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Thread: Braids Stax

  1. #161
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    Re: Braids Stax

    Owerbart what's your current list?

  2. #162
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    Re: Braids Stax

    Quote Originally Posted by TLK View Post
    Owerbart what's your current list?
    I'm still playing my stock list. I didn't included it in the report, but Trading Post literally was the MVP the whole event. The card has so many good interactions it's beyond insane.

    @Hellraiser157 I know that like a lot of people in this thread, you favor Liliana over Trading Post, and although I can see your point, believe me that if you want to jam Liliana in this deck, then definitely Trading Post isn't the card to cut. I've been playing this deck for something like two years, and Lili was in my initial builds, but I can count with just one hand how many times I'd rather have Lili than T.Post.

    I've been experimenting with a Ghost Quarter in the sideboard if decks with a shit ton of basics keep appearing, and is also nice vs Miracles and Delver decks with no basics.

    I've been planning on having the Guardian Beasts in the sideboard but never managed to draw it unfortunately.

  3. #163
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    Re: Braids Stax

    I still need to see it on my own eyes in a real game, but Guardian Beast would be a beating against Decay decks, since you are both nullifying Decay and K. Grip (beast dodges both).

    The thing about decay is that it's so flexible, thats why bug decks have it as their permanent removal/ creature killer spell. The more they rely on it, the more Beast becomes. Other creature removal they usually run are disfigure post board (beast survives it) and edict effects from lili or the 2cmc cards, so that they should be covered through Ophiomancer and our favorite Goat generator :)

  4. #164

    Re: Braids Stax

    Quote Originally Posted by owerbart View Post
    I still need to see it on my own eyes in a real game, but Guardian Beast would be a beating against Decay decks, since you are both nullifying Decay and K. Grip (beast dodges both).

    The thing about decay is that it's so flexible, thats why bug decks have it as their permanent removal/ creature killer spell. The more they rely on it, the more Beast becomes. Other creature removal they usually run are disfigure post board (beast survives it) and edict effects from lili or the 2cmc cards, so that they should be covered through Ophiomancer and our favorite Goat generator :)
    And your current sideboard? Opening post lists the 8 Helm/Leyline pieces and then 7 flex. And ouch for Guardian Beast's pricetag in paper. Probably one of the most expensive oddball sideboard cards, at least from a playability-to-cost ratio. I like it though.

  5. #165
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    Re: Braids Stax

    Quote Originally Posted by square_two View Post
    And your current sideboard? Opening post lists the 8 Helm/Leyline pieces and then 7 flex. And ouch for Guardian Beast's pricetag in paper. Probably one of the most expensive oddball sideboard cards, at least from a playability-to-cost ratio. I like it though.
    Guardian Beast skyrocketed because of 93/94. It didn't carry that hefty of a price tag a number of months ago. That said, I do like the application here.

  6. #166

    Re: Braids Stax

    Quote Originally Posted by owerbart View Post
    I still need to see it on my own eyes in a real game, but Guardian Beast would be a beating against Decay decks, since you are both nullifying Decay and K. Grip (beast dodges both).

    The thing about decay is that it's so flexible, thats why bug decks have it as their permanent removal/ creature killer spell. The more they rely on it, the more Beast becomes. Other creature removal they usually run are disfigure post board (beast survives it) and edict effects from lili or the 2cmc cards, so that they should be covered through Ophiomancer and our favorite Goat generator :)
    I have resolved him a couple of times to hold off the Krosan Grips of the lands player I test with frequently. Quite strong! Definitely worth running 1 or 2 in the board I think.

  7. #167
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    Re: Braids Stax

    Quote Originally Posted by Wotkenmendo View Post
    I have resolved him a couple of times to hold off the Krosan Grips of the lands player I test with frequently. Quite strong! Definitely worth running 1 or 2 in the board I think.
    I resolved it against Deathblade

    Chalice protecting Guardian Beast from STP

    Guardian protecting Chalice from Decay :)

  8. #168
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    Re: Braids Stax

    Quote Originally Posted by owerbart View Post
    I resolved it against Deathblade

    Chalice protecting Guardian Beast from STP

    Guardian protecting Chalice from Decay :)
    I'm now $100 poorer because this thread made me buy a guardian beast. I can't wait, especially because against shardless in the finals of a local weekly, i lost match 3 because he maelstrom pulse'd my bottled cloister, and then cast 2 decays on both of my ensnaring bridges. I need that guardian beast in my life lol.

  9. #169
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    Re: Braids Stax

    I'm gonna put this together once I get the ophiomancer's...

    The green splash with Tireless Tracker plays well with Smokestack; you can sacrifice clues to stax and TT grows by +1/+1

    Also, gonna run one Inventor's Fair when it's legal to play!

  10. #170
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    Re: Braids Stax

    Gonna run this next week.
    Just gotta get the last few cards and maybe a guardian beast!

    4 Braids, Cabal Minion
    4 Ophiomancer
    4 thalia

    3 Crucible of Worlds
    3 Smokestack
    3 Trinisphere
    4 Chalice of the Void
    3 Ensnaring Bridge
    4 Mox Diamond
    2 Bottled Cloister
    1 Vindicate

    4 Cavern of Souls
    4 Ancient Tomb
    3 City of Traitors
    2 Scrubland
    1 Mishra's Factory
    2 Horizon Canopy
    1 karakas
    1 God's Eye, Gate to the Reikai
    4 Wasteland
    2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
    1 Volrath's Stronghold

  11. #171

    Re: Braids Stax

    Quote Originally Posted by non-inflammable View Post
    Gonna run this next week.
    Just gotta get the last few cards and maybe a guardian beast!
    Which Thalia are you referring to?

    1W oldschool Thalia doesn't work so well with Trinisphere.

    I would be really hesitant to run lands such as Factory, Volrath's Stronghold, Canopy, and Gods' Eye if you want to splash a second color. Can be surprising how important having access to basics can be. Or if you splash, access to more dual colors.

  12. #172
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    Re: Braids Stax

    Quote Originally Posted by non-inflammable View Post
    Gonna run this next week.
    Just gotta get the last few cards and maybe a guardian beast!

    4 Braids, Cabal Minion
    4 Ophiomancer
    4 thalia
    I assume you mean Liliana and not Thalia...
    Chalice on 1

  13. #173
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    Re: Braids Stax

    nope, gonna run that list, when i can, with old school thalia.
    first turn mox diamond, cavern of souls, and you have a thorn of amethyst that stings with first strike and can be protected with karakas. seems good?
    I decided on this list to always have a first turn play that needs to be answered or fall way behind.

    My local meta is mostly tempo and lots of card drawing.
    I have a visceral enmity towards brainstorm and consider it my personal duty to make any one that thinks it is a fair card to play me...

    granted, i haven't played the list yet but it is totally built sitting next to me as i type this.
    my goal for every Legacy event at my LGS was to come with a very different deck for every event.
    Every deck i play would be evaluated and either altered or retired.

    Sure, liliana of the veil IS my favorite card, but for now she will stay in my binder...

  14. #174
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    Re: Braids Stax

    So I went 2-1-1 and top 4'd for split.
    Stomped out storm, lost badly to D&T, beat eldrazi and went to time with thopter foundry sword of the meek tezz.

    I did encounter several games where I had multiple Thalia in hand and needed something else.
    I also had vindicate stuck in my hand too often, never cast bottled cloister and some games I never saw a single wasteland.
    If i make this again, I might go mono-black and include Lili like suggested...

    Lots of fun and most opponents read ophiomancer wrong: MVP :}

  15. #175

    Re: Braids Stax

    Quote Originally Posted by owerbart View Post
    I've been planning on having the Guardian Beasts in the sideboard but never managed to draw it unfortunately.
    Sorry for reply late this quote but there are other alternatives to Guardian beasts for stax decks:

    Hanna's Custody
    Karmic Justice

    You also could try Enlightened Tutor if you didn't cast a chalice of the void with 1 mana cost.

    As you are using Braids, Cabal Minion and Smokestack, why don't you use Paradox Haze in your deck? I'm using it in another stax deck version but imagine the cabal minion and Smokestack powered their effects.

    Regards

  16. #176

    Re: Braids Stax

    I took an older list of Braids Stax 3-2 in the old friendly legacy leagues. It's a really fun deck, and I'm currently testing this list on MODO in the tournament practice room getting ready for another run:


    4 Ancient Tomb
    1 Drownyard Temple
    4 Cavern of Souls
    3 City of Traitors
    1 Gods' Eye, Gate to the Reikai
    1 Inventors' Fair
    5 Swamp
    2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
    4 Wasteland

    1 Bottled Cloister
    4 Chalice of the Void
    2 Crucible of Worlds
    3 Ensnaring Bridge
    1 Ghirapur Orrery
    4 Mox Diamond
    4 Smokestack
    1 Trading Post
    4 Trinisphere

    4 Braids, Cabal Minion
    4 Ophiomancer

    3 Toxic Deluge


    Sideboard

    1 Bottled Cloister
    3 Helm of Obedience
    1 Engineered Explosives
    1 Engineered Plague
    4 Leyline of the Void
    2 Phyrexian Revoker
    2 Plague Spitter
    1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale


    I like Drownyard Temple for recursive sacrificing. I played against Nic Fit with Deathrite Shaman today, and with 5 additional mana sources, I was able to keep it from getting exiled while their lands got sacrificed.

    I've had Ghirapur Orrery come online as early as turn 3 under a Trinisphere with Trading Post in play. I managed to draw 6 cards over 2 turns, which earned a concession. I'm not sure if this card is good or bad yet. It seems like opponents don't come close to drawing nearly as many cards as I do, but they do get to play an extra land every turn which sets the plan back a little bit, especially against Miracles. The good news is that some of the more aggressive decks I tend to lose to (Burn) have lower land counts, which helps to offset the problem. I also like that you get card draw about equal to Bottled Cloister but there's no risk of losing your hand to artifact destruction. There's still a trade between accelerating yourself and your opponent, and having discard protection.

    Inventors' Fair is awesome. It's very easy to be on 3 artifacts, and the life gain mitigates some of the damage from Ancient Tomb. Being able to search multiple artifacts with Crucible of Worlds can be handy, but I wish there was a more proactive artifact to go get in the main. I've toyed with the idea of vehicles side or main. The Crew 2 works well with Ophiomancer and Braids, Cabal Minion that occasionally end up sidelined when they manage to keep a creature in play. It also acts as your fourth Helm of Obedience in the sideboard.

    If I had to cut anything it would be Gods' Eye, Gate to the Reikai. It's nice that you get two sacrifices out of it, and it's powerful with Crucible of Worlds, but I've been underwhelmed. I'd replace it with another black source most likely.

    The sideboard is fine. The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale is great even with a low creature count because of how many lands you wind up killing. I used Contamination and really liked it the first turn. It was bugged on MODO, so you couldn't sacrifice a creature to it. With Ophiomancer in play, it really sets some decks back. Plague Spitter has been ok, but I wish it did more, especially against Deathrite Shaman and Insectile Abberation. Bottled Cloister may come out for something else. I've really liked Warping Wail in the side and main, so that's a possibility. Also would like something against Eldrazi since I wind up boarding out Chalice of the Void and Trinisphere, usually for helmline.

  17. #177
    bruizar
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    Re: Braids Stax

    If this build could include either tangle wire or vehicles, i think king macar would make an excellent addition to the deck. It produces a permanent that can be sacked for smokestack/braids, exiles creatures, and serves as a win condition + ramp

    Also, when running tabernacle and plaguespitter, up the amount of urborgs and run a kormus bell

  18. #178

    Re: Braids Stax

    Quote Originally Posted by bruizar View Post
    If this build could include either tangle wire or vehicles, i think king macar would make an excellent addition to the deck. It produces a permanent that can be sacked for smokestack/braids, exiles creatures, and serves as a win condition + ramp

    Also, when running tabernacle and plaguespitter, up the amount of urborgs and run a kormus bell
    The copter adds a lot of gas to Dragon Stompy (I ran it in main Eternal Weekend event and the filtering was huge), but there is also an absurd amount of bodies to pilot it in that deck. 8 Rabblemasters + tokens, Magus, Pia + tokens...

    I really do love the idea of having some looting in Braids Stax but you'd have to guarantee the creature base can support that one. Ideas I think could make it work would be Hangarback Walker, overloading on Bitterblossom, or trying for a more human-centric build with some combination of those + Dark Confidants which I tried earlier in the year.

    Over the weekend I played against the Inventor's Fair Stax deck and saw Tanglewire do a lot of work. With Ophiomancer + Bitterblossom we have the ability to flood the board early with even more permanents which makes that card further in our favor. Think I would try it before the Copter + creatures idea which to me sounds like it could take too many key spots in the deck. Tanglewire hasn't had much esteem in legacy but that stax deck is making it work well.

  19. #179

    Re: Braids Stax

    Quote Originally Posted by bruizar View Post
    If this build could include either tangle wire or vehicles, i think king macar would make an excellent addition to the deck. It produces a permanent that can be sacked for smokestack/braids, exiles creatures, and serves as a win condition + ramp

    Also, when running tabernacle and plaguespitter, up the amount of urborgs and run a kormus bell
    I like the concept of The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale with Plague Spitter, Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth and Kormus Bell. With Spitter, you're dealing 3 a turn (if they have no blockers) until they get mana back on line, and with Tabernacle you're probably tapping down 60% of your lands (and taking a fair amount of damage) whereas they're likely tapping down more. If you get out a Crucible of Worlds you're ahead. If Ghirapur Orrery is out with the crucible, you're way ahead.

    The other nice thing about Ghirapur Orrery I've noticed in testing is its interaction with Bottled Cloister. If you stack Cloister -> Orrery, Orrery resolves to draw you 3 cards, then you get a card from Cloister, then you get your hand back.

  20. #180
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    Re: Braids Stax

    I recently found this thread, so I'm not sure if this counts as necro'ing a thread, but I've been working on my own list. Does it look okay to ya'll?

    4x Ancient Tomb
    3x City of Traitors
    1x Drownyard Temple
    4x Ghost Quarter
    1x Gods' Eye, Gate to the Reikai
    1x Karakas
    2x Scrubland
    4x Swamp
    2x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
    1x Volrath's Stronghold

    4x Chalice of the Void
    3x Crucible of Worlds
    3x Ensnaring Bridge
    1x Ghirapur Orrery
    4x Mox Diamond
    4x Smokestack
    1x Trading Post
    2x Trinisphere
    3x Toxic Deluge

    4x Braids, Cabal Minion
    4x Ophiomancer
    4x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben

    Sideboard
    1x Ethersworn Canonist
    2x Helm of Obedience
    1x Leonin Arbiter
    4x Leyline of the Void
    2x Phyrexian Revoker
    2x Plague Spitter
    3x Recruiter of the Guard

    I decided to go with a more toolbox sideboard, almost like a D&T shell, but avoiding anything with double white since we only have a splash of white anyway. I've also changed out all four Wastelands for a set of Ghost Quarters, for the sole reason that they can hit basics.
    Fun is a zero-sum game in Magic. Therefore, Prison is the best archetype.

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