BigEldrazi

[marnir]

https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/1240238#paper

This one looks interesting however. Replacing keys with simian spirit guides. I can see that being reasonable. Also, one maindeck revoker.

[marnir]

Looking at the different lists ot there I see two directions that people are taking this deck.

Big Eldrazi plays 4 eldrazi temple, 2-3 city of traitors and at least 3 eye of ugin. Its finisher of choice is Ulamog or some other eldrazi fatty.

Big colorless is its sibling, it plays 2 eldrazi temple, and 2 eye of ugin, but goes all in on city of traitors. Its finisher of choice is Ugin. Basically it moves away from the eldrazy theme to try and play the most powerful colorless spells.

Which direction do you think the deck should be heading? What are the pros and cons? Personally I'm on the eldrazi list, but that is because i don't own any ugins, so I dont know how good he is as a finisher. What are your experiences?

[DNSolver]

Ugin certainly sucks in the semi-mirror. I tried the all-ramp deck with no Chalices / 3Balls (I put 4 Chalice 4 Thorn in the sideboard) last night, played vs Eldrazi twice and drew Ugins. Multiples in some cases. That's one thing to consider - if you're going to play a lot of Ugins as threats, have sideboard threats to come in to replace them when playing vs Eldrazi.

[FourDogsinaHorseSuit]

Looking at the different lists ot there I see two directions that people are taking this deck.

Big Eldrazi plays 4 eldrazi temple, 2-3 city of traitors and at least 3 eye of ugin. Its finisher of choice is Ulamog or some other eldrazi fatty.

Big colorless is its sibling, it plays 2 eldrazi temple, and 2 eye of ugin, but goes all in on city of traitors. Its finisher of choice is Ugin. Basically it moves away from the eldrazy theme to try and play the most powerful colorless spells.

Which direction do you think the deck should be heading? What are the pros and cons? Personally I'm on the eldrazi list, but that is because i don't own any ugins, so I dont know how good he is as a finisher. What are your experiences?

The direction putting up results recently is the medium eldrazi that goes light on Titans for midrange threats than can outclass its little brother and isn't dependant on having forty Mana to close out a game.
I still think that ugin is the best finished, but it's stone cold dead against other eldrazi decks so I don't know which is the best. I haven't played much since the ban but I'm thinking I'll be able to get out tonight. And! I won't be in the hospital next week for the first time in months so I may even play two weeks in a row!
#excitment

[FourDogsinaHorseSuit]

Ugin certainly sucks in the semi-mirror. I tried the all-ramp deck with no Chalices / 3Balls (I put 4 Chalice 4 Thorn in the sideboard) last night, played vs Eldrazi twice and drew Ugins. Multiples in some cases. That's one thing to consider - if you're going to play a lot of Ugins as threats, have sideboard threats to come in to replace them when playing vs Eldrazi.

I'm thinking bridge to lock them out and plus+ult to close

[hofzge]

The direction putting up results recently is the medium eldrazi that goes light on Titans for midrange threats than can outclass its little brother and isn't dependant on having forty Mana to close out a game.
I still think that ugin is the best finished, but it's stone cold dead against other eldrazi decks so I don't know which is the best.

This has been discussed to death in this thread and the Eldrazi Post – Colorless Eldrazi Ramp thread.
There are clear distinctions and the differences between the 2 versions are that the less Eldrazi Threats you play, the less Eye of Ugin and also Eldrazi Temple you want.
The more colorless mana you need, the more City of Traitors, Voltaic Key and Thran Dynamo and Vesuva (Thespian's Stage) you play.

The bigger version is obviously slower and plays less midrange threats. As it is slower, it is worse against combo (similar lockpieces - no clock). The midrange version has a harder time against a control, as it plays less creatures than Eldrazi Stompy but similar lockpieces. Both versions have a colorless sweeper (Ugin vs. All is Dust) but Ugin is arguably much better but more expensive.

The question is how fast will the format be now? If it turns out that the midrange grindfest is over and more combo is played as well as faster Delver variants the midrange version should be better. If Miracles id the DTB then Ugin version is a bit better.

But for all the pros and cons please just read this thread.

How about an example of a midrange list I've been brewing:
//Lands
4 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
4 Cloudpost
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 Eye of Ugin
4 Glimmerpost
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2 Vesuva

//Spells
2 All Is Dust
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Grim Monolith
2 Karn, Scion of Urza
2 Thran Dynamo
3 Trinisphere
2 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon

//Creatures
4 Endbringer
2 Oblivion Sower
4 Reality Smasher
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger

//Sideboard
SB: 2 Ratchet Bomb
SB: 3 Sorcerous Spyglass
SB: 1 Faerie Macabre
SB: 1 Karn, Scion of Urza
SB: 4 Leyline of the Void
SB: 3 Warping Wail
SB: 1 All Is Dust


Maybe I have to add: I really don't like Matter Reshaper as it has an awkward mana cost and does little to further our game plan. Also against miracles it is a blank card.

[Cocheloco]

The direction putting up results recently is the medium eldrazi that goes light on Titans for midrange threats than can outclass its little brother and isn't dependant on having forty Mana to close out a game.
I still think that ugin is the best finished, but it's stone cold dead against other eldrazi decks so I don't know which is the best. I haven't played much since the ban but I'm thinking I'll be able to get out tonight. And! I won't be in the hospital next week for the first time in months so I may even play two weeks in a row!
#excitment

Nice to hear you are doing better!

[FourDogsinaHorseSuit]

Nice to hear you are doing better!

Thank you
I ended up playing a list that is outside the scope of the thread and went 2-1. Learned some applical lessons though:
Is there a colorless answer to Marit Lege? Britle effigy? Scour from existence? Your own stage?

[Von]

Thank you
I ended up playing a list that is outside the scope of the thread and went 2-1. Learned some applical lessons though:
Is there a colorless answer to Marit Lege? Britle effigy? Scour from existence? Your own stage?

I imagine karakas would work too, or mirage mirror like in the Japanese list

[MGB]

Looking at the different lists ot there I see two directions that people are taking this deck.

Big Eldrazi plays 4 eldrazi temple, 2-3 city of traitors and at least 3 eye of ugin. Its finisher of choice is Ulamog or some other eldrazi fatty.

Big colorless is its sibling, it plays 2 eldrazi temple, and 2 eye of ugin, but goes all in on city of traitors. Its finisher of choice is Ugin. Basically it moves away from the eldrazy theme to try and play the most powerful colorless spells.

Which direction do you think the deck should be heading? What are the pros and cons? Personally I'm on the eldrazi list, but that is because i don't own any ugins, so I dont know how good he is as a finisher. What are your experiences?

The direction putting up results recently is the medium eldrazi that goes light on Titans for midrange threats than can outclass its little brother and isn't dependant on having forty Mana to close out a game.
I still think that ugin is the best finished, but it's stone cold dead against other eldrazi decks so I don't know which is the best. I haven't played much since the ban but I'm thinking I'll be able to get out tonight. And! I won't be in the hospital next week for the first time in months so I may even play two weeks in a row!
#excitment

I've been playing the 4 Ugin build with more of a focus on mana rocks and Eldrazi finishers without the midrange Eldrazi and it has consistently been doing better for me than the midrange version ever did. Like I said, I've maintained around a 1800 ELO rating on MTGO with the deck, top-8ed several challenges, and cashed nearly every paper tournament I've played in including a Top-4 finish at a recent SCG Classic event.

I personally believe that the 4 Ugin build with less midrange Eldrazi is actually a better choice in this metagame because many decks are playing more spot removal now and that version basically doesn't really care about spot removal or edict effects, and it generally has a better match-up against the blue control decks like Stoneblade or Miracles.

[ESG]

Is there a colorless answer to Marit Lege? Britle effigy? Scour from existence? Your own stage?

Preempting it with Sorcerous Spyglass or Pithing Needle is the easiest way to buy time. Thespian's Stage, if you run that, can let you make your own Marit Lage and threaten a standoff. Karakas is also great. Once you set up Endbringer, you can stop it from attacking. Ensnaring Bridge is another option: Just slow the game down, and when you're ready to close it out, you can always remove your Bridge with Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger. Ulamog can exile Marit Lage as well. Karakas + Ulamog is a pretty sick combo if you reach that stage. Forcefield is a techy answer that I wrote down a while ago but haven't gotten around to testing.

[FourDogsinaHorseSuit]

Preempting it with Sorcerous Spyglass or Pithing Needle is the easiest way to buy time. Thespian's Stage, if you run that, can let you make your own Marit Lage and threaten a standoff. Karakas is also great. Once you set up Endbringer, you can stop it from attacking. Ensnaring Bridge is another option: Just slow the game down, and when you're ready to close it out, you can always remove your Bridge with Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger. Ulamog can exile Marit Lage as well. Karakas + Ulamog is a pretty sick combo if you reach that stage. Forcefield is a techy answer that I wrote down a while ago but haven't gotten around to testing.

Lol, forcefield doesn't target? It works against tnn too???

[Cocheloco]

Guys, I have seen a couple of lists using sands of time in the SB (e.g. https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/1256868#paper). When are they boarded in? against back to basics only?

[FourDogsinaHorseSuit]

Guys, I have seen a couple of lists using sands of time in the SB (e.g. https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/1256868#paper). When are they boarded in? against back to basics only?

Someone's really desperate to get extra activation of their Walking Ballista/eye of ugin?

[Cocheloco]

Someone's really desperate to get extra activation of their Walking Ballista/eye of ugin?

Yes, Walking Ballista should recharge like hell and there is no need to pay mana for untaping grim monolith. I guess this is good against death and taxes?

[Cocheloco]

I've been playing the 4 Ugin build with more of a focus on mana rocks and Eldrazi finishers without the midrange Eldrazi and it has consistently been doing better for me than the midrange version ever did. Like I said, I've maintained around a 1800 ELO rating on MTGO with the deck, top-8ed several challenges, and cashed nearly every paper tournament I've played in including a Top-4 finish at a recent SCG Classic event.

I personally believe that the 4 Ugin build with less midrange Eldrazi is actually a better choice in this metagame because many decks are playing more spot removal now and that version basically doesn't really care about spot removal or edict effects, and it generally has a better match-up against the blue control decks like Stoneblade or Miracles.

Hi Patrick. Against which decks do you bring the 2 SB Karn, Scion of Urza? What is your strategy to fighting delver? Would you have made any changes to your SCG list? I'm thinking of investing in the few cards I'm missing to complete your list

Thanks

[MGB]

Hi Patrick. Against which decks do you bring the 2 SB Karn, Scion of Urza? What is your strategy to fighting delver? Would you have made any changes to your SCG list? I'm thinking of investing in the few cards I'm missing to complete your list

Thanks

Karn and All is Dust usually come in against Miracles and Death n Taxes and any other list that plays Swords to Plowshares, and I sub the Thought-Knot Seers out. The goal is to make opposing spot removal irrelevant.

Regarding Delver... I honestly haven't faced much Delver but in the past I've simply relied on TKS and early game interaction to hold the fort until you can stabilize. You can weather the storm vs. a Wasteland or two and still win, but sometimes they just have a great draw with multiple Daze/FoW/Wasteland AND early pressure that is very hard to beat. Something worth investigating is boarding in Wurmcoil Engines, but I never liked that in the past. It might work for you though.

[Cocheloco]

Karn and All is Dust usually come in against Miracles and Death n Taxes and any other list that plays Swords to Plowshares, and I sub the Thought-Knot Seers out. The goal is to make opposing spot removal irrelevant.

Regarding Delver... I honestly haven't faced much Delver but in the past I've simply relied on TKS and early game interaction to hold the fort until you can stabilize. You can weather the storm vs. a Wasteland or two and still win, but sometimes they just have a great draw with multiple Daze/FoW/Wasteland AND early pressure that is very hard to beat. Something worth investigating is boarding in Wurmcoil Engines, but I never liked that in the past. It might work for you though.

Thanks!

[MGB]

Anybody going to GP Richmond rocking this deck? I plan to run the Last Chance Trial gauntlet with this bad boy and then enter the main event with the deck as well.

[FourDogsinaHorseSuit]

Last night I went 3-0, testing out Sands of Time I boarded it in only one match (against Jeskai Blade) and only cast it once. It was countered so who knows if it's any good.
2-1 Vs Burn. Stomped game one, lucked out game two (he punted harder than me) and stabilized just in time game three. Warping Wail is good here but it's like a chalice: Their other spells are just so powerful that unless you TKS or Wurmcoil this is going to be a bad time. For example, I lost game one with a start that included a Glimmerpost, and a turn one chalice, key and monolith.
2-0 Vs Goblins. Both games I kept threat-light hands that were just full of Glimmerposts, which combined with draws that were also more glimmer posts and vesuvas I annoyed him into submission with life gain.
2-0 Vs Jeskai Blade. Game one on the play I can explode with a key, and two monoliths and he had no counters for those or the threats. Game two was much closer but once monoliths are down the mana denial plan becomes too sketchy and his soft counters just aren't good enough.