I think of Stifle as a reasonable Late-game card actually. Blocking the SFM trigger, the Snap-trigger, a Jace Ult, or even a Liliana-sacrifice is pretty nice. It "feels bad" because your opp got a 2-for-1, but they got the shit half of the deal. They didn't get the spell they needed from Snap and they didn't get an equip, but instead just a Squire. The more I play it, the more I find strange outs.
The other day I won a life-race in part by Stifling a DRS activation. Seems bad to essentially say "I gain 2 life.." but that's the thing, the card's versatility: hitting Terminus, hitting Fetchlands, hitting a Grim-activation, hitting the BSK trigger, stopping a Pyro trigger. Lots of times it costs you a card for "nothing"; but you were about to lose a bunch of cards or lose the game. The fact that it acts as DRS 5-8 some games, and acts as "randomly hose your opponent's most important game plan" other games has felt quite good.
I know that I sometimes would land an SFM and they'd spend a stifle and my lizard brain would say "Got the 2-for-1!!" while I was being beat up by a Delver; but it matters. I get that Therapy can hit all those equips too, and more reliably a lot of the time, but it can't stop the Batterskull if you get the Therapy on the wrong draw step, it can't stop the Snapcaster from killing your last threat, or the Terminus from sweeping your board.
As always, no problem if you just disagree, but I really feel like in the past month or two I've really come around to the card as a versatile game-saver. It feels a lot better than I would've thought to stifle the Snap trigger and leave your opponent without the removal they were planning for, or without the Ponder they needed to find card X.
Originally Posted by Nestalim
For the folks playing Cabal Therapy in their main, do you feel that Dismember and/or Spell Pierce are still holding their weight in the flex spots?
"Good, bad, I'm the guy with the gun." --Ash
Hi, tnx for your work guys!
Can you also write about what to cut for SB options? What card are weak in matchups and why. It would be very helpful.
Hey kabal, interesting question. Hard to say, depends on what you're gunning for in game 1.
Im back and forth, but I read an article on how to beat storm, by Jonathan Alexander. It mentioned that the more ways you can interact on turn 1-2 (play and draw), the better, so that's the case for spell pierce. It's still reasonable to cut it though, noah walker is running a TNN in its place. (Go to CFB and read sigrist's article)
As for the extra removal spell, i think as a one of, anything you prefer is fine, but I personally like either the catch all dismember, or a forked bolt and putting the other in the side. Dismember also nabs prelate on 1, but forked bolt is an amazing 2 for 1 against elves.
In the bug and grixis mirror, dismember is clutch though, since the therapy version isn't attacking the opp mana as much, they're more likely to resolve goyf/angler without worry of daze, so having a live draw off of your ponder/brainstorm is sweet. Plus you can cast it off of any mana producing land, against wasteland, it seems super relevant.
I remember someone mentioning that 1-ofs are still really strong in legacy, because you play draw spells that dig down 3 cards.
Its all what you prefer though, GSY plays fire//ice, lol.
Dismember is awesome, I might even go up to 2. It hits everything relevant except TNN, it doesn't get blown out vs prowess decks, you can play it under blood moon, and also under chalice. Since the meta is leaning a little more fair lately I think now might be a good time to play 2 again, like people were after eldrazi came out.
I just 5-0'd a league too. List is here.
Czech Pile: 2-1
RUG Delver: 2-0
Storm: 2-0
Big Red (Mono red sneak attack): 2-1
Mirror: 2-1
I wanted to purposefully keep that section vague, but still include some ideas for people to think about. I always feel like sideboards can vary and mapping your board comes down to personal preference. I like to always keep in a couple Forces, for example, but some people dont, and both can work with a proper map, plan, or play style.
I've been very forthcoming with my own sideboard map, i have posted it many places, but here it is again for you if it'll help. But really, even i deviate from my own plan if i feel like i need to. My opponent might play strangely to where i keep in Stifles or he is reckless and i keep in all the Forces, etc.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...it?usp=sharing
thanks for all the input! keep on 5-0ing
After playing Canadian for a bit (and not doing very well), I went back to Team Australia and 4-0'd my local weekly Legacy.
2-0 ANT (how good is Stifle on Tendrils?)
2-0 UR Standstill
2-1 UR Delver
2-0 4C Loam.
I've noticed an uptick in mid-range g/w/x decks floating around so I've been trying new things in the sideboard.
//Creature (12)
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Delver of Secrets
2 Tombstalker
2 True-Name Nemesis
//Instant (25)
4 Brainstorm
1 Counterspell
4 Daze
2 Fatal Push
4 Force of Will
4 Lightning Bolt
1 Spell Pierce
1 Spell Snare
4 Stifle
//Sorcery (4)
4 Ponder
//Land (19)
1 Badlands
4 Polluted Delta
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Tropical Island
3 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland
SB: 2 Ancient Grudge
SB: 2 Dark Confidant
SB: 1 Fatal Push
SB: 2 Flusterstorm
SB: 1 Grafdigger's Cage
SB: 1 Marsh Casualties
SB: 2 Pyroblast
SB: 2 Surgical Extraction
SB: 2 Thoughtseize
Note: Dark Confidant is only there for the combo matchups,though I could see it coming in against decks like the Czech Pile where your life-total isn't super relevant. I've yet to test that matchup with Bob however so take it with a pinch of salt.
Haha, i played against a guy who had Bob and Tombstalker in his deck, just the other day. Lo and behold, he took 8 on a crucial turn. Was pretty sick... for me.
Top 4'd a 50-man Legacy Invitational Tournament in beautiful Guangzhou, China this weekend...with "ol' reliable" a.k.a. Honda Civic a.k.a. Grixis Delver.
https://writtenbyjames.com/2017/07/0...grixis-delver/
Feedback most welcome.
A book about the dark side of Legacy: "Magic: The Addiction" // Conversations with Magic players: "Humans of Magic"
Congrats for your top 4'd! Well done!
Nice report! Awesome write up!
Thanks for sharing :)
I'm currently working on building Grixis Delver, and your list is perfect, and the SB guide is awesome, thanks!
Here too, nice report James, thx for showing some chinese legacy news to other delver players here in the world ^^
So, I really like your list a TON. I am a huge fan of TNN as well as Tombstalker > Gurmag in a lot of match-ups. I am having a hard time with Spell Snare viability in my meta and was curious what makes you use it in yours? :)
Hey, y'all, kind of an odd question, but I'm playing a Team Unified tournament tomorrow and am the blue mage of my team. My partners are on BR Reanimator and either DnT with Chalices or straight-up EnT. I anticipate lots of Belcher, some DnT, some Burn, opposing Delver decks, and then lord knows. Which build of Delver would you sleeve up for a tournament like this? My first instinct is "Grixis Canadian"/"Team Australia" because I'd have less air and more business in my deck. But if I were to go with Team Australia, I can't play the Badlands because my BR teammate needs it (though I could run four Seas and only two Volcanics because only one deck per team will have access to Wasteland). I also can't play Thoughtseize for the same reason. Should I play traditional Grixis instead and run Therapies maindeck instead of Stifle? And regarding the creature suite, I was considering playing a maindeck Clique with two TNNs in the sideboard, anticipating slightly more combo than fair/grindy stuff.
Team Unified is a new frontier for me, so I'm grasping at straws a bit.
Thanks a lot!
If you are expecting lots of Burn, Belcher and DnT, you don't want Stife. Stifle is great against Belcher, but against burn and DnT, Stifle is pretty hit or miss. This also brings me to a point I have been wanting to mention lately. I feel like since the banning of Sensei's Top, the format transitioned from being Leovold.Format (exaggerating) to more combo and aggro decks. Stifle was a meta call to prey upon the greedy manabases of all the Leovold decks, and now that those decks aren't as prevalent, I think it is time to start moving back to the Therapy build.
Good luck in the event tomorrow!
______________________________________
The patient Brainstormer always wins.
In that format with that meta, I would stay away from using a tempo deck. I would go with a BUG Delver control build, heavy on the hand disruption. You would be better positioned for whatever you face.
Edit: If I understand the rules correctly, its 2 vs 2? If thats the case, I think it would be pretty fun for partners to play Eldrazi/Stompy & B/U FAE Control. That has a good chance of being the tourney winner.
But, what ever you choose, I would stick with two colors for better consistency.
It's three-player teams, and no players can share cards besides basic lands. So there's only going to be one Force of Will/Brainstorm deck per team, for example. BUG Control, interesting. Hymn is probably pretty good in this assumed meta, now that I think about it. But control > tempo, even with all this combo? Interesting.
Thanks for the input, y'all!
(And I don't wanna steer the thread off course, so if people think there are Grixis Delver builds that would work in this tournament, I'm all ears about reading it here. Otherwise I'll take my question to a different thread.)
Thanks mindcrank!
Spell Snare I've found to be insane as a hard-counter against Death and Taxes/all fair decks really, Chalice decks, Reanimator/Storm. When you draw it against Sneak and Show it makes you question your life-choice to play a conditional hard-counter but other than that, the card is nuts and has a heap of power IMO. What specifically does your meta look like I guess?
For those wanting to see the deck in action, here are some videos of me playing it at the Aus Eternal Weekend some weeks ago!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T9ez...crjLVc&index=4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEt8...crjLVc&index=9
The rest of the coverage is great too, make sure to check it out!
Hey everybody, I finally got mostly finished with the deck I've wanted to play forever: Grixis delver. I've been on forums with different usernames since the release of young pyromancer, helping develop grixis tempo strategies even though I hadn't been able to play with it at the time. Anyways, I got to go to my first Legacy monday event with the deck yesterday and I did pretty well (4-0, dropping two games). I know it's not a big event, but there were about 30-40 people there and our meta is pretty competitive. I also just sort of wanted to do a write up.
Here's my list:
Creatures
4x Delver of Secrets
4x Deathrite Shaman
3x Young Pyromancer
2x Gurmag Angler
Noncreature Spells:
4x Brainstorm
4x Ponder
4x Gitaxian Probe
4x Lightning Bolt
4x Daze
3x Stifle
3x Force of Will
2x Spell Pierce
1x Forked Bolt
1x Dismember
Lands
4x Wasteland
4x Flooded Strand
4x Bloodstained Mire
2x Volcanic Island
2x Underground Sea
1x Island
Sideboard
3x Red Blast
3x Cabal Therapy
1x Blue Blast
1x Hydroblast
1x Baleful Strix
1x Nihil Spellbomb
1x Rakdos Charm
1x Smash to Smithereens
1x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Pithing Needle
Round 1 vs. BRw Reanimator (2-0)
Game one he takes the play. I played against him two weeks ago when I was on Maverick, which may have influenced his decision to play this hand; it's a brutal t1 lotus petal, chrome mox, thoughtseize himself, attempt to reanimate griselbrand for which I have a force. I probe him on my turn revealing tidespout tyrant. Delver+double bolt seals the deal.
Game two I board in Rakdos Charm, Nihil Spellbomb, Baleful Strix for some bolts and dismember. This game he reveals double chancellor before passing the turn without making a land drop. Luckily I have two probes, and I see a hand of 2x dark rit, exhume, 2x chancellor, and 1x wear//tear. I manage to land DRS turn one and have daze+rakdos charm. I'm sort of stuck on lands so I do a lot of passing with DRS up, eventually putting him to 6 life with it before finding a land to cast a Gurmag Angler, which gets a scoop.
Round 2 vs. NO BUG (2-1)
Game one I probe to see a hand of force, daze, misty, verdant, and dryad arbor. I don't really find anything but bolts, and he gets to dryad arbor+3 other lands without doing anything else. At this point, I actually think that he's on natural order, but I stupidly didn't bolt his dryad arbor. He drew natural order and had force to back it up. I had a delver which could have raced the progenitus using the bolts in hand, but it didn't flip when I needed it to.
Board in some cabal therapies and red blasts, taking out some dazes and stifles.
Game two I see a lot more stuff. I have an early flipped delver and bolt a deathrite and a noble hierarch before probing to see a true-name nemesis and a land while we're both topdecking. Somewhere in here I dismember a hooting mandrills. He ends up going to 1 off of a fetch while I have my delver in play, gains 2 with a deathrite, and attempts to toxic deluge for 2. I have daze for it.
Game three I bolt his t1 deathrite and then wasteland him. Eventually I get pyromancer+therapy online and he hasn't done much, so I get to strip a toxic deluge and a monkey before getting my pyro pushed. I ponder into angler, delver, and deathrite, which gives me a three turn clock that he has no way of dealing with.
Round 3 vs. Sneak and Show (2-0)
Game one I have t1 delver and probe to see his 2x show, 1x force, 1x ponder, lotus petal, and some lands. He doesn't do much, and I have wasteland for his second land. I'm holding force and daze the whole game and delver gets there.
Board in some REBs and therapies, taking out some bolts and dismember.
Game two I have probe t1 to see flusterstorm, show, brainstorm, and lands. I therapy and he brainstorms in response. I call flusterstorm, which he kept in hand and loses. At this point his hand is pretty miserable and I land a t2 delver that gets in for a bunch before I get a DRS and red blast a brainstorm that he tried to get back in the game with. He's at 10 when I EOT DRS+bolt and then hit him with the delver and activate DRS again. His hand was full of lands and I still had brainstorm, force, and daze.
Round 4 vs. Spicy ANT(1 entomb, 1 griselbrand, 1 shallow grave) (2-0, Feature match)
I saw him playing in round three and know what he's on. I still keep a pretty bad hand g1. It had had deathrite and angler, but no dig other than a brainstorm that got stripped anyways. He tendrils me out through PiF a turn after I resolve angler.
Board in therapies, spellbomb, and red blast for bolts and dismember.
Game two I leave only one land untapped when I already have stuff going to cast a pyromancer. He makes ten goblins because I brainstormed into stifle without mana to cast it. Here he messes up, not using a goblin to therapy my pyromancer; but it wasn't necessarily a safe call anyway because I had resolved brainstorm. On my turn, I flip two delvers with another brainstorm and then have pyro holding up stifle and daze. This allows me to race the goblins.
Game three is much more brutal. I have a great hand with therapy, spellbomb, and threats. I shuffle wasteland, deathrite, island with ponder t1 and he plays out two LEDs and doesn't play a second land. So of course I therapy for Infernal Tutor, which hits. I play spellbomb and then have pyro+another therapy the next turn to completely shred his hand and still leave up spellbomb, which is especially good because I took tendrils. Then I draw wasteland to destroy his only land, and beat him down with a bunch of stuff in hand and a spellbomb up.
All in all, the singleton island, lack of a green source, and missing the fourth Force didn't really present much of a problem. I'll obviously be picking them up as soon as I can. Also which should I pick up first? Force #4, trop, or volc #3?
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