This has probably been covered before but what is the reasoning behind 0 snapcasters in the deck? Seems like getting to snap a bolt stifle or brainstorm would be very powerful
3 mana sucksOriginally Posted by Themucher
Besides 3 mana sucking, what would you even drop?
The flex slots. The problem lies with snap being a 3 mana spell like aforementioned. V clique would most likely be better and in the vain of value, snap seems win more. Albeit an allstar in modern, it loses power in legacy but especially so when we are already very graveyard dependent.
Side note: I'm smoking a cigar and I just tried to smoke my phone instead of submit this comment. I'm an adult, damn it.
Important note: I am putting this deck together(boring lands atm) to play at gp Columbus and chiba next year. Hopefully I will see some of you handsome rug mages there.(not being sexist, just a saying. I try to be pc)
besides being 3 mana, I also don't like how Snap is reactive
cheers
LOL at smoking your phone.
I want to make it out to GP Columbus next year. Not sure which delver deck I'll be playing, but I can guarantee you I'll be playing some iteration of delver with stifles. (Basically grixis vs rug)
Hey guys I'm trying to get my gp tournament report up. Sorry for the delay in just in the middle of moving. Hoping to have it done before Thanksgiving.
Sent from my SM-N915V using Tapatalk
I played kinda non-fancy 56+ 2/2/2 Pierce/Snare/FB build on Thursday and was handed my ass on a silver plate on several occasions, finishing the evening with a 2/2 finish.
I'm less and less liking the inability of RUG to make anything meaningful on mid-late game (and yep, we sometimes get that far into the game), and I also seriously hate Abrupt Decay.
I'm considering Divert, however that's a card you need asap, and as such, it should be played as three-of at least, while it's totally not worth the slots.
Fact is that one of my lost matches was to DnT with 7-8 strip mine,s so it's not like I'd be much better of with Divert.
Btw, are any other tools to save the Goyf? I'm considering Reality Ripple or even some Boomerang effect, as both of them are versatile.
Well you could play hooting mandrills and simic charm if you really want to beat abrupt decay.
Isn't apostle's blessing better than Reality Ripple in this situation? Ripple can also hit lands and evade sweepers, but I think holding 2 mana up is kinda situational. Also, if the opponent decays on the attack step, you still do attack.
I think this deck wants some sort of late-game trump card to get out of difficult situations.
The simplest option is to run a 13th creature. Another possibility is to instead include an enchantment that functions like a threat -- Sylvan Library, Sulfuric Vortex. Alternatively, a well-timed Price of Progress can often close out games. Manlands are similarly useful -- Faerie Conclave or Lumbering Falls.
It's expensive, but perhaps a planeswalker would be good -- Jace TMS, Garruk, Xenagos or Chandra could help beat stuff like Miracles.
If the goal is to win quickly then I think Thought Scour may be needed to pump up Mongoose ASAP. And then run 3-4 chain lightning to reach 20 damage quickly.
Hooting mandrills in this thought scour build?
Doing this so Jaytron will stop bugging me. This is the first of 2 reports, this being for a $1k at Channel Fireball on Sunday. I know I need to start taking better notes between rounds -- this is mostly just from memory, so bear with me.
Decklist:
Normal 54 + 2 Spell Snare/2 Dismember/2 Forked Bolt
Sideboard:
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Destructive Revelry
1 Flusterstorm
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Pithing Needle
1 Pyroblast
1 Red Elemental Blast
2 Rough // Tumble
2 Submerge
1 Sulfur Elemental
1 Surgical Extraction
1 Sylvan Library
CFB $1k - 4-2, 12th out of 45
Round 1 vs Grixis Delver
G1: I keep a mediocre 7 of delver, fetch, volc, ponder, goose, 2 cards I forget. I manage to keep him off land with some top-decked wastes/stifles. Flipped delver and goose take it home.
G2: He rips apart my hand and I die to zombie fish.
G3: See game 2.
1-2; 0-1
Round 2 vs Mentor Miracles
G1: I mull to 6 (no land) but manage to land a t2 delver after stifling his fetch. It flips naturally and I ride it and an eventual tarmogoyf home. His draws were pretty poor, in fairness.
SB: -2 daze, -2 dismember, -2 FoW, | +2 needle, +2 REB/Pyro, +1 Sulphur Elemental, +1 Sylvan Library
G2: I keep a decent 7 with Delver, Goose, 2x land, Ponder, Stifle, Stifle. I play out my threats and draw into Needle. I play it, and it meets a FoW. Delver flips, then eats a Swords. I play Ponder, find another Delver and some spells to flip it. I play it and a goyf, always leaving up U for Stifle. Next turn, I get to Stifle a Terminus Miracle trigger and waste a Tundra. Delver and Goyf get my opponent to "lethal-next-turn". He finds another Terminus that I Stifle the miracle trigger for again. He scoops. Note: at some point, after he already had 4 lands, he played a fetch. I declined to Stifle it in favor of miracle triggers -- glad I did.
2-0; 1-1
Round 3 vs Mana Dredge
G1: I've never played this matchup before and I just watch as my opponent does dredge things. I get him to around 10 life before getting overrun by 2/2 zombies and Ichorids.
SB: -2 dismember, -2 spell snare | +1 Grafdigger's Cage, +2 Rough // Tumble | +1 Needle (Cephalid and Putrid Imp? I wasn't sure about this)
G2: My opponent plays an older printing of Gemstone Mine that read: "When ~ comes into play, put three mining counters on it." and passes the turn. I ask to read the card as I've never seen it before. I play a Volcanic and pass, with stifle up. He plays another Gemstone Mine and I attempt to Stifle what I thought was an ETB trigger based on the wording of the card. We both discuss the interaction, he reads the card and says "yeah looks like an ETB trigger, I guess that works. Nice play." **Note: I later looked this up and realized we were both wrong and the card had be reprinted with "~ comes into play with three mining counters on it." essentially getting rid of any notion of a triggered effect. Oops. Sorry, round 3 opponent!** He plays Faithless Looting, which I Daze, and passes the turn. At this point, I'm able to drop 2 goyfs. He plays Breakthrough and doesn't hit much gas and passes the turn. This was a misplay on his part because he essentially didn't do anything but grow my goyfs to 5/6's. He's at 12 life. I swing for 10 and bolt him.
G3: I keep a decent 6. My opponent has a relatively slow start for the first 2 turns while I make land drops and cantrip. On turn 3, my opponent Cabal Therapy's me, naming Grafdigger's Cage. I reveal my hand with 2x Goose, a land, a bolt, and a Goyf. He doesn't have a creature to flash back cabal at this point and passes the turn. I draw my 1-of Grafdigger's Cage and play it. He had a sad. I eventually get 2 Goyfs on the field and ride them to victory, removing his Ichorids with Forked Bolts.
2-1; 2-1
Round 4 vs Esper Mentor
I don't really remember this match much. I took it in game 3 off good 'ol fashioned mana denial and Delver beats. I made 2 misplays. The first was in G2, letting my opponent use Deathrite Shaman to eat a land, making a second W to cast Supreme Verdict, wiping away a flipped Delver, Goyf, and Mongoose. I had Stifle in hand, but didn't use it on the DRS's mana ability. :( I never recovered. The second was shuffling away a Sulphur Elemental I found in a Ponder with two other bad cards, giving my opponent a possible out in Mentor. Thankfully, I drew a bolt even though he never found a Mentor.
2-1; 3-1
Round 5 vs TES -- I'm playing against Donnie, a guy that plays at my LGS.
G1: I fail to find much interaction and he eventually makes lots of Goblins that kill me in 2 turns.
SB: -2 Daze, -2 Dismember | +1 Flusterstorm, +2 Rough // Tumble, +1 Grafdigger's Cage
G2: Mana denial + a timely Rough // Tumble get me the win.
G3: I play a Delver on my t1 and pass. My opponent goes off T2, making 10x goblins and passes. I flip delver, attack, play my second land, cast goyf and pass. He swings and I am down to 10. On my turn I swing with Delver and Goyf for 8, combined. He's now at 9. I play a delver, leave a volc untapped and a Bolt in hand. He swing with 8 goblins. I block 1 with delver and go to 3. He's at 6 and cracks a fetch. I Stifle it. He's at 5. I untap, and swing with delver + goyf. He blocked goyf and takes 3, down to 2. I cast Ponder. The third card down is a Forked Bolt. WHEW.
2-1; 4-1
Round 6 vs 4c Delver. On the bubble - the winner goes to top8.
G1: I dont remember much except that I had a really fast start and just tempoed him out.
G2: I mulled to 6, and he ground me out. I eventually lost to zombie fish and Young Pyromancer beats.
G3: I mull to 6, keeping a hand with mostly reactionary spells: Bolt, 2x Stifle, Ponder, Forked Bolt, 1 fetch and a Wasteland. I'm able to keep him off mana with waste + stifle and bolt his early threats while trying to cantrip into a threat of my own. Suffice to say, I never found that threat. I didn't draw a creature until I was at 6 life staring down my opponent's Delver, Angler, and 2x Deathrite Shaman. I must have drawn 20+ cards without seeing more than that loan Delver, far too late. Cest la vie.
1-2; 4-2 final.
I made 12th, which was good enough to win my entry fee ($25) so I can't complain too much. It was my first real event with this deck and really only my second time playing it in the flesh (besides a handful of games on Cockatrice).
Second report to follow when it's not 12AM and I'm falling asleep at the keys.
<3 Now that you're on delver, I'm going to hound you all the time for tournament reports.
I'm surprised your opponent didn't call a judge over just to verify that Gemstone Mine could be stifled especially with older cards. Whenever there is any type of uncertainty on how cards interact, it's always best to ask a judge.
I am too. I would have in his situation. I honestly had never played or seen that card played before and it seemed pretty straight forward/intuitive enough with its templating.
Jandro, I want to call you cheatyface. 100% of the time so far, you've "cheated" with the deck. Hahaha
Although... if you didn't cheat last night, it drops to like 66%
/shrug
Ok so my report for the weekly grinder isn't nearly as exciting but I played against a really sweet brew in my second match so I figured I'd write it up.
Decklist:
Normal 54 + 2 Spell Snare/1 Dismember/2 Forked Bolt/1 Spell Pierce
Sideboard (few changes from last time. I'll likely be taking out a Flusterstorm for a Null Rod for my LGS's meta):
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Destructive Revelry
1 Flusterstorm
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Pithing Needle
1 Pyroblast
1 Red Elemental Blast
2 Rough // Tumble
2 Submerge
1 Sulfur Elemental
1 Izzet Staticaster
1 Sylvan Library
1 Krosan Grip
Round 1 vs Mana Dredge
G1: I win the die roll and keep a decent 7. Volc -> Delver, pass. My opponent plays Gemstone Mine (no trying to Stifle it, this time ;) ), Faithless Looting, dumping some dredge enablers. T2 and I draw a Wasteland for the turn. Waste his Gemstone Mine, cast Ponder, pass. My opponent plays another Gemstone Mine and another Faithless Looting starting the dredge machine. I can't quite clock him fast enough and get overwhelmed as he Cabal Therapies away a Goyf.
SB: -2 Spell Snare, -1 Dismember, -1 Daze, +1 Grafdigger's Cage, +1 Destructive Revelry (for a LED? I was grasping here), +2 Rough // Tumble
G2: I draw a 7 with no land and mulligan. I draw 6 with Force, Force, Stifle, Ponder, Mongoose, Brainstorm. Sigh. I mulligan to 5. NOTE: I probably should have kept this hand as disrupting his first 2 plays with FoW could have really slowed his hand down and allowed me to draw into lands for either a Ponder or BS. I never recover, despite drawing a Rough // Tumble. By that time he already had 3 Bridge From Below in the yard and closes out the game fairly quickly.
0-2 (0-1)
Is this typically a difficult match for Delver? I assume it's in Dredge's favor and my opponent mentioned he likes seeing Delver decks, in general, so I'm assuming so. Should I be looking to keep hands with FoW/Daze for his T1 plays? Slowing them down as much as possible, while also having a threat of your own on board seems the way to victory, here.
Round 2 vs. Thoughtlash/Skill Borrower/Kikijiki combo. What a sweet brew!
G1: I mull to 6, keep a decent hand with some permission and a delver. My opponent plays Island, Sensei's Top, go. I blind flip Delver, attack, look at how silly this Wasteland looks in my hand, and play a ponder then pass. My opponent drops a City of Traitors and casts Skill Borrower, knowingly placing it in front of me so I can read it. I take him up on it. I have no idea what my opponent is playing at this point but after reading the card, I decide to Daze it. On my turn I Waste his city of traitors, attack for 3 and play a goyf. At some point my opponent tries to get another Skill Borrower in play that I bolt before he can do any shenanigans with. I ride the Goyf and Delver to victory.
SB: I have no idea what's going on. -1 Daze, -1 Dismember, -1 Spell Snare, +1 Ancient Grudge, +1 Destructive Revelry, +1 Pithing Needle. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
G2: I still don't have a clue what's going on. I continue to not let Skill Borrower resolve, but then on T4 my opponent plays a Thought Lash! Wtf is this, EDH?? A turn or so later, he is able to play a Laboratory Maniac and I see the writing on the wall if I pass the turn after not finding a Bolt for labman. Ok then! I saw a counterbalance from Skill Borrower revealing the top card so I:
SB: -1 more Spell Snare for +1 Krosan Grip.
G3: I keep a 7, my opponent mulls to 6 (or maybe it was 5). I get a T2 Delver down and my opponent manages to get a resolved Skill Borrower after I Ancient Grudged his first one and he countered a Bolt for this one. My opponent whiffs on seeing a Kikijiki or Thoughlash for a couple turns and I beat down with a flipped delver. I bolt him to 3 and it's his last turn to find something. After a Brainstorm, Skill Borrower-Sensei's Divining Top activation + Fetchland, he fails to find a Kikijiki (both were near the bottom of his deck) and I attack for lethal on the next turn. WHEW. What a fun match!
2-1 (1-1)
Round 3 vs my buddy Tyler's Affinity deck.
G1: I'm on the play and have to mull to 6 (just not my night for drawing lands!). I keep a decent start but his start is better and he's able to get an Etched Champion suited up with a Cranial Plating. Game 2!
SB: -3 FoW, -2 Stifle, +1 Ancient Grudge, +1 Destructive Revelry, +1 Pithing Needle, +1 Krosan Grip, +1 Rough // Tumble
G2: We both mull to 5 (FFS!!). I find a hand with Trop, a Delver, Ancient Grudge, Destructive Revelry, Ponder. I play Trop, Delver and pass. My opponent plays out an Ancient Tomb, Mox Opal, Ornathopter, Archbound Ravager and passes. On my T2, I draw a Wasteland, play it, and play Ponder. I find a Krosan Grip and a Volc in the three. I take the Volc and leave the Kgrip on top to flip Delver. I can't Waste my opponent's land because I need it to play Kgrip next turn. My opponent plays an artifact land and Etched Champion. He sacs his Mox Opal to Ravager and plays another Opal, pass. On my turn, I flip delver and attack. I then Kgrip the Ravager since using I don't think using Revelry or Ancient Grudge would be all that profitable, seeing as how he has time to respond. Was I wrong? He moves the 2 counters to his Etched Champion and swings in for the win 2 turns later as I find nothing to stop him. Null Rod can't come in the mail soon enough! :p
0-2 (1-2 final)
Really wasn't my night, but my second match was a lot of fun and my two friends (one being Jaytron) came up from the South Bay to play, so I can't complain too much.
I'm wondering what people would recommend for a sideboard. Meta has miracles, show and tell, elves, jund, delver and deathblade. Any big cards that people would recommend?
2 pyroblast
2 flusterstorm
2 rough // tumble
2 submerge
Null rod
Krosan Grip
Sylvan Library
Sulfuric Vortex
Vendilion Clique
13/15
I would use that as a starting point.
Pyroblast/Flusterstorm: These help cover Miracles and show and tell primarily. Against Delver and Deathblade pyroblasts are usually good and flusterstorms at least vs delver are usually strictly better spell pierces.
Submerge/Rough: These help against Jund and Elves. Rough isn't that amazing vs Jund, but can be better than some of our other cards especially otd.
Sulfuric Vortex/Vendilion Clique/Sylvan Library/Null Rod/Krosan Grip: All of these cards are great vs Miracles and Deathblade. They help when the game is going long which against those two decks in particular it usually turns into long grindy games.
That would cover all those decks with an additional 2 spots left over for graveyard hate or something. You might also want another actual artifact hate card or a sulfur elemental if Maverick is going to be around. Null Rod can deal with top, batterskull and other equipment with Krosan Grip to mop up. Chalice of the Void or other Mud prison cards could be problematic with only the Krosan Grip as an answer.
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