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Thread: [Deck] Deathblade

  1. #241

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    Quote Originally Posted by pipet76 View Post
    Hi everybody,

    I've heard that FOW is not very good against Lands. Do you really think that this is true? I mean, countering an Exploration, Gamble, Manabond or sometimes even Crop Rotation can be a game changer.

    Guess my question is, do you use FOW after sideboard in this situation? I'm talking about Lands, not Turbo Lands.
    Yes, I bring in my 4th sideboard fow post board. It is indeed good. Stopping exploration is a very good plan. Or, stopping loam for one turn whIle you get a drs active. It's definitely good. I have an extensive amount of experience in this matchup.
    A good key in this matchup is to spread their resources thin while maintaining consistent pressure. Of course true name is best, but jace the Mind Sculptor and leovold also work.

  2. #242

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    Quote Originally Posted by ClimbGneiss View Post
    Yes, I bring in my 4th sideboard fow post board. It is indeed good. Stopping exploration is a very good plan. Or, stopping loam for one turn whIle you get a drs active. It's definitely good. I have an extensive amount of experience in this matchup.
    A good key in this matchup is to spread their resources thin while maintaining consistent pressure. Of course true name is best, but jace the Mind Sculptor and leovold also work.
    Thanks a lot!

    What do you actually mean by "spreading their resources thin"? I mean, like actual examples.

    :)

  3. #243

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    Quote Originally Posted by pipet76 View Post
    Thanks a lot!

    What do you actually mean by "spreading their resources thin"? I mean, like actual examples.

    :)
    Sorry for the long delay. Here's a pretty typical sequence for a deathblade player on the play vs lands:

    T1, play Deathrite Shaman. Fetch a basic Swamp if you can.
    T1, play Mox Diamond, discard chaff, play land, play exploration. You Force of will it. If they play Punishing fire, you probably Force of will it. If they play loam, again you probably Force of will it.

    T2, fetch an island told hold up Spell pierce if you have it s you can use your Deathrite and your Swamp to eat the hypothetical fire or loam. Eat the Punishing Fire or life from the loam if you can.
    If you just Force of willed gamble or exploration, Then you can lay down sfm looking for sword of fire and ice or true name nemesis. Or, leovold.
    T2, opponent probably gambles for loam or for the piece to finish the depths combo and you probably don't have a way of stopping it. Keep an eye on which lands end up in their yard. Always keep their yard as empty as possible. This a pretty critical turn for the opponent, if they have the right hand and rip the right topdeck, they can still be very hard to beat.
    T3, cast jace and depending on game state start ticking up or brainstorming. If you are fighting off Punishing fire, it may be best to start ticking up. Presuming they don't have loam online it will be absolutely tie them up to Punishing Fire a new threat every turn AND jace ticking up. If your opponent is setting up dark depths or they are loaming, you should look for Swords to Plowshares, clique, Wasteland, and force of will as various measures to disrupt loam or depths.

  4. #244

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    What kind of configuration would you guys bring to a death and taxes / bug Delver heavy meta? Do I drop FOWs? Jace?

  5. #245

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    Basics mostly. Both of those decks run 4 wastelands so basics will serve you well.

    Against death and taxes, the next most important thing is stopping their vial. If they don't have vial they actually have to cast their creatures, which costs mana. That's mana they can't use tying up your basics with things like rishadan port. Other than that i bring in my sweeper suite, zealous persecution, toxic deluge, engineered plague, any sweeper that can get value really. Also containment priest is good since she stops vial in its tracks, in addition to the new flikerwisp+recruiter of the guard combo.

    Against bug one of your best cards is wasteland. I think most builds run 1 or zero basics so any sort of mana denial you can find will be helpful. BUG decks are evolving as well. They are moving away from goyfs to the tasigur/angler/tombstalker/TNN due to the popularity of killspells likes fatal push and abrupt decay. This makes your most valuable cards TNN and STP(the one killspell that takes out the delve fatties.) Stoneforge mystic is somewhat less valuable in this matchup since its pretty likely to bite the bullet early due to all the removal they have for it. IMO, your best bet is fetching jitte and gluing it to TNN after making sure they don't have any more ADs in hand. That's easier said than done though. Bring in other sideboard kill spells you have, but generally i bring in anything i have that deals with abrupt decay. My wincon here is a TNN+jitte and AD is a really problem for that plan.

    Generally both matchups are tough, but manageable. In terms of actual cards i take out, you're right to take out the slow stuff. In these matches bitterblossom+jace are usually yanked which frees up 3-4 slots right away. Mana intensive cards like counterspell might go as well, especially in Dnt. If you're finding that your meta is really saturated with these decks try running 3-4 wastelands with basics of your own.

  6. #246

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    Thanks chief, that's useful information. Cramming those basics in with such a greedy manabase is gonna be tough, but a man's gotta do..

  7. #247

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    Back to the stoneblade after a few weeks playtesting bug delver. Really need some Lilianas for that. I could’ve sworn I’d be doing this a lot more than once a month.
    Anyway the list should look familiar, did some more fine tuning. Removed the two bitterblossoms as they felt somewhat underpowered. Replaced them with 1 leovold and 1 lingering souls. Other than that the list remains unchanged.

    The list:
    Lands-21

    4 Polluted Delta
    4 Flooded Strand
    1 Marsh Flats
    3 Underground Sea
    2 Tundra
    1 Tropical Island
    2 Wasteland
    2 Island
    1 Plains
    1 Swamp


    Creatures-14

    4 Deathrite Shaman
    3 True-Name Nemesis
    4 Stoneforge Mystic
    1 Vendilion Clique
    1 Snapcaster Mage
    1 Leovold Emissary of Trest


    Spells: 23

    4 Force of Will
    2 Spell Pierce
    1 Counterspell
    1 Lingering Souls
    3 Thoughtseize
    4 Brainstorm
    2 Ponder
    4 Swords to Plowshares
    1 Vindicate


    Artifacts: 2

    1 Batterskull
    1 Umezawa’s Jitte


    Planeswalkers: 2

    2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor


    Sideboard:

    1 Ethersworn Canonist
    1 Containment Priest
    2 Flusterstorm
    2 Abrupt Decay
    1 Toxic Deluge
    1 Zealous Persecution
    1 Engineered Plague
    1 Pithing Needle
    2 Meddling Mage
    1 Invasive Surgery
    2 Surgical Extraction


    Match 1: Dredge 2-0 Win

    Game 1: I don’t think I’ve ever won Game 1 against a dredge deck, but first time for everything. On the play I thoughtseized him revealing breakthrough, LED, and some dredgers. I took his breakthrough, but left his LED behind. Thankfully I had FoW in hand. I passed the turn, FoW his LED, and went to my turn. I was out of hate at this point, so I played SFM fetching batterskull to apply some pressure. Off the top he rips cabal therapy taking my batterskull. I played TNN after that and eventually just beat him down with TNN and SFM. He never found another LED or breakthrough and I was able to thoughtseize him again to keep him off 7 cards so he couldn’t discard.

    Game 2:
    Sideboarded as follows:

    +2 Surgical Extraction
    +2 Flusterstorm
    +1 Containment Priest
    -4 Swords to Plowshares
    -1 Vindicate

    Sloppy game of magic. Mulliganed to 6 and I probably should’ve mulliganed to 5. I kept a no lander. As I recall, the keep was 2x DRS, 1X ponder, 1X brainstorm, 1X FoW, 1X Spell Pierce. The plan was to use the scry and the draw for my turn to find a land, and deploy DRS+Tropical island. It didn’t work out that way. I didn’t find a land for another 3 turns. I was only able to win this game because he kept a hand with one breakthrough, which got eaten by my FoW. He also cast cabal therapy targeting surgical extraction. He figured that I had some of those in my hand since I’d decided to keep a no land hand. I played so badly I managed to convince him I had a good hand. While I was busy trying to find land he was busy trying to find an enabler or pitch to hand size. I got my land, set up DRS+ tropical island, and eventually got established. He never recovered, resulting in a very sloppy win.

    Match 2: Nahiri Control 2-1 Win
    Game 1: Had no idea what I was playing against. He started out by playing a bunch of basic islands/plains/mountain. I thought I was playing miracles but he never counterbalanced or topped, and he lightning helix’d my deathrite so I was very confused. Shortly thereafter he cast blood moon on T3 or T4 and I essentially choked on mana. I stuck around in the game to see how exactly he wins, and it turns out he casts nahiri, the harbinger defends it, then ultimates into an emrakul. At some point in there he cast TNN as well. Game 1 loss, but learned how the deck works.

    Game 2:
    With a better idea of what exactly he was doing I made the following SB adjustments.

    +2 Meddling Mage
    +1 Pithing Needle
    +1 Containment Priest
    -4 Swords to Plowshares

    My opening hand was 6 lands and a batterskull. Obvious mulligan. My six included a deathrite, FoW, TNN, and some fetches. I managed to T2 TNN into play with deathrite using my FoW as protection, and I fetched only basics. He played a blood moon the next turn which did make the other lands in my hand awkward, but I had 2 islands and a swamp in play so I was in okay shape. Proceeded to beat him down with TNN. Then he resolved an engineered on 3 and detonated taking out both his blood moon and my TNN. With a freed up mana base I cast TNN and SFM fetching batterskull. Eventually glued batteskull to TNN for the win.

    Game 3:
    I made no SB adjustments.

    Opening hand was awkward. TNN, Jace, FoW, brainstorm, a dual, and 2 fetches. Fastfowarding to his T3, he resolves blood moon, and all I have on board are my two flooded strands. At this point I have TNN, Jace, FoW, wasteland, spell pierce, a blue dual, and SFM. I fetch an island and a plains I can cast SFM, but can’t cast TNN or Jace. If I fetch an island I can cast TNN and Jace, but my clock is slow. I chose to fetch two islands. My next turn I resolved the TNN with FoW backup. He spends his turn durdling with cantrips and casts surgical extraction targeting FoW. I resolve a jace that turn, and apply pressure with TNN. He plays engineered explosives on 3 and detonates, to get my true name, but his blood moon is in the crossfire. He follows up with a TNN of his own and passes the turn. I brainstorm with jace revealing among other things, a vendilion clique. Which I put in hand. I play stoneforge mystic fetching batterskull with my freed up mana to shuffle away the bad and present another threat. I pass the turn. Now things got interesting. At my end step he casts snapcaster mage targeting surgical extraction. In response I attempt to cast zealous persecution to kill both his TNN and his snapcaster. He FoW it, and surgically extracts all of my TNNs. He attempts to resolve blood moon, his last card in hard, but in response I flash in clique. At this point he’s down to 5 life. He passes the turn, clique swing puts him to 2. Jace fateseal shows his last card as an island. Win.

    Match 3: Aggro Loam Draw.
    We were the only 2-0 players so we ended up just splitting. We played it out but honestly I don’t remember the match to well since I wasn’t taking it too seriously at this point. Generally aggro loam felt like a beating, I need to study this matchup if I play it again seriously.

  8. #248

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    Hello all:

    So, with the current meta being swamped with miracles and bug, and a few other non-magic reasons, I had been taking a few weeks off from playing. Recently, a couple of other familiar deathblade sourcers and I have been discussing how to tweak the deck to have favorable matchups vs miracles and bug midrange.

    The answer we have come up with finding competit I've means of consistent card advantage:
    Planeswalkers, Snapcasters, Baleful strix, etc.

    Personally, I'm wondering if Stoneforge Mystic is any good right now. While active equipment is good, creatures are very easy to answer right now so you need to be getting your 2 for 1's in or have non-targetable creatures.

    We are still brewing up something so I'm sure you'll see some posts about it soon.

    Do any of you have any lists that have been tweaked to fight the recent meta?

  9. #249

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    Here’s something I’d try vs BUG. Thankfully I don’t have too much miracles in my meta, but my win rate against that deck is horrendous.

    I’d change my deck to this, if I knew I was against a lot of BUG.

    Big additions:
    3 Wastelands-BUG has a really sensitive manabase. I’d slot in one more in addition to the two I normally run.
    3 SFM-You’re right that SFM is really easy to kill. Going down to 3 is probably fine. I’m not really on board with cutting her entirely though.
    Tombstalker-The BUG decks in my meta have been putting in the delve fatties as they dance around AD and fatal push. Tombstalker is good here because they really can’t remove it as far as I’m aware. Just swords away their delve fatty and go to town.

    If you really have a lot of BUG going around you could probably cut jaces, a FOW, a thoughtseize, and counterspell.

    I'd also be curious if Path to Exile becomes a good SB going forward. They don't have any basics to fetch so it behaves like a better STP in this case. Divert and Misdirection could also be quite good in the SB.

    I’d be curious to see the list your group brainstormed up.

    Lands-21

    4 Polluted Delta
    4 Flooded Strand
    1 Marsh Flats
    2 Underground Sea
    2 Tundra
    1 Tropical Island
    3 Wasteland
    2 Island
    1 Plains
    1 Swamp


    Creatures-14

    4 Deathrite Shaman
    3 True-Name Nemesis
    3 Stoneforge Mystic
    2 Snapcaster Mage
    1 Leovold, Emissary of Trest
    1 Baleful Strix
    1 Tombstalker


    Spells: 22

    4 Force of Will
    2 Spell Pierce
    1 Counterspell
    3 Thoughtseize
    4 Brainstorm
    2 Ponder
    4 Swords to Plowshares
    1 Vindicate


    Artifacts: 2

    1 Batterskull
    1 Umezawa’s Jitte


    Planeswalkers: 2

    2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
    Last edited by First_Revenge; 03-31-2017 at 03:13 PM.

  10. #250
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    Re: [Deck]Esper Deathblade

    I was the last months quite successful with Deathblade. I'm playing right now Sword of Light and Shadow as third equipment and 4 Stoneforge Mystic. The last times against BUG and Miracles. I love SoLaS. It provides life in grindy match ups and bring backs creatures. Especially Strix and Snapcaster Mage are great to get back. Besides that my list changed completely. Abrupt Decay and Thoughtseize are in the sideboard right now which offers me 5 more slots main. Both cards are great but not in every match up. This change allows me to be more consistent and makes sideboarding easier. I had the problem that I have to side out so much but less to side in. So my list looks like this:

    Lands (21)
    4 Polluted Delta
    3 Marsh Flats
    1 Mist Rainforest
    1 Flooded Strand
    2 Wasteland
    1 Island
    1 Swamp
    1 Karakas
    2 Underground Sea
    2 Tundra
    1 Scrubland
    1 Bayou
    1 Tropical Island

    Creatures (16)
    4 Deathrite Shaman
    4 Stoneforge Mystic
    2 True-Name Nemesis
    2 Snapcaster Mage
    2 Baleful Strix
    1 Tombstalker
    1 Leovold

    Instant & Sorcery (17)
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Swords to Plowshares
    4 Force of Will
    2 Spell Pierce
    2 Ponder
    1 Painful Truths

    Other (6)
    2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
    1 Liliana of the Veil
    1 Batterskull
    1 Umezawa's Jitte
    1 Sword of Light and Shadow

    Sideboard
    1 Containment Priest
    2 Surgical Extraction
    2 Abrupt Decay
    3 Thoughtseize
    2 Zealous Persecution
    1 Toxic Deluge
    1 Flusterstorm
    1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
    1 Pithing Needle
    1 Vendilion Clique

  11. #251

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    So with how mana-hungry Deathblade is, I see a lot of lists running wasteland in the deck. To become more consistent with your mana could you cut the wastelands for more colored sources? Just curious, I haven't played the deck much but am interested in building it.

  12. #252
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    Re: [Deck]Esper Deathblade

    Wasteland is not a must have but it helps. Mostly against utility lands like vilraths stronghold, phyrexian tower, thespian stage.
    But plays like 1st turn deathrite; 2nd Wasteland + Stoneforge Mystic; gives you a huge tempo advantage. Combo decks like rb reanimator can get easily screwed with one wasteland.

  13. #253

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    So I built this list for the time being, to test things out and such. What do you all think?

    Creatures
    4 Deathrite Shaman
    3 Stoneforge Mystic
    3 True-Name Nemisis
    2 Baleful Strix
    2 Snapcaster Mage
    1 Leovold, Emissary of Trest

    Spells
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Swords to Plowshares
    2 Ponder
    3 Force of Will
    2 Spell Pierce
    1 Abrupt Decay
    1 Painful Truths

    Planeswalkers
    2 Jace, the Mind Sculpter
    2 Liliana of the Veil

    Artifacts
    1 Batterskull
    1 Umezawa's Jitte

    Lands
    2 Underground Sea
    2 Tundra
    1 Tropical Island
    1 Bayou
    1 Scrubland
    1 Karakas
    2 Wasteland
    1 Swamp
    1 Island
    4 Polluted Delta
    3 Misty Rainforest
    3 Marsh Flats

  14. #254

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    So with the advent of the miracles ban where are we left? Our manabase gets more stable since we don't really need AD as much?

  15. #255

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    Quote Originally Posted by First_Revenge View Post
    So with the advent of the miracles ban where are we left? Our manabase gets more stable since we don't really need AD as much?
    I'd say so, maybe just 1 green source now. But who knows what the meta will change to now.

  16. #256

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    I’ll make some predictions for posterity, I can look back on this in a few months and have a laugh at myself. I’m obviously far from a legacy expert, but here are some initial thoughts I have.

    As an archetype I think stoneblade in general gets way more viable. Stoneblade/deathblade has always felt like miracle’s less powerful younger brother. If I’m not mistaken the emergence of miracles was what pushed us out of the metagame in the first place. With miracles out of the picture stoneblade might emerge as one of the premier control decks.

    Combo decks will probably make a pretty big resurgence. Not sure which ones in particular, but I suspect we’ll be putting our counterspells to good use. I’ve always run a pretty counter heavy build so this doesn’t really phase me as much.

    Elves making a huge resurgence seems likely, we may need to pack more point removal and sweepers in the SB.

    I don’t think we really need AD anymore. Green has always strained our manabase. I suspect we replace our AD’s with fatal push. I personally kept two ADs in my sideboard so I’ve got two more slots to play around with! No more AD’s means we are probably more of a 3.5 color deck, splashing green for the odd deathrite activation or leovold.

    There’s going to be a fight to figure out who the best DRS deck is. I don’t really know what happens with all the BUG goodstuff builds that have been running around. I suspect they’re still good, but one of their main selling points has been the ability to beat miracles. With miracles gone who knows what happens or how they adjust. I don’t think deathblade comes out as the best DRS deck, but then again deathblade has always been a jack of all trades sort of deck so that doesn’t phase me much.

    Possibly a bad thing, with miracles gone, I think DRS becomes the new “king” of legacy. I don’t expect my shamans to live very long if I resolve them since everyone will have a plan to deal with them. Strapping on my tinfoil hat, I think DRS might even eat a banhammer. Pre SDT ban, DRS is in 36% of decks, with the ban I can see it crawling over 50% of decks. Then again pure % of decks isn’t enough to get a card banned as brainstorm continues to prove to us. /speculation

  17. #257
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    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    I expect Delver to make a huge resurgence. I may be biased, but I think Bant (Nobleblade) is better positioned in the meta. 8 mana dorks is a really strong plan against Daze and Wasteland, especially without Terminus to punish overcommitting to the board.
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  18. #258

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    So I'm curious, In Japan some lists run Tasigur in the main. But with how widespread Karakas is in the format, do you think it's worth it to jam him anyways? I like how he can improve the mid-late game with reoccuring spells without having to use snapcaster, but I'm not super sold on him. Just curious what you all think about it.

  19. #259

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    I played in my local LGS tournament tonight and went 2-1, and split top 4. I played against ANT, D&T, and BUG Delver. This was the list I played for reference;

    Creatures - 15
    4 Deathrite Shaman
    3 Stoneforge Mystic
    3 True-Name Nemisis
    1 Baleful Strix
    1 Vendilion Clique
    2 Snapcaster Mage
    1 Leovold, Emissary of Trest

    Spells - 19
    2 Thoughtseize
    1 Inquisition of Kozilek
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Swords to Plowshares
    2 Ponder
    3 Force of Will
    1 Spell Pierce
    1 Abrupt Decay
    1 Painful Truths

    Planeswalkers 3
    1 Jace, the Mind Sculpter
    2 Liliana of the Veil

    Artifacts 2
    1 Batterskull
    1 Umezawa's Jitte

    Lands 21
    2 Underground Sea
    2 Tundra
    1 Tropical Island
    1 Bayou
    1 Scrubland
    2 Wasteland
    1 Swamp
    1 Island
    4 Polluted Delta
    3 Misty Rainforest
    3 Marsh Flats

    Sideboard:
    2 Meddling Mage
    2 Flusterstorm
    2 Surgical Extraction
    1 Disenchant
    2 Zealous Persecution
    1 Grafdigger's Cage
    1 Supreme Verdict
    1 Force of Will
    1 Pithing Needle
    1 Counterspell
    1 Notion Thief

    Round 1 ANT (2-0)
    Game 1: I have 2 deathrite's in play, he cabal therapies hitting the 2 fow in my hand and sees a tnn. next turn he therapies the tnn in my hand. he combos for exact lethal but with the 2 drs i eat my tnn and go to 2 life. after a few turns of eating his grave he scoops.
    Game 2: I thoughtseize him seeing a hand of rituals and dark petition. I play meddling mage naming dark petition. beatdown with mage wins the game.

    Round 2 D&T (1-2)
    Game 1: I dont remember too much about this game other than flickerwisp + vial fucked my world.
    Game 2: tnn with jitte carries that game.
    Game 3: veryyyyy long game with him having a heavy mana denial hand with wasteland/port. I sorta climb out of it with snapcasters/drs and soon there is a clogged board. I supreme verdict the board and both of us are hellbent but he has a sword of feast and famine. he draws mom and thalia while i get a leovold and jitte, but it was too late.

    Round 3 BUG Delver (2-1)
    Game 1: jace the mind sculpter + liliana of the veil + tnn won me the game
    Game 2: golgari charm kills my tnn and maelstrom pulses my batterskull then abrupt decays my jitte. next game
    Game 3: long game, we both keep very reactive hands but neither of us do anything for awhile. we both play creatures that all die to removal. we both get hellbent and i get a top deck batterskull then a tnn that wins me the game.

    After thoughts: Cutting the karakas seemed worth it in the meta I'm currently in at the moment, not a whole lot of targets to bounce and overall kinda meh. I need to change my sideboard a bit to have more game against delver, I didn't have too much in the board to bring it.

    Overall I really like the list I'm currently running, but would make minor changes to the sideboard.

  20. #260

    Re: [Deck] Deathblade

    Quote Originally Posted by MrFrowny_ View Post
    So I'm curious, In Japan some lists run Tasigur in the main. But with how widespread Karakas is in the format, do you think it's worth it to jam him anyways? I like how he can improve the mid-late game with reoccuring spells without having to use snapcaster, but I'm not super sold on him. Just curious what you all think about it.
    Do you have a link to some of these decklists by any chance?

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