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Thread: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

  1. #41

    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by rufus View Post
    This 'draft only' set seems even more money grubbing than introducing mythic rares.
    Yeah, I'm not really a fan of the fact that many of the cards are explicitly Limited only (with their "When you draft..." text) as opposed to implicitly Limited only (i.e. janky shit cards you wouldn't ever find a use for in any Constructed format). Yes, it's unexplored design space, and it may even be pretty fun to try, but it comes at a bad time; after Wizards has already done some serious money-grubbery in the recent past. Things like the way Modern Masters was printed and priced, Commander's Arsenal, or a freaking $70 Modern event deck (yes, I am EXTREMELY butthurt about this) really add up.

  2. #42

    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Bed Decks Palyer View Post
    Interesting? How that happend?
    I could be wrong on the number but I believe it was a decision made by Wizards to chose about 20% of the rares from the affected sets to be not put on the reserved list for future reprints.

  3. #43
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    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Sylphnir View Post

    Is this the first direct mana to life converter since Channel?
    Way less powerful obviously but still.
    You can't pay life you don't have right? So no Lich's Mirror or Phyrexian Unlife combos?

  4. #44
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    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Cire View Post
    You can't pay life you don't have right? So no Lich's Mirror or Phyrexian Unlife combos?
    Yep. If you're at 1 or 2 you can't activate it.
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  5. #45
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    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion



    Most goblins have 2 or less power right?
    I am convinced that WotC is "dumbing" the game because of all the stupid posts they come across on MTG-related forums
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    [10:23:04]  13NoVa: lol dumb ******; nice draws with retard.dec
    stupid cocksucker
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  6. #46

    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    He puts every playable Goblin but Krenko into play I believe.

  7. #47
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    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by (nameless one) View Post


    Most goblins have 2 or less power right?
    Looking at the most recent top 16 from a 6+ round tournament, the guy played 16 creatures with 1 power, 12 with 2 power and 1 with 3.

    Definitely a possibility, but I think you'd probably want to tweak the deck to play a few more 1 power duders.
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  8. #48

    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by thecrav View Post
    Looking at the most recent top 16 from a 6+ round tournament, the guy played 16 creatures with 1 power, 12 with 2 power and 1 with 3.

    Definitely a possibility, but I think you'd probably want to tweak the deck to play a few more 1 power duders.
    It's less than or equal to, so he hits every Goblin. With some 20-25 Goblins still in the deck around t4~, it seems like he's about 40-50% chance to hit. Imagine Vialing him in after a Terminus to rebuy all your Ringleaders or SGC or Matrons. I can see him taking a couple Piledriver or MWM slots in RB Goblins, since there's no Thalia to clog that slot.

  9. #49
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    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Would you run RWB Goblins? Doubt that. The question is: is the blacksplash for this dood + discard better than RW Goblins with hatebears?
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  10. #50

    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Lemnear View Post
    Would you run RWB Goblins? Doubt that. The question is: is the blacksplash for this dood + discard better than RW Goblins with hatebears?
    You also get access to cards like Thoughtseize and DRS, and potentially others.

  11. #51
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    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Darkenslight View Post
    You also get access to cards like Thoughtseize and DRS, and potentially others.
    I mentioned discard as the only alternative to hatebears if you cut white for black to still being able to support Port + Wasteland and that includes Thoughtseize. It's an age-old discussion if you can afford to run cards like Thoughtseize, which present no threat itself in a pure aggro shell. The RB design of Goblins was en vogue during Llorwyn but got dismissed later as the Mad Auntie's & Wort, Boggart Auntie's cardadvantage wasn't worth the splash. I feel this is just the same case: You splash black for a 2cc creature which will create cardadvantage for about 4 mana in activation cost while you want to use your mana for mana-disruption instead. Do goblins really need an off-color engine in addition to Matron + Ringleader? Doubt that.

    DRS is a stupid argument. It's an elf, requires green for full potential and you are not even running a mentionable number of instants/sorceries to feed it. What is it recently that people suggest splashing DRS or SFM in like any archetype and call it a day?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Echelon View Post
    Lemnear sounds harsh at times, but he means well. Or to destroy, but that's when he starts rapping.

    Architect by day, rapstar by night. He's pretty much the German Hannah Montana. Sometimes he even comes in like a wrecking ball.

  12. #52
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    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by (nameless one) View Post


    Most goblins have 2 or less power right?
    Wow, a decent RB card? Picture me impressed, i'd never thought i'd see the day... But honestly, this would've been so good as a card 2-3 years ago. Still a good card, but not sure it has an home right now.

  13. #53
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    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Niiiice.

    I know Goblins is the most relevant tribe in RB but it could just as well be any efficient assortment of 1-3 power guys. Goblin Guides, Hellspark Elementals, Dark Confidants, etc.

    Granted it's easiest to find it with Matron, and flipping Ringleader to it is living the dream and all, it just doesn't have to be Tribal is all.

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  14. #54

    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    What do you think about Muzzio, Visionary Architect ?

    It is a way slower than Tinker and a boltable creature, yet still interesting.

    http://www.magicspoiler.com/wp-conte...al-Spoiler.jpg

  15. #55

    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Rush80 View Post
    What do you think about Muzzio, Visionary Architect ?....
    I think there are better options for 7 mana.

  16. #56
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    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by (nameless one) View Post


    Most goblins have 2 or less power right?
    Why are we focusing in on goblins?

    Most good creatures nowadays don't have more than 2 power. Colorwise they are all over the place but this guy can get; DRS, SFM, Mother of Ruins, Ooze, etc.

    The problem is that he does nothing 50% of the time - and that's if you run 30 creatures with 2 or below power and not named Grenzo.

    It might be better to think about playing Grenzo in combination with things like: Ancient Stirrings and Commune with Nature.

    Theoretical Deck list:

    Four - Color Dungeon.

    4 Grenzo
    4 Nobel Heirarch
    4 SFM
    4 Dark Confidant
    4 Mother of Ruins
    4 Thalia
    4 Phyrexian Revoker

    3 Ancient Stirrings
    4 Commune with Nature
    1 Jitte
    1 Batterskull
    1 Sword of fire and Ice
    4 Aether Vial

    2 Ancient Ziggurat
    2 Cavern of Souls
    4 Mana Confluence
    4 City of Brass
    2 Reflecting Pool
    4 Wasteland

  17. #57
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    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Cire View Post
    Why are we focusing in on goblins?

    Most good creatures nowadays don't have more than 2 power. Colorwise they are all over the place but this guy can get; DRS, SFM, Mother of Ruins, Ooze, etc.

    The problem is that he does nothing 50% of the time - and that's if you run 30 creatures with 2 or below power and not named Grenzo.

    It might be better to think about playing Grenzo in combination with things like: Ancient Stirrings and Commune with Nature.
    So, inasmuch as 'doing nothing' -- it's about like any "reveal the top X cards" effect, only it's bottom of the library instead.

    If it were the top of the deck, then it would necessarily be one of those 'aw shucks, it's only good with Brainstorm" cards. That's not to say that Blue isn't real good at sending cards to the bottom too, but at least Scry gives RB a means of stacking the trunk as well. I doubt the kind of decks that would play this card benefit from splashing Blue for, like, Truth or Tale right?

    Also it gives Ye Olde Durpy Sligh Deck one more thing to do at end of turn. As ever, being able to commit resources to the right task is critical in such a deck, and it sucks to run out of gas. If you're 'The Beatdown' but you're playing control with your burn spells, you're failing. If you're supposed to be playing control and you're doming your opponent instead, you're doing it weird. This guy at least gives an RB deck an alternative to cycling through their burn spells as fast as possible; EOT, pay 4 and maybe drop 2 - 6 power of creatures into play? Seems good.

    Also also... read the card -- first the card hits the graveyard, and then if it meets the conditions it comes into play. It doesn't get exiled; that means it's yet another means of tossing any card you want into the bin(short of a creature that would ETB, it's not an optional effect). Something something Flashback, something something Reanimator, something Threshold? something. You can dump bunches of shit in the bin, is what I'm saying.
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  18. #58
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    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by TsumiBand View Post
    So, inasmuch as 'doing nothing' -- it's about like any "reveal the top X cards" effect, only it's bottom of the library instead.

    If it were the top of the deck, then it would necessarily be one of those 'aw shucks, it's only good with Brainstorm" cards. That's not to say that Blue isn't real good at sending cards to the bottom too, but at least Scry gives RB a means of stacking the trunk as well. I doubt the kind of decks that would play this card benefit from splashing Blue for, like, Truth or Tale right?

    Also it gives Ye Olde Durpy Sligh Deck one more thing to do at end of turn. As ever, being able to commit resources to the right task is critical in such a deck, and it sucks to run out of gas. If you're 'The Beatdown' but you're playing control with your burn spells, you're failing. If you're supposed to be playing control and you're doming your opponent instead, you're doing it weird. This guy at least gives an RB deck an alternative to cycling through their burn spells as fast as possible; EOT, pay 4 and maybe drop 2 - 6 power of creatures into play? Seems good.

    Also also... read the card -- first the card hits the graveyard, and then if it meets the conditions it comes into play. It doesn't get exiled; that means it's yet another means of tossing any card you want into the bin(short of a creature that would ETB, it's not an optional effect). Something something Flashback, something something Reanimator, something Threshold? something. You can dump bunches of shit in the bin, is what I'm saying.
    I don't really understand what part of my post you're responding to?

  19. #59
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    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Yes! Someone create an Enter the Dungeon.dec list!
    I am convinced that WotC is "dumbing" the game because of all the stupid posts they come across on MTG-related forums
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle View Post
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    Finglonger plays Spell Pierce from his hand.
    [10:22:43]  13NoVa: lol
    sure
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    [10:23:04]  13NoVa: lol dumb ******; nice draws with retard.dec
    stupid cocksucker
    You have been kicked out of the game.

  20. #60
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    Re: Conspiracy - Spoiler discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Cire View Post
    I don't really understand what part of my post you're responding to?
    Eh, I lost my narrative a bit. :/

    You also posted how it didn't have to be tribal, which I agree with (and meant to say so in my response). Consider the case of Hellspark Elemental; even if Grenzo is a 2/2, one can still Unearth it for 3 dmg and great justice.

    It's just more complicated than "50% of the time he does nothing", because he does "reverse mill" your deck in fact. The cards stay in the graveyard. It's attractive because the effect is, as they say, "on a stick". I feel like there's a host of good interactions potentially there, just not sure what exactly.
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