[EDH] Karlov of the Ghost Council

[DarthVicious]

Karlov of the Ghost Council


Overview
Ok, here we go. Making this into a primer-style conglomerate, mostly as a type of archive for synergy and goodstuff. Just from reading the card you can tell he wants lots of instances of lifegain, as opposed to large clumps like some other Orzhov generals. Not that they're a bad thing, but he really wants to see loads of triggers and things. Combining the fact that he can get very huge very fast with his second ability means it's also very easy for him to step back and play controllish also, which was one of my main draws to him, as it makes him very adaptable to dynamic games.

Key Cards
So there's several cards that Karlov loves on the table. Realistically, you can find many of these on Gatherer by searching for 'whenever gain life' and just about all of them come up, but I'll go ahead and list the ones I think are the best at their job.

The Soul Sisters
Soul Warden
Soul's Attendant
Auriok Champion

Free lifegain triggers when creatures enter play is really where it's at for Karlov. Turn 1 Soul Warden leads right into a turn 2 4/4 Karlov, and he continues to get bigger if your opponents play creatures before your turn 3. Every group has aggro strategies of some kind, as creatures are the most efficient form of damage per mana spent. Knowing that, creatures also always tend to die in this format too. Fortunately, we can take advantage of that too.

The Addams Family
Blood Artist
Deathgreeter
Sangromancer
Falkenrath Noble

The list goes on. However, what if there's that one cheeky guy that doesn't play a lot of creatures? There's other things we have in store for him.

The Other Guys
Confessor
Kambal, Consul of Allocation
Angel's Feather
Tithe Drinker

These are just a few options, obviously. Many more exist to take advantage of other colors besides white, and many more extort cards exist. Again, think synergy. Confessor and Sangromancer love to see activations of Liliana of the Veil or Geier Reach Sanitarium, for example. It's also worth noting the synergy between Extort and Exquisite Blood.

Support Cards
This is where I put the 'toys'. I like picking lower mana cost cards to reduce dead draws of acceleration pieces later, however running acceleration allows you to run out more expensive and/or exciting cards earlier than usual. I leave that for the pilot to decide. Under this category exists card draw, tutors, spot destruction, sweepers, etc. This is the interesting stuff, the above category is more 'nuts & bolts' for Karlov.

Some of my favorites are:
Necropotence
Well of Lost Dreams
Key to the City
Whispersilk Cloak
Vindicate
Karmic Guide
Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim
Words of Worship


Again, the list goes on. Anything that uses life as a resource is good, as you're gaining life steadily throughout the game.

Planeswalkers

The hate magnets. Dropping a planeswalker almost always turns heads, even when it's something as unassuming as Kaya. Alas, that does not mean they should not be played. Walkers are all about timing, more or less. Dropping one when another player is in control of the game may or may not be a bad idea, depending on the circumstances. Anyway:

Kaya, Ghost Assassin
Ajani Goldmane
Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
Elspeth Tirel

Alternate Win Conditions

Sometimes, creatures just can't get through. Sometimes, creatures just plain die. It's EDH, shit happens. Can't expect your 30/30 unblockable general to survive more than one attack if someone is sandbagging a Wrath. So we include other ways to win that don't involve the combat step. Such as infinite combos, or the oh-so-obvious Sanguine Bond & Exquisite Blood combo. Aetherflux Reservoir. Pestilence. You get the idea.

My List
You may want to include other things that suit your own playstyle. I'll admit there are things that I could be running that'd streamline the deck a little better and make it more consistent. But... I like fun & interesting games. Tutoring for an infinite combo to end a 3 hour game is one thing. Tutoring for an infinite combo on turn two is quite different. Some of these cards I'm simply testing, others are here to stay, some for personal reasons, some not, etc. This is just 'my' list.

Karlov of the Ghost Council
Kambal, Consul of Allocation
Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim
Deathbringer Liege
Shattered Angel
Divinity of Pride
Angel of Despair
Ashen Rider
Mentor of the Meek
Desolation Angel
Resplendent Mentor
Necropolis Regent
Archangel of Thune
Sangromancer
Bloodline Keeper
Vizkopa Guildmage
Deathgreeter
Auriok Champion
Disciple of Griselbrand
Confessor
Serra Ascendant
Soul Warden
Soul's Attendant
Falkenrath Noble
Leonin Elder
Blood Artist
Tithe Drinker
Karmic Guide
Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
Liliana of the Veil
Elspeth Tirel
Sorin, Grim Nemesis
Ajani Goldmane
Kaya, Ghost Assassin
Ob Nixilis of the Black Oath
Oversold Cemetery
Bloodchief Ascension
Well of Lost Dreams
Angel's Feather
Necropotence
Damnation
Merciless Eviction
Pestilence
Tragic Arrogance
Wrath of God
Skullclamp
Demon's Horn
Phyrexian Arena
Key to the City
Call the Bloodline
Golem's Heart
Whispersilk Cloak
Bitterblossom
Blade of the Bloodchief
Words of Worship
Council's Judgment
Anguished Unmaking
Utter End
Vindicate
Aetherflux Reservoir
Ivory Tower
Phyrexian Processor

8 Swamp
8 Plains
Rogue's Passage
Kjeldoran Outpost
High Market
Dust Bowl
Shizo, Death's Storehouse
Tectonic Edge
Diamond Valley
Geier Reach Sanitarium
Wasteland
Scoured Barrens
Temple of Silence
Forsaken Sanctuary
Orzhov Guildgate
Tainted Field
Scrubland
Godless Shrine
Isolated Chapel
Caves of Koilos
Fetid Heath
Concealed Courtyard
Orzhov Basilica
Strip Mine

Cards I Would Like To Add
Circle of Despair
Martyr's Cause
Exquisite Blood
Purify
Authority of the Consuls
Vault of the Archangel
Night Dealings
Pontiff of Blight

[H]

I've never played Karlov myself, but I have seen him in action and he is pretty absurdly powerful. One game I saw he was something like a 12/12 by turn 3 and the draw didn't really seem all that crazy. I personally run Ayli as my BW general of choice, so my deck is much more top heavy, with a reanimation subtheme. I also eschewed any infinite combos, just grinding value off ETB/LTB effects and leveraging life as a resource. I personally do run tutors though.

Some cards that came to mind that I might personally include in this list:
Sanguine Bond (I run this as a value proposition, so I omit Exquisite Blood but in this deck, I can see doing the opposite and running Blood without Bond to grow Karlov.)
Swiftfoot Boots (Protecting Karlov while still letting you use the utility lands on him.)
Crypt Ghast (More mana, plus extort is good to grow Karlov with.)
Pristine Talisman (Some acceleration, plus life gain.)
Volrath's Stronghold (Just getting back dudes they kill.)

Other cards that come to mind, but I am unsure if they are actually good enough:
Ranger of Eos (Might still not be enough one drops to make it worth it.)
Proclamation of Rebirth (Might be too slow, or like Ranger, still not enough one drops, or both.)
Blind Obedience (Actually seems kind of decent at slowing people down, plus Extort.)
Pontiff of Blight (Extort and a big butt, but probably win-more.)
Pious Evangel (Might be good, replacement Soul sister.)
Rhox Faithmender (Probably just win-more.)
Faith's Reward (For the inevitable board wipes.)
Sunbond (Probably win-more, but does let you make another creature into Karlov.)
Reveillark (As a value proposition, perhaps.)
Ajani's Pridemate (Sort of a back-up Karlov.)
Blood Artist (Not sure if there are enough "dies" triggers though.)
Suture Priest (Basically, same idea as Blood Artist.)

Just some ideas for you to consider, or not.

[deakmana]

I'll try and suggest things based on the limitations you've set yourself for the deck (no tutors/combos). Offhand I think the biggest issues are lack of protection for your general and lack of direct card advantage. Here's a quick list of suggestion cards


Land Destruction Stuff---
Armageddon
Ravages of War
Crucible
Flagstones of Troikar

Mana Ramp---
Sol Ring
Mana Crypt
Coldsteel Heart

Creatures---
Graveborn Muse
Mother of Runes
Dark Confidant
Sun Titan
Tymna, the Weaver

Artifacts---
Sensei's Divining Top

Equip---
Sword of Light & Shadow
Umezawa's Jitte
Sword of Fire & Ice
Lightning Greaves


Lands---
Personally I would remove any lands that come into play tapped (except Scoured Barrens) and replace them with fetches (or basics if you consider fetches tutors)


super fun probably bad cards---
Sword of the Ages
Lich
Nefarious Lich

[deakmana]

*EDIT* Deleting double-post

[H]

Some of those suggestions are good, like Sword of Light and Shadow but most of them fail to really fit the theme and focused plan of the deck. I don't think he wants to just run BW_GoodStuff.dec if I understand him correctly.

While you didn't seriously propose Lich you are right the card would be pretty bad, because it is a replacement effect, so you'd never gain life again, making Karlov pretty bad. I don't see any pay off to drawing so many cards in this deck, Necropotence is easier to cast, easier to abuse and doesn't usually directly lose you the game.

[deakmana]

Some of those suggestions are good, like Sword of Light and Shadow but most of them fail to really fit the theme and focused plan of the deck. I don't think he wants to just run BW_GoodStuff.dec if I understand him correctly.

While you didn't seriously propose Lich you are right the card would be pretty bad, because it is a replacement effect, so you'd never gain life again, making Karlov pretty bad. I don't see any pay off to drawing so many cards in this deck, Necropotence is easier to cast, easier to abuse and doesn't usually directly lose you the game.

As a precursor to my comments, I don't mean to be so serious in my rebuttal, but I was like damn I thought these were the safest suggestions that fit with the constraints set by the deck creator.

You can have support cards and still have a consistent theme. I realize that some of these cards are "good stuff" and Ravages of War may be out of some players price range, but I don't like to hinder suggestions because of that. In a creature heavy deck with a relatively low curve, mass land destruction is pretty good.

Having one Necropotence (and one Phyrexian Arena) without tutors does not solve the problem of running out of gas. I only included 3 direct card draw cards (Confidant, Graveborn, SoFI) because they're very good at what they do.

Karlov is also very easy to remove. Lightning Greaves/MoR/Sofi/SoLS all help and add solid utility.

I did not seriously suggest Lich or Nefarious Lich and I realize it replaces the life gain, but having them in a gain based deck with cards like Confessor and discard outlets can be a fun time.

Finally, there are many cards in the list that don't already fit the theme. I'll list a few (not to beat on the decklist, just to prove a point)
Teysa, Envoy of Ghosts (has no direct synergy with commander. Deck isn't a pillowfort there's no ghostly prison or windborn muse)
Linvala, Keeper of Silence (great card in here, doesn't fit theme or directly interact with commander)
Desolation Angel (destroys all lands, pretty solid, no direct synergy with commander)
Bloodline Keeper (not a fan of this dude, but also no life gain theme/synergy)
Avacyn, Angel of Hope (another solid card although no ramp will make it tricky)

*EDIT* Just wanted to add the Skullclamp would be great in here too.

[H]

I was probably a bit too harsh on some of the selections, but I still think something like Sun Titan is outside what he mainly wants to be doing. Ultimately that is up to him though, I know most groups would probably be up in arms over the like of Armageddon, or Ravages of War, but I guess that depends of who you play with.

[Davran]

I had an Ayli deck for a while that was similar to this one, and a couple cards I really liked were Vampire Nighthawk and Mother of Runes. Nighthawk gains you life and also trades fairly favorably in most combats, plus it interacts well with Sun Titan and/or Reveillark which also seem to be absent from your list. As for mom, she seems so low impact right up until you want to chump block something (maybe with the nighthawk) or save something from spot removal.

Someone mentioned it above too, but I'll second Blood Artist. At first pass it sounds sort of weak if you're not running some sort of dedicated sacrifice based strategy, but creatures die so often in this format that you'll get plenty of triggers.

It might be a little too try-hard for the theme you're going for, but Thalia, Heretic Cathar does tons of work.

[DarthVicious]

I have loads of card draw in there. Mistakenly I forgot to post Skullclamp even though it is in there. Forgot what I posted instead, but I know I have clamp. Must have clamp.

Anyway, here's a list of the card draw sources, regardless how often they can be used/abused:

Mentor of the Meek combines well with all the little guys and token generators.
Sorin, Grim Nemesis draws and causes opponent life loss while ticking up.
Kaya draws cards while forcing discards, although she's the least abusable card in the deck she has synergy with just about everything.
Ob Nixilis also draws cards while ticking up.
Mind's Eye is nutty, especially in multiplayer.
Necro is Necro. I'm never cutting it.
Shadows gives me scry, so that's something.
Well of Lost Dreams is almost as nutty as Mind's Eye, and gets galactically stupid with Words of Worship.
Key to the City is a nice little filtering trinket that gets Karlov through.
Arena is one of my favorite cards ever.
Sanitarium is basically for the global triggers, but can function as filtering if need be.

I've tried the equipment that protects him from spot removal (e.g. Greaves, Boots, etc) and found that it only caused my group to fire off sweepers/removal more liberally. They fear Karlov big time, even when all my lifegain sources have been swept away and General Tazri is threatening four players with lethal damage next turn. Ever since I one shot an Ezuri elf deck that had 100+ life.

Desolation Angel I only included because it's my favorite creature of all time. Firing it off at the right time can win the game for you. However... Most of my group runs artifact mana anyways. Some of which I would like to include, but from my own observations it needs to be cheap enough to drop otherwise I'll never get it out (another in my group runs a pillowfort Grand Arbiter and has included several cards that prevent the untapping of land... Grrr) I was tempted to include the likes of two mana color producers like Charcoal/Marble Diamond, Grafstone, Fellwar, Star Compass and Coldsteel. Drawing them lategame is massive feel-bads however. Pristine Talisman is the only one I would consider that costs more than two, even considering my own glorious history with Gilded Loti in a Wildfire deck of ages past, that ended up dropping to one Death Cloud so people would play against it again.

Extort was a thing I tried and didn't really like, your mileage may vary however. But I do love Ayli to the end of the known universe. She's a friggin goddess. Tymna I tried and she ended up being underwhelming. Teysa is really only there for how combat proficient she is, she runs every combat step I'm involved in. Linvala is really only there because I had her sitting around and I thought it a shame to see her go to waste.

I had Exquisite Blood in for another just to get more lifegain triggers off other people getting in combat, but it just ended up making me a target. Especially when I dropped Grim Nemesis next turn... *ahem*..... Sanguine Bond I never wanted just because it only targets one opponent, and I recently cut Vizkopa Guildmage for not doing much more than giving Karlov lifelink... Only to have him eat a Plow or something. Hence the reason no protection equipment also, 'in response to equip' doesn't just happen in Legacy. There have been times I literally just recast him as a 2/2 for eight friggin mana onto an empty board and someone blew him up instantly.

Phew. All that being said, I'll probably cut some things to add those little artifact manas I mentioned.

[H]

I have loads of card draw in there. Mistakenly I forgot to post Skullclamp even though it is in there. Forgot what I posted instead, but I know I have clamp. Must have clamp.

Now you have me thinking, maybe I should have Skullclamp in Ayli...

Phew. All that being said, I'll probably cut some things to add those little artifact manas I mentioned.

I think the best 2 mana one isn't one you mentioned and that Orzhov Signet if that wasn't one you already thought of.

Chances are good your instincts are better than mine, I almost never play aggressive anything in EDH, I am usually the "fun police" making sure no one wins.

[DarthVicious]

Now you have me thinking, maybe I should have Skullclamp in Ayli...



I think the best 2 mana one isn't one you mentioned and that Orzhov Signet if that wasn't one you already thought of.

Chances are good your instincts are better than mine, I almost never play aggressive anything in EDH, I am usually the "fun police" making sure no one wins.

If you have sacrificial x/1 dudes or token generators (and with Ayli as your general, I KNOW you do) you definitely should run the Clamp. Especially considering she can sac the dude herself regardless whether Clamp kills it or not. Sticking it on a 6/6 before saccing it to her, for example, gets you 5 life and 2 cards for 2 mana.

I avoided the Signet simply because it requires mana to get me mana, but I might include it anyway. I have most other cards with the Orzhov watermark anyways.

I only play him aggressive in a 1v1 EDH. In a free-for-all four/five man game I usually sit back and build up counters to use his second ability and go on police patrol myself. I like that he can switch gears like that if the situation calls for it.

Also I realized I missed two cards off my list, Clamp and Argentum Armor. The Armor is likely to get cut for mana rocks.

[H]

If you have sacrificial x/1 dudes or token generators (and with Ayli as your general, I KNOW you do) you definitely should run the Clamp. Especially considering she can sac the dude herself regardless whether Clamp kills it or not. Sticking it on a 6/6 before saccing it to her, for example, gets you 5 life and 2 cards for 2 mana.

Yeah, I really don't have an X/1's in my deck, so that is why I didn't even consider Clamp before you mentioned it. I'll probably not include it, since I feel it is kind of win-more for me. If I can slap down a Sun Titan and sac it, I probably don't even need two more cards in my hand. What I do want, looking at my list now, is a way to win around or through Grave-hate. In this way, I am thinking of swapping out something for a Conjurer's Closet so I can still get some extra ETB abilites and even possibly abuse them with Panharmonicon if I can't remove enough of the hate.

[DarthVicious]

Crafting OP into primer status. Suggestions for inclusions welcome.

Side note: It'd be nice if I could include a picture of my list. I use Gatherer pictures to make a big bmp of all my decks so I can see all the synergies easier.

[DarthVicious]

Updated with current list, and a small wish list.

[DarthVicious]

Had a game recently that went like this:

Turn 1: Soul's Attendant
Opponents: Mana rocks/Lands
Turn 2: Karlov
Opponents: Creatures and some more mana rocks
Turn 3: Whispersilk Cloak
Opponents: More creatures, not noticing my board state just yet
Turns 4-7: Equip, swing for well over twenty general damage each time
Opponents: WTF JUST HAPPENED??!!??!?!

Granted, that's pretty much living the dream right there, but it happened and it was fun.