A'ight, check out this sweet pile I'm rocking tomorrow. Thoughts?
4x Aether Vial
4x Goblin Lackey
2x Warren Instigator
2x Goblin Piledriver
2x Mogg War Marshal
4x Goblin Ringleader
4x Goblin Matron
1x Pyrokinesis
2x Tarfire
1x Goblin Sharpshooter
3x Gempalm Incinerator
1x Siege-Gang Commander
2x Stingscourger
1x Tuktuk Scrapper
2x Goblin Warchief
1x Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1x Krenko, Mob Boss
3x Arid Mesa
4x Cavern of Souls
1x Karakas
4x Mountain
2x Plateau
2x Rishadan Port
3x Scalding Tarn
4x Wasteland
Sideboard (15)
1x Blood Moon
1x Magus of the Moon
2x Containment Priest
1x Pithing Needle
1x Ethersworn Canonist
2x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1x Grafdigger's Cage
2x Surgical Extraction
1x Tormod's Crypt
1x Pyrokinesis
1x Goblin Settler
1x Tuktuk Scrapper
I'm digging the Humans in the sideboard. I actually think the sideboard is pretty gorgeous.
I've got twelve pieces of removal main. I'm trying out only 2 haste-lords which did well in the Channel/Fireball tourney. I'm often finding that Warchief is just a removal magnet OR doesn't increase my board presence enough, so I'm actually ok with cutting a few. I love that I have 1 Pyro main and 1 in the side. Moon effects and Goblin Settler will be great against Lands. Priest and Needle for Sneak and Show. Thalia and Canonist for Storm. I'm digging this.
All I can say is that I really dig the list here. I generally prefer grafdigger's cage over crypt; crypt does beat the BR reanimator chancellor problem, but I like cage is better in enough other matchups that I'd prefer to have 2. The list looks a little weak to Elves, so a 2nd cage could help with that.
The only other tension I see is the lack of pendelhaven in the deck for the instigator, but double stingscourger does help with getting past the Squire of doom. Best of luck!
Let's see, against Elves I would board in ....
+1 Pyro
+1 Cage
+1 Canonist
+2 Containment Priest, doing the same job as cage
I think that's a pretty decent side against Elves.
It was Pendelhaven or Karakas and I'm valuing the legends bounce and on-color mana more heavily.
Well boys, I tried to bring that championship belt back home, but all I could muster was another 0-2 drop kinda day.
R1 Burn
G1 Opponent Mulls to 5. I win.
G2 I mull to 5 and lose.
G3 We both keep 7. My Thalia eats some removal. So does my Vial. Then I eat burn to the noggin before I can kill him.
Good match though. Competitive.
R2 Nic Fit
G1 Deed wipes my board
G2 Krenko gets active
G3 Ringleader blanks
The story of the day was multiple Ringleaders blanking. 3 Ringleaders completely blanked on me over these two rounds which directly led to me losing games. That was some serious bad luck.
The decklist felt good. The board felt good. But Ringleader didn't bring the party. I would totally play the list again though. One thing that did come into play was that Cheiftain would have been stronger than Warchief and Pendelhaven would have been stronger than Karakas. Multiple -1/-1 effects hurt me against Nic Fit, and the +1/+2 would have been relevant against Burn.
I think a stronger list would have been....
4x Aether Vial
4x Goblin Lackey
2x Warren Instigator
2x Goblin Piledriver
2x Mogg War Marshal
4x Goblin Ringleader
4x Goblin Matron
1x Pyrokinesis
2x Tarfire
1x Goblin Sharpshooter
3x Gempalm Incinerator
1x Siege-Gang Commander
2x Stingscourger
1x Tuktuk Scrapper
2x Goblin Chieftain
1x Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1x Krenko, Mob Boss
3x Arid Mesa
4x Cavern of Souls
1x Pendelhaven
4x Mountain
2x Plateau
2x Rishadan Port
3x Scalding Tarn
4x Wasteland
Sideboard (15)
1x Blood Moon
1x Magus of the Moon
2x Containment Priest
1x Pithing Needle
1x Ethersworn Canonist
2x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1x Grafdigger's Cage
2x Surgical Extraction
1x Tormod's Crypt
1x Pyrokinesis
1x Goblin Settler
1x Tuktuk Scrapper
To bad on the result, i do think that NicFit is a bad match up.
Hitting ringleaders with 0 result always fiels bad, but it happens, its something we have to live with;)
When i see your list with instigators krenko and siegegang and only two hastelords i think chieftain would have had a lot more impact.
It keeps your creatures alive and it benefits warren instigator a lot more.
It is also great vs. deck with plague/charm/and other -/- effects.
I really like the diversity in your sideboard. Although i miss the wear/tear or krosan grip. What are you gonna do about echantments?
Plague, nights of soul betrayal, omnisience, echantress etc...
Nic Fit is definitely a worse MU when you change your MD to run 4 Mountains instead of 12!
I don't really care about dealing with Enchantments. There aren't many E PLagues out there. You're not going to beat an Omniscience with Wear//Tear. K Grip isn't strong enough to warrant G splash. Enchantress runs Sterling Grove and lots of redundancy. Needle and Containment Priest beat Sneak Attack. Counterbalance doesn't matter. Thalia is really good at keeping enchantments from hitting the board in the first place.
Oh wow. I'm 2-10 over my last five tournaments. So, ummmm, do I just give up at this point? I'd like to hit up one more good sized tourney before I take a vacation for a few weeks and still wanna rock goblins. Part of that is because my most recent losses have been quite close, so I think I'm really just sucking on the ass end of variance right now. Still, this is an awfully large number of tourneys to fail so consistently in.
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Not kidding, but you should probably let someone else build a list for you.
At least for me that works like a wake-up call and helps me re-calibrating. Taking someone else's list might help you to shift your attention away from deck building to actually playing and enjoying the game.
If I am not mistaken, it was you who threw a Thalia list at me 3 years ago that I took to a tournament no questions asked.
@ Fourbirr: you have a PM
MountainCaverns, Lackey, Go.
If you have an apple and I have an apple and we exchanges our apples, we each have one apple. But if you have an idea and I have an idea and we exchange our ideas, we each have two ideas.
@GoboLord: got it, thanks.
Good day all.
I'm kinda new, but I'm considering getting into Legacy Goblins (mainly due to monetary restrictions...Legacy itself is a pricey format but I can't justify 300 bucks for one Underground Sea, so...). Plus, I love me some Aggro and after doing research, Goblins feels right up my alley.
Anyway, I was considering putting together a decklist, but I had some questions first.
1) Thalia...too good not to splash white for, IMO (though I can understand black). Mainboard or side? I see most putting her in side, but she feels almost like she belongs in main. As an aggro deck, we're all about tossing out tons of creatures fast and flooding the board. Thalia offers some protection in accordance with that strategy, taxing a lot of the most popular spells in the format to allow our guys to make it onto the board safely. I feel like putting her in the side straight off the bat is kinda counterproductive, so I'd like some opinions.
2) I see many people putting Stingscourger or Tuktuk Scrapper in the mainboard, whereas I feel they may be more useful sideboard options considering that they're more specialist creatures. Board them in when needed. Again, thoughts and opinions on this?
3) With Wear/Tear available, is Tuktuk Scrapper really that useful? Yes, you get a 2/2 body to go along with the artifact removal, but Wear does that for 2 mana cheaper, and it comes coupled with Tear to wreck pesky enchantments like Sneak Attack, Animate Dead or Counterbalance. It just feels like Tuktuk is so expensive for what he does.
4) Grafdiggers, Rest in Peace or Relic? I'm feeling Relic is the best because it replaces itself with a draw after nuking graveyards.
5) Sharpshooter-side or main, or is it meta dependent? Also, just so I'm 100% clear, if Sharpshooter is shooting 1/1s, he taps, does 1 damage to a creature, let's say. That creature dies, hits the graveyard. So that causes Sharpshooter to untap again, effectively allowing him to clear the entire field of 1/1s over and over again?
6) Is Pendelhaven really worth it? I'm stuck on it. On the one hand, its ability to allow our 1/1s push through past DRS and friends for that little bit extra could be really useful, and of course hitting for extra is always nice. That said, replacing a land to produce green when nothing else in the deck runs off of it sounds risky. It might enable Tin Street Hooligan, but he only becomes useful IF Pendel is out, since you need to spend a green mana to activate his artifact destruction. You can't fetch Pendel, so it may not show up at all during a game, which in turns won't allow Tin Street to come online, making 2 dead cards. And playing more than 1 Pendel isn't worth it to further push yourself off precious red mana (not to mention its legendary).
7) Warren Instigator-really sounds sweet, potentially putting out 2 goblins. Now none of the lists I'm seeing run Chrome Mox, like the primer suggests, which I'm guessing means its not worth running Mox. So basically, the earliest he's getting on the field is turn 2 and turn 3 to take a swing. Now, when he connects, we're getting the chance to potentially flood the field with some great goblins, but I worry that by T3 (or even T2) that it may be a bit late for him. T3 and our opponents will probably have 3 mana out, making him a nice target for Daze (if there's no Cavern out), Abrupt Decay, Lightning Bolt, Swords to Plowshares, etc. Him being so deadly almost makes him necessary to answer, but unlike Lackey being a T1 play and only 1 red mana, he's slower and thus allows the opponent more time to set up a board state where they can answer him. I'd love some opinions on him.
Thanks in advance.
All of your questions are meta/personal preference dependent. They're very specific so I'm guessing you've realized this. On Thalia if you are ok with hoping to dodge combo they're better in the board. If you're expecting to face multiple combo decks in a 5-8 round tourney you shouldn't be playing goblins (assuming you're trying to optimize your win odds). You need an anti artifact goblin you can matron for. Ringleader (the best card in the deck) can't grab it either. I like 2 instigator in a 4 waste, 2 port, 2+ chieftain build.
Stingscourger is a good maindeck card when you're playing an aggressive list that can benefit from Stingscourger's ability to remove a blocker for a turn, or when there is a lot of Show and Tell type decks in your meta.
Scrapper maindeck is good if you expect a lot of artifacts that you need to deal with, particularly equipments out of Death & Taxes. It becomes less necessary if you can reliably deal with these some other way, i.e kill all their creatures or use Skirk Prospector to stop Jitte, outgrind a Batterskull, preferably with Krenko.
Tuktuk Scrapper is a goblin, and can thus be found with Matron/Ringleader. One copy of Scrapper in your deck essentially gives you five cards that answer the first artifact.
It depends. I wrote a short post on this earlier. I like Relic because it's good against Tarmogoyf, but rarely want to bring in more than two or three versus those decks, which is why I usually play a split with Surgical Extraction, Grafdiggeer's Cage, or both. It depends on your metagame predictions and what your general plans and sideboard plans for each matchup are.
I'm a big proponent of Goblin Sharpshooter, and want access to two copies in my 75. Also, yes, that's how it works.
It depends. It's great against Deathrite Shaman, Stoneforge Mystic, Umezawa's Jitte, and Punishing Fire. If you expect to see a lot of those cards you should strongly consider it. It obviously also gets better if you can utilize the green mana for something like TSH. One of the most important things to consider when deciding whether or not to run Pendelhaven is what your plan for BGx decks are. If you plan on boarding out lackeys to grind them out Pendelhaven gets a lot worse. If you prefer to try to steal a win with a turn one lackey on the other hand, it's often an essential part of that plan, as it helps attack through Deathrite Shaman.
R/B Goblins
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Thanks for the replies so far, I'll take these into consideration when I formulate a practice deck.
So far from my tinkering, I'm loving 6 haste lords and 2 Krenkos. It just floods the board, even nastier if you have a Chieftain.
I brewed up another little list while I was supposed to be working today. I was thinking about going card for card against other decks in the format and how to avoid playing into the format's strengths.
4 Vial
4 Lackey
4 Matron
4 Ringleader
Obvi
4 Gempalm
3 Tarfire
1 Pyrokinesis
4 MWM
These will chump block the fatties and kill the x/2s for days. That's the majority of the format.
1 Skirk
1 Stingscourger
1 Tuktuk
For when you just need an answer to Fatties and Jitte... Skirk could also be a 2nd Stingscourger
3 Chieftain
1 Krenko
Cheiftain makes your MWM horde dangerous and makes Krenko just end the game. There are so many goblins that are really good in niche rolls, but it seems that our gameplan these days is to control what we can, and overwhelm what we cannot control. Chieftain and Krenko make that happen.
3 Chalice of the Void
Protection for your Cheiftains and Krenko, seriously disrupts the rest of the format more than it hampers you. Mostly it's a better 2-drop than Piledriver and doesn't open you to G1 variance in manabase like a MD Thalia would.
12 Mountain
4 Waste
2 Port
4 Cavern
So that's 30 Goblins, 13 removal/disruption. I think this would be very difficult for the fair decks of the format, would have a lot more game against combo , and would be resilient and consistent. I'd welcome some thoughts on this. I recall a 3 Chalice deck doing well in a big tourney in Japan a while back, and I think it could still be successful today.
Guys, I've been playing this on Cockatrice and doing surprisingly well. Give it a spin:
Lands [21]
4 Wasteland
4 Cavern of Souls
2 Rishadan Port
4 Bloodstained Mire
2 Wooded Foothills
3 Mountain
2 Badlands
Creatures [28]
4 Goblin Lackey
4 Goblin Matron
4 Goblin Ringleader
3 Goblin Warchief
3 Goblin Chieftain
3 Warren Instigator
3 Goblin Piledriver
1 Krenko, Mob Boss
1 Wort, Boggart Auntie
1 Gempalm Incinerator
1 Stingscourger
Spells [11]
4 AEther Vial
2 Chrome Mox
3 Fatal Push
1 Warren Weirding
1 Tarfire
Sideboard [15]
4 Leyline of the Void
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Pyrokinesis
2 Blood Moon
2 Pithing Needle
1 Slaughter Games
Pretty much in your face RB Goblins. Of course it's pretty bad against Combo.
Let your Dredge 6 be: Narco, Narco, Narco, Bridge, Bridge, Dread Return
You van upgrade your combo matchup with earwig squads. Those guys are beast and something you can prowl Them turn 2. I like Them more than slaughter games because you can tutor them.
I think piledrivers are strange without MwM. What is your gameplan?
Do you Have any match data?
I don't like Mogg War Marshal, this deck should be the aggressor. Chumpblocking isn't good enough imo. Piledrivers are fine with 2+ Goblins attacking, they're 80% of time attacking for 5.
Good idea on Earwig Squad, I'll test that.
I haven't tracked it down, but as far as I remember:
Miracles: 3W 1L
Team America: 2W 0L
Eldrazi: 1W 2L
Show and Tell: 1W 3L
ANT: 0W 2L
Grixis Delver: 2W 0L
RG Lands: 1W 0L
Death and Taxes: 1W 2L (fuck Mother of Runes D:)
RB Reanimator: 2W 0L (they can't beat Leyline of the Void)
Let your Dredge 6 be: Narco, Narco, Narco, Bridge, Bridge, Dread Return
I've been thinking of the relative merit to running Chalice in the Maindeck and I wanted to run something past you all. Chalice @1 seems like the best 2-drop play we could have right now. For a few reasons. ....
1st, your 1-drop should already be played on T1, so a T2 Chalice shouldn't be too disruptive.
2nd, we have really good removal spells in the 2-drop spot, but our 1-drop removal is weak. Tarfire is pretty bad late game and is terrible against combo and control MUs where running a Chalice would be much stronger. Whereas our 2-drops (Stingscourger, Gempalm, Warren Weirding, Sparksmith) have a much higher power level than Tarfire.
3rd, if you can resolve a Chalice @1 you've essentially cut off your opponent's ability to cast removal spells. If you're playing a deck with a high concentration of removal targets (Lords, Piledrivers, Krenkos, etc) they will be a bigger threat.
4th, (and most obvious) we can play a game with 8 1-drops. The rest of the format plays 20.
I put together a list that's heavy on 2-drop removal, has many must-answer creatures, and still keeps the goblin count at 30...
4 Vial
4 Lackey
4 Piledriver
2 Sparksmith
2 Warren Weirding
2 Stingscourger
2 Gempalm
2 Warchief
2 Chieftain
4 Matron
4 Ringleader
2 Krenko
3 Chalice
1 Pyrokinesis
22 lands
One of the goblins players in London runs chalice main right now. Merfolk does it too. No chrome Mox?
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