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Thread: [DTB] Turbo Depths

  1. #2701

    Re: [DTB] Turbo Depths

    Quote Originally Posted by adrieng View Post
    With the return or rug delver I think it is time to be submerge proof again. this ban is really good news cause the deck loses to grixis delver if well played rug delver is easier
    they have a slower clock.

    Here is what I'll be playing :


    // 60 Maindeck
    // 8 Artifact
    4 Expedition Map
    4 Pithing Needle

    // 4 Creature
    4 Vampire Hexmage

    // 4 Enchantment
    4 Sylvan Library

    // 4 Instant
    4 Crop Rotation

    // 26 Land
    4 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
    4 Thespian's Stage
    4 Dark Depths
    4 Blooming Marsh
    1 Ghost Quarter
    1 Bojuka Bog
    4 Khalni Garden
    1 Sejiri Steppe
    3 Llanowar Wastes

    // 14 Sorcery
    4 Sylvan Scrying
    3 Inquisition of Kozilek
    4 Cabal Therapy
    3 Duress

    // 15 Sideboard
    // 3 Artifact
    SB: 3 Ratchet Bomb

    // 2 Creature
    SB: 2 Sylvan Safekeeper

    // 2 Enchantment
    SB: 2 Seal of Primordium

    // 5 Instant
    SB: 3 Surgical Extraction
    SB: 2 Golgari Charm

    // 1 Land
    SB: 1 Maze of Ith

    // 2 Sorcery
    SB: 2 Toxic Deluge

    HI adrieng

    Help me side guide vs tiers decks. Thanks

  2. #2702
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    Re: [DTB] Turbo Depths

    With DRS gone the deck can play life from the loam main and not have to worry about 25% of your matches. It results in a slightly slower version overall but better vs the slower matches where you need to recur the combo to easily win.

    I dont know if I ever posted about this but I used to play a version that was three colors with life from the loam main. It was ALOT of fun and really good vs alot of the meta but got crushed by DRS and all the grave hate that was main. It was something like the following.

    ***edit - see list below

    it also ran some one of's that I cannot remember. Things like glacial chasm and ancient grudge. I believe they had flashback or could be recurred to work with the entomb, loam, and gamble. It didn't have to run pithing needles because it could loam back its lands that got destroyed. It had ALOT of lines of play and was rather complex. Ultimately I abandon it because it was not well positioned in the meta at the time, but now with DRS gone it may be worth another look. It was similar to lands.dec but it was way more aggressive instead of defensive / controlling. T2 tokens were very common because of your ability to gamble / tutor so freely. I think that exploration was a 2 of and mirri's guile was 1x because I was testing it out. It wasn't wasted because I could check the top 3 before deciding to dredge with sylvan library.

    If anyone is interested to know more I can dig into my archives to see if I can find a list.


    *Edit - found / recreated the list

    This is 1 of 2 different lists...or its a combination of both. I couldn't find the list so this is what I remember. Some of the cards listed in the sideboard were actually main deck because I remember that I had 2 versions. One version played more white with knight of the reliquary, and the other version had rishadan ports to tap down opponents karakas / maze of iths. It's possible I found a way to run ports in this white version but that would have made it extremely weak on nonbasic lands and I dont think it would have functioned. The knight would have had trouble sacrificing lands to search and the deck might not have had enough colored mana sources. I'd have to take another really close look at the land composition.

    I'm also certain I didn't play with 61 cards...but I have no idea what I would have cut from here. I think the other version cut the white for liliana's and abrupt decays. If I recall correctly, the white version performed better because knight of the reliquary was a big enough threat on its own and could win games itself without having to rely on the combo. Of course it helps get the combo but it's just 1 extra measure of pressure that the opponent will use removal on. If the opponent does kill knight, it can be recurred it with volrath's stronghold. Hexmage is a good recursion target too. I remember this version being extremely strong vs miracles Game 1. They had grave hate for game 2 but I think i ended up taking out cards that made me rely so heavily on grave and putting in cards that did better late game / vs miracles like Abrupt decay's and liliana's. I also remember playing with 1 ravenís crime and 1 flame jab main. It was perfect because i could easily tutor them with gamble or entomb and they would completely wreck some decks. Flame jab helped A lot with D&T, and ravenís crime against control. It was a little slow against combo depending on what how many lands you had but if you went pas t3 you could usually take advantage of it.

    // 61 Maindeck
    // 4 Artifact
    4 Mox Diamond

    // 7 Creature
    3 Knight of the Reliquary
    4 Vampire Hexmage

    // 6 Enchantment
    3 Sylvan Library
    2 Exploration
    1 Mirri's Guile

    // 9 Instant
    2 Abrupt Decay
    3 Entomb
    4 Crop Rotation

    // 28 Land
    1 Bayou
    4 Dark Depths
    1 Forest
    1 Karakas
    1 Maze of Ith
    1 Savannah
    1 Scrubland
    1 Swamp
    1 Taiga
    4 Thespian's Stage
    3 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
    1 Tranquil Thicket
    4 Verdant Catacombs
    2 Wasteland
    1 Sejiri Steppe
    1 Volrath's Stronghold

    // 7 Sorcery
    3 Life from the Loam
    4 Gamble


    // 11 Sideboard
    // 4 Creature
    SB: 4 Dark Confidant

    // 2 Instant
    SB: 1 Ancient Grudge
    SB: 1 Ray of Revelation

    // 2 Sorcery
    SB: 1 Flame Jab
    SB: 1 Ravenís Crime

    // 2 Land
    SB: 1 Riftstone Portal
    SB: 1 Glacial Chasm

    // 3 Planeswalker
    SB: 3 Liliana of the Veil


    Hands that played out well

    T1 mox -> exploration, urborg, depths, hexmage (replace any of the lands with crop rotation)

    T1 land -> exploration, land, mox, entomb / gamble -> life from the loam

    T1 mox, land -> sylvan library
    T2 upkeep entomb life from the loam, drege 3 draw 2
    Last edited by apple713; 07-07-2018 at 02:22 PM.
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  3. #2703
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    lavafrogg's Avatar
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    Re: [DTB] Turbo Depths

    I need to submit a Decklist befor the end of the week. I want to play a safe keeper/Confidant list but donít know what to do!
    "eggs... why'd it have to be eggs"

  4. #2704

    Re: [DTB] Turbo Depths


    // 60 Maindeck
    // 8 Artifact
    4 Expedition Map
    4 Pithing Needle

    // 4 Creature
    4 Vampire Hexmage

    // 4 Enchantment
    4 Sylvan Library

    // 4 Instant
    4 Crop Rotation

    // 26 Land
    4 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
    4 Thespian's Stage
    4 Dark Depths
    4 Blooming Marsh
    1 Ghost Quarter
    1 Bojuka Bog
    4 Khalni Garden
    1 Sejiri Steppe
    3 Llanowar Wastes

    // 14 Sorcery
    4 Sylvan Scrying
    3 Inquisition of Kozilek
    4 Cabal Therapy
    3 Duress


    // 15 Sideboard
    // 3 Artifact
    SB: 3 Ratchet Bomb

    // 2 Creature
    SB: 2 Sylvan Safekeeper

    // 4 Enchantment
    SB: 4 Dread of Night

    // 3 Instant
    SB: 3 Surgical Extraction

    // 1 Land
    SB: 1 Maze of Ith

    // 2 Sorcery
    SB: 2 Toxic Deluge



    RUG delver :
    +3 bomb +1 maze
    -4 library

    miracle :
    +3 surgical
    +2 safekeeper

    -1 bog
    -4 scrying

    reanimator :

    +3 surgical
    + bomb if expect blood moon (Br)
    - scrying -ghost quarter

    storm :

    +3 surgical
    +3 bomb
    -4 scrying
    -1 ghost quarter
    -1 map

    sneak show :

    +3 bomb
    + 2/3 surgical
    - scrying/map

    death and taxes :

    +2 deluge
    +4 dread of night
    +2 safekeeper
    +1 maze
    -2 map
    -2 crop
    -3 duress
    -2/3 scrying

    ur delver/burn :

    -1 library
    -4 needle
    +3 bomb
    +2 safekeeper

  5. #2705

    Re: [DTB] Turbo Depths

    Quote Originally Posted by adrieng View Post

    // 60 Maindeck
    // 8 Artifact
    4 Expedition Map
    4 Pithing Needle

    // 4 Creature
    4 Vampire Hexmage

    // 4 Enchantment
    4 Sylvan Library

    // 4 Instant
    4 Crop Rotation

    // 26 Land
    4 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
    4 Thespian's Stage
    4 Dark Depths
    4 Blooming Marsh
    1 Ghost Quarter
    1 Bojuka Bog
    4 Khalni Garden
    1 Sejiri Steppe
    3 Llanowar Wastes

    // 14 Sorcery
    4 Sylvan Scrying
    3 Inquisition of Kozilek
    4 Cabal Therapy
    3 Duress


    // 15 Sideboard
    // 3 Artifact
    SB: 3 Ratchet Bomb

    // 2 Creature
    SB: 2 Sylvan Safekeeper

    // 4 Enchantment
    SB: 4 Dread of Night

    // 3 Instant
    SB: 3 Surgical Extraction

    // 1 Land
    SB: 1 Maze of Ith

    // 2 Sorcery
    SB: 2 Toxic Deluge



    RUG delver :
    +3 bomb +1 maze
    -4 library

    miracle :
    +3 surgical
    +2 safekeeper

    -1 bog
    -4 scrying

    reanimator :

    +3 surgical
    + bomb if expect blood moon (Br)
    - scrying -ghost quarter

    storm :

    +3 surgical
    +3 bomb
    -4 scrying
    -1 ghost quarter
    -1 map

    sneak show :

    +3 bomb
    + 2/3 surgical
    - scrying/map

    death and taxes :

    +2 deluge
    +4 dread of night
    +2 safekeeper
    +1 maze
    -2 map
    -2 crop
    -3 duress
    -2/3 scrying

    ur delver/burn :

    -1 library
    -4 needle
    +3 bomb
    +2 safekeeper
    I know it isn't common anymore, but why not run ESG? At least as a two of, it enables so many early turn wins.

  6. #2706

    Re: [DTB] Turbo Depths

    I know it isn't common anymore, but why not run ESG? At least as a two of, it enables so many early turn wins.
    More discard is usually better than ESG it allows to slow down your opponent and is not a dead card against deck which have answer to your token.

    I think also with the rise of stifle that playing guide +petal is not such a good idea because stifling your stage while you used guide or petal gives your opponent more turn to win than douvle activation with stage while having only lands.

  7. #2707
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    Re: [DTB] Turbo Depths

    Quote Originally Posted by adrieng View Post
    More discard is usually better than ESG it allows to slow down your opponent and is not a dead card against deck which have answer to your token.

    I think also with the rise of stifle that playing guide +petal is not such a good idea because stifling your stage while you used guide or petal gives your opponent more turn to win than douvle activation with stage while having only lands.
    True, but at the same time, decks running Stifle (mainly Canadian Threshold) will also play Daze and Spell Pierce, so instant fast mana can be handy in the matchup, no?

  8. #2708
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    Re: [DTB] Turbo Depths

    Quote Originally Posted by apple713 View Post
    // 61 Maindeck
    // 4 Artifact
    4 Mox Diamond

    // 7 Creature
    3 Knight of the Reliquary
    4 Vampire Hexmage

    // 6 Enchantment
    3 Sylvan Library
    2 Exploration
    1 Mirri's Guile

    // 9 Instant
    2 Abrupt Decay
    3 Entomb
    4 Crop Rotation

    // 28 Land
    1 Bayou
    4 Dark Depths
    1 Forest
    1 Karakas
    1 Maze of Ith
    1 Savannah
    1 Scrubland
    1 Swamp
    1 Taiga
    4 Thespian's Stage
    3 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
    1 Tranquil Thicket
    4 Verdant Catacombs
    2 Wasteland
    1 Sejiri Steppe
    1 Volrath's Stronghold

    // 7 Sorcery
    3 Life from the Loam
    4 Gamble


    // 11 Sideboard
    // 4 Creature
    SB: 4 Dark Confidant

    // 2 Instant
    SB: 1 Ancient Grudge
    SB: 1 Ray of Revelation

    // 2 Sorcery
    SB: 1 Flame Jab
    SB: 1 Ravenís Crime

    // 2 Land
    SB: 1 Riftstone Portal
    SB: 1 Glacial Chasm

    // 3 Planeswalker
    SB: 3 Liliana of the Veil


    Hands that played out well

    T1 mox -> exploration, urborg, depths, hexmage (replace any of the lands with crop rotation)

    T1 land -> exploration, land, mox, entomb / gamble -> life from the loam

    T1 mox, land -> sylvan library
    T2 upkeep entomb life from the loam, drege 3 draw 2
    like where your going. i might give it a try.
    Currently Playing:
    Legacy
    BUG
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    Stoneblade

    Modern
    Jund
    Abzan
    Death shadow variants

    RIP Birthing Pod, i still remember the fun times we had
    RIP DRS, good bye my 1 mana PW friend. i will never forget you. Friends forever.

  9. #2709

    Re: [DTB] Turbo Depths

    Hello boys,
    I played turbo-depths versus a deck that it was new for me.
    My opponent played a complete playset of Wastelands that he replayed using Life from the Loam.
    All this land destruction makes my play very difficult.
    He sets also a Chalice of the Void at two, avoiding my Vampire Hexmage.
    Apart of that, my opponent was very kind, a MTG Shop-owner and a a very experienced player (playing from Revised times with no interruption, as he told me) and he explained me that my deck had very few possibilities against his deck.

    In G2 I boarded in Abrupt Decays, Pithing Needle and Reclamation Sage, but he boarded in Blood Moon and G2 was very similar. I lost 0-2

    Is it really such a very bad matchup for us? Any advice to play versus this kind of decks?

    Thank you for reading.

  10. #2710
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    Re: [DTB] Turbo Depths

    Blood Moon? Lol...

    Your first description sounds like Aggro Loam with Chalice, Loam, Waste and other utility lands like Maze and Karakas, all of which are bad for us. That matchup is pretty terrible as they also have Lili and Knight of the Reliquary.. But I have no idea what sort of deck plays Waste, Loam and Blood Moon. Sounds like a wonky brew that has a lot of good stuff against us. I wouldn't sweat that that much.

    Waste + Loam though is something that a lot of decks will employ against us. You can lead on basics, bait out Wastes with unnecessary Stages and stuff, and find Pithing Needle as soon as possible. It's all about setting the game up to where you have another piece of protection or interaction to protect your combo when you initiate it, like Hexmage into a Wasteland activation into Crop Rotation to win, etc. Post board for that you just want your 4th Pithing Needle. Moon effects can be challenged with Krosan Grip, Decay, Beast Within, etc.

  11. #2711

    Re: [DTB] Turbo Depths

    I dont like the "Aggro Loam" approache. It feels just like a not needed toolbox. And I have to argue against the "Deathrite is gone, lets go Loam" statement. With Reanimator on the rise, and even dredge getting picked up again(in my meta) the surgicals will go wild. Surgicals are shutting us down after the first combo/waste, loam will mostly not stop that.
    Sure loam with GQ can be a stripmine, but we are not lands. I feel its a just a bad spot to grind stuff. Many players are picking up D&T and new ones tend to pick something along that line as well.(The costs for Duals is out of this world, its the first time I am thinking about selling mine. 1k for a playset Useas ... plain stupid).

    Ground Seal and Dread of Night will be in my SB for sure. Not sure about the numbers right now. (Maybe 1/2 or 2/2)

    Edit: I noticed an uptick of Stoneblade as well, anyone else?
    Last edited by Izza; 07-12-2018 at 05:44 AM.

  12. #2712

    Re: [DTB] Turbo Depths

    I'm just getting into Legacy now that DRS's reign of terror is over, and could use some tips on this budget brew I'm working on. adrieng, thanks for that last list you posted, it was a great starting point. I went with the ESG's but kept out the Petals, and I also moved away from the Khalni Garden/Therapy synergy. Any tips, esp on sideboard matchups, would be welcome. Been a long time lurker in forums, thanks for all the info over the years y'all!
    //Land//
    4 Blooming Marsh
    2 Llanowar Wastes
    1 SC Forest
    1 SC Swamp
    1 Bojuka Bog
    1 Sejiri Steppe
    1 Ghost Quarter
    1 Dryad Arbor
    4 DD
    4 Thespian
    4 Urborg
    //Creature//
    4 Vampire Hexmage
    4 Elvish Spirit Guide
    2 Sylvan Safekeepr
    //Spells//
    4 Duress
    2 IoK
    2 Thoughtseize
    4 Sylvan Scrying
    4 Crop Rot
    2 Into the North
    4 Pithing Needle
    3 Expedition Map
    1 Sylvan Library

    //Side//
    1 Karakas
    1 Mishra's Factory
    3 Extripate (budget choice, but also working great, is Split Second > phyrexian mana right now?)
    1 Damping Sphere
    2 Rite of Consumption (not sure if these are needed)
    2 Ground Seal
    1 Sylvan Library
    3 Abrupt Decay
    1 Krosan Grip
    Attached Images

  13. #2713

    Re: [DTB] Turbo Depths

    For a budget list, its okay I guess. I would cut -1 Urborg and add +1 Llanowar Wastes. Blooming Marsh makes hands clunky enough if drawn in later stages of the game. Not beeing able to deploy a land for the kill because of the legendary/comming into play tapped is heartbreaking.

    Your MD:
    If you make any investments, buy fetches first to make you more wasteland prove. It is nice that you play 4x Needle because of the missing fetches by default.

    Your SB:
    You don't have to play Mishras Factory, if you play a Dryad Arbor.(Fetches make Arbor SO much better.) Its beter to play +1 Sylvan Library more, or a Sphere if combo is in your meta. You can also considre +1 GQ in your SB(I do so and it has me won many games.)
    Its a personal thing, but I dont like Rite of Consumption. I would rahter play +1 Decay and +1 Sphere. But this depends on your meta, if its full of mirrors play 3 Rite of Consumption not 2. :D

  14. #2714

    Re: [DTB] Turbo Depths

    Quote Originally Posted by Izza View Post
    For a budget list, its okay I guess. I would cut -1 Urborg and add +1 Llanowar Wastes. Blooming Marsh makes hands clunky enough if drawn in later stages of the game. Not beeing able to deploy a land for the kill because of the legendary/comming into play tapped is heartbreaking.

    Your MD:
    If you make any investments, buy fetches first to make you more wasteland prove. It is nice that you play 4x Needle because of the missing fetches by default.

    Your SB:
    You don't have to play Mishras Factory, if you play a Dryad Arbor.(Fetches make Arbor SO much better.) Its beter to play +1 Sylvan Library more, or a Sphere if combo is in your meta. You can also considre +1 GQ in your SB(I do so and it has me won many games.)
    Its a personal thing, but I dont like Rite of Consumption. I would rahter play +1 Decay and +1 Sphere. But this depends on your meta, if its full of mirrors play 3 Rite of Consumption not 2. :D
    Awesome, thanks for the advice! I haven't had too much trouble with the mana/haven't had too many issues with multiple urborgs but I'll keep it in mind. I did play with the SB a little, swapping a sylvan safekeeper in main with the library in board, which is now
    //Board//
    Extirpate x3
    Abrupt Decay x3
    Damping Sphere x2
    Toxic Deluge
    Rite of Consuption
    Sylvan Library
    Krosan Grip
    Ground Seal
    Sylvan Safekeeper
    Karakas

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