I've tried to jam Gitaxian Probes in Canadian, and after some playtesting, I found it really valuable (was pretty skeptical, at first).
My latest list, for reference:
Lands [18]
3 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta
2 Wooded Foothills
3 Volcanic Island
3 Tropical Island
4 Wasteland
Creatures [12]
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Nimble Mongoose
4 Tarmogoyf
Spells [30]
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Daze
4 Stifle
4 Ponder
3 Gitaxian Probe
2 Spell Pierce
1 Forked Bolt
Sideboard [15]
3 Submerge
2 Rough/Tumble
2 Pithing Needle
2 Red Elemental Blast
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Flusterstorm
1 Artifact Mutation
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Sulfur Elemental
Probe everything RUG needs. Being able to know what to play in the first two turns for "free" is awesome.
Let your Dredge 6 be: Narco, Narco, Narco, Bridge, Bridge, Dread Return
the 4th should never be a problem...i always have success with variety...coz i hate losing to simple resolved things like kotr..batterskull..rip...i carry 3goyfs..3goose..1tnn..1cliq..4delvers..minimizing rip targets gives me more game vs matchups that carry them..with the addition of tnn..i still have for untargetable crits and the latter gives me game vs walls like bskull..tstalker..opposing goyfs..kotrs that goose usually becomes outclassed midgame...ive tried scooze...and even on the bluezoo where it has 4green sources...its just too slow...grim will have issues with goose...u play goose when ur canthresh...u play grims when ur on bluezoo.Originally Posted by personalbackfire
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I don't know man. 8 bolt plan still seems pretty good.
Maindeck
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Polluted Delta
3 Tropical Island
3 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Nimble Mongoose
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
1 Gitaxian Probe
4 Force of Will
4 Daze
4 Stifle
2 Spell Pierce
1 Red Elemental Blast
4 Lightning Bolt
1 Forked Bolt
1 Fire // Ice
Side:
1 Sylvan Library
1 Life from the Loam
1 Divert
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Red Elemental Blast
1 Pyroblast
2 Flusterstorm
2 Submerge
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Rough // Tumble
1 Pithing Needle
1 Tormod’s Crypt
1 Grafdigger’s Cage
Took this to the Belgian Legacy Cup Trial(43players) last sunday, 4-1-1 in the swiss but got knocked out of the quarterfinals.
Match-ups were:
Elves, Sneaky Show, Elves, ANT(my one loss), Twelvepost, ID
In swiss lost to 4cc with punishing fire, deathrites, Baleful Strixes etc...
I expected a lot of Miracles and U/W/x Stoneblade hence the extra REB main. It might have better been Probe I guess, but REB usually has several targets and having a maindeck hardcounter for TNN and Counterbalance seemed appropriate. Eventually the mainboard REB only hit a single brainstorm but it also never stranded in my hand so guess that's okay. I feel the core is 56 cards and four are fill with whatever you like as this list basicly shows. To me 2x Spell Pierce is part of the core really.
Maindeck REB is a lottery. It may win you games you'd otherwise lost, and it may be completely irrelevant in many matches, see your two Elves affairs.
IDK. Maybe it's good, maybe it's not. As a one of it isn't that bad, and I guess that "Volcanic, go; REB your Ponder" makes your (unknowing) opponent pretty confused.
"Hu, what's that, Counterbalance-PainterStone?"
How the sb served you? I see a lot of one-ofs. And what about Crypt? With the rise of LftL decks, I kinda think about adding it.
To be honest I would have added a second Cage if I had one, but I like variaty as noticible of my maindeck. I like how some cards overlap matchups and can be used for different purposes. Lftl for example doesn't care about Cage, so it's basicly giving up a slot on Elves to improve against graveyard strageties. Note that my Elves main is already fairly better because of the Fire and Forked Bolt.
Here again, why not just 2 Forked Bolt? Ice can be gamebreaking against a resolved Reanimate/Show and Tell Griselbrand , or a Batterskull to push the last damage through.
Best sideboardcard of my own was LftL.
instead of REB in MD, i would go Divert in Main. At least you can divert a counter, a removal, or such.
Funny you say that, I actually had it main first but eventually I voted for putting it side because of my expectations. Forgot to mention I also expected a decent amount of Show and Tell which REB takes care of also. I'm definately not advocating it, I just think like Bed Player confirmed, it is a lottery. In the ANT matchup I would be staring at my Divert wishing it were a REB for instance. I also encountered 2 Show and Tell decks btw.
Trouble of Divert is that you want either three (to have them everytime), one (to win a lottery from time to time) or (and that's the best number) exactly none. And it's hard to say if it's worthy the sb slot, I never really liked it. but I see the power in a GBx meta full of Thoughtseize, Hymn or ADs.
It pushes the BUG Delver matchup over the top imo.
When the meta gets overrun by Shardless or BUG Delver, I bust out my Diverts. :)
Can you explain this? To me LftL in Canadian Threshold feels like a win more card. If I can reliably cast it, I'd rather be winnig than durdling around with (Waste-)Lands...
Legacy-Decks: UBrg ANT/TNT ~ RUG Canadian Threshold ~ Mono U OmniTell ~ U Candleless Spiral Tide ~ RG 1 Land Belcher ~ UBRGW Quadlaser Dredge
I'm not TraxDaMax, but one thing about LftL: it makes games against LD much more easier. Quite often all that you need is one Loam to get you som much back into the game (or even ahead) that it's not even funny. When both players sit on their one land and hope for some miracle, all it needs is to get the second land and return fetch, Waste, x land, to fruther protect your manabse and deny the opponent a game.
IDK. As a one of, it's unreliable, but then again it won me some games. My meta doesn't warrant it (lots of Miracles and Storm), but if there'd be more Wastalnd decks, I'd definitely play it, esp. in a heavy-burn version that's capable of dealing with DRS.
If you want an inexpensive replacement I was quite happy with Sylvan Library. That card can be so broken in so many match ups. Hell Miracle players fear Library more than any of our creatures except maybe the turn 1 delver. Or combo drawing nut cards like flusterstorm/pyroblast/force etc and filtering your draw with fetches so much value. When I ran it main I was running the following:
53 core + 1 sylvan, 3 chain lightning, 1 forked bolt, 2 spell pierce
sb something like:
2 submerge
2 pyroblast
2 flusterstorm
2 rough
2 cage (because I hate losing to manaless dredge / dredge in general)
1 vendilion clique
1 sulfur elemental
1 ancient grudge
1 destructive revelry (I would say better than Kgrip or mutation based on the maindecks game plan)
1 whatever you feel like you need 3rd submerge/ pyroblast even a single price is surprisingly useful I mean have you ever seen Deathblade shy of 3 non basics in play? or Shardless bug because you know they like their duals too.
The main idea is you have 12 (in this case 11) crits, 8 bolts and everyone's life total in legacy is 18 (fetch/force) so you only need 6 bolts/creatures to win. The forked bolt doesn't change the math too much in my opinion and the upside of sending 1 upstairs or two for one against elves/d&t is more valuable I think. They sylvan library is a personal touch, but I've found it to be really good in this build. Half the time it just draws you some extra cards the other half you draw the last bolt to just close the game.
There are games that tend to go long, and RUG Delver has no real lategame plan. Loam helps with that. I also like that it is a pretty good card against Hymn to Tourach. Loam just comes in against decks with nonbasics and that can overrun us with cardadvantage. I'm thinking of Jund, Shardless, Deathblade.
And I got to cast it against Twelvepost which obviously is strong too.
I understand RUG Delver doesn't normally want to be wasting time(on wasting lands) but often it will be the semi-timewalk needed to push through the last bit and outtempo the opponent. And sometimes it just creates free wins. ("Nice come into play tapped lands you have there Twelvepost")
It is actually also decent in RUG mirrors.
In my matchups it was good against twelvepost and it probably would have won me my quarterfinals.
I played small tournament with RUG 54 core + 4 chain lighting + 2 spell pierce yesterday. I split finals againts miracles due to lack of time.
I really like the reach of 8 burn spells cos you dont have to rely on your creatures that much.
PS: MVP - nimble mongoose
How do you side against Miracles? I never know if I should take out burn and increase counterspells and other permission so that my creatures last and end the game on their own, or if I should keep the burn in to finish the game once the inevitable Terminus sweeps away my dudes.I played small tournament with RUG 54 core + 4 chain lighting + 2 spell pierce yesterday. I split finals againts miracles due to lack of time.
I really like the reach of 8 burn spells cos you dont have to rely on your creatures that much.
PS: MVP - nimble mongoose
I think the first approach is more reasonable, as this stops any CB/Top or JTMS or EtA, but I've read that ppl someties try the fast way. Idk. Just asking...
I side in all my dudes, TNN clique and if I have it that week sulfur elemental, red blasts and Krosan grip
I side out daze (both on the play and the draw) and forked bolt.
My goal is to always have a threat on board and 2 of 3 new threats have flash the last one can only be hit by terminus and verdict. Lightning bolt is one of the best cards in the deck against miracles in my opinion. Forked bolt is pretty bad because it's a sorcery and does less.
I just took a massive beating from that new merfolk deck. Shit that deck is tough.
8TNN.dec is rough. I just consider that match an auto loss and move on. You can't counter TNN or deal with it and they play a lot of them.
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