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Thread: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

  1. #361
    The crazy nastyass honey badger

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    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    Not having Bridges probably means you may have to split your combo over 2 turns (although recurring Bloodghasts mid-combo might give you enough creatures to finish it entirely).

    Let's say Kelpie is the only creature we have on the field when we DR it and with our last dredge we get back a Dakmor Salvage. If we manage to get 3 Bloodghast in our yard and/or Narcomoeba on the field whilst dredging that'd be enough to complete the combo without any help from Bridge from Below. You sacrifice Kelpie + 2 creatures (1 creature + Kelpie left on the field) to DR Flayer and then sacrifice Flayer, Kelpie and the last creature to cast the third DR, targeting Grave-Troll. Seems reasonable.

    You could also switch out the 3 Vengeful Pharaoh and a River Kelpie for 4 Bridge from Below. 20 creatures, Bridges and a combo finish all in one list.
    Last edited by Echelon; 04-08-2016 at 08:51 AM.

  2. #362

    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    Any new testing with our new guy?

    I was goldfishing a 3 PA version, 13 dredger, 4 chancellor and the devil win cond and it was good. The only concern with adding PA in exchange for dredgers (shambling shell) is the need for a higher number of mulligans.

    Is anybody using chancellor of the main MD?
    Last edited by GoldenCid; 04-09-2016 at 10:02 AM.

  3. #363

    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldenCid View Post
    Any new testing with our new guy?

    I was goldfishing a 3 PA version, 13 dredger, 4 chancellor and the devil win cond and it was good. The only concern with adding PA in exchange for dredgers (shambling shell) is the need for a higher number of mulligans.

    Is anybody using chancellor of the main MD?
    I do, probably only card that significantly increases your win rate vs a potential blow out, where Force of Will vs Storm is just skating up hill. Probe just gets countered too often to bother fwiw, so the only other generally useful card is like the Red Chancellor or Gigapede or an X creature.

    I think it is important to play what generally good anti hate you can when nothing else is that stellar.

  4. #364

    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    So....this is the list im testing:

    Dredge

    4 troll
    4 imp
    4 thug
    1 shell

    Beaters

    4 ichorid
    4 shadow
    4 moeba
    3 amalgam

    Spells

    4 therapy
    4 probe
    4 return

    Stuff

    3 W. rider
    4 street wraith
    1 flayer of the hatebound
    4 bridge
    4 phantasmagoria
    4 chacellor of the anex

    SB (not defined at all suggestions are welcomed)

    4 Fow
    3-4 blue shoal
    4 blue trap
    3-4 Unmask
    0-2 contagion

    It's nice. It goes off via combo o beatdown.

  5. #365
    The crazy nastyass honey badger

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    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    That's a dangerously small number of dredgers.

  6. #366

    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    Quote Originally Posted by Echelon View Post
    That's a dangerously small number of dredgers.
    That is what i thought at first....that is why i mentioned mulligans i a previous post. In my testing mulls was almost unaffected but it is true that when i reanimate rider for going off there are just 1 or 2 dredges for digging. Off if phantasmagorian is not in yard.

    What would you cut? i think 14 dredgers is the nunmber.

  7. #367
    The crazy nastyass honey badger

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    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    Normally I'd say a Phantasmagorian since you'd have enough dredgers to compensate.

    In your case I'd choose to go down to 3 DR.

  8. #368

    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    Quote Originally Posted by Echelon View Post
    That's a dangerously small number of dredgers.
    Especially when you consider how prevalent DRS is these days. Personally 15 is the lowest number of dredgers I'll go.

  9. #369
    The crazy nastyass honey badger

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    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    Quote Originally Posted by slave View Post
    Especially when you consider how prevalent DRS is these days. Personally 15 is the lowest number of dredgers I'll go.
    Seconded.

  10. #370

    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    14 is a good number for me.

    I'll cut a PA for 1 dredger to rise to 14.

    The deck worked fine before PA was printed

  11. #371
    The crazy nastyass honey badger

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    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    So... I took both the Prized Amalgam Balustrade Spy list and Horde Mode out for a spin yesterday. Here's some thoughts:

    I started off with the Spy list. Prized Amalgam in the Spy list is nuts. Turns out it gives you some funny interactions. At some point I had 2 Amalgams on the field and dredged a third into my yard, together with a Narcomoeba (so number 3 triggered and was primed to return at my EoT. I put a dice on it to keep track of that). During combat my opponent blocked both Amalgams to death. As soon as Amalgam no. 3 came back at the end of my turn, both Amalgams triggered and returned at my opponents' EoT. The Amalgams gave me enough raw power to break through a Batterskull, Thalia and assorted other stuff. It was insane.

    On to Horde Mode: It must be the funniest deck I've ever piloted. At some point (vs. D&T again) I went from having a Narcomoeba and a Nether Shadow on the field (as lonely blockers) to having that + 3 Bloodghast, 3 Nether Shadows and 3 Ashen Ghouls. For some reason, Ichorid was nowhere to be found. At the end of the turn I also got back a couple of Amalgams. Reminder: Combat math is hard. That's all I can say. It was funny as hell (I had 1 game vs. Grixis Delver where my opponent started out with 2 DRS. He still almost lost. I had some poor luck with my dredges, so he got there), Vengeful Pharaoh made attacking a living hell for my opponents. Games take long and take a lot more thinking than the Spy list though.

  12. #372

    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    Quote Originally Posted by Echelon View Post
    So... I took both the Prized Amalgam Balustrade Spy list and Horde Mode out for a spin yesterday. Here's some thoughts:

    I started off with the Spy list. Prized Amalgam in the Spy list is nuts. Turns out it gives you some funny interactions. At some point I had 2 Amalgams on the field and dredged a third into my yard, together with a Narcomoeba (so number 3 triggered and was primed to return at my EoT. I put a dice on it to keep track of that). During combat my opponent blocked both Amalgams to death. As soon as Amalgam no. 3 came back at the end of my turn, both Amalgams triggered and returned at my opponents' EoT. The Amalgams gave me enough raw power to break through a Batterskull, Thalia and assorted other stuff. It was insane.

    On to Horde Mode: It must be the funniest deck I've ever piloted. At some point (vs. D&T again) I went from having a Narcomoeba and a Nether Shadow on the field (as lonely blockers) to having that + 3 Bloodghast, 3 Nether Shadows and 3 Ashen Ghouls. For some reason, Ichorid was nowhere to be found. At the end of the turn I also got back a couple of Amalgams. Reminder: Combat math is hard. That's all I can say. It was funny as hell (I had 1 game vs. Grixis Delver where my opponent started out with 2 DRS. He still almost lost. I had some poor luck with my dredges, so he got there), Vengeful Pharaoh made attacking a living hell for my opponents. Games take long and take a lot more thinking than the Spy list though.
    Would you share your list?

  13. #373

  14. #374

    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    And what about sideboarding?

  15. #375
    The crazy nastyass honey badger

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    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+


  16. #376

    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    Quote Originally Posted by Echelon View Post
    Off course. But i meant sideboaring, not the list of your side.
    You could tell us specific movements in your match ups

  17. #377

    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    Quote Originally Posted by Echelon View Post
    So... I took both the Prized Amalgam Balustrade Spy list and Horde Mode out for a spin yesterday. Here's some thoughts:

    I started off with the Spy list. Prized Amalgam in the Spy list is nuts. Turns out it gives you some funny interactions. At some point I had 2 Amalgams on the field and dredged a third into my yard, together with a Narcomoeba (so number 3 triggered and was primed to return at my EoT. I put a dice on it to keep track of that). During combat my opponent blocked both Amalgams to death. As soon as Amalgam no. 3 came back at the end of my turn, both Amalgams triggered and returned at my opponents' EoT. The Amalgams gave me enough raw power to break through a Batterskull, Thalia and assorted other stuff. It was insane.

    On to Horde Mode: It must be the funniest deck I've ever piloted. At some point (vs. D&T again) I went from having a Narcomoeba and a Nether Shadow on the field (as lonely blockers) to having that + 3 Bloodghast, 3 Nether Shadows and 3 Ashen Ghouls. For some reason, Ichorid was nowhere to be found. At the end of the turn I also got back a couple of Amalgams. Reminder: Combat math is hard. That's all I can say. It was funny as hell (I had 1 game vs. Grixis Delver where my opponent started out with 2 DRS. He still almost lost. I had some poor luck with my dredges, so he got there), Vengeful Pharaoh made attacking a living hell for my opponents. Games take long and take a lot more thinking than the Spy list though.
    Money plays.
    DDD / Death & Taxes

  18. #378
    The crazy nastyass honey badger

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    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    Quote Originally Posted by easysantiago View Post
    Money plays.
    Thank you.

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldenCid View Post
    Off course. But i meant sideboaring, not the list of your side.
    You could tell us specific movements in your match ups
    I didn't do any sideboarding. I wanted to get a good feel for the new list as-is first.

  19. #379

    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    Quote Originally Posted by Echelon View Post
    Horde Mode
    You sick man... I salute you! This is so fun to play :) Few changes made – thoughts?

    28 RECUR
    4 Prized Amalgam
    4 Nether Shadow
    4 Gravecrawler
    4 Ashen Ghoul
    4 Narcomoeba
    4 Bloodghast
    4 Ichorid

    19 DREDGE
    4 Golgari Grave-Troll
    4 Stinkweed Imp
    4 Golgari Thug
    4 Dakmor Salvage
    3 Shambling Shell

    5 UTILITY
    4 Street Wraith
    1 Vengeful Pharaoh

    8 GRAVE
    4 Phantasmagorian
    4 Gigapede

    ---

    The changes:

    • -3 Vengeful Pharaoh +3 Shambling Shell: Ichorid food, dredges, enables Shadow / Ghoul
    • -4 Gitaxian Probe +4 Gigapede: more chances to get engine going, enables Shadow / Ghoul

  20. #380
    The crazy nastyass honey badger

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    Re: [Primer] +Manaless Dredge+

    Quote Originally Posted by vieko View Post
    Beautiful list
    I'd switch a Shambling Shell and/or a Gigapede for 2 Vengeful Pharaoh. They do some much needed discouraging to your opponent whenever he thinks of attacking.

    The list is stable as it is so I don't really know if you'd want to switch 4 Timewalks for other cards, but it absolutely does not hurt to try!

    It's awesome to see other people messing around with Horde Mode. It might not be better than the combo lists, but it's fun as hell.

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