View Poll Results: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

Voters
197. You may not vote on this poll
  • No

    108 54.82%
  • Yes

    38 19.29%
  • I'd think about it

    51 25.89%
Page 1 of 7 12345 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 134

Thread: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

  1. #1
    (' ' '\( 0 ,o)/''')
    TheInfamousBearAssassin's Avatar
    Join Date

    May 2004
    Location

    Northern Virginia
    Posts

    6,627

    Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    Since this seems to be the only argument anyone can come up with for why the card shouldn't be banned, let's get some numbers. If Brainstorm was banned, would you quit the format entirely?
    For my confessions, they burned me with fire/
    And found I was for endurance made

  2. #2

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    I wont quit legacy(i use maverick and omnitell). Will this hurt blue players...yes. will it make them quit.i dont think so. Will it make for a more diverse format..it might.")

    Sent from my GT-N7100 using Tapatalk

  3. #3
    Member

    Join Date

    Apr 2008
    Location

    Czech Republic
    Posts

    88

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    Last years I have played Bant, New Horizons, Canadian, Team America, TES, Show and Tell, Maverick.

    It would nerf 6 of 7 my decks. Maybe I will spent more time with Vintage? :-)

  4. #4
    Member

    Join Date

    May 2007
    Location

    Italy, Eternal
    Posts

    1,848

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    While i may have been all in favor of a BS ban before, let's be real. Right now, if you ban BS, TNN take over the format cause miracle really need those brainstorm for consistent Terminuses against it. IT MAY be decent enough to go with just SDT, but you'd really have to ban TNN with it too for safety. And honestly i really wouldn't want to see 2 cards banned at once just because wotc fucking sucks at designing cards for eternal unless they're fucking blue, blue blue and more blue.

    Unban Survival and say fuck to this shitty TNN.

    EDIT: nevermind, just ban fucking TNN and we may see Jund, DnT and maybe even some maverick again.

  5. #5
    Member

    Join Date

    Oct 2004
    Location

    Earth
    Posts

    112

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    I would quit this forum if the Ban Brainstorm vendetta run by a handful of people doesn't stop.
    It's just spam at this point.

  6. #6
    Member

    Join Date

    May 2007
    Location

    Italy, Eternal
    Posts

    1,848

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hof View Post
    I would quit this forum if the Ban Brainstorm vendetta run by a handful of people doesn't stop.
    It's just spam at this point.
    Yeah sure the personal vendetta. Not like the card had like 75%+ presence in T8 for the last, what, 3 months? MM didn't reach 70% and everyone called for that even like the meta back then was still diverse, probably more so than it is now (granted, much of the fault is fucking TNN but whatever). But keep telling yourself that is a personal vendetta. This is getting stupid like climate deniers that just ignore the evidence for some sort of faith in their BS god.

  7. #7
    (' ' '\( 0 ,o)/''')
    TheInfamousBearAssassin's Avatar
    Join Date

    May 2004
    Location

    Northern Virginia
    Posts

    6,627

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Miagi View Post
    Repetative bullshit from the same users, every cahnce they get.
    Nice double post.
    For my confessions, they burned me with fire/
    And found I was for endurance made

  8. #8
    (' ' '\( 0 ,o)/''')
    TheInfamousBearAssassin's Avatar
    Join Date

    May 2004
    Location

    Northern Virginia
    Posts

    6,627

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hof View Post
    I would quit this forum if the Ban Brainstorm vendetta run by a handful of people doesn't stop.
    It's just spam at this point.
    You can tell this because of the statistical data and reasoned arguments toted by the supporters of Brainstorm, whereas the pro-banning crowd are forced to revert to threatening tantrums and trying to silence their opponents with sniffily dismissive, insubstantive posts.
    For my confessions, they burned me with fire/
    And found I was for endurance made

  9. #9


    Join Date

    Apr 2007
    Location

    São Paulo - Brazil
    Posts

    222

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    If they ban Brainstorm, what am I supposed to pitch to FoW?

  10. #10

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gheizen64 View Post
    Yeah sure the personal vendetta. Not like the card had like 75%+ presence in T8 for the last, what, 3 months? MM didn't reach 70% and everyone called for that even like the meta back then was still diverse, probably more so than it is now (granted, much of the fault is fucking TNN but whatever). But keep telling yourself that is a personal vendetta. This is getting stupid like climate deniers that just ignore the evidence for some sort of faith in their BS god.
    I think the real issue is that blue is the only colour able to interact with the stack and stop combo. Blue gives you dramatically better matchups against an archetype that no other colour can reliably face (maybe black, though even then, blue is still more effective at it), and it doesn't make any sense to not play brainstorm at that point because it dramatically improves the consistency of your deck.

    What needs to happen is that other colours also need ways to target things on the stack, because it will at least provide some incentive for other colours to be played a bit more. On top of this, we need more cards like spirit of the labyrinth which hose blue card draw. Notion Thief was on the right track, but he was in blue, and he cost too much. SoL is almost there, but she came at the wrong time. TNN being in the format means she cops a lot of incidental hate as splash damage.

    What I would also like to see is better card filtering for other colours. Things like:

    R
    When ~ enters the battlefield, draw a card.
    When ~ leaves the battlefield, discard a card.
    2/1

    It's aggressive card parity that would suit red, and play into aggro decks by giving them slightly better card selection without overpowering them.

  11. #11
    Site Contributor
    Raystar's Avatar
    Join Date

    Sep 2009
    Location

    London, UK
    Posts

    392

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Illusions View Post
    I think the real issue is that blue is the only colour able to interact with the stack and stop combo. Blue gives you dramatically better matchups against an archetype that no other colour can reliably face (maybe black, though even then, blue is still more effective at it), and it doesn't make any sense to not play brainstorm at that point because it dramatically improves the consistency of your deck.

    What needs to happen is that other colours also need ways to target things on the stack, because it will at least provide some incentive for other colours to be played a bit more. On top of this, we need more cards like spirit of the labyrinth which hose blue card draw. Notion Thief was on the right track, but he was in blue, and he cost too much. SoL is almost there, but she came at the wrong time. TNN being in the format means she cops a lot of incidental hate as splash damage.

    What I would also like to see is better card filtering for other colours. Things like:

    R
    When ~ enters the battlefield, draw a card.
    When ~ leaves the battlefield, discard a card.
    2/1

    It's aggressive card parity that would suit red, and play into aggro decks by giving them slightly better card selection without overpowering them.
    I believe that UR Delver would be very happy to play that card in addition to its cantrip suite :)

  12. #12
    Member

    Join Date

    May 2007
    Location

    Italy, Eternal
    Posts

    1,848

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Illusions View Post
    I think the real issue is that blue is the only colour able to interact with the stack and stop combo. Blue gives you dramatically better matchups against an archetype that no other colour can reliably face (maybe black, though even then, blue is still more effective at it), and it doesn't make any sense to not play brainstorm at that point because it dramatically improves the consistency of your deck.

    What needs to happen is that other colours also need ways to target things on the stack, because it will at least provide some incentive for other colours to be played a bit more. On top of this, we need more cards like spirit of the labyrinth which hose blue card draw. Notion Thief was on the right track, but he was in blue, and he cost too much. SoL is almost there, but she came at the wrong time. TNN being in the format means she cops a lot of incidental hate as splash damage.

    What I would also like to see is better card filtering for other colours. Things like:

    R
    When ~ enters the battlefield, draw a card.
    When ~ leaves the battlefield, discard a card.
    2/1

    It's aggressive card parity that would suit red, and play into aggro decks by giving them slightly better card selection without overpowering them.
    Designing good cards in other colors is something we waited R&D to do forever. We still haven't got a decent red card, and we'll probably never get someting good for red draw ever, since card drawing in general has been nerfed. The point is that in the past we saw many cards banned for ubiquity, like Clamp, MM, Survival etc... and here we are a point where historically i think no card has ever been this dominant. I'll be happy to be proven wrong, but i've played since 93 and i think i've seen every winter or summer combo season, and tbh even in the tinker era u still had many non-blue decks like goblin, elves, and enchantress (this is pre-mirrodin tinker obv).

    Your answer to combo in other colors already exist, for black it's called discard, but it's generally ineffective against Brainstorm. White also has way to stop combo with taxxes, so you would get actually 3 colors that can interact with combo meaningfully (red COULD interact decently with combo if they printed some aggressive LD or random-discards into draw for both players, but red has to sucks apparently), and green being basically unable to interact with anything outside of the in-game zone sit well in the flavor for the color imho. Problem is that now color have not only to not sucks against combo, but against TNN too. This basically kills red dead, because of no efficient fliers, nor way to remove or race TNN, and bolt become irrilevant. Black and green combination can still survive because of ways to remove TNN efficiently with Liliana + Golgari and other cards, and once again blue is the best color to deal with it with countermagic + library manipulation into terminus or simply supreme verdict. White alone can do something but has to rely on fliers which are usually underpar against anything that isn't TNN, and as such DnT is dying too.

    TNN has to go, and he has to go right now because it's a dumb card that has to die in hell for removing so many kinds of interactions from this format.

  13. #13
    Member

    Join Date

    Oct 2004
    Location

    Earth
    Posts

    112

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    What is the point of this thread, if not to generate a repeat of exactly the same discussion, with exactly the same arguments for the 100th time?
    I call that spam.

    Are you trying to prove that not very many would quit Legacy? If so why? Why does it matter?

  14. #14
    Clergyman of Cool
    lordofthepit's Avatar
    Join Date

    Mar 2009
    Location

    Daisy Hill Puppy Farm
    Posts

    1,954

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    No, but I would be disappointed, and I've piloted more than my fair share of non-blue decks.

  15. #15
    Member

    Join Date

    May 2007
    Location

    Italy, Eternal
    Posts

    1,848

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hof View Post
    What is the point of this thread, if not to generate a repeat of exactly the same discussion, with exactly the same arguments for the 100th time?
    I call that spam.

    Are you trying to prove that not very many would quit Legacy? If so why? Why does it matter?
    New facts have emerged, and as data change , people opinions on it may too. If they doesn't, then they probably harbor some kind of "faith" that's stronger than any data we will ever present to them. And we that don't share that faith with them are damned to hell.

  16. #16

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    Combo sure would get stronger (Especially Dredge since people couldn't dig for hate as easily).

    Brainstorm decreases variance. Everyone wants less variance to their deck. It makes sense that so many people run it. I have 2 decks that don't run Brainstorm (Merfolk and Dredge), but this would hurt my others (Patriot Midrange, TES, and Miracles) quite a bit.
    “There are only two ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle".
    - Albert Einstein

  17. #17

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    I wouldn't quit, but the format would be dramatically worse than it is now. Glass cannon combo would actually get better because decks now only have seven chances at a Force of Will rather than the ten they got on the play with Brainstorm. Banning Brainstorm wouldn't solve the main diversity-reducing problem of the format now, which is True-Name Nemesis. TNN decks would just shrug, run Preordain and Ponder instead of Brainstorm, and carry on as before.

    Brainstorm isn't the culprit here. True-Name Nemesis is. TNN gave blue the best card ever in fair matchups. Legacy was fine before C13 was printed when the fair Brainstorm decks tended to have trouble with Jund, Death and Taxes, Goblins, and Maverick and those decks were real contenders. TNN throws that out the window and makes blue the best colour at everything. It only follows that Brainstorm, a heavily played blue card, is played more because of that.

  18. #18

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gheizen64 View Post
    While i may have been all in favor of a BS ban before, let's be real. Right now, if you ban BS, TNN take over the format cause miracle really need those brainstorm for consistent Terminuses against it. IT MAY be decent enough to go with just SDT, but you'd really have to ban TNN with it too for safety. And honestly i really wouldn't want to see 2 cards banned at once just because wotc fucking sucks at designing cards for eternal unless they're fucking blue, blue blue and more blue.

    Unban Survival and say fuck to this shitty TNN.
    Yeah ... this is sad but true. I think some unbannings until something cracks are in order. Having Earthcraft, Survival and Black Vise on the list when Ancestrallite 28 of 32s every event is really embarrassing for WotC/DCI.

  19. #19

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by JPoJohnson View Post
    Combo sure would get stronger (Especially Dredge since people couldn't dig for hate as easily).

    Brainstorm decreases variance. Everyone wants less variance to their deck. It makes sense that so many people run it. I have 2 decks that don't run Brainstorm (Merfolk and Dredge), but this would hurt my others (Patriot Midrange, TES, and Miracles) quite a bit.
    2 Card combo (Show and derp mostly) would be impacted profoundly. Not only their ability to chimp together their 2 cards, but the inability to save one half from targeted discard. Dredge as a combo deck is a redudant pile looking for enabler -> dredger. Storm combo would also be impacted savagely, being unable to setup a winning turn whilst hiding a key card and also not being able to ancestral and flush extra tutors and lands to find more gas cards.

  20. #20
    Joe Cool Above All
    HSCK's Avatar
    Join Date

    Sep 2007
    Posts

    664

    Re: Would you quit Legacy if Brainstorm was banned?

    You know what would be more embarrassing? People stop showing up to events and banning a creature that was a 5-of in the top 8 of the GP. It's going to take a lot to get a ban if attendance continues to be great and there being a significant amount of different decks in the meta blue or not.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)