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Thread: [Primer] Nic Fit

  1. #3821
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    [Primer] Nic Fit

    Hello everybody!

    Aftef I came back from Gent I finally sat down to write a bit about the tournament where I finished 7-2 with my Junk Nic Fit. It was a great tournament and I am happy I didnt play Miracles (although they are a better deck) and decided to play something thats just more fun and plus points are when you can surprise your opponent.

    3explorer
    1satyr wayfinder
    1ooze
    1teeg
    1knight of autumn
    2tracker
    1witness
    2stoneforge mystic
    1meren
    1thragtusk
    4zenith
    18

    4therapy
    4trophy
    3stp
    1deluge
    2deed
    3library
    1batterskull
    1kaya, ghost assassin
    1nissa, vital force
    20
    38

    4verdant catacombs
    4windswept heath
    1marsh flats
    4forest
    2swamp
    1plains
    2bayou
    1scrubland
    1savannah
    1karakas
    1phyrexian tower
    22lands
    60maindeck

    Sideboard:
    3seize
    3surgical
    3choke
    2containment
    2canonist
    1deluge
    1pithing needle
    15 side

    With help of my friend Marcus I changed a few things and added Stoneforge Mystic as a nice T2 play+helps our survival. As late game we go over any other deck - lets get there. So I cut Rhinos I had there before as they were unimpressive and it only helps against delver for one turn. In this case Paths were not justifiable and we can finally kill opponents creatures t1 without regret with stp.
    I think we want 4 Trophy as we are a control deck and why not to play card that kills almost everything? I think we want at least 1 deed 1 toxic. The split makes it much harder to play around then playing just one.
    I think deck like this competing against jace wants walkers. I chose two that are the strongest I think. Nissa is obvious. Against control decks you plus her, protect her and dont be greedy and just minus her. Miracles, Grixis just cant compete with that emblem. Kaya is more tricky but she can help you against control with making the card difference 2. She can blink Thragtusk or Witness. Discard last cards of a combo player, gain life against burn. I really like her.
    I also think playing less then 3 Libraires is not right. The card is bonkers. We have a lot of lifegain which means free cards. It ensures we draw the right answers against aggro and that we can draw extra against control. We will prevent us from drawing basics or equiupment when we dont want to. And after board agianst mircles you go discard, library, choke, walker... They will have a hard time!
    A weird card is Satyr Wayfinder. I wanted something instead of the 4th Veteran. Often I was on 3 mana with double zenith and had not other lands, didnt want to go Veteran or I couldnt and ooze without open mana or teeg blocking your zenith is not amazing. I am thinking of Wall of Blossoms, Sakura but the appeal of Wayfinder is that it gets me a landrop, can sac it to therpay wihtout regret and can help me to find therapy, milling unwanted top from library. creates graveyard for witness and meren. let me know what do you think.
    Side is straingforward - 3 Thoughtseize, 3 Surgical, 2 canonist against combo. 2 priest againt sneak mainly. 3 choke against the menace (miracles) - they almost cant with in it on table. 1 needle was a great addition against mainly jace, stage, inkmoth and so on.

    R1 bye
    R2 Stoneblade - you just loose g1 most of the time. After board and missing landrop I came back with needle - fow, trophy - fow, trophy! He is beating me with Clique and Skull. In the last round I blindtherapy his last card - Caster and carried away I Therapy Skull (I think I can flashback therapy if he returns it but he has an active mystic and my skull cant block...) Stupid! 0-2
    R3 Deathshadow - he dosent really know what is he doing but on the draw I am facing t2 wright+shadow... G2 is very similar. I think its insane matchup for us but I never saw zenith or veteran... 0-2
    R4 junk with confis. We go much bigger in one game he threw it all at me and I had not sweeper. He last card was stp for my Tracker which could turn it around (I had a lot of mana and 4 clues) The other two games I did what I am supposed to. 2-1
    R5 elvers. G1 I stabilized with Teeg, Tracker, Therapies. I Therapied him at some point - only Order with 5 elves in play. I diddnt flashback - I have time. He ripped Karakas off the top! and killed me. Amazing. Next games I was deluging, containing him and got to two victories. 2-1
    R6 UR tempo. Not the best player but we had great games. He almost got me in two postbardgames with Winter Orb but I had Deed or Autumn ready. Last game he was attacking with TNN against my six life with two bolts on top. I deede my own board put him with Tusk to 3 so next turn he had to bolt him attacking instead of my face. Meren sealed it. 2-1
    R7 Czech Pile. I got beaten but he didnt want to play so he scooped. first game I got tripple hymned plus fow my library. After board I think its very good but his only postboard goyf got there as I couldn get blockers.
    R8 Miracles. Lost game one as usual. G2 he mulled to 5 keeping no lander. G3 I was in contorl whole game as I htoughtseized him and he had terminuses, stp, no cantrip, balance was missing and I could play around what he had. Nissa ultimate made me sometimes discard to handsize eot twice.
    R9 Final game for money! (I missed money by two places) Against UB tempo. I won first he won second. In the final I had witness to bring back stp. Chump angler. Meren bring back witness, he edicts it. play witness bring back meren play it. I was drawing 5 lands in six turns but still managed to stabilize against his two anglers, delver, blossom with this combo+withness brought back Batterskull so I could gain some life back. Karakas looking after Meren so doesent get Pushed unfortunately. Epic game!

    I really like the list. It bricks lesss then any other list that I ever played and you are not afraid of any matchup. I would like to know what do you think about it!
    Last edited by Koplinchen; 05-02-2019 at 12:39 PM.

  2. #3822

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Nissa who shakes the world will end up in nicfit, pretty sure about that.

  3. #3823
    The crazy nastyass honey badger

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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    I'm not sure that it will. The deck doesn't need the extra mana anymore when she hits the field and Nissa Vital Force is a better answer to Jace.
    Quote Originally Posted by cavalrywolfpack View Post
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  4. #3824
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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by Echelon View Post
    I'm not sure that it will. The deck doesn't need the extra mana anymore when she hits the field and Nissa Vital Force is a better answer to Jace.
    Agreed. Nissa, Vital Force is the best Nissa for us. All abilities are very relevant. Extra mana of the new Nissa is irrelevant, its + ability doesent kill jace.


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  5. #3825

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Nissa Who Shakes the World is much more impactful than Nissa Vital Force if you ask me. Its +1 ability is permanent, unlike Vital Force which lasts for one turn. This means you can't build up an army of 3/3's. It also means that it is a perfectly fine answer to Jace. If you untap with Nissa and you have a Green Sun Zenith in hand, you can directly put any card in play (Progenitus, Woodfall Primus, Terastodont, or whatever other bomb you can think of in green.). If that fails, you still have the ultimate, which spits out all forests/duals from your deck and makes your lands indestructible. Not just the ones you animate, but also dryad arbor. It is a lot more impactful than Vital Force's draw. Drawing into a land card with Vital Force is a lot worst than having put all the lands into play and just drawing the relevant spell in the first place..

  6. #3826
    The crazy nastyass honey badger

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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    I'm afraid the Nic Fit Discord disagrees bud. New Nissa got received with a resounding "Meh"
    Quote Originally Posted by cavalrywolfpack View Post
    DAMMIT ECHELON

  7. #3827

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by Echelon View Post
    I'm afraid the Nic Fit Discord disagrees bud. New Nissa got received with a resounding "Meh"
    Well, the. NIcfit community is generally not representative for competitive players anyway, so ill take that with a grain of salt.

  8. #3828
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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    You do you man. Have fun on that high horse of yours.
    Quote Originally Posted by cavalrywolfpack View Post
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  9. #3829
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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    I am not a fan of Nissa, Who Shakes the World. She does nothing with basic swamps or your B/x duals in whatever variant you play. Her 3/3 lands don't trade favorably with most of the format's threats like Batterskull, True-Name, Gurmag Angler, making them piss poor blockers and not a threat until 3-4 turns in which you've made your manabase open to removal. Nissa Vital Force's -3 is relevant and having access to the -6 if you untap with Nissa Vital Force just seems better. Why you would replace her with a walker that makes mediocre threats and doubles your forest mana in a deck that doesn't really hurt for mana is beyond me.

    Also, I'll agree with the last post. You seem to be on a pretty high horse, especially since a large part of the Nic Fit discord community is people who love the deck and probably have a large amount of insight into how it works and what cards appear to be just mediocre. Why come to a Nic Fit thread posting ideas if "the. NIcfit community is generally not representative for competitive players anyway". Seems like a waste of your time then mate.
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  10. #3830

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Hi,

    What about this new card :




    Against D&T, Elfball, Goblins, Stoneblade maybe ?

  11. #3831
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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Sweet card but at 5 mana its too slow.


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  12. #3832
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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    @Bruizar

    I hope you are not trolling

    Unfortunately we did not get anything good from WotS. Unless the metagame will change significantly.
    Concerning the new Nissa. In Nic Fit if you want to play a 5 mana green planeswalker. You play Nissa VF main, if you really want to add another PW you add another Nissa VF. The other viable Green 5 mana PW will be Garruk Primal Hunter in my opinion or if you want to play a pet card, spice up the deck. .
    I do not see any other G 5 mana PW worth playing atm.

    @grokh

    I think if you really have a problem with D&T, Goblins, Elf. It is better to play Massacre Wurm. At least when you hard cast it you win the game on the spot. But Pernicious deed main deck should be sufficient to slow/kill your opponent.

  13. #3833
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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Not being GSZ'able is a deal breaker for Massacre Girl. You don't want non-tutorable creatures, we're not playing EDH
    Quote Originally Posted by cavalrywolfpack View Post
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  14. #3834
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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    There have been non-tutorable creatures before though, I mean wasn't Grave Titan pretty absurd at one time? Massacre Girl I don't think is worth it, but going one mana further to Massacre Wurm seems worth the investment against tribal decks. It hits for 6 and you get a drain 2 for every creature that gets wiped. It's not as efficient as Deluge or even Deed, but the payoff seems pretty good.
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  15. #3835

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    There have been non-tutorable creatures before though, I mean wasn't Grave Titan pretty absurd at one time? Massacre Girl I don't think is worth it, but going one mana further to Massacre Wurm seems worth the investment against tribal decks. It hits for 6 and you get a drain 2 for every creature that gets wiped. It's not as efficient as Deluge or even Deed, but the payoff seems pretty good.
    Actually think I might prefer the Girl to the Wurm. Against Elves, DnT, and a pile of Emptied goblins...that one mana can mean the difference between getting the effect in play vs dying from the opp's next turn. 5 to 6 mana is a large jump, and 5 is the sweet spot of t1 Vet, t2 Tower sac him -> 5 mana. Wurm doesn't kill x/3's, but Girl has the potential to wipe them out. Interaction against Mentor is kind of nice - no matter how many spells are played in response, and even if they STP her in response, the ETB still happens and kills the monks off one by one (as far as I understand it...although they could...stp one of their existing tokens?).

    It's certainly a very niche role though, and most lists shouldn't be really caring to play either in their 75. Between Deluge/Deed/Golgari Charm things should be covered. Sneak Attack lists with Fierce Empath can get away with a Wurm (fits nicely there). Perhaps GB lists might care for the effect, but hey it isn't tutorable so eh.

    I'm not impressed with new Nissa at all.

  16. #3836
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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by square_two View Post
    Actually think I might prefer the Girl to the Wurm. Against Elves, DnT, and a pile of Emptied goblins...that one mana can mean the difference between getting the effect in play vs dying from the opp's next turn. 5 to 6 mana is a large jump, and 5 is the sweet spot of t1 Vet, t2 Tower sac him -> 5 mana. Wurm doesn't kill x/3's, but Girl has the potential to wipe them out. Interaction against Mentor is kind of nice - no matter how many spells are played in response, and even if they STP her in response, the ETB still happens and kills the monks off one by one (as far as I understand it...although they could...stp one of their existing tokens?).

    It's certainly a very niche role though, and most lists shouldn't be really caring to play either in their 75. Between Deluge/Deed/Golgari Charm things should be covered. Sneak Attack lists with Fierce Empath can get away with a Wurm (fits nicely there). Perhaps GB lists might care for the effect, but hey it isn't tutorable so eh.

    I'm not impressed with new Nissa at all.
    Good points, but I would argue that Massacre Wurm also brings a couple serious upsides: draining for 4-8 and trading with Gurmag Angler. The -2 also conveniently kills flipped Delvers. That extra mana is big, for sure, but Girl's added -1/-1 is based on creatures dying. If creatures are already out of range they won't get more than -1/-1. Cue the 'whomp whomp' sound effect. I still think Deluge/Deed/Charm are the best answers, but if you're in the market for a big threat that really swings games while also dealing with a problem, Massacre Wurm, in my opinion, can do that better than Girl. Ideally it's a way to add redundancy; you'll want the Deluge/Deed/Charm early already, but having a backup Wurm if they rebuild seems like just the thing to tip the scales. That 5 mana on t2 we all want also does Deed plus crack for 2, which is still the better way to go.

    Massacre Wurm might be 'win more', but I'll be damned if it isn't a powerful thing to be doing. Massacre Girl is just not big enough to matter as an actual threat.
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  17. #3837
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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Safety View Post
    Good points, but I would argue that Massacre Wurm also brings a couple serious upsides: draining for 4-8 and trading with Gurmag Angler. The -2 also conveniently kills flipped Delvers. That extra mana is big, for sure, but Girl's added -1/-1 is based on creatures dying. If creatures are already out of range they won't get more than -1/-1. Cue the 'whomp whomp' sound effect. I still think Deluge/Deed/Charm are the best answers, but if you're in the market for a big threat that really swings games while also dealing with a problem, Massacre Wurm, in my opinion, can do that better than Girl. Ideally it's a way to add redundancy; you'll want the Deluge/Deed/Charm early already, but having a backup Wurm if they rebuild seems like just the thing to tip the scales. That 5 mana on t2 we all want also does Deed plus crack for 2, which is still the better way to go.

    Massacre Wurm might be 'win more', but I'll be damned if it isn't a powerful thing to be doing. Massacre Girl is just not big enough to matter as an actual threat.
    Since I'm the one using it at the moment let me share a few more things.
    Wurm is easier to play as a 1-of than the new threat because you can fetch it with empath. So when it matters you have a reliable way to get it.
    To be able to do so with the new card you'll have to include the new GSZ which in the end will be detrimental to the whole deck.
    Wurm also won't wipe the board on your end which might be important.
    And finally as you said, the ping ability is very very important especially in a control deck such as Nic Fit where being able to finish off your opponent in a timely fashion is key.

    My two cents.

    Ralf

  18. #3838
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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralf View Post
    Since I'm the one using it at the moment let me share a few more things.
    Wurm is easier to play as a 1-of than the new threat because you can fetch it with empath. So when it matters you have a reliable way to get it.
    To be able to do so with the new card you'll have to include the new GSZ which in the end will be detrimental to the whole deck.
    Wurm also won't wipe the board on your end which might be important.
    And finally as you said, the ping ability is very very important especially in a control deck such as Nic Fit where being able to finish off your opponent in a timely fashion is key.

    My two cents.

    Ralf
    Ahhh, the ol' Zenith into Fierce Empath into Massacre Wurm line. Awesome!
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  19. #3839
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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Which is totaly enough and not slow against elves and goblins. :D

    I think we should stay with toxic and deed and zenith for witness to recycle it.


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  20. #3840
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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by Koplinchen View Post
    Which is totaly enough and not slow against elves and goblins. :D

    I think we should stay with toxic and deed and zenith for witness to recycle it.


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    It's not for the first wave, it's for the 2nd wave!

    I digress, and I do agree that Eternal Witness is definitely a better strategy in general. I always had a Witness and a maindeck Nissa VF (which could buy back Deeds as well.)
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