[Primer/Deck] Nic Fit

[lavafrogg]

Just look at a random list and count the number of actual creatures with CMC <= 3. The number is far too low to support Collected Company.

It would be a new NicFit idea, or more importantly a new VeteranExplorer/Cabal Therapy Idea. Something like:

4 Eternal Witness
4 Veteran Explorer

3 Collective Company
4 Green Sun's Zenith
4 Cabal Therapy

Instant speed lets the deck recover from sweepers and also allows us to hold up for removal/play around counters.

I am just wondering why a GBx creature deck didn't even consider the card.

[Echelon]

The Nic Fit 2.0 you're describing is Maverick, roughly.

It's Nic Fit without the strength to go over the top.

Decks don't touch it b/c it's a horrible card. It would have been borderline playable if either it looked at creatures with CMC <= 4 instead of 3 or of it let you look at the top 10 cards instead of 6. In its current state it does too little for the effort/dedication needed to pull it off.

[lavafrogg]

Edit: Moving this

That being said, I played my list from last week at this weeks local and had a great time going 3-1-1. It was a big switch from all of the Lands I have been practicing with, but I have tons of experience with GBx decks in the past.

The list:
Creatures(16)
4 Veteran Explorer
4 Dark Confidant
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Primeval Titan
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons
1 Thragtusk
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Courser of Kruphix
1 Siege Rhino
1 Eternal Witness

Spells(22)
4 Green Sun's Zenith
3 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Cabal Therapy
3 Hymn to Tourach
3 Liliana of the Veil
2 Pernicious Deed
3 Abrupt Decay

Lands(22)
3 Windswept Heath
3 Verdant Catacombs
2 Marsh Flats
3 bayou
2 savannah
1 scrubland
3 forest
2 swamp
1 plains
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Phyrexian Tower

Sideboard(15)
3 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Path to Exile
2 Gaddock Teeg
3 rest in peace
2 surgical extraction
3 choke

Round 1 BUG Delver W 2-0
I drew tons of basics and resolved a Veteran Explorer for profit both games. Lilliana shut the game down quickly and top kept my "hand" relevant.

Round 2 Miracles Draw 1-1-1
All 3 games went long. I would have won game 3 as I had an eternal witness/pernicious deed soft lock and would have switched to thragtusk, but I could not draw him in time to get the kill. I think I could have left 1 Veteran explorer in to power through the point in the game where I don't have much to do. Jace was also surgically extracted game 3.

Round 3 UWr Stoneforge W 2-1
Seige Rhino/Courser were MVP's of this one as swords were blown on Confidants and Explorers early and bolts could not take down the fatties. Hymn also made an early appearance game 2.

Round 4 Omnitel L 2-1
I just did not draw enough relevant cards to make anything happen game 1. An early Bob game 2 drew enough gas to hold him down with therapies and hymns but game 3 a canonist was the only thing i could find to try and slow the search, he had the combo in hand and show and told me turn 3.

Round 5 Elves W 2-0
Green Sun into Teeg early both games was enough to seal the deal. He had a value glimpse both games but could not draw enough with Teeg in play.

Super fun! I will work on the list more and I might have to slip back into the junk forum for a little bit.

[jbone2016]

So what do people think about watered down version of survival?

[Memories of the Time]

Made a 3-1-1 in a local last sunday with BUG Pod. Lose against UWR mentor (drawn all the lands, g2 keep swamp-sea-strix-ooze-veteran-vendilion... never found the third land), won against MentorMiracle, Miracle, Tezzeretor and 1-1 against Lands by my mistake, horribly.

[pettdan]

So what do people think about watered down version of survival?

Hard to say, but I'll try with a few comments. Not quite thought through yet.

Could be quite good with Explorer, Witness, Finks, Huntmaster and any token producer (Souls, Mentor, Garruk, Elspeth), providing card advantage at most activations. Which seems powerful.

It's destroyed by deed similarly to Sylvan, and doesn't filter for lands or removal. So you'll still want some Tops. On the other hand once you have lands you often want to draw your creatures and it's good at that, getting value along the way. You may be able to chain through a large part of your creature base over a few turns, especially due to Explorers. But you need to build for it with a few more cheap creatures and CIP effects. And even though you can't tutor for bullets it increases chances of finding them.

It's like a Pod without CMC limitations, random selection and not putting things into play. It means you need to keep low CMC's to make it better than Pod. Or play it with GSZ's and 8 basics, setting all exporers off more often while chaining for the larger beasts.

It does offer fast graveyard filling so Recurring Nightmare could be good next to it. Or maybe next to Living Wish [edit: Living Death] with Oozes and Deathrites..

[Arianrhod]

Hard to say, but I'll try with a few comments. Not quite thought through yet.

Could be quite good with Explorer, Witness, Finks, Huntmaster and any token producer (Souls, Mentor, Garruk, Elspeth), providing card advantage at most activations. Which seems powerful.

It's destroyed by deed similarly to Sylvan, and doesn't filter for lands or removal. So you'll still want some Tops. On the other hand once you have lands you often want to draw your creatures and it's good at that, getting value along the way. You may be able to chain through a large part of your creature base over a few turns, especially due to Explorers. But you need to build for it with a few more cheap creatures and CIP effects. And even though you can't tutor for bullets it increases chances of finding them.

It's like a Pod without CMC limitations, random selection and not putting things into play. It means you need to keep low CMC's to make it better than Pod. Or play it with GSZ's and 8 basics, setting all exporers off more often while chaining for the larger beasts.

It does offer fast graveyard filling so Recurring Nightmare could be good next to it. Or maybe next to Living Wish with Oozes and Deathrites..

If you run that card, you probably switch from running Deeds to running Damnations or Deluges instead, and round out with possibly 2 maindeck artifact/enchantment kill guys to compensate for losing Deed.

[Echelon]

It's doesn't net you any advantage. I don't see a reason to play it. G, sacrifice a creature: Draw the first creature card to come along. Seriously?

The problem with the card is that you have to play/resolve your creature cards before you can recycle them for a random critter. That's a rather big investment. Sure, it's cute when you use it in response to your opponents' removal, but how often will that come up?

Also, concerning token producers - why not just smash face with said tokens rather then durdle about?

[Fatal]

I was thinking about Evolutionary Leap and Veteran Explorer synergy.
http://www.magicspoiler.com/mtg-spoi...utionary-leap/

I case when deck running only Veteran Explorers as a creature we have combo which fetch 8 basics in one turn, which can't be broken by removal (only permission or enchantment removal).

Let take some scenerio:
Turn 1 - SDT/Discard/Cantrip
Turn 2 - Evolutionary Leap
Turn 3 - Explorer/GSZ + mana for use
Turn 4 - We have about 10+ mana available and great CQ in deck after fetching so many lands.

deck restriction - no other creatures in deck so basically deck should be focused on plainswalkers as wincon which isn't bad.

[Echelon]

Scapeshift on steroids?

[MD.Ghost]

Scapeshift on steroids?

This! and Walkers (and we can use the biggest with 10+ Mana ^^) and after the Explorers are gone, Deed is also ok, because Evolutionary Leap isn't needed anymore. Without Scapeshift (or without black...which means RUG ) you can also go the Walker Route and build a BUG Shell with the Engine, which also enable Counter Magic and Cantrips. Sounds absurd

[UseLess]

Minor note, it can only fetch 8 forests in one turn, which is significantly less attractive if you start running three or even two colors. Both the activation and casting the new explorer cost G, so I wouldn't call it a one-turn "combo".

[Bobmans]

I am currently thinking of something more alike R/G (JUND) Beats. Flametongue Kavu, Huntmaster of the Fells. Something in lines of JUND. The nice thing about the card is that it makes your creatures dodge your opponents removal. All it needs is have some solid ETB creatures and silver bullets. Packing Sensei's Divining Top and maybe even a couple of Worldly Tutor to put those silver bullets on top. Magus of the Moon on request vs lands. Sign me up. I am going to crack this card is some awesome build. Heck maybe i'll even jam in some Tarmogoyf's. Bloodbraid Elf would work to here. Or Bloodghast to be able to keep the loop going. Just some unorganised thoughts here. But i will be on this for sure.

Edit: hmm, on the other hand going for Worldly Tutor to put creatures on top so you can draw them with E.Leap is a bit awkward. Still i would love to jam a Master of Cruelties to the table. First Strike and Deathtouch. Plus unblocked puts your oppenent at zap range for Punishing Fire or Lightning Bolt.
Also the card dodges Rest in Piece since it does not require a graveyard. Offcourse cards like Recurring Nightmare make it better.

[Echelon]

Minor note, it can only fetch 8 forests in one turn, which is significantly less attractive if you start running three or even two colors. Both the activation and casting the new explorer cost G, so I wouldn't call it a one-turn "combo".

Hence Scapeshift . That, at least, is on-colour.

@Bobmans: You have read that the card goes to your hand, right? You're describing scenario's where you'd need 5 mana+ to tutor for a Magus of the Moon and so on. That's just too slow to be viable.

Also, why Worldy Tutor + sac a creature to draw a creature when you can also run Brainstorm/Ponder..? Seriously...

[Bobmans]

Hence Scapeshift . That, at least, is on-colour.

@Bobmans: You have read that the card goes to your hand, right? You're describing scenario's where you'd need 5 mana+ to tutor for a Magus of the Moon and so on. That's just too slow to be viable.

Also, why Worldy Tutor + sac a creature to draw a creature when you can also run Brainstorm/Ponder..? Seriously...

Well, not running blue is where i would like to be. JUND is where i specifically want to be at. I do not care to look for the best, i want to make the best out of something i like.

It's core would still be similar as current NicFit lists, ramping is key here. Offcourse i have read the card. It puts the shit in hand. Already revised on the Tutor tech. The mana curve would be lower, but it would be a "bigger" variant then regular JUND. Kinda like RG Survival was back then. Still i am exploring posibilities, but i really want to prevent the deck from going blue cantrip circus.

[Barook]

I was thinking about Evolutionary Leap and Veteran Explorer synergy.
http://www.magicspoiler.com/mtg-spoi...utionary-leap/

I case when deck running only Veteran Explorers as a creature we have combo which fetch 8 basics in one turn, which can't be broken by removal (only permission or enchantment removal).

Let take some scenerio:
Turn 1 - SDT/Discard/Cantrip
Turn 2 - Evolutionary Leap
Turn 3 - Explorer/GSZ + mana for use
Turn 4 - We have about 10+ mana available and great CQ in deck after fetching so many lands.

deck restriction - no other creatures in deck so basically deck should be focused on plainswalkers as wincon which isn't bad.

Why not run GSZ (for more consistent Explorers) and a few mana-heavy GSZ bombs, probably with some quality token producers to feed the Leap? I don't think you need to chain an absurd amounts of forests to get value out of the combo.

Some kind of Walker Superfriends deck might be workable, too, especially the token-producing ones.

[Fatal]

First list Scapeshift on Steroids:

4 Veteran Explorer
4 Evolutionary Leap - New Survival
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
3 Scapeshift
4 Burning Wish
4 Force of Will
4 Dig Through Time
4 Lightning Bolt
7 Forest
2 Island
1 Mountain
1 Taiga
3 Volcanic Island
2 Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle
3 Scalding Tarn
1 Tropical Island
3 Wooded Foothills
1 Badlands
1 Bayou
SB: 1 Scapeshift
SB: 1 Green Sun's Zenith
SB: 1 Overmaster
SB: 1 Slaughter Games
SB: 2 Firespout
SB: 2 Garruk, Primal Hunter
SB: 2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
SB: 2 Toxic Deluge
SB: 2 Krosan Grip
SB: 1 Gaze of Granite

First 20 hands played - GSZ MD would be good - but there is a problem with blue cards count.

DTT works great here since combing out feed your greaveyard with extra 4 cards (4 explorers)

[Memories of the Time]

@Fatal: too few Mountains i think

[firebadmattgood]

First list Scapeshift on Steroids:

4 Veteran Explorer
4 Evolutionary Leap - New Survival
4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
3 Scapeshift
4 Burning Wish
4 Force of Will
4 Dig Through Time
4 Lightning Bolt
7 Forest
2 Island
1 Mountain
1 Taiga
3 Volcanic Island
2 Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle
3 Scalding Tarn
1 Tropical Island
3 Wooded Foothills
1 Badlands
1 Bayou
SB: 1 Scapeshift
SB: 1 Green Sun's Zenith
SB: 1 Overmaster
SB: 1 Slaughter Games
SB: 2 Firespout
SB: 2 Garruk, Primal Hunter
SB: 2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
SB: 2 Toxic Deluge
SB: 2 Krosan Grip
SB: 1 Gaze of Granite

First 20 hands played - GSZ MD would be good - but there is a problem with blue cards count.

DTT works great here since combing out feed your greaveyard with extra 4 cards (4 explorers)

6 is way too few mountains. If you happen to draw a single one, you now can't scapeshift until you find a brainstorm to put it back. It also means you can only cast bolt or wish off of a Valakut.

[Ganfar]

4 color Shapeshift seems greedy.