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Thread: [Primer] Nic Fit

  1. #81
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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by square_two View Post
    Anyone have a chance to test out Chandra, Torch of Defiance lately? Can't remember any consensus on her. She can damage walkers (though only 2 at a time), give some slight card advantage, ramp 2 mana, remove low toughness annoying critters, and her ult does win the game quickly (especially since we have 3 Tops). I'd like to get my hands on one but she is a tad pricey right now. I think if I tried to add her in Sneak, then I'd also want to bring back Primeval Titan to the main because Chandra's +1 mana could allow for a small boost to GSZ power. She doesn't seem nearly as powerful as Nissa but the ramp is intriguing.

    Maybe something close to this.

    4 Veteran Explorer
    1 Deathrite Shaman
    1 Sakura-Tribe Elder // 2nd Deathrite Shaman?
    1 Eternal Witness
    1 Fierce Empath
    1 Tireless Tracker
    1 Thragtusk
    1 Primeval Titan
    1 Inferno Titan
    1 Woodland Bellower
    1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn

    4 Cabal Therapy
    4 Green Sun's Zenith

    2 Lightning Bolt
    3 Abrupt Decay

    4 Sneak Attack
    3 Pernicious Deed

    3 Sensei's Divining Top

    1 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
    1 Nissa, Vital Force

    Also - is Sakura-Tribe Elder subpar if you are not running Meren? Wonder if that really should be a 2nd Deathrite in my list. I love the extra basic but I love a turn 1 DRS even more.
    What are the bolts for? Punishing fire, please.
    I hear they got twisters miles wide in the Midwest.

  2. #82

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by Tokugawa View Post
    What are the bolts for? Punishing fire, please.
    Cheaper more powerful removal. I made my case for them towards the end of the last thread and do not miss leaving the PFire package behind at all.

    God have mercy on the poor chap trying to fight against Leovold with some Punishing Fires.

  3. #83

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by square_two View Post
    Also - is Sakura-Tribe Elder subpar if you are not running Meren? Wonder if that really should be a 2nd Deathrite in my list. I love the extra basic but I love a turn 1 DRS even more.
    I find the interaction rarely comes up, it's strong to be sure but in practice I find it to be too much durdling and not enough killing. That said, in your situation I would definitely go with the second DRS before adding STE.

  4. #84

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by Tokugawa View Post
    What are the bolts for? Punishing fire, please.
    As square_two has noted, I've been on this same plan on Sneak of cutting P-Fire/Grove for Bolts. Am not looking back.

    Honestly, it feels better. P-Fire is pretty slow, and as stated, Leovold is gaining in popularity. Having another way to answer him beyond just Decay in 1 card is pretty good. Having cheap effective removal at the beginning of the game, very good. Still having reach to end a game out of nowhere if your opponent is at 3 life, still really good.

    In all the games I've played with the list, I've found Punishing Fire to just be too slow to deal with things like it should be. We're not a Punishing Fire deck, the engine is slow and it takes time to set up properly without any disruption. And if you get disrupted, it really slows you down. Bolt lets you deal with that thing you needed to quickly, and does so on 1 mana.

  5. #85
    The crazy nastyass honey badger

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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    @Brael: Yeah, I can see that list having trouble with Manaless Dredge. The lands package in your SB takes up a lot of room. I wonder if it's worth it.

    Also, why the 2 DRS in the SB? If you need GY hate, you need it to be fast. As in preferably free. Like Surgical Extraction, or Tormod's Crypt.
    Quote Originally Posted by cavalrywolfpack View Post
    DAMMIT ECHELON

  6. #86

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by Echelon View Post
    @Brael: Yeah, I can see that list having trouble with Manaless Dredge. The lands package in your SB takes up a lot of room. I wonder if it's worth it.

    Also, why the 2 DRS in the SB? If you need GY hate, you need it to be fast. As in preferably free. Like Surgical Extraction, or Tormod's Crypt.
    The DRS isn't really there for GY hate, while that's a potential benefit it's actually there so I can bring in mana ramp when I need to take Explorers out.

    The DD package has won me a lot of games, it's very useful against the medium speed combo decks but it's weak enough against Miracles and other STP decks though that I don't feel comfortable having it MB.

    The Bojuka Bog should go a long ways towards fixing it. Combined with Crop Rotation that gives me 3 ways in G1 and 4 ways in G2/G3 to fully wipe the GY at instant speed. At least against most builds, the local manaless includes FoW in their build (SB only though). It's got implications for decks like BR Reanimator too.
    Last edited by Brael; 01-21-2017 at 04:20 PM.

  7. #87

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Anyone else playing with Pharika, God of Affliction in Nyx Fit? Seems to synergize pretty well with a lot of what the deck does.

    • You can tutor for it with GSZ (it's only not a creature on the battlefield) or Sterling Grove
    • Devotion is pretty easy to trigger with all our double-color enchantments and such, and then you have a 5/5 beater (or indestructible blocker if that's needed)
    • You can make deathtouch snakes out of your spent Veteran Explorers
    • Those snakes are also enchantments, so you can trigger Constellation with them at instant speed
    • It's indestructible, so most enchantment removal is useless against it (it becoming a creature does open it up to StP, but by then you'll probably have a Grove out too)

  8. #88

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    I rather just Liliana, the Last Hope as the walker of choice to pick off small critters as she is easier on mana than Chandra and comes a full turn earlier which is critical if you want to emblem.

  9. #89

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by lowpass View Post
    Anyone else playing with Pharika, God of Affliction in Nyx Fit? Seems to synergize pretty well with a lot of what the deck does.

    • You can tutor for it with GSZ (it's only not a creature on the battlefield) or Sterling Grove
    • Devotion is pretty easy to trigger with all our double-color enchantments and such, and then you have a 5/5 beater (or indestructible blocker if that's needed)
    • You can make deathtouch snakes out of your spent Veteran Explorers
    • Those snakes are also enchantments, so you can trigger Constellation with them at instant speed
    • It's indestructible, so most enchantment removal is useless against it (it becoming a creature does open it up to StP, but by then you'll probably have a Grove out too)
    It's hard to kill, but it doesn't actually do anything.

    - Zenithing for value is better as Eidolon of Blossoms. Zenithing for pressure is better as Sigarda.
    - Rector and Sterling Grove is better for Starfield, unless you need stabilization immediately, in which case it's better for Doomwake
    - You don't actually have many creatures go to the graveyard - it's pretty much just Vet and Witness, since Eidolon etc you want to keep there as Starfield targets, and Rector exiles itself.
    - Enchantment removal is gonna be used on more relevant targets than a vanilla 5/5.
    - If you have Starfield it's just a 3/3.

  10. #90

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    I'm looking to build this deck and saw this particular 5-0 list from MTGO.

    http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=14127&d=284061&f=LE

    Is this a good place to start? What would we want to adjust right off the bat? I'm targeting this particular list as I have almost all of these cards in my collection and wouldn't have to invest heavily right away.

  11. #91
    The crazy nastyass honey badger

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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by koten View Post
    I'm looking to build this deck and saw this particular 5-0 list from MTGO.

    http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=14127&d=284061&f=LE

    Is this a good place to start? What would we want to adjust right off the bat? I'm targeting this particular list as I have almost all of these cards in my collection and wouldn't have to invest heavily right away.
    Well, we do have a nice, shiny new primer to look at. The list you suggest is a very odd duck. It might be smart to get some experience with a more stock list. Proxy it first before actually spending any money on it too.
    Quote Originally Posted by cavalrywolfpack View Post
    DAMMIT ECHELON

  12. #92

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Thinking of giving a BUG pod list a shot with Trophy Mage to search up some utility artifacts. In particular, she fetches Staff of Domination which I'm sure can be set up to do something powerful in this deck. Maybe Pod a recurring 2-drop (Bloodghast?) into Trophy Mage and Selvala, Heart of the Wilds?

  13. #93

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by Navsi View Post
    Thinking of giving a BUG pod list a shot with Trophy Mage to search up some utility artifacts. In particular, she fetches Staff of Domination which I'm sure can be set up to do something powerful in this deck. Maybe Pod a recurring 2-drop (Bloodghast?) into Trophy Mage and Selvala, Heart of the Wilds?
    I've been thinking about Trophy Mage for awhile, I have that list of interesting artifacts in a post in the previous thread. My main concern with Trophy Mage right now is that it really clogs up the 3 slot. Not only do you have the Mages, but you have what they fetch. I think pod in particular is better off using Trinket Mage because that plays better as a 1 of.

    I really like the Bloodghast idea though.

  14. #94

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by Brael View Post
    I really like the Bloodghast idea though.
    I've been trying to get Bloodghast working properly for ages, ever since the Contamination builds we tried to make work a few months ago. I think with Fatal Push around it might be more feasible to give a shot to a build that's heavier on the black mana, running Contamination, Recurring Nightmare, Grave Titan etc. Could probably manage to splash a third colour if necessary, but it might be interesting to try and put something together.

  15. #95

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by Navsi View Post
    I've been trying to get Bloodghast working properly for ages, ever since the Contamination builds we tried to make work a few months ago. I think with Fatal Push around it might be more feasible to give a shot to a build that's heavier on the black mana, running Contamination, Recurring Nightmare, Grave Titan etc. Could probably manage to splash a third colour if necessary, but it might be interesting to try and put something together.
    Bloodghast, Ophiomancer, Braids, Contamination, Tireless Tracker, Smokestack...

    You know you want to try it

  16. #96

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    1 Dryad Arbor
    4 Veteran Explorer
    3 Deathrite Shaman
    2 Bloodghast
    2 Ophiomancer
    1 Eternal Witness
    1 Courser of Kruphix
    1 Tireless Tracker
    1 Academy Rector
    1 Meren of Clan Nel Toth
    1 Gray Merchant of Asphodel
    1 Grave Titan

    4 Cabal Therapy
    2 Diabolic Intent
    2 Fatal Push
    2 Abrupt Decay
    1 Maelstrom Pulse

    2 Sensei's Divining Top
    2 Birthing Pod
    1 Nissa, Vital Force
    1 Garruk Relentless
    1 Liliana, the Last Hope

    1 Recurring Nightmare
    1 Contamination

    3 Swamp
    2 Forest
    1 Plains
    3 Bayou
    1 Scrubland
    1 Savannah
    4 Verdant Catacombs
    2 Marsh Flats
    2 Windswept Heath
    2 Phyrexian Tower
    1 Volrath's Stronghold

    Might do some testing tonight. White for Rector also expands sideboard options quite well. Gray Merchant seems good with Recurring Nightmare but might just want to be Thragtusk.

  17. #97

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Hello All,

    I've been playing Rhino Fit for a little while and find it appreciable with the updated primer. However, and not that I doubt the people who've posted before me, but I have found that naming chalice in the blind is most effective, as opposed to brainstorm. And when playing Eldrazi, or Big Red, or Loam, I will always name chalice. It just shuts off too much of what I want to do. Cuts me off of top, vet., Dr. Shaman, therapy, StP, PtE.

    Yes, I can GSZ for pridemage, or draw an abrupt decay, at some point, I will probably end up too far behind.

    I can see the argument for naming brainstorm in the dark, it is probably the most played spell in legacy, but BS doesn't shut down my game plan like chalice does.

    Thoughts? I'd appreciate the feedback, either in agreement with me or the primer, but I am a little curious as Therapy involves equal parts skill, luck, and brazenness.

  18. #98
    The crazy nastyass honey badger

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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    Quote Originally Posted by Kobra_D View Post
    Thoughts? I'd appreciate the feedback, either in agreement with me or the primer, but I am a little curious as Therapy involves equal parts skill, luck, and brazenness.
    If you really have no clue what your opponent is on, just wait until their first landdrop. That should give you enough to work with.

    The point of the blind Brainstorm is that Brainstorm sees more play than CotV, hence giving you a better chance of hitting rather than whiffing. On the flipside, your opponent not having what you name with CT is usually a very good thing, so there's that.
    Quote Originally Posted by cavalrywolfpack View Post
    DAMMIT ECHELON

  19. #99

    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    I normally pretty much always drop Explorer first if I'm on the play. It opens him up to removal but that's not necessarily a problem, and it means you have more information before using Therapy.

    - Against Miracles you don't particularly want Vet to trigger anyway so Swords isn't a problem
    - You'd like to get the trigger against most D&T hands, but at the same time if they Swords veterans on turn one they aren't making Vial or Mom which are way worse for you
    - If they make Chalice you'd rather have cast Vet than Therapy since if Explorer is already on the board you can cast Therapy into the Chalice to get the Explorer trigger anyway, which gives us better odds of being able to do something useful.

  20. #100
    The crazy nastyass honey badger

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    Re: [Primer] Nic Fit

    I actually really like the Explorer trigger vs. D&T. Pretty much instantly gets you out of their mana denial plan, and you benefit more from the mana than they do. For T1 plays vs. a completely unknown opponent it's probably SDT > GSZ for X = 0 if the rest of my hand is good enough > nothing > CT > Veteran Explorer.

    If your opponent plays blue (generalizing here) or white, it's CT/SDT > Veteran Explorer.
    If your opponent plays something without Stifles/StP that isn't Storm it's Veteran Eplorer > Cabal Therapy > SDT.

    Or something along those lines. I tend to play very defensively.
    Quote Originally Posted by cavalrywolfpack View Post
    DAMMIT ECHELON

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