A rise in Lands.Originally Posted by H
It is better to ask and look stupid then keep your mouth shut and remain so.
I hope your afterlife is filled with eternal torment.
Fuck. Which one of my quotes do I drop for this?
I'm not sure lands is actually that good vs this deck. I've been playing the 4c blade deck which is very close to Reids list, but with a much worse manabase and I've found lands to be a very positive matchup. Between 8 dorks, TNN, Leovold and Jace it's easy to outgrind them. Just have to have an answer to Marit Lage (I have StP, but this could play Diabolic Edict).
it probably wouldn't be fair to not give whoever this is some credit, it came out before leovold came out. maybe this person can give some opinions on how the deck has played out? it was also back in june, does this person even play this list anymore?
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/435592#paper
-rob
It is better to ask and look stupid then keep your mouth shut and remain so.
I hope your afterlife is filled with eternal torment.
Fuck. Which one of my quotes do I drop for this?
Going by Reid's deck, while Leo is good if you can land it against Lands (more so postboard I would imagine), there is no maindeck way of reliably dealing with Marit Lage or interacting with Loam.
Lands has traditionally done very well against decks with greedy manabases and small dudes, which fits this pretty well
Shouldn't we discuss about this deck in the Team America midrange/control thread ?
1. I hated this name. The name itself says very little about the deck, just as I hate tin-fin, nic-fit.
2. The definition of T.A. varies from person to person; based on what I understand, it's a tempo deck that usually has 4 Delvers.
3. This deck, in which Reid won with, has 8 Mana accelerators and 0 Delvers. In fact, the deck feels like it's trying to land turn-3 Jace or turn-2 threat, sometimes with Daze/FoW backup. I don't feel it's a tempo deck at all, it appears to be more Shardless than tempo.
Now, without Terminus or any board wipes like Deed, I don't understand how it can stay alive long enough to not get overwhelmed by Thalia and her pals, or Eldrazi, or any Vial decks for that matter.
The mentioned thread is for non-delver BUG midrange decks, where people have, for the last few weeks, been discussing (among other things) DRS + Hierarch + TNN + Leo decks like this one.
Yeah, the idea of Hierarchs and TNN in BUG hasn't just come out of the blue. Especially since Leovold has been printed people have been working on it.
I have been working on this style of deck for a while and played it at the GP but scrubbed a bit. However, I did beat lands, and my deck had 0 basics. You just have to be smart about what to counter and keep your deathrites alive. If they don't resolve a loam, and especially if they don't dredge one, you are in really good shape. I also conceded early in game 1 just to get my board cards in on the play.
I played a Far/Away maindeck anticipating reanimator decks, Marit Lage decks, and TNN decks. I think the card has some merit, especially when Fatal Push comes out to clear the path so that the edict is better.
It seems Reid's conclusion was that TNN is so hard to answer that you might as well speed it out there and make them beat it. Hierarchs are good for exalted triggers on the TNNs when you don't have equips.
Unlike most BUG or UBx decks the black is really a splash here -- just for a couple multicolored cards and removal. No Hymns or Lilis that require a heavy black commitment. That's a big change from a deck like Shardless or other midrange TA builds. It makes it a little less splashy, but it gets the job done (clearly). Maybe this will be the deck to get TNN banned; until then, get your Llawan's ready.
Shouldn't the deck be called BUG Stoneblade?
It's literally BUG with a Stoneforge package.
You could also call it Dark Bant like Reid did as it mostly resembles the Bant Deck he played several years ago with Sam Black with only adding Abrupt Decays and 2 Leovolds to the main.
The name Noble BUG fails to recognize Stoneforge as its powerful play.
No, it shouldn't. There's no Stoneforge Mystic in Reid's deck, let alone an equipment package. He has one Jitte in the main and one in the board.
Dark Bant is a much better name, since the deck plays out like earlier Bant decks. Here's Sam Black's list from GP D.C. in 2013, for comparison: http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=6049&d=235017
There are 0 white cards, so this is no less a fallacy than calling it BUG Stoneblade. I picked Noble BUG to reflect on Vintage's Noble Fish. Reid had called it Sultai True Name, which also doesn't fully describe the deck to me since Leovold is a major component of the strategy as well. I can change it to the name Reid picked; I think that would be the most appropriate change.
I love it when people do their research.
I still don't see this deck as being unique enough to warrant it's own thread when it nearly all the elements of the deck have shown up in decks in the Team America (Midrange/Control Thread) at one time or another, if not together.
"The Ancients teach us that if we can but last, we shall prevail."
—Kaysa, Elder Druid of the Juniper Order
Totally agree. It's a wonderful and powerful deck with lots of design space, just not a brand new idea. People have been talking about Hierarch in BUG with TNNs and Leovold for a while now.
Time for a new primer me thinks.
It is better to ask and look stupid then keep your mouth shut and remain so.
I hope your afterlife is filled with eternal torment.
Fuck. Which one of my quotes do I drop for this?
While I agree, I think the coming of Fatal Push means we should probably wait to see it's effect, at least a little.
Perhaps I can try working on one in the mean time, if I get a little time.
"The Ancients teach us that if we can but last, we shall prevail."
—Kaysa, Elder Druid of the Juniper Order
He had 2 Submerge in the SB.
I also have no problem writing up a new primer for it. I definitely have the time but I would love help. I can start mocking something up since the old primer is pretty outdated anyways.
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