I might try it out in the main as that's another catch all type of card. 4 damage is good, and indestructible might save the team, but getting to 5 mana will be hard. I don't like it as much as a sideboard since a lot of those slots are necessary (Modern is such a linear-broken format...).
Swiftspear is so good. She's probably better than YP since a 1-drop creature in your starting hand makes your win % go up by quite a bit. 4 Snaps is too many, though I haven't tried that yet. The problem with the deck is balancing lands with nonlands since you really want to hit 3-4 lands and then stop entirely, since any more is a detriment to all of your threats. I would take out Delvers before Swiftspears since they're just so variable. Powerful, and flipping early wins you games, but really relies on chance more than you'd like. Try swiftspear out first, she's pretty awesome.
Always play delver before swiftspear turn 1, though.
The main reason to run it is to protect Monastery Mentor who is definitely the star of the deck. So you'd want to protect him the turn you play him, therefore 5.
Harm's Way is way too cute and almost always bad.
I've been testing a lot and am at a crossroads in deck designs. I've updated the OP with the 2 different decks, and they both have strengths and weaknesses, which manifests in winrates vs specific decks.
The faster version that still has Monastery Swiftspear has a faster goldfish kill which is very helpful against the slower decks that don't have many blockers or linear combo decks, Amulet Bloom, Splinter Twin*, Tron, and Infect.
The slower version that cuts Swiftspears for Dispels, electrolyze, and the full set of Young Pyromancers. I'm molding this version after Twin decks since Twin only combos maybe 40% of their matches and YP + MM are more functional creatures and should fill the roll of win condition better. Dispels are pretty awesome, and probably the best 1 cmc in slot since it takes out Lightning Bolt + Path on critical creatures while also making the control matchup and burn matchups much better (thus the -1 Lightning Helix in this version). Double Electrolyze means Affinity and decks with tokens are much easier to handle. The main added bonus is that I was able to move a lot of sideboard slots maindeck when I took out Swiftspears and therefore have even better sideboard options now. This version boasts better win rates against Burn, Junk, UWR control, Affinity, WB tokens, and Podless pod decks.
*Splinter Twin is actually still at 0% in matches vs me in testing. The amount of removal we run is just too much for them to combo out and their alternate strategy of beat down with 2/1 or 1/4s gets run over by the card advantage of generated tokens. But the games are much closer with the non-swiftspear version.
Sideboard is becoming a bit more solidified. The problem matchups are now Eidolon Burn (need to hit Helix or sideboards against them or you'll just lose with 1/4 of the deck being cantrips), GW token + creature + Gavony Township decks (but not the black version, for some reason Siege Rhino and Liliana just don't do enough against us). Decks with maindeck Zealous Persecution can be really rough. Amulet Bloom post sideboard can be tough, Hornet Queen is actually a huge pain.
The version with Swiftspear makes no sense at all in my opinion.
Young Pyromancer and Monestary Mentor best fit into control decks. Swiftspear is true aggro.
It could be argued that Delver fits into control just as well as into aggro but still if I was making a UWR deck around Mentor I would probably start with 4 Pyromancers and maybe only 2-4 Monastery Mentor.
At that point I think Snapcaster Mage is by far the better choice if you want to run more creatures, unfortunately Modern has no access to Stoneforge Mystic.
Overall I guess I like a Team Italia style deck in modern a lot better than UWR. I played this deck before with just YP and Dark Confidant plus Thoughtseize, Path to Exile, Lightning Bolt, Lingering Souls, Lightning Helix and the secret star of the deck was Gods Willing/Boros Charm to protect the Young Pyromancer. It's a control deck that can grind with Dark Confidant, can transform into burn thanks to Bolt, Charm and Helix or just reactive control with cheap removal. Now throw in Monastery Mentor as YP 5-8 and a few filler spells like Night whisper or Valorous Stance et voila. Was good enough to win FNM without the Mentor.
Right, I keep forgetting how certain creatures are purely aggressive or purely control. You should just make me a quick reference sheet so I don't keep accidentally winning with the wrong version.
Have you done some experiences with your deck until now?
I wanna start playing this deck too. Build a similar version to yours.
Playing 4 Delvers, 4 Monastery Mentor, 4 Pyromancer, 2 Snapcaster Mage and thinik about the Monastery Swiftspear.
Then cards like Lightning bolt, Forked Bolt, Path to Exile, Serum Visions, Electrolyze, Gitaxian Probe,
Didnt think of Lightning Helix maybe i can find some some space.
I am interested with this one.
Anybody here care to share his recent tourney experiences?
^_^
If none, what are your thoughts/ in sights for the following match ups
Abzan, Twin, Affinity, Rw burn, delver patriot, UW control
Thanks!
TJB
http://deartiyopaeng.blogspot.com/ <---- (updated) MTG related blog. ^_^
TES: 102nd out of 2000 players at GP Kyoto 2015 (Legacy)
UR Storm: 37th of 950 players at GP Guangzhou 2016 (Modern)
Was going to sleeve the deck for testing. I still find the idea good however after checking your list, I found out that 18 lands seems low. Even burn that plays only 1-2 drops play 20 lands. 18 seems really low especially when you consider that sometimes you'd like to play mentor and a spell in the same turn, or snap and a 2 CMC spell.
What would you remove from your list if you had to go up to 20 lands? 1 sleight of hand? 1 path? (I'm talking about the version with the full 4 young pyromancers).
You have 4 Serum Visions, 4 Sleight of Hand, and 4 Gitaxian Probe. You should not have troubles finding land when you need it if you use them correctly. I've found 18 to be correct after playing many games. You do not want to dead draw lands late game.
Fair enough. I forgot about the 4 sleight of hands. I was comparing this deck to my old UR (before treasure cruise era) and I did not play sleight of hand at that time.
I'll try it with 18 lands. we will see. (I fear the 1 lander / 1 cantrip hand on the draw that gets devastated by a thoughtseize thought :) )
Defensively speaking, I am not a big fan of counter spells.
I am thinking of using discard spells, Thoughtseize and Kozilek of Inquision and Duress I think would be enough.
I'll try to come up with the deck and will use this in my LGS this weekend.
TJB
http://deartiyopaeng.blogspot.com/ <---- (updated) MTG related blog. ^_^
TES: 102nd out of 2000 players at GP Kyoto 2015 (Legacy)
UR Storm: 37th of 950 players at GP Guangzhou 2016 (Modern)
So 4 color UWRB? Or are you dropping blue and cantrips? Either of those options are going to be difficult on the current manabase and you'll have to bump up the number you play.
Glad to see someone else really excited to test out this archetype! I've been playing a list with 4x delver, 4x YP, 4x SCM, and 2x Monastery Mentor. I like the argument that this deck doesn't want to play counter spells due to wanting to achieve as many prowess triggers on your turn while attacking. Another card to consider is valorous stance. It can act as both removal against Goyf and protect a delver from abrupt decay, etc. Hopefully modern will be firing tonight at my LGS and I can comeback with some positive results.
I am not going to drop cantrips.
Just the counter spells.
Anyway, i am just speaking theoretically.theoretically.
Also, 4 mentor, is it too much? Two or three is just right, at least as i see it. What do u think guys?
TJB
http://deartiyopaeng.blogspot.com/ <---- (updated) MTG related blog. ^_^
TES: 102nd out of 2000 players at GP Kyoto 2015 (Legacy)
UR Storm: 37th of 950 players at GP Guangzhou 2016 (Modern)
Sure, but if you want to add discard you have to add another color, which really hurts the manabase.
Mentor is so much better than Young Pyromancer. I wouldn't cut any, he provides easy turn 4 kills (if you can save a Git Probe) and multiples are actually just nuts.
For more specific reasons, BGW decks have bigger threats, which you can chump block with a token, but the threat of alpha striking in a single turn is very real if you have 3+ prowess on the table at an untap step. Mentor is the best card in our deck against them. For stuff that tries to creature kill you, you want as many mentors as possible. For stuff that has tons of removal, you want 4 mentors (you can always wait to play them so you have another spell immediately after, but you want as many as possible. Against fast combo decks, you want to get a Mentor out on turn 3, since you can actually race them. Against GR tron, you want as many as possible so you can reload the board after they pyroclasm.
I guess there is a decent iteration of this deck that doesn't play max mentors, but it's going to be closer to burn than anything else.
Hello,
don't know if you are still playing the deck.
However, was thinking about one potential card that could be played: Manamorphose. It's a cantrip that fixes and allows to play 2 / 3 spells in the same turn with only 2 mana.
Did you consider it at some point?
I considered it but if you have it early it's a really big strain on your manabase as well as being a card that doesn't really help you do anything. You're making yourself fetch out RR so that you can use a color fixing cantrip, which kind of goes against the whole point of having a color fixing cantrip. I'd probably go with Mishra's Bauble over that if I wanted another pseudo free pseudo cantrip.
Woops, was thinking it was G/R G/R. I still don't like that it requires 2 mana to cast because then it isn't actually a free spell in the sense of playing it turn 3 after you land a Monastery Mentor. Having Gitaxian Probes and Mishra's Baubles would be the best just because of that interaction. Those also allow you to play MM on turn 4 and leave a Dispel mana up, whereas you still wouldn't have mana up on turn 5 with manamorphose.
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