With 4 noble and 4 judges. That's quite a bit of one drops. This deck needs something to answer artifacts and enchantmentsOriginally Posted by lyracian
3 Meddling Mages and 2 Trygon Predators are in my 75 now for that.
They're both powerful 1 drops, but you need 10 or so in order to reliably have one in your opening 7.
Meddling Mage and Trygon Predator are both pretty good options here (Trygon is expensive though). Main deck, I prefer Pridemage because of the exalted trigger. Those things really do some work in a deck with this many evasive creatures.
I do like Trygon Predator over Manriki in the SB, though.
I played Bahra's list at SCGCincinnati this weekend with one minor modification - replacing a Daze with a Karakas. I also ran a totally different sideboard with 4 Humility, 3 Rest in Peace and some other poor card choices.
Between the open trial on Saturday and the open on Sunday, I went 6-6-1 with the deck. I was 1-1 vs. W/B Deadguy, beat Affinity, lost a close match to R/U Delver, lost to Miracles, lost to Dredge (even with 3 SB Rest in Peace), lost to Sneak & Show (even with 4 Humility), went 1-1 vs. Shardless BUG, drew vs. Elves, went 1-1 vs. Jund (Rest in Peace was key to my win), beat RUG Delver, and I don't remember my other match ups (I won them though haha).
I liked the deck but it was missing something. Just like Cambriel said earlier, the Noble Hierarchs and Edrics have a little anti-synergy. The Judge's Familiars and Looter il-Kors were awesome. They definitely belong. I could even see running 3 looters and only 2 Edrics (even though I know that is one of the main reasons for the deck). The looting ability is very strong and the Looters' evasion goes well with the exalted triggers and equipment.
Even though they are very powerful, the Stoneforge Mystics felt a little out of place in this shell. They are very slow in this tempo-style deck, in my opinion. I searched up Jitte a lot of the time. By using 2 mana to cast SFM, 2 mana to cast Jitte, and 2 mana to equip it, I feel like you are slowing yourself down. I would consider running multiple copies of Jittes/Swords with no SFMs, with the idea that you could cast some early drops and then cast/equip Jitte or Sword quickly. This would give you a huge tempo edge against the stone blade decks and allow you to keep pace with the delver decks. When I searched Batterskull, my opponent would often kill the SFM, leaving me no realistic chance of playing it in such a land-light deck.
I would like to test with 2 Qasali Pridemages and 2 Meddling Mages for removal and disruption in place of the SFMs. The Pridemages would be good against equipment and Miracles. I think the main deck Meddling Mages would be nice against combo, control, and fair decks. For combo, you could name a combo piece, for control you could name board sweepers, and against fair decks I think its really important to name the -1/-1 effects that are designed to hit TNN but wreck this deck as well. Basically, I like the classic Noble Fish idea of cheap creatures and disruption. This build needs a little more disruption IMO.
In the matches I won, I really felt the benefit of running a deck that no one knew about. People are so unsure of how to play against you when they see Judges Familiars and Looter il-Kors. They have no idea if you are running Daze or what. I also remember somebody siding in something against me that was totally horrible just because he wasn't familiar with my list. I think the deck has potential - I want to try playing it a little more. I know this is a small sample size, so take it for what its worth.
I tried cutting the two Moms for Qasali Pridemages and it seemed to work out really well. This isn't really a Mom deck...most of the creatures are either 0/1 mana dorks, 1/1s that sac themselves, and TNNs which don't need Mom to protect them. To be honest, I didn't notice the presence of the Pridemages nearly as much as the absence of Moms. I'm sure there's an argument to be made for running Meddling Mage or Snapcaster Mage or who know what else in those two spots.
@the anti-synergy between Edric and exalted creatures: I've found that the exalted trigger is really just a nice side-effect, but it's not really critical. Most of the time, the extra draw power is the real advantage. If you get to a point where you are attacking with multiple Ophidians, you're probably gonna win in spite of the missing exalted triggers.
I've really enjoyed the 3 TNN and 3 Meddling set up so far. Has anyone else tested something similar? Bahra just 4-0'ed a daily with his original list.
I haven't tried the Meddling mage, but I'm trying to shore up the MOMs to 4
Would it be stronger to just play it in a Maverick shell with Edric and TNN in the knight of the relinquary slots?
I thought the reason the Bant-stoneforge decks went out of favour was because Maverick sported basically the same gameplan but better.
9th at SCG Somerset with Edric making another appearance in a BUG Order deck.
Looks at the standings -
BUG Edric (Natural Order) 8th Eli Kassis
Bant Edric (Noble Fish) 9th Matthew Szabo
Guess they will have to move this to Established soon!
My Legacy Decks of choice: Pox, Miracles, D&T or Lands.
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Also, with Bant Edric, Szabo was 7-1 and got deck checked and was given a game loss for two sleeve being a bit more played. He was then up agianst dredge and lost game one with out sideboard knowledge at that point. He came back to beat Eric Reel on Rug Delver 2-0.
Szabo posted a report of the tournament here.
I'm curious how bad were those sleeves.
I can't help but wonder, with all the recent comments about this deck's strengths and flaws, if black > white would be preferred. Here's what I think:
-You lose SFM but it doesn't mean you lose equipments as you can still play 1-2 copies of Jitte successfully;
-StP becomes Decay and you get better answers against artifacts and enchantments;
-Noble gets upgraded to DRS;
-You get access to Baleful Strix for more card advantage, resilience to Goyf, and Edric potential;
-Dark Confidant doesn't sound too bad in there either;
-Your vulnerability to -1/-1 wrath effects decreases;
-Higher blue count for FoW;
-Overall more deck space to work with
Do you know what assuming does? It makes an ass out of you and me.
Get it...? Ass, u, me?
... ffs I was trying to be funny...
So what goes in he SFM slot that can grind games or be a quick route to winning?
I playtested with Szabo in preparation for the event so I will share my thoughts:
- SFM is awesome in the deck. Finds the right equipment and allows it to be played for less and uncounterable.
- The deck functions on very little mana, so StP is not worse than Decay here. You want to play a guy and equip.
- Noble to Deathrite is not really an upgrade here. Yes DRS survives all the -1/-1 effects; however the exalted triggers allow your Birds to be a serious threat and helps TNN in a race. You also don't have to worry about playing Deathrite mirrors which can become frustrating.
- Baleful Strix is not bad but does not help the -1/-1 arguement.
- Rest In Peace with Enlightened Tutor out of the board are huge against Goyf/ DRS decks and Tutor also gets Arcane Lab for Elves (which was everywhere) and Storm.
- Confidant again dies to -1/-1 effects. You already have Edric, who can draw you 2-3 cards as soon as he is played and you move to combat.
Still in love with this deck, might consider a Will of the Council in the board as my 5th removal spell.
seems like green sun's zenith could fill the role of additional one drops, in the form of dryad arbor, tutor for edric when you need it and play a toolbox of sorts to answer random threats.
arbor is also decent as a surprise attacker/blocker when you fetch it with a fetchland
the package would be something like this:
1 dryad arbor
3 zenith
1 scavenging ooze
1 qasali pridemage
1 knight of the reliquary
The question is what to cut and still keep the blue count high for FOW
Hello people! First time poster here.
I have been playing Death and taxes for close to 2 years straight now i tought i needed a change. After watching gahra playing this deck online i tought it was very interesting and i might as well give it a spin!
I playtested the original list for close to 4 weeks and something was just ......weird. I totaly loved it but i tought i was just lackluster sometimes.
So............ i started to do some tweaking. I came up whit a different list but i think its still the same as Noble Fish.
alright so here it is,
Creatures:
4x noble hierach
4x judge's familiar
3x stoneforge mysthic
3x Cold-eye selkie
2x looter ill-kor
2x true-name nemesis
2x quasalie pridemage
Spell:
1x jitte
1x batterskull
1x sword of fire and ice
4x Force of will
4x brainstorm
4x swords to plowshares
3x daze
3x Giant growth
Lands:
1x island
1x plains
2x tropical island
3x thundra
1x savanah
4x misty rainforest
4x floded strand
4x wasteland
Alright so yeah...... now what i tryed to do, is just keep the same goal whit diffrent cards. I found edric great sometimes, but the poor synergy of him with noble hierach and mother of runes just kept buggin me. On his own, edric was not to good either. So i went and replaced him with Cold-eye selkie. I also replaced the mothers for Quasalie pridemage. The selkie just performed BEYOND my expectations. If you land her on the field and carve a way for her, its card advantage heaven and since like 60% of the meta game is blue.....thats not realy an issue. Get her to attack whit 1 or 2 exalted triggers and your already in the money, now add Giant growth, and you just cast ancestral recall.
Giant growth surprised me also. I tought it might be just *to cute* of an interaction to keep it in the deck but as i playtested the deck, i found it quite good. Protects from bolts, helps to kills gofys when blocking, DRAWS CARDS WITH SELKIE and can help you win a race. I seriously fell in love whit it all over again. Heck!! i had people starting to cast toughtseizes and cabal theray on it juste because they couldnt handle it. Not to mention when you attack whit selkie and they force giant growth to stop you from drawing additional cards, wich is also realy nice..... 2 for 1....OFF A GIANT GROWTH!!!
the only thing i don't like at this point are the stone forge mystics....they just feel slow. I would rather run 3-4 pieces of equipments floating around in the deck and run other creatures instead.
I have been playing this list for 3 weeks now and have a record of 12-3 so far (5 rounds events every monday nights).lost to burn, G/U food chain and 12 post.
Sorry for the misspelling if any, i tryed my best
61 cards with 3 Mystic....and 3 Giant Growth seems really really wrong. The point of Edric is to combine with your evasive guys and generate CA that way, Selkie will always be a turn slower and only adds to the -1/-1 vulnerability.
I think if you are saying that Giant Growth is better than Stoneforge Mystic, you really need to play more Legacy.
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