After all the testing I've done, I can't help but believe that the UW version with the RIP/Force Field/Helm combo is the best iteration for the deck in Legacy. The fact that you can Pith Top is not insignificant, and your ability to just lock out decks like Burn thanks to Force Field cannot be ignored.
While I admittedly miss the discard and Extirpate effects from B, jamming in those cards seems counterintuitive at this point with a fairly strong shell as it stands.
Ok guys. No miracles and Abrupt decay will be down in play. Our time to shine.
I agree! I saw the announcement, and immediately thought "time to dust off lantern - it may be the new control deck in Legacy." Miracles was a tough match-up, and really tested the time constraints that the deck already has problems with. Anyway, how many copies of Abrupt Decay do you think, out of Leovold and Shardless decks, will become more Fatal Push instead? They still want answers to Chalice of the Void I would think.Originally Posted by itrytostorm
Now the list I ran back in August that did well in a tourney had 4 copies of Top, but I can see moving away from it easily. It means no Terminus out of the board, which kind of hurts, but there are lots of directions to go. As someone who's played a crap ton of Tezz in Modern recently - Whir of Invention is a ridiculously powerful card. I'm thinking of building a whir list, over the E-Tutor/Top package. It's slower, but is better card-advantage wise. Whirring for X=4 with Rest in Peace out on their end step will probably be GG lots of times.
Here's a quick whir list that I threw together that I'll probably play at a local store tonight. Needing UUU, I went more heavily on blue, and included daze.
Artifacts: 22
1 Welding Jar
3 Mox Opal
1 Urza's Bauble
4 Codex Shredder
4 Lantern of Insight
2 Pyxis of Pandemonium
2 Pithing Needle
1 Ethersworn Canonist
1 Ratchet Bomb
2 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Helm of Obedience
Enchantments: 9
1 Land Tax
1 Field of Dreams
4 Rest in Peace
3 Energy Field
Instants/Sorceries: 11
4 Brainstorm
3 Daze
1 Enlightened Tutor
3 Whir of Invention
Land: 19
4 Polluted Delta
4 Flooded Strand
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Tundra
1 Plains
6 Island
1 Seat of the Synod
1 Inventors' Fair
SB:
1 Torpor Orb
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Padeem, Consul of Innovation
1 Spellskite
1 Containment Priest
2 Unexpectedly Absent
2 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
2 True-Name Nemesis
1 Underground Sea
3 Thoughtseize
Sideboard is all over the place, but I want some cards that can come in on a different axis and win under time constraints. TNN and Tezz seem like good options.
I like the opening we have now that miracles has left, but there are a few more hurdles to address. Chalice of the Void can easily be neutered with an Unexpectedly Silent, but Leovold is the next problem we have as it directly counters our strategy. How do you propose to address Leovold in your list? My suggestion: A clean way to defeat Leovold, Emissary of Trest and True-Name Nemesis is Porphyry Nodes as it does not target. Whir of Invention looks great indeed and I also like the TNN's as additional bridges. You could even increase that count with Etched Champions, but that's probably not the way to go :-). I'm expecting storm, burn and DRS/Leovold decks en masse. White has Warmth in the sideboard, which is good against burn, but bridge won't be able to save us from the life loss of DRS and Leovold counters our millstones directly.
There are several builds I would like to keep improving. The UW version, the UB version I'm posting here, and I have a deck idea that uses Inspiring Statuary to turn the millstones into mana rocks for cards like Karn, Ugin, All is Dust or even Thought-Knot Seer and Reality Smasher.
Here is the latest UB version I have:
1 Duskmantle, House of Orzhova
1 Nephalia Drownyard
1 Inventor’s Fair
2 Grasping Dunes
2 Wasteland
2 Island
3 Swamp
4 Polluted Delta
2 Underground Sea
3 Mox Opal
2 Lim-Dul’s Vault
3 Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver
4 Liliana of the Veil
4 Ensnarinng Bridge
2 Chains of Mephistopheles
2 The Abyss
1 Cursed Scroll
2 Field of Dreams
2 Codex Shredder
4 Pyxis of Pandemonium
3 Collective Brutality
2 Dimir Charm
2 Flusterstorm
4 Pithing Needle
3 True-Name Nemesis
1 Crucible of Worlds
Leovold is a nuisance, you're right, which is why 4 pyxis and 2 shredder or something is probably a better option than 4 shredder. I think Humility could be a good sideboard option. To beat burn, you're right about bridge not cutting it, but I think Energy Field is the nuts. The combo of energy field and rest in peace covers DRS, burn, and attackers like Noble Hierarch that can get under a bridge.
I'd also like to know how the new Gideon might perform in this deck. He can really cover your bases against storm.
The more i look at the list the more i like it. Let us know how it went.
Is Field of Dreams on MTGO yet? I want to try this deck but not until I can play with it online for practice.
I do not believe so. I would 100% play this online.
is it that hard to know when terminus is on top of deck? you'll likely only be casting it on your turn, but it's still a pretty powerful effect.
-rob
Well, how'd it go?
I stupidly didn't leave myself enough time to throw the deck together, and instead played another deck that was already assembled. I was so mad that I didn't bring lantern that I went to MTGO late last night to put it together, only to find out field of dreams isn't available. Now I have to wait 2 weeks.
Artifacts: 23
1 Welding Jar
3 Mox Opal
1 Darksteel Reactor
3 Codex Shredder
4 Lantern of Insight
4 Pyxis of Pandemonium
2 Pithing Needle
1 Ratchet Bomb
3 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Helm of Obedience
Enchantments: 11
1 Humility
2 Field of Dreams
4 Rest in Peace
4 Energy Field
Instants/Sorceries: 7
2 Unexpectedly Absent
2 Enlightened Tutor
3 Whir of Invention
Land: 19
4 Polluted Delta
4 Flooded Strand
2 Tundra
2 Plains
4 Island
1 Seat of the Synod
1 Inventors' Fair
1 Karakas
SB:
1 Back 2 Basics
2 Detention Sphere
2 Flusterstorm
2 Meddling Mage
1 Padeem
2 Peacekeeper
1 Swan Song
2 Swords to Plowshares
2 Vendilion Clique
Been crushing Delver and Sneak and Show with this. Hopefully more testing this weekend.
Nice list, good to hear you had positive results. How has whir played out in your games? Are you usually holding it reactively or using it on turn 3 to power out more mill rocks? And why Darksteel Reactor? Seems like you'd just mill an opponent by the time it wins.
I'd strongly suggest an Ethersworn Canonist, as it gives you game against stuff like storm, reanimator, omnitell, and aluren game one. Especially if you have any copies of enlightened tutor, responding to a turn one Unmask by putting canonist on top is basically gg against storm.
Now that I think about it, I wonder if the Ratchet Bomb (which I think is necessary to not auto-lose to Chalice of the Void) would be better served as a Powder Keg, for a couple reasons. It only hits artifacts and creatures, so it would leave your enchantments alone. I could see situations where you need to get rid of a Gaddock Teeg or Dark Confidant but you don't want to lose your Rest/Field combo. Also, it doesn't need to tap to add a counter, so you can improvise with it freely. The drawback is that it wouldn't be able to blow up Liliana or Library, or hose enchantress. So maybe it isn't better.
Just a way that wins through Leyline of Sanctity, Abrupt Decay, Pulse, Stony Silence, Null Rod, etc. It may be cute, but with our tutors and lock pieces, 20 turns goes by quickly.
How do we feel about Predict in this deck? It would almost always be draw 2 for 2 at instant speed.
I think 1 mana spells like brainstorm or ponder would be more beneficial, letting us keep more hands. The deck cares more about card selection than card advantage or instant speed, right?
I'm not sure that's entirely true. In its essence, lantern is a hard control. Card advantage can be very relevant against jund or shardless type decks that pressure you with hymns, liliana's, abrupt decays and cantripping/cascading creatures. Brainstorm is highly likely a must, because it is essentially 0.5 mulligan for 1 mana. However, Predict is possibly much better than Ponder in this deck. Supreme Verdict is also something that should be looked at again. The fact that tempo can't daze it is very powerful.
You would play Brainstorm first but the synergy of the deck with Predict is apparent. May not make the cut, but tossing it out there b/c of how strong Predict has proven to be recently in Miracles.
Predict was strong in Miracles for a few reasons:
1. Predict is a 2-drop. Miracles was flush with 1-drops for counterbalance, and generally was inconsistent with guaranteeing a 2-drop.
2. Force of will. You could not just pitch Predict to FoW, but you could also replenish your hand after a force of will making it significantly less hurtful.
3. Monastery Mentor. Not every version of Miracles ran Monastery Mentor but Predict synergized super well with him.
4. Clearing the top of the deck. Often times you'd get into a slump with no shuffle effect and one or two crappy cards on top of your library. Better to mill one and draw two.
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