thanks for the interest though!

  5. #1625

    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    Hi,

    This new creature has just been spoiled :



    Could this fit in Food chain, maybe replace Ballista for the kill ?

  6. #1626

    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by grokh View Post
    Hi,

    This new creature has just been spoiled :



    Could this fit in Food chain, maybe replace Ballista for the kill ?
    I love it. If there is room, it might be worth it to play it alongside 1-2 Ballista so you can draw the ballista and win that same turn. But maybe that’s not necessary. Gaining 40 life and playing every creature in your deck with 3 FoW in hand is a guaranteed win next turn regardless.

    It’s a win condition once food chain is on the board and not horrible otherwise (pitches to FoW, 4 mana for a 2/2 draw a card, gain a life or 6 mana for a 4/4 draw 2 cards and gain 2 life).

    Best of all, the card draw happens on cast which means the draw can’t be countered the way ballista can. So even if countered, you draw 40 cards and gain 40 life, play all your creatures and win with FoW backup.

    The one con is that it’s not as versatile as Ballista if you don’t have the combo online. So it’s not as easy to justify playing 4 of these maindeck the way Ballista could be. Would it make sense to maindeck Living Wish and play one of these along with some utility creatures/lands in the sideboard?

  7. #1627

    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    The only "problem" i can see with this new Hydra is you have to count the number of cards you got in library before casting it because if you draw too much, you can just kill yourself cos trying to draw into an empty library ...

    You still can imagine a new wincon with Laboratory maniac though

    It’s not as versatile as Ballista if you don’t have the combo online but it can't be blocked by a Pithing needle/Revoker as could be Ballista !

  8. #1628

    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by grokh View Post
    The only "problem" i can see with this new Hydra is you have to count the number of cards you got in library before casting it because if you draw too much, you can just kill yourself cos trying to draw into an empty library ...

    You still can imagine a new wincon with Laboratory maniac though

    It’s not as versatile as Ballista if you don’t have the combo online but it can't be blocked by a Pithing needle/Revoker as could be Ballista !
    Ballista can be countered, Hydra can be stifled - Hydra is better in that regard
    Ballista win on the spot, Hydra build a powerful boardstate/hand and probably win the next turn, unless you run both then hydra win on the spot too - Ballista is better in that regard, but not by much
    Ballista is a deecent card outisde of combo, Hydra is worse
    Both cards are however stronger the more mana you can ut into them so if you plan on running both, maybe you can have an alterantive mana generator in addition of food chain
    What comes to mind is carpet of flowers, ancient tomb, mana dorks, gaeas cradle (and more creature).
    Maybe there's some sort of UG ramp build that utilizes the scalablility of ballista and Hydra, powering them out with dorks and cradles.

  9. #1629

    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by JackaBo View Post
    Ballista is a deecent card outisde of combo, Hydra is worse
    Hydra worse than Ballista outside of combo ?

    For 4 manas :
    -Ballista : you got a 2/2 which can kill 2 1/1
    -Hydra : you got a 2/2 Flying trample, draw 1 + 1 life

    For 6 manas :
    - Ballista : you got a 3/3 which can kill 3 1/1
    - Hydra : you got a 4/4 Flying trample, draw 2 + 2 life

    And the hydra can't be blocked by a Pithing needle/Revoker, for me outside of combo Hydra > Ballista

  10. #1630

    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by grokh View Post
    Hydra worse than Ballista outside of combo ?

    For 4 manas :
    -Ballista : you got a 2/2 which can kill 2 1/1
    -Hydra : you got a 2/2 Flying trample, draw 1 + 1 life

    For 6 manas :
    - Ballista : you got a 3/3 which can kill 3 1/1
    - Hydra : you got a 4/4 Flying trample, draw 2 + 2 life

    And the hydra can't be blocked by a Pithing needle/Revoker, for me outside of combo Hydra > Ballista
    Good point. Plus even if you don’t have a Misthollow, saccing a bunch of creatures to cast a massive Hydra makes it likely you can draw into one. And it pitches to FoW. So do we go...
    -4 Ballista
    +4 Hydra

    And call it a day.

    Without MD Ballista, we will need some way to blow up Ensnaring Bridge.

    So Engineered Explosives or the new Reclamarion Sage maindeck is a must play. Maybe a maindeck Relic of Progenitus as well. Trinket Mage was great for getting utility 1 of artifacts and a Ballista when needed for the win. So the deck is really not gaining much.

    So what does the deck need to be competitive again. It hasn’t seen many Top 8s since DRS’s ban.

  11. #1631

    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Hammer View Post
    Good point. Plus even if you don’t have a Misthollow, saccing a bunch of creatures to cast a massive Hydra makes it likely you can draw into one. And it pitches to FoW. So do we go...
    -4 Ballista
    +4 Hydra

    And call it a day.

    Without MD Ballista, we will need some way to blow up Ensnaring Bridge.

    So Engineered Explosives or the new Reclamarion Sage maindeck is a must play. Maybe a maindeck Relic of Progenitus as well. Trinket Mage was great for getting utility 1 of artifacts and a Ballista when needed for the win. So the deck is really not gaining much.

    So what does the deck need to be competitive again. It hasn’t seen many Top 8s since DRS’s ban.
    Nope, i think we need to keep Ballista as our kill MD, cos it go over Ensnaring bridge, i thought in my list do -1 Trinket mage +1 Hydra.

    i'd play 1 Hydra 2 Ballista or maybe 2 Hydra 1 Ballista, not fixed yet

    And we can't play Knight of autumn in this deck cos our main colors are BUG and i don't think we want to add a 4th color to the deck

  12. #1632

    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    Yeah Hydra is great here. What do you guys think of the new white splash build putting up results that plays RIP and Energy Field?

    The only thing that pushed this deck out of tier one is the loss of Deathrites ability to eat your own Griffins. RIP does the same and also hates on a big chunk of the format and combos with Energy Field. It maindecks Knight of Autumn which is an amazing card and can bring in both LotV and Helm from the board for an alternate win condition.

    Overall a much more controllish list.

  13. #1633
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    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    Looked on MTG Top8 and TC decks,looks like the basic BUG.
    I’ve been considering building RIP but Food Chain RIP sounds more fun.
    Where did you come across the lists?
    Last edited by Curtis Dittmar; 01-27-2019 at 10:42 AM.

  14. #1634
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    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by Curtis Dittmar View Post
    Looked on MTG Top8 and TC decks,looks like the basic BUG.
    I’ve been considering building RIP but Food Chain RIP sounds more fun.
    Where did you come across the lists?
    Most people playing white are on the FB group. Here is a sample list:
    4 Misty Rainforest
    3 Flooded Strand
    3 Windwept Heath
    2 Tundra
    2 Tropical Island
    1 Savannah
    2 Island
    1 Forest
    1 Plains
    1 Karakas

    4 Noble Hierarch
    2 Spell Queller
    1 Spellseeker
    1 Vendilion Clique
    1 Eternal Scourge
    3 Misthollow Griffin
    2 Walking Ballista
    1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
    1 Tidespout Tyrant

    4 Brainstorm
    2 Swords to Plowshares
    1 Enlightened Tutor
    3 Manipulate Fate
    1 Sylvan Library
    2 Energy Field
    3 Rest in Peace
    4 Food Chain
    4 Force of Will

    SB:
    2 Pithing Needle
    2 Surgical Extration
    2 Krosan Grip
    2 Containment Priest
    2 Flusterstorm
    2 Swords to Plowshares
    1 Ethersworn Canonist
    1 Disenchant
    1 Carpet of Flowers

    Personally I have been playing BUGr food chain since the ban of deathrite.

  15. #1635

    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    I can confirm, Narset, Parter of Veils is the real deal for Food Chain Combo.

    It's a Leovold that's much easier to cast and like Leovold shuts off a ton of the matchups we have the toughest time against.

    But it also has two impulses attached to it, making it fantastic in digging for Food Chain, cantrips or Manipulate Fate.

  16. #1636
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    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Hammer View Post
    I can confirm, Narset, Parter of Veils is the real deal for Food Chain Combo.

    It's a Leovold that's much easier to cast and like Leovold shuts off a ton of the matchups we have the toughest time against.

    But it also has two impulses attached to it, making it fantastic in digging for Food Chain, cantrips or Manipulate Fate.
    Narset does look great in this deck (as well as in many others). Have you just swapped 2 Leovolds for 2 Narsets in a typical BUG build?

  17. #1637
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    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    So i saw the new strix and made that:
    Could be good:

    Bant Foodchain:

    Maindeck (60)
    3 Walking Ballista
    2 Birds of Paradise
    4 Noble Hierarch
    3 new bant strix
    1 Eternal Scourge
    3 Misthollow Griffin
    3 Narset, Parter of Veils
    3 Teferi, Time Raveler
    1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
    4 Brainstorm
    2 Ponder / new fow but ponder is probably more important.
    3 Manipulate Fate
    4 Force of Will
    4 Food Chain
    1 Flooded Strand
    4 Misty Rainforest
    2 Polluted Delta
    1 Savannah
    2 Snow-Covered Forest
    2 Snow-Covered Island
    2 Tropical Island
    2 Tundra
    4 Windswept Heath

    Sideboard (15)
    1 Containment Priest
    2 Vendilion Clique
    3 Flusterstorm
    2 Surgical Extraction
    2 Disenchant
    2 new fow
    1 Carpet of Flowers
    1 Rest in Peace
    1 Sylvan Library



    Shared via TopDecked MTG

    https://www.topdecked.me/decks/35ca7...2-d612eeaaf872

    What do people think about that?

  18. #1638

    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    Narset has whiffed for me on occastion. Not 100% sure if it's superior to Leovold anymore.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pdingo View Post
    So i saw the new strix and made that:
    Could be good:

    Bant Foodchain:

    Maindeck (60)
    3 Walking Ballista
    2 Birds of Paradise
    4 Noble Hierarch
    3 new bant strix
    1 Eternal Scourge
    3 Misthollow Griffin
    3 Narset, Parter of Veils
    3 Teferi, Time Raveler
    1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
    4 Brainstorm
    2 Ponder / new fow but ponder is probably more important.
    3 Manipulate Fate
    4 Force of Will
    4 Food Chain
    1 Flooded Strand
    4 Misty Rainforest
    2 Polluted Delta
    1 Savannah
    2 Snow-Covered Forest
    2 Snow-Covered Island
    2 Tropical Island
    2 Tundra
    4 Windswept Heath

    Sideboard (15)
    1 Containment Priest
    2 Vendilion Clique
    3 Flusterstorm
    2 Surgical Extraction
    2 Disenchant
    2 new fow
    1 Carpet of Flowers
    1 Rest in Peace
    1 Sylvan Library



    Shared via TopDecked MTG

    https://www.topdecked.me/decks/35ca7...2-d612eeaaf872

    What do people think about that?
    Two thoughts...

    I would replace Walking Ballista with Hydroid Krasis.

    Krasis draws 40+ cards and gains you 40+ life even if it gets countered (making it the better win condition to Walking Ballista) and it can be pitched to FoW, and it's an extra green creature that can be sacced to Natural Order (sometimes playing Krasis for 4 mana to gain a life and draw a card and get a 2/2 isn't a bad play).

    Throw a Dryad Arbor in the deck and Natural Order works beautifully in a list like this (triply so if you have a Teferi, Time Raveler on the board). I think Natural Order is a stronger option than the planeswalkers. The planeswalkers don't outright win you the game, Natural Order does.

    With all the mana elves and the high density of green creatures (hierarchs, birds, krasis, the new strix that can be played EOT, the ability to turn any of your fetchlands into a dryad arbor), Natural Ordering out a Progenitus on turn 3 with FoW and Daze and Misdirection backup is very consistently doable and an excellent way to end the game if you're unable to food chain combo online. You can even bait a counterspell with a turn 2 Food Chain even if you don't have the combo, and follow that up with a turn 3 Natural Order.

    If you have a Progenitus in hand but no Natural Order, Progenitus can be hardcast if you get the Food Chain online. Alternatively, you can shuffle it back into the deck using Brainstorm/Jace.

    Sample list...


    4 Noble Hierarch
    2 Birds of Paradise
    2 Hydroid Krasis
    2 Progenitus
    3 Ice-Fang Coatl
    3 Misthollow Griffin
    1 Eternal Scourge

    1 Misdirection
    1 Ponder
    2 Teferi, Time Raveler
    3 Manipulate Fate
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Force of Will
    4 Food Chain
    4 Natural Order

    4 Misty Rainforest
    4 Windswept Heath
    3 Verdant Catacombs
    2 Snow-Covered Forest
    2 Snow-Covered Island
    2 Tropical Island
    1 Tundra
    1 Savannah
    1 Dryad Arbor

    Sideboard
    3 Flusterstorm
    2 Surgical Extraction
    2 Return to Nature
    2 Vendilion Clique
    2 Force of Negation
    1 Containment Priest
    1 Carpet of Flowers
    1 Rest in Peace
    1 Sylvan Library
    Last edited by Captain Hammer; 05-20-2019 at 02:48 PM.

  19. #1639
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    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    This is definitly not the way i wanna go. And no krassis is not better. And narset is just nuts. But anyway thanks for advice.

  20. #1640

    Re: [Deck] Food Chain Combo

    Quote Originally Posted by Pdingo View Post
    This is definitly not the way i wanna go. And no krassis is not better. And narset is just nuts. But anyway thanks for advice.
    I like your line but i would cut also the white color... next days i will put my new list but only UG

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