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Thread: Esper Mentor

  1. #361

    Re: Esper Mentor

    Quote Originally Posted by Hanni View Post
    SFM isn't impressive in every match. Against Storm, it's not great and gets trimmed postboard.

    SFM is at it's best against Delver and aggro decks, although it's quite solid against control as well.

    Against Food Chain, SFM can be lackluster preboard. Postboard, Sword of Fire and Ice is great since it lets you swing past Baleful Strix and Misthollow Griffin while applying a major clock and draws a card.

    Against Miracles, it's a threat that puts them in a position where they have to make bad trades. If they kill it with Swords to Plowshares, they're down a card. If they deal with a Battersull germ token and SFM with Terminus, they're still down a card. Postboard, Sword of Fire and Ice is great. Even Jitte is pretty good, since an active Jitte can shut them down from playing Mentor.

    Glad to see that you enjoyed the deck, though.
    Wouldn't say stoneforge was bad, just it didn't have the raw power mentor do, and it's a bit Mana hungry.
    Yep I did all of these but keeping Jitte in g2vs miracle, will keep it next time.

  2. #362

    Re: Esper Mentor

    Quote Originally Posted by Hanni View Post
    So I lost against D&T at my LGS last night due to some fairly bad draws... mana flooded both games, little to no creature removal drawn, etc.

    At any rate, my loss to D&T got me thinking. While I've beaten D&T with Esper Mentor on more than one occasion, it's a fairly close matchup. On the other hand, I've played quite a bit with Bant Deathblade, and I crush that matchup everytime. TNN + Jitte is insane against them.

    So like I said, it got me thinking. I wrote a blurb in the Deathblade thread before about some of the various pros and cons for both Mentor and TNN, and while I'm firmly in the Mentor camp because Mentor is absurd... why can't I run both?

    I'm going to test the following list at my LGS next week:

    Lands (18)
    4 Flooded Strand
    4 Polluted Delta
    1 Marsh Flats
    2 Tundra
    1 Underground Sea
    1 Tropical Island
    1 Scrubland
    2 Island
    1 Plains
    1 Swamp

    Creatures (13)
    4 Deathrite Shaman
    4 Stoneforge Mystic
    3 Monastery Mentor
    2 True-Name Nemesis

    Spells (29)
    2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Ponder
    4 Gitaxian Probe
    4 Force of Will
    1 Spell Pierce
    4 Cabal Therapy
    4 Swords to Plowshares
    1 Umezawa’s Jitte
    1 Batterskull

    Sideboard (15)
    2 Meddling Mage
    1 Spell Pierce
    1 Flusterstorm
    1 Disenchant
    1 Council’s Judgment
    1 Toxic Deluge
    1 Zealous Persecution
    2 Surgical Extraction
    1 Back to Basics
    2 Engineered Explosives
    1 Pithing Needle
    1 Sword of Fire and Ice

    The debate for me was whether or not to cut a Pierce or a Jace from the maindeck, but decided that Pierce was only mediocre and Jace was incredible, so I trimmed a Pierce.

    Cutting down to 2 Meddling Mage to fit the Pierce in the board seems fine for me. I've been on the fence about the 3rd Mage for a while, and there are matchups where I want the 2nd Pierce, so I think I'm okay with making that adjustment.

    Thoughts?
    How did you do with the addition of TNN? Was it ok, or just too clunky?

  3. #363
    Etherium is limited. Innovation is not.
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    Re: Esper Mentor

    I haven't tried it yet. I won't get to try it until next week.
    Sligh
    Mentor Deathblade
    The Mind Harvester
    4c Nobleblade

    Quote Originally Posted by MMogg View Post
    In porn terms, Zoo has a 11" shlong and an impressive money shot, but it's over in 4 minutes, whereas Landstill is a good 8" and can go for 30 minutes.

  4. #364

    Re: Esper Mentor

    New poster, lurked for a while. I brought Hanni's list to my LGS tonight, with a few changes to the sideboard.
    -1 meddling mage -2 EE -1 back to basics because I don't have these cards and spent my store credit on mentors
    +1 CJ to replace the "answer a problematic permanent" part of EE
    +1 Liliana the Last Hope to replace the sweeper effect of EE while also being strong against grindy decks
    +1 Vendillion Clique to replace meddling mage's "generally good vs combo" slot and give evasion vs elves, which is overrepresented here
    +1 Hydroblast because I like the card

    I went 2-0 vs merfolk 2-0 vs BUG delver 2-0 vs Elves 1-0 vs grix delver after an ID, so I'm obviously feeling pretty good about this deck. All day my opponents were telling me how strong mentor was vs their deck. I would be very hesitant to put TNN in this deck. Basically every deck has sideboard TNN hate that lines up very poorly vs mentor, like edict or -1 sweeper effects. I've also played a lot of D&T and a fair amount of bant blade, and I think D&T is favored in that matchup anyway, so equipment + TNN is not a sure thing to shore up that matchup.

    My sideboard plans today were:
    Merfolk: -2 pierce -2 jtms -2 fow / +2 CJ +1 disenchant +1 SoFI +1 deluge +1 ZP
    BUG Delver: -4 fow / +2 CJ +1 deluge +1 fluster
    Elves: -4 SFM -1 batterskull -2 pierce / +2 meddling mage +1 needle +1 deluge +1 ZP +1 lili last hope +1 clique
    Grixis Delver: we didn't play out boarded games but it would have been -4 fow -2 jtms / +2 CJ +1 fluster +1 hydroblast +1 ZP +1 deluge

    What do people think about those sideboard plans? Aside from missing EE which would have been nice in all of those matchups of course.

  5. #365
    Etherium is limited. Innovation is not.
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    Re: Esper Mentor

    Quote Originally Posted by JacobRoberts View Post
    I would be very hesitant to put TNN in this deck. Basically every deck has sideboard TNN hate that lines up very poorly vs mentor, like edict or -1 sweeper effects. I've also played a lot of D&T and a fair amount of bant blade, and I think D&T is favored in that matchup anyway, so equipment + TNN is not a sure thing to shore up that matchup.
    You're right, Mentor is strong against alot of decks, that's why this deck is so good. Mentor is a rediculously powerful card.

    That doesn't make TNN any less good in a deck with equipment, though.

    The thing is, diversifying the threats has the ability to make this deck even harder to deal with. While there may be answers for TNN postboard, there are also answers for Mentor. TNN doesn't get hit by Abrupt Decay, for example.

    Mentor is much better than TNN in most matchups for this deck, but there are matchups where TNN is very strong. I still haven't tested the split yet, but I very much like the idea in theory.

    Also, D&T is definitely not favored against Bant Deathblade. I've never lost that matchup from the Bant Deathblade side. I'm not saying the matchup is unloseable, but it's a very favorable matchup.

    I don't think that it's going to change the D&T matchup from tough to favorable simply by squeezing in 2 TNN, but it will make the Jitte plan stronger against D&T, Elves, etc.
    Sligh
    Mentor Deathblade
    The Mind Harvester
    4c Nobleblade

    Quote Originally Posted by MMogg View Post
    In porn terms, Zoo has a 11" shlong and an impressive money shot, but it's over in 4 minutes, whereas Landstill is a good 8" and can go for 30 minutes.

  6. #366

    Re: Esper Mentor

    @Hanni - Any chance you will type up a SB guide for your list?

  7. #367
    Etherium is limited. Innovation is not.
    Hanni's Avatar
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    Re: Esper Mentor

    I have it on a word doc on my work computer, but I don't have a personal computer these days, and typing it all up on my phone would be a huge pain. So maybe at some point I will, but I don't feel like doing it right now.
    Sligh
    Mentor Deathblade
    The Mind Harvester
    4c Nobleblade

    Quote Originally Posted by MMogg View Post
    In porn terms, Zoo has a 11" shlong and an impressive money shot, but it's over in 4 minutes, whereas Landstill is a good 8" and can go for 30 minutes.

  8. #368

    Re: Esper Mentor

    Quote Originally Posted by Hanni View Post
    You're right, Mentor is strong against alot of decks, that's why this deck is so good. Mentor is a rediculously powerful card.

    That doesn't make TNN any less good in a deck with equipment, though.

    The thing is, diversifying the threats has the ability to make this deck even harder to deal with. While there may be answers for TNN postboard, there are also answers for Mentor. TNN doesn't get hit by Abrupt Decay, for example.

    Mentor is much better than TNN in most matchups for this deck, but there are matchups where TNN is very strong. I still haven't tested the split yet, but I very much like the idea in theory.

    Also, D&T is definitely not favored against Bant Deathblade. I've never lost that matchup from the Bant Deathblade side. I'm not saying the matchup is unloseable, but it's a very favorable matchup.

    I don't think that it's going to change the D&T matchup from tough to favorable simply by squeezing in 2 TNN, but it will make the Jitte plan stronger against D&T, Elves, etc.
    Eh, my experience with TNN has been very disappointing, outside of delver decks where it can be a fantastic tempo play. I'm more against replacing mentors with TNNs than I am the idea of including TNN in general though.

    I've won more than I've lost on the D&T side vs bant. A normal bant 60 lines up extremely poorly with D&T's gameplan, except of course TNN + jitte/sofi specifically, and there are more opportunities for tight play on the D&T side than the bant side to win that fight. Post board, setting up a good ZP is very strong. So if I was going to try to improve the d&t/elves matchups, I'd just find room for another ZP in the board. But you obviously have a lot more experience with this deck than I do, I'm using your list after all. Let us know how the testing goes!

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