[Primer] R/G Lands

[Ingo]

1 Ancient Tomb
4 Thorn of Amethyst
3 Krosan Grip
1 Crucible of Worlds
2 Tireless Tracker
2 Containment Priest
2 Porphyry Nodes

Was a quick & dirty thing I came up with. Could squeeze 2 more hatebears in place of the Crucible and Nodes, etc. Or maybe the two hatebears of choice would be Thalia + Revoker because all 4 can be brought in vs all combo, etc.

Playing the Thorns instead of spheres is a nice touch with hatebears.

On a slightly different topic, I feel like we don't need Krosan Grip as much anymore as we used to. White opens up some new options, would you consider Ray of Revelation, or even Council's Judgement (the card deals with TNN and Leovold)? Double white on CJ is a lot though.

[Sparkii]

Playing the Thorns instead of spheres is a nice touch with hatebears.

On a slightly different topic, I feel like we don't need Krosan Grip as much anymore as we used to. White opens up some new options, would you consider Ray of Revelation, or even Council's Judgement (the card deals with TNN and Leovold)? Double white on CJ is a lot though.

I still like grips quite a lot. The "uncounterable" part is nothing to scoff at when trying to remove back to basics or something else important and it also does really well against certain things like batterskull bouncing or vials.

[Ingo]

I still like grips quite a lot. The "uncounterable" part is nothing to scoff at when trying to remove back to basics or something else important and it also does really well against certain things like batterskull bouncing or vials.

There's no card better at doing what Kgrip does. But there is an interesting cardpool of Kgrip-like effects like Decay or Song of the Dryads with specific advantages (and disadvantages) over Kgrip. Just wondering if Council's Judgement could be one of them when playing a whitesplash (in regards to dealing with TNN or Leovold, the card sits between KGrip and Nodes).

[rlesko]

I had a similar thought lately (Regrading cutting Krosan Grip). I think it is still needed but definitely not necessary to have 4. I am comfortable with 3. I would even consider shaving it down to 2. Seems the meta isn't Counterbalance / Blood Moon anymore and its more like Surgical / Edict. Though it depends on whether you are ok with randomly getting screwed by an Ensnaring Bridge / B2B.

[supremePINEAPPLE]

I've played 2 in a few leagues and it feels ok since you rarely want to see multiples and can gamble. It does feel really bad when running into leyline decks that can easily answer the token and also probably not a good idea to scrimp on grip if you play against blood moon or tezzeret regularly.

[inevitablepnut]

I have been playing this to much success lately! Feels good all around.

-Main
4 Crop Rotation
3 Gamble
3 Burning Wish
3 Life from the Loam
2 Punishing Fire
4 Mox Diamond
4 Exploration
1 Manabond
1 Molten Vortex
1 Barbarian Ring
1 Bojuka Bog
4 Dark Depths
1 Forest
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Glacial Chasm
3 Grove of the Burnwillows
1 Karakas
3 Maze of Ith
1 Misty Rainforest
3 Rishadan Port
1 Sheltered Thicket
2 Taiga
1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
4 Thespian's Stage
1 Tranquil Thicket
4 Wasteland
1 Windswept Heath
1 Wooded Foothills

-Sideboard
2 Tireless Tracker
1 Devastating Dreams
1 Hull Breach
1 Life from the Loam
1 Firespout
2 Krosan Grip
2 Sphere of Resistance
2 Thorn of Amethyst
1 Trinisphere
1 Drop of Honey
1 Ancient Tomb

https://www.topdecked.me/decks/d86e3...0-c389b6148575

[Ingo]

I have been playing this to much success lately! Feels good all around.

https://www.topdecked.me/decks/d86e3...0-c389b6148575

Looks like a very balanced list, nice to see some Burning Wishes!
I think the Firespout overlaps a bit with the Devastating Dreams, so I'd be tempted to add a tiny blacksplash and swap it for a Toxic Deluge, as it gets rid of creatures that survive Dreams (mom, TNN, bigger creatures like Kotr or Eldrazi ...)

[inevitablepnut]

Looks like a very balanced list, nice to see some Burning Wishes!
I think the Firespout overlaps a bit with the Devastating Dreams, so I'd be tempted to add a tiny blacksplash and swap it for a Toxic Deluge, as it gets rid of creatures that survive Dreams (mom, TNN, bigger creatures like Kotr or Eldrazi ...)

That would be interesting.. I would find it difficult to find the cuts for the black splash tho although deluge would be spicy as hell! Frirespout is there when i don't have a significant land advantage or cards to discard to the dreams.

[Ingo]

That would be interesting.. I would find it difficult to find the cuts for the black splash tho although deluge would be spicy as hell! Frirespout is there when i don't have a significant land advantage or cards to discard to the dreams.

Apart from splashing black, I think your list might be too tight on the greenproviding lands, as there are 11 of which 2 enter play tapped. So maybe you should move Karakas to the side and replace it with a Bayou.

[Manroe]

Hi everyone.

I'm a new Lands player and I'm still learning a lot everytime I play this deck. That being said, I'm curious if any of the more experienced players have tried out a living wish package. My main questions about living wish are:

1) What gets removed from the main (I think this would be a depths, Maze, and/or gamble)?

2) Are the benefits of Living Wish worth changing the streamlined deck

3) What cards make up your "Wish Board"?

I think the cards I'd consider would be:
Dark Depths
Bojuka Bog
Maze of Ith
Azusa, lost but seeking
Oracle of Mul Daya
Courser of Kruphix
Primeval Titan
Ramunap Excavator

Thanks!



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[baboontilt]

Hi everyone.

I'm a new Lands player and I'm still learning a lot everytime I play this deck. That being said, I'm curious if any of the more experienced players have tried out a living wish package. My main questions about living wish are:

1) What gets removed from the main (I think this would be a depths, Maze, and/or gamble)?

2) Are the benefits of Living Wish worth changing the streamlined deck

3) What cards make up your "Wish Board"?

I think the cards I'd consider would be:
Dark Depths
Bojuka Bog
Maze of Ith
Azusa, lost but seeking
Oracle of Mul Daya
Courser of Kruphix
Primeval Titan
Ramunap Excavator

Thanks!



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There was a Bant Living Wish build featured at GP Paris 2014, obviously out of date, but here is the original list:

Sorcery (13)
2 Life from the Loam
4 Living Wish
4 Ponder
3 Supreme Verdict
Instant (16)
4 Brainstorm
4 Crop Rotation
4 Force of Will
4 Intuition
Enchantment (4)
4 Exploration
Land (27)
1 Dark Depths
4 Flagstones of Trokair
4 Flooded Strand
1 Maze of Ith
2 Misty Rainforest
2 Savannah
3 Thespian's Stage
4 Tropical Island
2 Tundra
1 Wasteland
3 Windswept Heath
60 Cards
Sideboard (15)

1 Dark Depths
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Bojuka Bog
2 Engineered Explosives
1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Karakas
1 Meddling Mage
1 Peacekeeper
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons
3 Spell Pierce
1 Sylvan Safekeeper

This was the first lands list I actually built (before I had my Tabby). Wasteland in the board was great for me, and I think Tracker would be an auto-include nowadays.

[Chatto]

Hi everyone.

I'm a new Lands player and I'm still learning a lot everytime I play this deck. That being said, I'm curious if any of the more experienced players have tried out a living wish package. My main questions about living wish are:

1) What gets removed from the main (I think this would be a depths, Maze, and/or gamble)?

2) Are the benefits of Living Wish worth changing the streamlined deck

3) What cards make up your "Wish Board"?

I think the cards I'd consider would be:
Dark Depths
Bojuka Bog
Maze of Ith
Azusa, lost but seeking
Oracle of Mul Daya
Courser of Kruphix
Primeval Titan
Ramunap Excavator

Thanks!



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Welcome, Manroe!

Hmmm, that card hasn't crossed my mind for quiet some time.

1. Depths, other utility land are the first cards that cross my mind. Gamble to make room... Yeah, why not, but shave one max(?)

2. No, because imho your deck becomes another beast all together.

3. In all honesty, no idea. Do you want to stay RG, or are you planning to splash another colour?

[Claymore]

Living Wish to grab an Excavator isn't half bad...

[Manroe]

Welcome, Manroe!

Hmmm, that card hasn't crossed my mind for quiet some time.

1. Depths, other utility land are the first cards that cross my mind. Gamble to make room... Yeah, why not, but shave one max(?)

2. No, because imho your deck becomes another beast all together.

3. In all honesty, no idea. Do you want to stay RG, or are you planning to splash another colour?

Thanks for the quick replies and warm welcome all. I wasn't sure if the wish idea would warrant another color but the Bant list above intrigues me. Intuition just seems incredible in this kind of deck.

I think the format may be too fast for this sort of change but once I feel more comfortable with it, I'll probably give it a go for the hell of it.

I also really enjoy playing smallpox with the depths shell but again thats another deck completely.


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[rlesko]

So, the format is not only very fast but also the most played creature is deathrite shaman. Playing around / through it is critical. Intuition really feels bad vs an active deathrite.

[OldSpellMaster]

Just my thoughts about the 'tutors'. (really just my oppinion)
When I came back to Lands, before I read the forum, I was also thinking about Living Wish so I start with that.
It was a good idea having a tutor for every land solution in the board (I thought). You don't need to have those solutions in MB. So, you don't draw a card you don't need.
Well, there are some problems about that. A bigger wishboard means a smaller sideboard. G2, you maybe want to side in the correct solution cards, which makes the wish unuseful. Then you need Crop Rotation to get it, but CR is not that useful G1 where you have your solution in the SB. So, maybe you put the most needed cards in MB and SB which kills your slots. Or you don't side in and get the wishes countered or extracted.
What's left is putting one of the 4ofs in the side so you have like 7 of Wasteland, DD, Stage... But need to cast a spell for it... Where you already have CR.
Finally, the upside doesn't compare to the downside. But still a tutor to consider.

So next, how many tutors should I put in a Lands deck. I'd say about 8 is normal. That's (normally) 4CR and 4Gamble. You have to ask yourself: Should I put in more and what kind makes sense.

What I want with tutors:
1. Get Exploration (fast)
2. Get Loam (fast)
3. Get a specific land
4. Get something else (EE for RUG...)

In the early game, I really really wanna have point 1 and 2. Followed by point 3 to get the perfect solution agains my opponent in form of a land. Later, I want the other points OR maybe Exploration/Loam are lost and I have to get it again... But still, I wanna have cheap tutors for point 1-2, then 3 in the start hand. I don't want an expensive midgame tutor in the start hand (and also, it's not nice to dredge one away).
Better draw a good starting tutor midgame than having a great midgame tutor in starthand.

So which tutor fits best?

Tutors:
- Gamble
low cost. Great loam tutor. Tutors Exploration with a little risk. Counterable, but in T1 maybe he needs FoW.
Tutored card in hand after resolution. -> fast.
- Crop Rotation
low cost. Doesn't get loam or Ex. Risky when countered. Tutored card on the BF instant speed(!) without landdrop after resolution. -> fast.
- Intuition
high cost->high risk of being countered. Needs blue splash. Excellent tutor for loam and combo. Can tutor 3Ex. Tutors lands. Most needed tutored card in grave after resolution. -> slow
Attention: Gravehate, counterspells.
- Burning Wish
mid cost. Tutors loam even if that is extracted. Nothing else. Card in hand after resolution. -> fast
- Living Wish
mid cost. Tutors just lands in the side (creatures are not relevant). Card in hand after resolution. -> ok
- Entomb
low cost but needs black splash. Tutors loam well. Later, tutors lands. Counterable, but in T1 maybe he needs FoW. Card in grave after resolution. -> ok to slow
Attention: Gravehate
- Enlighted Tutor
low cost but needs white splash. Tutors Ex. Card on top of library after resolution. -> slow
- Tolaria West
high cost, needs blue splash. Uncounterable recurrable (the only one of them). Tutors lands and 0/x artifacts. Card in hand after resolution -> ok

See, Gamble plus CR seems to be the best combination for points 1 to 3. Cheap and fast. Resistant to gravehate (more or less). Good in starthand.

If you feel good with other combinations or just more tutors... Sure... All tutors have good points... I have a TW for midgame, a friend added Entomb to get that Loam... Many possibilities...

Oh and about DRS: I wouldn't cut Intuition just because of DRS. Dredging is bad as well under a DRS and I wouldn't cut Loam ;-)

[djxstream]

- Crop Rotation
low cost. Doesn't get loam or Ex. Risky when countered. Tutored card on the BF instant speed(!) without landdrop after resolution. -> fast.

you're forgetting the best part of crop rotation in a deck with 30+ non basic lands. Respond to an opponent wastelanding you.

While gamble maybe replaceable in some sense, crop rotation isnt.

[OldSpellMaster]

you're forgetting the best part of crop rotation in a deck with 30+ non basic lands. Respond to an opponent wastelanding you.

While gamble maybe replaceable in some sense, crop rotation isnt.

Good point (so top land tutor plus this positive effect)

[hoernchen]

I am really struggeling against D&T in the previous time. in my store all of the guys are running Magus main and have so much hate with 3 Karakas and 4 Swords Main, so it feels impossible to combo off.
Do you have any suggestion how to best approach this MU, how to SB?

[Airex]

I am really struggeling against D&T in the previous time. in my store all of the guys are running Magus main and have so much hate with 3 Karakas and 4 Swords Main, so it feels impossible to combo off.
Do you have any suggestion how to best approach this MU, how to SB?

Waste, port, karakas, swords and flokerwhisp r normal D&T mainboard, so u can combo off if he taps out, or play a control game G1(i always play 30 min G1 against D&T).
Post side it become easier more or less, ok he run RIP but u can SIDE IN Kozilek’s retourn/Sulfur elemental, drop of honey and some krossan. (Sorry for my bad english)