chasm is not doing the job here, its one of the top card to board out here, along with punishing fire. you could argue keeping tabernacle in for that scenario, but im boarding out chasm every time.Originally Posted by nolink
you could do whatever you prefer, but I dont think it puts you in the best position.
"Brainstorm and Fetchlands are interesting although I don't know if Brainstorms alone are worth it right now, because Stifle is a common card. " -Peddi 2015.
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...551#post892551
just wrote a report with lands.Would love to hear your comments.
Hi there, I saw more and more players with 2 Tabernacle in main (over Ghost Quarter). Do you think it's a good move in the current meta ? (read GP Lille metagame).
I have to say that I am really looking foward to see your list (and - maybe - a quick report, or your feeling about playing Eternal Garden in such a big event [9-14 round is exhausting for everyone, but with Land, it can be really brainkilling])
And still, #174 of 1567 is a good result, so congrats!
Decklist:
4 life from the loam
4 exploration
3 crop rotation
1 sylvan library
1 worm harvest
3 intuition
3 punishing fire
4 mox diamond
2 engineered explosives
2 chalice of the void
4 wasteland
4 rishadan port
2 tolaria west
2 tropical island
1 forest
1 taiga
1 bayou
3 grove of the burnwillows
3 maze of ith
3 fetches
2 thespians stage
1 dark depths
1 tabernacle
1 academy ruins
1 ghost quarter
1 karakas
1 bojuka bog
1 urborg, tomb of yawmoth
Sideboard:
2 CHOKE
4 dark confidant
3 sphere of resistance
3 krosan grip
3 Iona, shield of emeria
Will do a minireport, kina busy atm.
"Brainstorm and Fetchlands are interesting although I don't know if Brainstorms alone are worth it right now, because Stifle is a common card. " -Peddi 2015.
Thank you! =)
It seems i left my two pages of notes in France.
Il can only give a super brief summary.
Matchups:
Bye: Opponent Never showed up. AC died. Bottles of water were handed out. I got his too. doublewin.
RUG: 2-0
R/G "lands": 2-0
Burn: 2-0
Miracles: 2-0
BUG: 2-0
6-0 at that point. 3 more points for day two.
WGB maverick-ish: 1-1 ( i i win game 1. he wins game two in the last round of overtime) (I missplayed and missed my own chalice trigger ftw)
Infect: Lost. Cant remember score.
Miracles: Lost 2-1 (I think) he played at least two surgicals and meddling mages.
Felt like deck was good. Felt like i punted for 7-0.
Chokes were great. I cut a tropical for a grove for that reason.
When boarding in chokes, take out a trop and a tolaria west.(since intuition comes out as well, except vs omnitell)
I Never faced omni at all, couldnt say if Ionas are worth it yet.
Please ask questions.
Tightest game was perhaps vs burn, since i have no brige, zuran orb or chasm.
Chalices are super boss. killed several guys w. them.
current stat: NEVER lost to R/G lands.
Had sweet brag stat ruined at this GP. I lost for the first time on a GP day one, while playing w. lands, during my 26th round of play. Was sweet run.
"Brainstorm and Fetchlands are interesting although I don't know if Brainstorms alone are worth it right now, because Stifle is a common card. " -Peddi 2015.
@ Phelix: Ok, thanks for sharing, and sorry you forgot your infos in Lille.^^ So, a few questions for you:
1/ How was Worm Harvest, in particular against Miracle? Did you sided it out or not (I tend to keep them against Miracle because they are often running only 1 RiP in their 75, but maybe it's a mistake)?
2/ How good were the 4 Bob? In which M-U do you pack them in?
3/ What about that lonely Sylvan? =) I know it's super strong, but how many time per round can you get it into play, and not dredged in your yard (which tends to happen to me. Isn't it a free traget for Decay G1?)? (In other word, was that slot worth it?)
4/ Didn't you miss the 4th Krosan Grip?
5/ What are you thoughts about Boseiju in the 75?
6/ Would you ever consider playing Decay since you have a good black manabase?
Btw, gg against Burn... what happend? Ultra-quick 20/20?
PS: I lol'ed when i read R/G "lands": 2-0Damn, you really hate that R/G version!
EDIT: Not even a single Tranquil Thicket?
Interesting, could you elaborate on cutting Chasm?
Do you think RUG is favored against RG? It seems to me that who establishes loam/accelerant/wasteland, or who denies loam through crop->bog has the most chance to win, and with 2 manabond, 4gamble and 4crop RG seems best equipped?
1. I mainly play worm harvest to beat miracles. I love the card.
2. Love 4 bob. It gives us an engine without using the yard, as well as a clock.
3. Sylvan super strong against control and non-storm combo. Against deck w decay we win anyway since they mostly have No basics
4. 4 grips are a real option. I traded one for iona. If i wasnt on that plan id play 4.
5/ What are you thoughts about Boseiju in the 75? -No. With worm harvest we Are ok. We beat miracles. Id rather have smokestack
6/ i played decay for a while. Grip is better Vs omni (and moon)
7. Burn. Chalice ftw. Game two spheres also saved me.
EDIT: Not even a single Tranquil Thicket? - No And thats wrong now. Lots of surgicals out there.
"Brainstorm and Fetchlands are interesting although I don't know if Brainstorms alone are worth it right now, because Stifle is a common card. " -Peddi 2015.
I dont hate RG. Its a dark depths combo deck. Its not lands.
I hate saying sultai way more.
"Brainstorm and Fetchlands are interesting although I don't know if Brainstorms alone are worth it right now, because Stifle is a common card. " -Peddi 2015.
Yes i think RUG is a big favorite Vs RG.
Chasm is out now since the format about spells right now, not critters.
"Brainstorm and Fetchlands are interesting although I don't know if Brainstorms alone are worth it right now, because Stifle is a common card. " -Peddi 2015.
I've gone down to 2 twest and up to 2 thicket in case I can't get a chalice to stick vs surgical decks. After the cruise ban this felt like the way to go with more drs coming back and chasm/orb have been less effective in general with people picking up more omni and miralces. MD chalice is a good compromise for not having our traditional voltron setup. At least 3 Iona is reasonable, but I wouldn't go any lower if you go this route. I have found my opp get out from under a 3sphere too many times for my liking. The burn mu you have to just dodge with this setup(5 hate cards), but that seems like a fair tradeoff for the current meta.
For miracles, did you also bring in spheres to be paired with choke? I am on that plan, but with thalias.
Hi,
I went 10-4-1 in Lille with RG-Lands, hereīs my decklist and a quick report
4 Mox Diamond
4 Exploration
2 Manabond
4 Gamble
4 Loam
4 Rotation
3 Punishing Fire
2 Sylvan Library
1 Verdant Catacomb
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Windswept Heath
2 Taiga
1 Forest
2 Tranquil Thicket
4 Grove of the Burnwillows
4 Waste
4 Port
4 Stage
3 Maze
2 Depths
1 Chasm
1 Tabernacle
1 Savannah
1 Bojuka Bog
Sideboard:
4 Krosan Grip
4 Ethersworn Cannonist
3 Red Elemental Blast
1 Hydro Blast
1 Choke
2 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
Day1:
(I only remembered the things that stood out day one which are mainly the losses so its not gonna be very detailed, sorry)
R1: 2-0 against Stoneblade
R2: 2-1 against BUG Delver
R3: 0-2 against 4c Delver with True-Name-Nemesis
I just remember that I was extremly pissed and that he had True-Name-Nemesis as a 2-of and that I locked him out completly but that I still just died slowly to my personal Nemesis of a card, because I couldnt find an anything to save me or kill him.
R4: 2-1 against UR Delver
R5: 2-0 against Death and Taxes
R6: 1-2 against Elves
this were the least fun match, because two of the three games werent played they were decided by mulligan
Game one he mulls to 3, and I crush him with a near perfect 7
Game two is actually close and includes my most debatable play of the day, I have Tabernacle in play and he got Cradle and a bunch of creatures, I have Sylvan Library and see Gamble and nothing else that helps me,
if he has natural order and untaps he wins, but if not I could grind him out with punishing Fire, I have a Grove so I could Gamble for that, but if I gamble for Wasteland and get to keep it I most likely win on the spot, I ponder some time then pay 8 life to bring my total hand size to 8 and gamble for Wasteland, I roll the die and... hit the wasteland, he untaps and casts natural order
Game three I mull to a bad 4 and lose
R7: 2-1 against Death and Taxes
this match also sticked in my memory but for completly diffrent reasons
Game one I completly lock him out of the game but instead of conceding he watched me for over 30 min. do my thing until I find my kill, apparently he didnīt know what my deck was doing so I can at least understand that.
Game two he has a fast start and I keep a solid hand but after 2-3 completly landless dredges Iīm so far behind, that I canīt get back in the game.
Game three is again me having him completly locked out of the game, but I dont find the kill, and time is running up, but instead of playing fast he just stares for minutes at his cards, deciding which of the creatures that die to punishing fire heīs going to play, we go to extra turns of course and they run out one turn before I could kill him, at least after I explained to him that a draw would kill either of us and that thereīs definitly no way out for him he concedes, which was a fine move, but my nerves...my nerves.
R8: I dont remember this one Iīm sorry but I won
R9: 2-1 against RUG Delver
Day 2:
R:10 2-1 against Omnitell
canīt say much else other then my board paid of
R:11 2-1 against Omnitell
canīt say much else other then my board paid of
R:12 0-2 against ANT
Well my board lacked a bit in the anti-storm-department and he was one of the best ANT Players around (Kai), so I didnt stand that much of a chance
R:13 0-2 against Omnitell
even with 15 cards to side against Omnitell the matchup is still hard, and you still need good draw, so thats that
R:14 2-0 against UR Delver
R:15 1-1 intentional Draw against Maverick-ish
We still played after we drawed, and I would have won 2-1 but I rather took 250 then maybe playing another Storm or Onmitell and have nothing
So in conclusion I finished 77th, I really liked the sylvan librarys, but I dont know if they are a main stay, I really liked my board, Krosan Grip is probably the best board card right now, itīs usefull against almost anything, I wished I played against miracles because the 4 Blasts + the 4 Krosan Grip make that matchup really favorable, the white-splash board cards where mvp against Omnitell, but for having a good chance against storm 2-4 more cards would be needed, so I think I will maybe take out two Blasts for two Mind-Break-Traps if after the good finishes of Storm (I rarely saw any Storm players at all but all the ones I saw were playing at the top-tables, and even if none were Top-8, I think those decks might gain back some popularity), because against good storm players you got to deversify your hate between permanent and spell hate. Also I tried slauther games for an extended period of time and its almost allways to slow.
Another thing I wanted to talk about is something that bugs me, the generel shittalking of RG-Lands by RUG-Lands Players like "its not real Lands", look I intensivly and exclusivly played Lands long before the printing of Thespian Stage and thereafter, I played it 4c, 5c with Intuition and E-Tutor, with Intuition and Gamble etc. and I tried the RG-Version almost immediatly after it was possible, so I have expierience with both decks. And after playing both decks alot, I came to the conclusion that RG-Lands is just the superior deck of the two, I havenīt played the recent Incarnation of the RUG version so I reserve judgement for that and plan to play around with that in the future, but from what I can see not much has changed.
So why do I think RG is superior, the main reason is its versetility, in that yes it can be a very explosive Dark Dephts Combo deck, but to think its just that is just foolish, it can also be a nearly as grindy prison-controle Deck as the RUG version, using alomst the same tools. And while I agree you dont have the complicated Intuition piles (which I genuinly miss) or a swissarmy-knive artifact toolbox, to test your skill, what really makes the RG-Version so challenging is to know when to follow which strategie or when to switch gears, something that can be as or even harder than an Intuition pile, and while RUG-Lands is the better controle deck (which is why itīs better in the mirror, because thats all about controle), it lacks this very core aspect which makes RG-Lands such a great deck. And of course the win-percentage numbers of the two decks back me up, but thats beside the point.
On an unrelated note, I think the best positioned deck this GP was the 4c Aggro-Loam which made top-8 twice, its a great deck (that can crush everything right now including Lands), a hybrid of Lands and Maverick I would say, so its definitly worth checking out.
Thats all
Best Michael
I'm a Lands player who vastly prefers RUG, yet I agree with everything you say. I even consider Jund Depths to be a Lands.dec configuration - and that's more of a stretch.
R/G is a control deck just like RUG, and trying to combo out asap is usually a mistake with either deck. I actually find R/G harder to play, but that could be because I'm more used to playing RUG. As you say the tools are similar and the differences are often subtle in the heat of battle; so my RUG Lands instincts might be hindering me.
I think the shit talk is jealousy - RUG lands is just more fun, and some of us (not me) are bitter that R/G puts up better numbers. As for which is better, I think it's meta dependent. RUG tends to be better vs control but worse vs combo.
I think it's just Punishing Dark Maverick with 4x Chalice and a lack f 1ccspells t play around Chalice (though people are bound to call it a dedicated anti-blue deck). I have been thinking a lot about this MU though. I think the deck is apt to take off in a hurry, as some players are chomping at the bit to play a blue-less midrange deck.
My feeling is that RUG will do much better than R/G in this match.
I'd like to see more discussion on this MU for sure! Anybody have any thoughts?
- With almost every permanent they play having cc = 2, EE should be a bomb in this MU
- R/G runs more 1ccspells, and is more easily shut down by Chalice.
- Abrupt Decay is good against Lili
Yes I think the matchup is extremly hard, I played against it in a trial and was pretty much obliterated, DRS, Ooze (both 1-of but green-suns-zenithable) + Leyline of the void from the board + 4xChalice MB which mostly hits RG-Lands, thus making this matchup a good deal worse than with RUG I think, but both versions have trouble here, most RUG builds also run Crop Rotation and Exploration, and blanking those is allways terrible, but its true EE is probably a massive asset here.
It's a tough matchup. I played against it twice in Lille (trial and mainevent) and lost both 2-1. Thing is that Scooze and KOTR will outgrind RG if they see play. In retrospect, I think a fast combowin before KOTR comes active might be the best approach, as they only have Karakas/Maze to deal with the token (no swords because of Chalice).
Congrats by the way with your 77th place!
Its two different decks.
They have two threads on these boards. Lets with er merge them or seperate them.
What deck is better? Statistically we dont know.
What deck is harder to play? Id Wager the rug version
Do we need to pick sides ? Not at All.
"Brainstorm and Fetchlands are interesting although I don't know if Brainstorms alone are worth it right now, because Stifle is a common card. " -Peddi 2015.
I'm playing both right now and do prefer them to be separated even though it's annoying for new people like LegoEgo who post in the wrong thread. I feel like combining them would stifle most of the discussion about RUGx since it's being played way less.
MTGS has a combined thread that is confusing if you are not an adept lands player and has useless content if you are more experienced and prefer playing one version.
Agian, links to other "Lands" strategies are in primer.
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