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Thread: [Deck] Vial Goblins

  1. #1001

    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    Thank you so much that. Iíve been pushing myself towards dropping him lol. I think the rise in delver decks having bolts, push, k-command and all the other you mentioned + 4C control and decks like lands that have P-fire make him so hard to use efficiently. Iíve been considering putting a second EWS in due to it body and ability. But Iím so iffy on that. Krenko always seems to eat removal as soon as he lands but I guess that lets my other guys live.

    Iím going to the Colombus event Saturday and Iíll be posting my list tomorrow togetnlast minute opinions and advice. Any of you guys going to be there?

    Edit: might be coming up with a list thatís just solid 4ofs to be Grindy and go wide. But Iím not too sure on that. I feel like going wide will consistently pull through. But against decks like elves and combo Iím not even sure if we can compete.

  2. #1002

    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    In my opinion Kiki Jiki is the best 5. It's almost always a backbreaking swing in terms of both card advantage and tempo.
    At the moment I don't play Krenko or Siege Gang. I agree that Siege Gang is generally the best thing to drop off an unblocked lackey on turn 2 but in my opinion this doesn't happen consistently enough to be worth a slot on a 5 cmc card. As I have said in the past Lightning Crafter does most of the things that makes Siege Gang good but is 1 mana cheaper. (It doesn't boost Piledriver but that card sucks regardless imo).

    Krenko is generally good, but I am off it at the moment because my list has only a very small number of haste lords in it. I could still see myself adding it back in despite this, but without being able to consistently have haste 4 mana is a lot to spend on a creature that can die to basically every 1-mana removal without doing anything.

  3. #1003

    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    Imo krenko and sgc are both amazing if you're running 3+ chieftain. If not I get Kiki.

  4. #1004

    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    I havenít tested with crafter yet. It is interesting to me. And kiki makes it great. Not sure if Iím on board with dropping both krenko and siege gang yet. I have to pull the trigger before the side events on Saturday lol

  5. #1005

    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    we will soon disappear from the "last 2 month metagame" on mtgtop8
    last goblin deck top 8ied the 18th of november


    i'm playing a Rwg build atm, the choice is mainly for Rip since it's the strongest GY card available in my opinion, and gy is very important for many decks in the curren meta. green is for tin street, since tutorable shattering for 2 mana feels pretty good, also giving access to library.

    think i'll cut karakas for another mountain adding mana stability. probabily it will be right to have 4 mountains since 4 mana is where we want to be without fearing wasteland.
    i'd like to add a prospector and maybe the 3rd gempalm somewhere. anyway i trimmed my beloved sgc for krenko, lowering down the curve and enjoying my vial @4. redcap shine against annoying planeswalker such as jace and liliana. i also like a lot the sparksmith since it give us a great advantage if activated 2+ times. rabblemaster is under evaluation: sometimes great sometimes suicidal, i'll continue to test him atm.

    the sideboard has 7 combodedicated slot (thalia, chalice, rip), wear-tear for enchantments and additional shattering effects, moon for marit-lage decks+ 4c decks, and library vs control

    i'm feeling good about the deck. i'm 11-10 in round atm, few games lost by my poor decisions, few lost by the deck (mana and mulligan)

    Creature (29)
    4x Goblin Ringleader
    4x Goblin Warchief
    4x Goblin Lackey
    4x Goblin Matron
    3x Mogg War Marshal
    1x Goblin Piledriver
    1x Goblin Rabblemaster
    1x Goblin Sharpshooter
    1x Krenko, Mob Boss
    1x Goblin Chieftain
    1x Murderous Redcap
    1x Sparksmith
    1x Tin Street Hooligan

    2x Gempalm Incinerator

    Land (23)
    6x r fetch
    4x Cavern of Souls
    4x Wasteland
    3x Rishadan Port
    2 x Mountain
    2x Plateau
    1x Karakas
    1x Taiga

    Instant (4)
    4x Tarfire

    sideboard

    3x chalice
    2x thalia
    2x moon
    2x pyrok
    2x rip
    2x wear tear
    1x sylvan library
    1x stingscourger

  6. #1006

    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    Went top8 in a small local tournament near my city (20 players), then split the prize.
    My list:

    Core (lackey vial matron ring warchief gempalm tarfire)
    1 sting
    1 siege gang
    1 kiki
    1 sharpshooter
    2 prospectors
    2 mogg war marshall
    1 chieftain

    Lands
    4 ports
    4 waste
    4 caverns
    4 ferches
    7 mountains

    sideboard:

    3 surgical extraction
    2 blood moon
    2 active volcano
    3 pyrokinesis
    3 thorn of amethyst
    1 scrapper
    1 mogg salvage

    Deck performed really well, hope it will help (:

  7. #1007

    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by Marlock96 View Post
    Went top8 in a small local tournament near my city (20 players), then split the prize.
    Deck performed really well, hope it will help (:
    Can I ask what your actual matchup/record was
    4 Gempalm 0 Tarfire seems insane to me

  8. #1008

    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by Marlock96 View Post

    Core (lackey vial matron ring warchief gempalm tarfire)


    There it is

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  9. #1009

    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by menph View Post
    There it is

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    Oh whoops.
    Still interested in a matchup report though.

  10. #1010

    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    yup sure,

    Grixis Delver 2-0

    G1 He played a classic list; won G1 porting lands, killing some stuff, blocking frogs etc..
    G2 I knew he would have sided out counters so T1 prospector T2 blood moon, ggs

    Storm 2-1

    G1 lost on T2, rit rit led tutor etc..
    G2 won on the spot with double thorn of amethyst
    G3 won with active volcano, opponent didn't notice the card, so I bounced an Island in response to infernal tutor/LED; he searched for an island, gg

    4c Czech Pile 0-2

    G1 mulled to 5, then he tourached me, lost.
    G2 nothing special here, just lost by kolagan and other stuff

    Goblin (mirror) 2-0

    G1,G2 he was a new player, he was playing this deck as an aggro deck

    Dredge 2-1

    G1 lost to dredge. (bridges from below, multiple things going on, elesh, gg)
    G2 won with surgical on stikweed imp
    G3 awesome game: He starts with looting then pass, I play lackey, game goes on, he takes damage and finally cast elesh from graveyard. He's at 1 life, I have nothing on the field... Port his city of brass and steal the game lol

  11. #1011

    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by Marlock96 View Post
    yup sure,

    Grixis Delver 2-0

    G1 He played a classic list; won G1 porting lands, killing some stuff, blocking frogs etc..
    G2 I knew he would have sided out counters so T1 prospector T2 blood moon, ggs

    Storm 2-1

    G1 lost on T2, rit rit led tutor etc..
    G2 won on the spot with double thorn of amethyst
    G3 won with active volcano, opponent didn't notice the card, so I bounced an Island in response to infernal tutor/LED; he searched for an island, gg

    4c Czech Pile 0-2

    G1 mulled to 5, then he tourached me, lost.
    G2 nothing special here, just lost by kolagan and other stuff

    Goblin (mirror) 2-0

    G1,G2 he was a new player, he was playing this deck as an aggro deck

    Dredge 2-1

    G1 lost to dredge. (bridges from below, multiple things going on, elesh, gg)
    G2 won with surgical on stikweed imp
    G3 awesome game: He starts with looting then pass, I play lackey, game goes on, he takes damage and finally cast elesh from graveyard. He's at 1 life, I have nothing on the field... Port his city of brass and steal the game lol
    Porting city of brass for the win: fantastic

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  12. #1012

    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by Marlock96 View Post
    yup sure,

    Grixis Delver 2-0

    G1 He played a classic list; won G1 porting lands, killing some stuff, blocking frogs etc..
    G2 I knew he would have sided out counters so T1 prospector T2 blood moon, ggs

    Storm 2-1

    G1 lost on T2, rit rit led tutor etc..
    G2 won on the spot with double thorn of amethyst
    G3 won with active volcano, opponent didn't notice the card, so I bounced an Island in response to infernal tutor/LED; he searched for an island, gg

    4c Czech Pile 0-2

    G1 mulled to 5, then he tourached me, lost.
    G2 nothing special here, just lost by kolagan and other stuff

    Goblin (mirror) 2-0

    G1,G2 he was a new player, he was playing this deck as an aggro deck

    Dredge 2-1

    G1 lost to dredge. (bridges from below, multiple things going on, elesh, gg)
    G2 won with surgical on stikweed imp
    G3 awesome game: He starts with looting then pass, I play lackey, game goes on, he takes damage and finally cast elesh from graveyard. He's at 1 life, I have nothing on the field... Port his city of brass and steal the game lol
    The active volcano tech in response to a tutor is absolutely hilarious, as is the port city of brass victory. Well done

  13. #1013

    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    Hey Everyone,

    3-0-1 last night at a weekly. Splitting with the other 3-0 person at the end of the night. Small wins, but a good run. Ran the same list I've posted earlier in the thread.

    First round
    2-0 Vs Miracles

    Typical miracles matchup, played conservatively swinging in for 2-5 damage and making sure my Matrons and Ringleaders couldn't be countered. Lightning Crafter championing Matron kept the ringleaders coming after a terminus and killed helped kill a couple angels between the 3 games.

    Round 2
    2-1 Vs ANT
    G1 got blown out, lackey didn't even get to attack.
    G2 T1 Lackey into T2 Piledriver lackey putting in Kiki Jiki, T3 kill copying Piledriver on end step and on my turn swinging in for lethal
    G3 Slower hand for both of us, I hit him down to 10 from top decking a Chieftain with my two 1/1 tokens on the board. He had to go for ad nauseum at 10 life and the first flip was the 5 drop tutor. He didn't get there.

    Round 3
    2-1 Vs BR Reanimator

    G1 kept a fire hand of 1 cavern, lackey, sting, warchief, sharpshooter, tarfire, matron. Top decked a port. Sharshootered my own lackey to avoid the life gain. He thoughtseized my stingscourger on his T1 making his exume dead.
    G2 Got run over
    G3 Mulled to 6, with lackey and grafdigger's cage. Jam the cage, he told me he had the T1 grissel, drew the port, played the lackey, drew another graf that got discarded, the damage added up quickely with a piledriver taking the win.

    Round 4
    Split for the credit at the store. Sweet 17 dollars. Asked the guy what he was on and he said TES. Whew.

    I had been off the deck for a few weeks since people started brining in targeted hate since our master's event that had two goblins players with 3-4 expected by most contenders. So I brought it back tonight for an "undefeated" run. Love my little green men.

  14. #1014

    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    Played my Rb list to a top-4 split at a 27 man win-a-tabernacle event this weekend.

    R1- 2-1 Win vs. Sneak+Show
    Both games I won were on the play. G1 I soul-crushed with lackey into Kiki into settler-Kiki combo to destroy all of his lands. G2 he sneaked me. Game 3 I had enough discard to keep him off of comboing, and eventually clean up with piledriver.

    R2 - 2-0 Win vs. D+T
    He mulled both games, and neither was remotely close. G1 I pyrokinesised all of his guys, and G2 my lackey put in Tuk-Tuk destroying vial, and then wasted his only land.

    R3- 2-0 Win vs. Punishing Grixis Thieves
    This was close, especially G1. He assembled double-grove p-fire, but didn't have much else going on. I managed to kill his Dack Fayden with hasty guys, and the grove lifegain from killing them kept me fairly healthy. I chained Ringleaders and got enough tarfires off of them to kill his deathrites and keep his clock slow. Eventually I found a matron with about 20 cards left in library, tutored up settler, and drew a wasteland for the other grove the next turn. SGC tokens helped me overwhelm remaining removal.
    Post-board I got a hit in with prospector and earwig squadded him. He'd already drawn a p-fire though :(. Didn't see any sweepers in the deck, assumed they were in hand. Wasted his only grove, and went to value-town. He managed to actually ult a Dack this game, but it didn't do much, as all his spells kill my dudes. Dack wasn't very effective as he didn't have big haymakers to cycle to (no sweepers!). Cast all four Ringleaders and ground him out again.

    R4+5 Double Draw into T8 (ANT, Grixis Delver)

    T8 2nd seed. played same Sneak+Show opponent as R1. open decklists, which was interesting.
    G1 I didn't have a great draw, but he didn't either. I lackeyed in a bunch of textless 2/2s and beat down while porting/wasting. Win.
    G2 I therapy Sneak attack, he draws it off the top and plays it T2. Loss
    G3 He forces my Therapy T1. He wishes for show and tell, shows in emmy. I show in matron, find wierding, kill emmy. I thoughtsieze him, leave him with 2 emmy nothing else. He rips show and tell, shows emmy, I show matron. Find my sideboard stingscourger and bounce emmy, flashback therapy with it to leave him empty handed. Surgical the emmys just in case. Win.

    T4 we split prize in cash.

    I really like my list. My finishers/tech are 1 Krenko, 1 SGC, 1 Kiki, 1 Settler, 1 Sharpshooter, 1 Wierding MD. I also only play 1 piledriver. I know there's a lot of disagreement about that, I like being able to tutor him up, but rarely miss him. My sideboard is heavy into discard (3 Therapy, 3 Thoughtsieze). I was playing a sparksmith this week instead of a rabblemaster in my flex slot, but i never cast it, so no thoughts on that. I also play 2 MD pyrokinesis, which I think is the right place for it. I like being super heavy anti-creature g1, and usually side in 11-12 cards in combo matchups to get rid of the removal. (3 tarfire, 2 gempalm, 1 wierding, 2 pyrokinesis, 1 sharpshooter, 1 sparksmith, 1 tuktuk). This give us a big edge G1 against creature decks, and lets us try to steal postboard by having all of our sideboard as pretty dedicated combo hate, with only an extra tuktuk and engineered plague as the big fairdeck sideboard cards.

    Thoughts?

  15. #1015
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    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    Wow, that are pretty aggressive ways to deal with S&T. Poor D&T opponent :-)

    Actually, I share the same boarding plan against combo at the exception that against TES, S&T or BR Reanimator, I like to keep TSH/Tuktuk for their Petal, Chrome Mox, or LED.

    Your removal suit seems quite overloaded and super ready, but I wonder what did you cut to have that much space. Could you edit your post and add your list and sideboard?

  16. #1016

    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by Fourbirr View Post
    Could you edit your post and add your list and sideboard?
    He indirectly gives you like 95% of it

    23 Land
    4 Vial

    4 Lackey
    4 Matron
    4 Ringleader
    1 Krenko
    1 SGC
    1 Kiki
    1 Settler
    1 Sharpshooter
    1 Piledriver
    1 Sparksmith
    1 Scrapper
    1 Skirk Prospector
    2 Gempalm

    2 Pyrokinesis
    3 Tarfire
    1 Weirding

    4 Warchief (Assumed)

    SB
    3 Thoughtseize
    3 Therapy
    1 Scrapper
    1 Stingscourger
    X Surgical
    X Eng Plague
    X Earwig Squad

    Quote Originally Posted by egoblinsw View Post
    I like being super heavy anti-creature g1, and usually side in 11-12 cards in combo matchups to get rid of the removal. (3 tarfire, 2 gempalm, 1 wierding, 2 pyrokinesis, 1 sharpshooter, 1 sparksmith, 1 tuktuk). This give us a big edge G1 against creature decks, and lets us try to steal postboard by having all of our sideboard as pretty dedicated combo hate, with only an extra tuktuk and engineered plague as the big fairdeck sideboard cards.
    I agree with this philosophy 100%, even if there are some individual card choices I'm not sure about.
    Last edited by kombatkiwi; 01-24-2018 at 12:58 AM.

  17. #1017
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    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    Thank you

  18. #1018
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    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    Hi dear goblin scientists,

    By refining my deck list, I realized that the mana curve could be biased by some cards. Actually, the algorithm does not take care of how we play the deck, but only count how much mana is needed to cast a spell. In my opinion, it's wrong. Let's consider these cards:

    Pyrokinesis: most of the time, it's not cast for 6 manas, but with its alternative cost. So, it should be considered like a two or three 0 CMC removal in our lists.
    Gempalm Incinerator: his main purpose is to be used as a removal. We rarely cast/vial him to attack or block. He should be considered as a 2 CMC spell.
    Mindbreak Trap: Costs 0, not 4
    Surgical Extraction: Costs 0, not 1, except for those splashing black

    So, I adapted my list with 0 and 2 CMC spells for the above mentioned cards, and the curve seems quite alright:

    2.14 avg. pre-board
    1.81 avg. post-board against combo (-3 Ringleaders, -2 Tarfire, -2 Gempalm, -1 Stingscourger; +3 Thalia, +3 Surgical, +2 Mindbreak Trap)

    Thoughts?
    Last edited by Fourbirr; 01-24-2018 at 01:54 PM.

  19. #1019

    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by Fourbirr View Post
    Hi dear goblin scientists,

    By refining my deck list, I realized that the mana curve could be biased by some cards. Actually, the algorithm does not take care of how we play the deck, but only count how much mana is needed to cast a spell. In my opinion, it's wrong. Let's consider these cards:

    Pyrokinesis: most of the time, it's not cast for 6 manas, but with its alternative cost. So, it should be considered like a 2 to 3 zero mana removal in our lists.
    Gempalm Incinerator: his main purpose is to be used as a removal. We rarely cast/vial him to attack or block. He should be considered as a 2 CMC spell.
    Mindbreak Trap: Costs 0, not 4
    Surgical Extraction: Costs 0, not 1, except for those splashing black

    So, I adpated my list with 0 and 2 CMC spells for the above mentioned cards, and the curve seems quite alright:

    2.14 avg. pre-board
    1.81 avg. post-board against combo (-3 Ringleaders, -2 Tarfire, -2 Gempalm, -1 Stingscourger; +3 Thalia, +3 Surgical, +2 Mindbreak Trap)

    Thoughts?
    100% agree
    I also consider Pyro a 0-drop and gempalm a 2-drop since we play them for this cost almost every time. The same for other spells with alternative cost such as earwig squad

    I do not check my curve stats from quite a long time, but I think I'll do it sooner or later in order to check if my efforts to trim it down are reflected also by numbers

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  20. #1020
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    Re: [Deck] Vial Goblins

    Quote Originally Posted by menph View Post
    100% agree
    I also consider Pyro a 0-drop and gempalm a 2-drop since we play them for this cost almost every time.
    That is specifically what I wrote.

    Quote Originally Posted by menph View Post
    The same for other spells with alternative cost such as earwig squad
    Sure

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