[DECK] Polymorph Thopters

[Mr. Safety]

I've been actively developing a Thopter/Sword deck since the unban, trying to find a way to make it work without being too dependant on it (Stony Silence is a thing.) I immediately thought of Gifts Ungiven (like others) for enabling a powerful way to assemble the combo while also being able to customize a diverse plan. I tried it but I couldn't get to a finished product quick enough to be ready for SCG Modern States. I turned to another powerful four mana spell: Polymorph.

The whole premise is to assemble thopter/sword as a primary win condition but with an alternate plan that completely dodges artifact hate. It also allows for a convenient turn four combo with something as simple as one thopter token, or lingering souls token that was played turn 3. Thirst for Knowledge is the stone cold nuts in this deck, easily one of the best cards in here. Not because I have junky artifacts to discard but because it finds the correct pieces without caring if I discard two cards. Naturally this led to Liliana of the Veil as a powerful card to help disrupt that works excellently with Lingering Souls. From there it was a matter of having good early interaction in the form of targeted discard, a small splash of permission, and some value cards to enable grinding wins. Oh and a pair of Emrakul. Most players panic a little at thopters, so they zone in on how to beat it or race it (racing is impossible without an answer if your life total is stable enough.) That leaves them wide open to Polymorph.

Here is my list, unchanged as of yet, but I am still working on it. The sideboard could be tightened up and I'm not sure Mana Leak is correct (it does however give an easy flexible 4 slots for boarding.)


2x Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
4x Polymorph
3x Thopter Foundry
3x Sword of the Meek
4x Thirst for Knowledge
4x Inquisition of Kozilek
2x Thoughtseize
2x Path to Exile
4x Mana Leak
3x Liliana of the Veil
4x Lingering Souls
1x Batterskull
1x Engineered Explosives

3x Flooded Strand
2x Polluted Delta
1x Marsh Flats
1x Hallowed Fountain
1x Watery Grave
1x Godless Shrine
2x Drowned Catacomb
1x Glacial Fortress
2x Swamp
2x Island
1x Plains
1x Blinkmoth Nexus
1x Celestial Colonnade
1x Shambling Vent
2x Ghost Quarter
1x Academy Ruins
1x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
61 Cards (I know, I know...I added the 2nd emrakul in case I drew one. In the future I may just drop a Mana Leak.)

Sideboard

2x Disenchant
2x Dispel
2x Supreme Verdict
2x Zealous Persecution
1x Iona, Shield of Emeria
1x Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
1x Path to Exile
2x Surgical Extraction
2x Timely Reinforcements


I took this list to SCG States in Maine on Sunday and went 5-0-1, being the top seed going into the top 8 (64 players.). I lost in the quarter finals to Amulet Combo (yes, that's still a deck), both losses coming from Hive Mind/Summoners Pact. I faced two bogles decks, bushwhacker zoo, rug scapeshift, infect, and amulet combo (my only loss.) The deck was super fun with plenty of juice. I won several games with lingering souls (fringe value with Sword of the Meek.) I actually only won two games with thoper/sword, and quite a few with Polymorph, some with Emrakul and some with sideboarded Iona.

I will continue working on the deck because simply put, its a blast to play. I welcome any and all constructive comments for the deck. I feel the Mana Leaks are the weak spot currently, I am just not sure what else to put in for a two mana disruption so I can curve the disruption into a turn 3 liliana or lingering souls.

I registered the deck as "The Hungry Little Caterpillar". If you have kids, you'll appreciate and get the reference.

[Mr. Safety]

http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...?DeckID=102062

[Baumeister]

I wonder if Proteus Staff may be better than just straight Polymorph? Knowing it costs more, the second activation gives you card advantage (over Polymorph). It also tucks as opposed to destroying although I'm not sure how relevant that is or if you use Polymorph as removal for opposing creatures.

Furthermore, you could shoehorn Fabricate into the deck to draw your win conditions more consistently and having a wide range of targets could be nice. Have you thought about adding signets to speed up the deck?

[Mr. Safety]

I wonder if Proteus Staff may be better than just straight Polymorph? Knowing it costs more, the second activation gives you card advantage (over Polymorph). It also tucks as opposed to destroying although I'm not sure how relevant that is or if you use Polymorph as removal for opposing creatures.

Furthermore, you could shoehorn Fabricate into the deck to draw your win conditions more consistently and having a wide range of targets could be nice. Have you thought about adding signets to speed up the deck?

All things I have tried (except fabricate.) I like Muddle the Mixture over fabricate, an easy card to include that I didn't have available at states. I tried both signets and mind stone for acceleration, and its better to simply play on curve. I want tokens turn three, polymorph turn 4. Or one half of the combo after thoughtseize/iok turn three. I really feel that the inevitability of either combo is what counts, not speed.

If I use proteus staff I STILL lose to stony silence. Not having mana open for staff+actvation makes me more susceptible to abrupt decay. My premise is that its difficult to hate out both thopters AND polymorph. Thopters offers a natural, and powerful way to make tokens to enable polymorph. I combo-ed twice against bogles by simply sacrificing foundry to itself turn three in response to silence, turn 4 emrakul.

Thanks for the input. I may try acceleration again in the mana leak slots, but I would put in a 3rd thoughtseize first. One mana leak has become muddle already, so that leaves a couple openings for signets. I hate drawing them late (which is why I tested mind stone) but on curve its great for thopters. Polymorph really needs a turn 3 souls/foundry to go off turn 4. Signets don't speed that up unless I miss land drops.

Thoughts on how to sideboard a little stronger? It was a complete guess for states.

EDIT: polymorph dodges iok. I like it over staff for that reason also.

[Baumeister]

All things I have tried (except fabricate.) I like Muddle the Mixture over fabricate, an easy card to include that I didn't have available at states. I tried both signets and mind stone for acceleration, and its better to simply play on curve. I want tokens turn three, polymorph turn 4. Or one half of the combo after thoughtseize/iok turn three. I really feel that the inevitability of either combo is what counts, not speed.

Good points. I forgot about Muddle the Mixture. That card is incredibly flexible in this shell.

If I use proteus staff I STILL lose to stony silence. Not having mana open for staff+actvation makes me more susceptible to abrupt decay. My premise is that its difficult to hate out both thopters AND polymorph. Thopters offers a natural, and powerful way to make tokens to enable polymorph. I combo-ed twice against bogles by simply sacrificing foundry to itself turn three in response to silence, turn 4 emrakul.

Another good point. I'd say maybe accept the loss to Stony Silence but that's probably not necessary. You're in the right colors for a midrange control deck and Lingering Souls tokens can go the distance. I just want Proteus Staff to be good.

Have you thought about adding Snapcaster Mage? You already have the right shell for him (with a Thopter kill and he does a lot. Along with that, Cryptic Command might be a thing, but holding 4 mana up seems detrimental to the deck's goals.

Thoughts on how to sideboard a little stronger? It was a complete guess for states.

It's been a while, but I ran Ghostly Prison, Leyline of Sanctity, Zealous Persecution, additional countermagic, Threads of Disloyalty, and some graveyard hate. You seem to have all the boxes checked. Again, I was just playing straight Esper midrange without the Polymorph engine.

[Mr. Safety]

Good thoughts. For now I am committed to polymorph. I would love to play a snapcaster value plan, but polymorphing into snapcaster would feel awful. I probably wouldn't get out of bed the next day.

If it makes sense, I am really trying to hybridize a deck with two different angles of attack. Hate thopters out, lose to polymorph. Hate out polymorph, lose to thopters. Somehow hate out both, I go for lingering souls/liliana/man land grind plan. The deck has natural synergy but also a ton of resilience.

So far it seems that jund is its worst matchup. Lingering souls does work, but abrupt decay kills both foundry and a token in response to polymorph. Liliana can make me sac emmy if I don't have spare tokens to sac. Leylines I am trying currently. I also am going -1 path, +1 celestial purge in the board. Pithing needle seems good, but without really specific targets in the metagame I don't like it (yet.) Scooze and relic deal with my graveyard, but the more they board for thopters the stronger polymorph gets. Leyline for jund seems good, and has value against burn.

[Lord0fHam]

What do you think of using one westvale abbey? I also thought that maybe craterhoof behemoth could work instead of emrakul, haven't tested at all though cause I don't have the cards.

[Dice_Box]

Both are cards that work best when you are ahead. I am not sure you should plan to win more over just suring up your win.

[Mr. Safety]

I agree. The deck either gets a strong early lead/combo or treads water until it can catch up with thopters/polymorph. Craterhoof/westvale without thopters (which are fine by themselves) would be so sad. Emrakul is like "win the game, suspend one", elesh norn in the right matchup is unbeatable, same with iona. The threats need to be individually backbreaking. I am currently testing a few more slots in the sideboard for jund, because it has proven to be a tough matchup. Sphinx if the Steel Wind seems very strong, as does Sundering Titan.

Played at TCG states and had a dissapointing day going 3/3. Wins against elves, g-r aggro (like the nacatl-ban era), and infect. Losses to jund, skred red, and affinity. Jund just had too much removal, and I didn't draw into my best cards in my losses like lingering souls. Affinity should be an incredibly good matchup but I lost to a close game one, and then lost to ghirapur aether grid game 2. Skred red I played around blood moon too much. I also won g1 in like a 5 minute game, so I got overconfident and played too quickly. Game 3 I was chiding myself and couldn't get focused.

I really have myself to blame for my losses. The two key losses of the day were to on-board tricks (spellskite and aether grid) both of which I should have played around and which warrent pithing needle in the board.

For the event I only changed a few cards, taking out batterskull main and replacing mana leak with a 2/2 split of remand/spell snare. More changes on the way (after playing a good slew of interactive decks now.) I still love the deck, its super fun and can be incredibly powerful and resilient. I was IN every game, but I got outplayed or lost to myself in my losses.

[AlterEgo]

Why 2x Emrakul? Even if you draw her, 3x Lili and 4x Thirst (plus 2x Thoughtseize for emergency) should be enough to somewhat reliably discard her.

What do you think is the minimum (and maximum) number of Foundries and Swords to include?
I included the combo as an alternate win in Lantern Control and I'm perfectly fine with one copy of each. Of course, Lantern with its Mill rocks naturally digs a lot deeper than this build ever could hope to. Still, I feel like replacing one of each with Muddle the Mixture could actually make the deck more consistent (transmute for the missing piece) AND resilient (Muddle with certain problem spells), whichever is necessary in any given matchup.

[Mr. Safety]

I agree on emmy, down to 1. Its fine.

I have had a few situations where I could transmute for the combo, and its interminably slow. Its so much better to naturally draw into a combo or find it via thirst (which is amazing anyways.) After about 50 test/real games I almost never assembled thopter sword, maybe a handful of games, with a 3/3 split and 1 muddle. I fully back playing 3 sword/4 foundry/1 muddle. Three swords seems odd but it can make for better thirsts.

Currently testing Mortarpod, which has some cool synergy. I will get an updated list posted soon.

[relue8]

I play a very similar deck. In my testing I did not like black that much: the mana base is not as solid and even though lingering souls is great, I preferred counters over discard as they might draw an answer. Also, I found you're not great at protecting Liliana, unless you already have the thopter combo out, at which point Liliana is just a bit of an overkill. I understand your point about polymorph versus proteus staff, but I think a lot of decks don't really have issues hating both polymorph and the thopter combo as it's not the same cards hating them: creature removal for polymorph and stony silence/artifact removal for the thopters. You mention abrupt decay targeting proteus staff, but it can also target the token you're polymorphing. What I did instead was adding a third win condition: just kill them with your tokens. To do this, make them stronger with Honor of the Pure (not with Intangible Virtue as then you shut your thopter combo out). My sideboard is basically filled with ways to further any of the three gameplans and some silver bullets. Terastodon has just been amazing against tron as you can hit their lands (they can get rid of emrakul rather easily). You can swap proteus staff for polymorph against stony silence, or you can just add extra polymorphs if you really need emrakul or terastodon in your matchup. Worship is there against very aggressive decks, and not only is Runed Halo great against Valakut and bogles, you can fetch it with muddle the mixture. Finally, you can also swap the thopter combo out for Spectral procession and intangible virtue, rendering the sideboarded stony silences of your opponent completely useless. Anyway, here's my list:

Creatures:
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
Spells:
4 Path to Exile
3 Spell Pierce
4 Gather the Townsfolk
4 Honor of the Pure
3 Muddle the Mixture
4 Raise the Alarm
1 See Beyond
3 Sword of the Meek
3 Thopter Foundry
1 Detention Sphere
2 Proteus Staff
1 Timely Reinforcements
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1 Polymorph
1 Supreme Verdict
Lands:
2 Academy Ruins
1 Arid Mesa
1 Blinkmoth Nexus
4 Flooded Strand
2 Hallowed Fountain
4 Island
3 Mystic Gate
4 Plains
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Windbrisk Heights

Sideboard:
1 Terastodon
2 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Disenchant
3 Intangible Virtue
1 Runed Halo
2 Polymorph
2 Worship
3 Spectral Procession

I only run 1 see beyond in case I draw emrakul because it happens quite rarely, you can fetch it with muddle the mixture (slow but it works) and since you have other game plans, drawing emrakul is not the end of the world either. Also, proteus staff lets you stack your deck if you have emrakul in hand, so you can put see beyond on top and draw it on your next turn, again, it's slow but it works.

[flightx3aa]

Thank you for getting this deck on mtg goldfish! I was having much trouble coming up with a thoptersword deck. I was a fan and used a grand architect pili-pala deck before this one! This is the exact cheat deck I want to play. Either win with thopter sword, or cheat emrakul or another big baddass into play I love it! I have now been using inspiration from this in my own way with much success, with only a few bad matchups. With much refining I think I have a great deck that has much utility and grindiness over many other and here it is:

4x Thopter Foundry
3x Sword of the Meek
3x Muddle the Mixture
3x Thirst for Knowledge
1x See Beyond
3x Lingering Souls
1x Secure the Wastes
2x Spell Snare
2x Swan Song
2x Path to Exile
3x Thoughtseize
2x Relic of Progenitus
4x Polymorph
1x Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1x Elesh Norn
1x Krark Clan Ironworks
1x Time Seive

4x Polluted Delta
4x Watery Grave
3x Flooded Strand
2x Hallowed Fountain
2x City of Brass
3x Island
2x Swamp
1x Plains
2x Ghost Quarter
1x Blinkmoth Nexus

Sideboard:
Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
Iona, Shield of Emeria
2x Extirpate
2x Darkblast
2x Disenchant
2x Negate
1x Dispel
2x Relic of Progenitus
2x Tormods Crypt

I am not in a graveyard heavy meta, but there are so many decks that we are bad against that abuse graveyards as we do. The mirror, Jund, Melira, Snapcaster, Dredgevine, etc. and worst case scenario mainboard relics become cantrips for more card draw. And after boards they are everything you want, graeyard hate that can be sacrificed to play around other graveyard hate. The only other option would be more interaction, discard spells, or serum vision.

The reason my deck works is because we run 11 one drops. It's that simple. The backup to that is 7 Draw spells if you include muddle the mixture. Muddle the Mixture is an extremely potent spell*** A hard counter spell for blue mana, or an uncounterable deck search. Transmute can no be countered. People think it is a time walk to yourself, but it is an uncounterable amazing next turn setup.

Against all graveyard decks we have 8 graveyard hate cards. We simply plan on winning. Jund which is a bad matchup can have all tarmagoyfs, confidants, and scoozes picked off by our repeatable darkblasts after emptying graveyards. Plus the 6 artifacts on board will help throw your sword around against opposing hate.

The only sideboard things I've found thoptersword to be bad against is hard echantments. Which spel lsnare gets almost all of them by itself. Swan song and thoughtseize hope to get the rest.

Infect is not the best matchup and can go either way. Early game darkblast hoses them and hopes to shut them out soon. Ghost quarters help

Tron is the final bad matchup that we basically can't sideboard against. Flex slot of ghost quarters are only cards we have to hopefully help with tempo. Ulamog is also creature of choice against them, turns on clock just as emrakul. Ulamog is also a good polymorph combo as you can target him with second polymorph and he wont be destroyed.

All in all, besides Jund, Infect, and Tron, Dredge was our only other bad matchup. All other decks don't nearly stand a chance.

Time Seive is a must if you are running muddle the mixture. Turn 6 win the game if you have to muddle for two pieces.
Krark-Clan and Emrakul allows you to beat someone who goes infinite.
See beyond is a good one of over one thirst as a flex slot for my 3 non emrakul creatures, and also increases small percentage of keepable hands. Thirst can be hard to get to with only 2 lands and no other card draw.

11 One Drops
11 Ways to make a creature token if you include swan song and blinkmoth nexus
7 Card Draw Spells
4 Win More/Combo Cards
61 Main Deck

I just like the numbers of things and synergy of the deck. The fact of the matter is it's a deck made up of modern staples, backed up by thoptersword, backed up by ultimate wonkiness of any modern deck right now. All the cards are very flexible. I really enjoy muddle the mixture and swan song, they are both counterspells, but also backup each one of my combos if necessary. We have a lot of different answers for the meta right now. Tron is our main issue, but hopefully can out race them. But a lot of out spells are dead against them sadly.

[Mr. Safety]

Well, I appreciate the enthusiasm. :)

I am still working this deck, trying to find just the right approach. Here are my observarions after easily 100+ games:

1) Polymorph shines against non-interactive decks (bogles, ad nauseam, infect, and affinity, zoo, burn.) The deck has just enough disruption to get a timely, unbeatable emrakul into play. In some of those matchups thopter-sword is nigh unbeatable.

2) Highly interactive decks like uw control, jeskai control, jund, and grixis pyromancer are a nightmare for resolving a polymorph. Thopter-sword can still get there but it becomes a grind and post board it usually gets worse. Polymorph is blown out but removal AND counterspells. These decks have one, sometimes both, and usually relevant sideboard cards.

3) My current plan is to play a higher count of thopter foundry combo (3/4 split of sword/foundry) along with some number of serum visions (currently at 3.) This way i will habe smoother games and a higher chance of assembling thopter sword. Regarding polymorph, I figure if I will have a hard time resolving polymorph then different targets won't matter. So I'm testing a snapcaster/tasigur/vendilion clique sideboard to bring in for poly/emmy g2.

SaffronOlive from mtggoldfish did a stream of the deck and went 1-4. Lots of close games, but a ton of losses. I started out the same way. Then I really tuned in the deck and started winning. However, due to the shift to non-interactive decks the metagame has shifted to more midrange decks in response (jund, grixis, etc.) This makes polymorph worse.

I'm committed to the deck, but sticking to polymorph stalwartly seems foolish. I really like the idea of shifting to snapcaster midrange post board. The more off-guard I can keep my opponent is what makes the deck appealing. Force them to misassigm roles and take advantage of it. G1 they assume a slow thopter deck, tap out and lose to emrakul. G2 make them overly fearful of polymorph and ride souls-snap-liliana to victory.

Also, against jund twin always boarded out their Splinter Twins. Polymorph is our splinter twins. And I cut to 60 cards main, lol.

[flightx3aa]

I also went down to 60 cards main, I think you should try using Swan Song, I've actually turn 4 a surprise polymorph by spell snaring my opponents spell and countering my counter with swan song turn 4 into Iona. And it hits all enchantments that our thopter sword is extremely weak against. Most games I actually just win with thopter sword as my main strategy, and polymorphing as my finisher

I also cut some graveyard hate for timely reinforcements lol. Extirpate gone