MUD Post

[Epeirogeny]

MUD Post

A Spicy List, more Refined List Below:

Lands
4 Ancient Tomb
1 Cavern of Souls
2 City of Traitors
4 Cloudpost
1 Diamond Valley
1 Eye of Ugin
4 Glimmerpost
1 Karakas
4 Maze of Ith
1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Vesuva

Creatures
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
4 Lodestone Golem
1 Sundering Titan
4 Thought-Knot Seer
1 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
2 Wurmcoil Engine

Artifact
4 Grim Monolith
2 Candelabra of Tawnos
4 Expedition Map
1 Forcefield
4 Pithing Needle
2 Temporal Aperture

Enchantment
1 The Abyss

Sideboard
2 All is Dust
4 Chalice of the Void
1 Grafdigger's Cage
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Ratchet Bomb
2 Trinisphere

This is a little brew, but not exactly a brew. It is an alternative version to the Green/Blue list. The list combines elements from both MUD and U/G Cloudpost ramp decks. I am not the originator of this list. I simply saw it online and added my own tweaks from the various versions. I do not want to take credit away from the original builder. The deck has many control elements for the early game while it assembles its manabase. Maze of Ith, Tabernacle, The Abyss, and Forcefield are all control elements while the deck gets Expedition Maps, Candelabra of Tawnos, Grim Monoliths, Lodestone Golems, and Thought-Knot Seers out in the early turns. Lodestone Golem and Though-Knot are nice as they have control elements (Taxing and Discard respectively), while also being a threat.

Compared to the U/G Prime Time lists, I am not the biggest fan of getting rid of Crop Rotation and Brainstorm as I must admit the deck is prone to weird hands and a difficult to assemble mana base. However, I do like having the option of bringing in 4 Chalice of the Void from the sideboard, which, especially on the play, can become an automatic win against many decks in the meta. Plus, this deck is already good against the Miracles heavy meta, the green-blue version showed that at Worcester SCG just a few weeks ago. However, this is better against Miracles since most of the cards have mana costs that go above the CounterTop flips, unlike Crop Rotation and Brainstorm. And though Expedition is also one-mana it allows us to find the lands needed at any time. However, it is slower since it does not put the land on to the battle field immediately like Crop Rotation.





Necessary Mana Base and Ramp:

4 Ancient Tomb
4 Cloudpost
4 Glimmerpost
2-3 Vesuva
1-3 Candelabra of Tawnos
4 Grim Monoliths

This is the fast mana required to play almost all of the spells in the deck. Personally, I like to go with 4 Vesuvas and extra City of Traitors because the lack of crop rotation prevents tutoring for the toolbox lands. I'd rather get as much ramp mana as fast as possible, and not rely on top decks. For those who have not seen a Cloudpost deck in action, Cloudposts are the true all-star of the Locus lands as they tap mana for the number of Locus lands (read card), Glimmerposts are nice because it allows for more Locus lands to be drawn and helps the Cloudpost engine. Vesuvas almost always copy Cloudposts and allow the deck to play with pseudo 8 Cloudposts. However, there are corner cases to copy a Glimmerpost, or another land entirely. Candelabras are costly in paper, but necessary for this deck as it allows the deck to go off with tons of mana. For those who do not understand the card due to the old text, the Candle does have to tap, it cannot go infinite. For example, with 2 Cloudposts and 1 Candelabra, one could tap 2 Cloudposts to generate 4 mana, then activate Candelabra for 2 mana to untap both Cloudposts and tap both Cloudposts again to generate a total of 6 mana. Nevertheless, it is necessary for the deck. Grim Monoliths are simply ramp. Just make sure to untap them if you are not doing anything else with the mana, some people forget that they're not only one-time use in the early game



Other Ramp:

Eye of Ugin
City of Traitors
Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
Expedition Map

• Eye of Ugin can also be considered another ramp land. It turns on early Thought-Knot Seers. Yet, only 1 is needed since it really only helps with 6 cards total when adding Thought-Knots to the Ulamog and Emrakrul. I have debated taking out Ulamog for another big artifact creature because Ulamog also has bad synergy with The Abyss. Yet, Emrakrul is simply too good. On the other hand, leaving Ulamog in is good since sometimes I have to name Eldrazi with Cavern of Souls blindly because I do not have a creature in hand when I put Cavern of Souls out into play.
• City of Traitors can be nice ramp at times, but the fact that it needs to be sacrificed when another land comes into play can feel awful. I feel it is a necessary evil for the deck, since it needs as much ramp as possible. 4 seems like too many, but may be interesting to try out.
• Urborg is simply there for the Abyss and allows the other "Spell" lands, Maze of Ith and Tabernacle, to tap for mana when possible.
• Expedition Map is not a ramp card, but allows you to find the ramp lands. Necessary in a non-blue deck.

Protection and Stall:

Cavern of Souls
The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
Maze of Ith
Karakas
Pithing Needle

• Sometimes you can't get very explosive hands, but you get hands that allow you to play a stall game in the beginning. I like Cavern of Souls because the deck is weak to Force of Will. There have been many games where I have dumped Grim Monoliths and tons of mana into a big creature only to have it countered. Cavern of Souls alleviates this issue. The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale, Maze of Ith, and Karakas are all toolbox lands that can be obtained through Expedition Map. Expedition Map's use is situational, generally you do not want to play the long game with this deck, but the midrange is fine. Though early game Expedition Maps will get ramp lands. Late game Expedition Maps will get the utility lands. Karakas is a utility land for Show and Tell, Reanimate, etc decks. It may or may not be needed to be trimmed or sideboarded depending on both local and larger metas.
• Pithing Needle almost always names Wasteland. The card destroys everything our deck wants to do. It is why we must play four. In other matchups it is still a very versatile card that can name planeswalkers like Liliana and Jace which answer our big threats. It can also name Sneak Attack and Aether Vial.

Threats:

Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
Lodestone Golem
Sundering Titan
Thought-Knot Seer
Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
Wurmcoil Engine

• This part is pretty straightforward. Make a bunch of mana to cast these big nasty guys. No matter what your spice is for the fatties, I do feel that 4 Lodestone Golems, 1 Emrakrul, and n Wurmcoil Engines are necessary for every MUD Post list.

My Spice:
Forcefield
Diamond Valley
Temporal Aperture
The Abyss

• Forcefield acts like a 5th Maze of Ith
• Temporal Aperture is a card I saw in a few lists, it allows me to spin the wheel on my deck and see what comes out. Would probably be better if I played a few more big fatty creatures, the odds are generally not in my favor with only 13 creatures in the deck. It is also good sometimes to get a land off the top of my deck. If I have not played a land for turn, it prevents me from drawing an extra land.
• Diamond Valley allows me to make the most of my non-synergy with the Abyss which kills Thought-Knot Emrakrul and Ulamog. Though I will try to not cast Eldrazi into an Abyss or vice-versa, it can happen. Though when Ulamog is cast, I could exile the Abyss. Diamon Valley is also useful for making the most of enemy removal spells as I can at least gain life in response, and prevents them from getting exiled by swords to plowshares. I can still gain the life and allow them to go to the graveyard
• The Abyss, probably coming out as well. I had one lying around and wanted to throw it in for fun. Its a nice control card, and I saw it played in other lists. However, overall I do not feel like it works well with the deck.

[Epeirogeny]

Sideboard Options:

I listed my current sideboard


I feel the deck always needs to play
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Leyline of the Void
1 Grafdigger's Cage


The other 6 spots are situational/meta dependent so far.


Leyline of the Void: Black/Red Reanimator is also a new and popular deck due to the easy cost of entry of the deck, and low learning curve of the deck. It makes it an overrepresented deck in any meta, especially large metas where people just pick up an easy deck to play and don't have a lot of experience in the format. MUD Post has a difficult time against Dredge and Reanimator because of the lack of Force of Will. Though we have big creatures, we are not as fast and though Tabernacle can help against Dredge, and Maze of Ith can help against Reanimator, it is not always guaranteed to find them. Bring out the graveyard hate. Also, good against those Oops all Spells deck and other fast combo decks that rely on the Graveyard. Can also hit Lands and Loam decks. Loam decks are also on the rise due to their power against Miracles.

Chalice of the Void: Just breaks down so many decks in the meta, Delver especially. Stops swords to plowshares, all the cantrips, etc. If we can get an early chalice on 1 against the decks it blows out, we do not have to worry about it interfering with Pithing Needle, Candelabra, and Expedition Map. When bringing in Chalice, I generally take out some Pithing Needles, Expedition Maps, and Candelabras, but never all of them.

Grafdigger's Cage: Similar to Leyline of the Void. But also hits Natural Order, Past in Flames and other Flashback spells like Cabal Therapy and Faithless Looting.



Other sideboard cards that can fit:

All is Dust
Damnation
Ensnaring Bridge
Glacial Chasm
Helm of Obedience
Leyline of Sanctity
Mindbreak Trap
Phyrexian Metamorph
Phyrexian Revoker
Ratchet Bomb
Spellskite
Tormod's Crypt
Toxic Deluge
Trinisphere
Warping Wail



All Is Dust: Good against Elves, though they can still get the combo going faster than we can ramp up to 7 mana. Also wipes any board with colors. Not just focused on creatures.

Damnation: Faster board wipe against decks like Elves , Merfolk, Eldrazi, etc. Yet, only hits creatures.

Ensnaring Bridge: Always found this one weird choice in other people's sideboards. Never used it myself personally. Most of our creatures get affected by this. Usually played with Helm of Obedience for the alternative win-con

Glacial Chasm: Another utility land that Expedition Map can get. Make sure you have it for Burn players. Can also stall for a few turns, and can play a copy trick with Vesuva and Thespian's Stage allowing you to sacrifice the original, but still have one on board with a refresh on the cumulative upkeep cost.

Helm of Obedience: Usually played with Ensnaring Bridge. Sideboard out fatties, and take the deck further down the control and stall route. Combos with Leyline of the Void to mill out your opponent for the win.

Leyline of Sanctity: Burn hate, protects against discard heavy decks.

Mindbreak Trap: Hits Storm decks, again no Force of Will makes us weak to combo

Phyrexian Metamorph: Show and Tell Card, though I always like just putting in my fatty or Karakas in anyways. Can copy other artifacts like Candelabra, or anything else the board state

Phyrexian Revoker: Name cards like Sensei's Diving Top, Sneak Attack, Mana Rocks (Lion's Eye Diamond, Mox Diamond, etc), and the like.

Ratchet Bomb: Allows us to wipe pesky permanents. Like Counterbalance, Sensei's Top, Sneak Attack, etc. Permanents Removal.

Spellskite: Extra Swords to Plowshares protection

Tormod's Crypt: More graveyard hate

Toxic Deluge: Better damnation. Avoids the double black, and allows faster board wipes without hitting our own creatures. I always like it more than Damnation.

Trinisphere: Generally brought in against the same decks that hate Chalice of the Void.

Warping Wail: Colorless counterspell (sorcery only), can also provide a mana dork

[Epeirogeny]

A Refined List Without Spice and Easier on Your Wallet:


Lands
4 Ancient Tomb
2 Cavern of Souls
3 City of Traitors
4 Cloudpost
1 Eye of Ugin
4 Glimmerpost
1 Karakas
4 Maze of Ith
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
4 Vesuva

Creatures
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
4 Lodestone Golem
1 Sundering Titan
4 Thought-Knot Seer
1 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
4 Wurmcoil Engine

Artifact
4 Grim Monolith
1 Candelabra of Tawnos
4 Expedition Map
4 Pithing Needle
1 Temporal Aperture

Sorcery:
1 Toxic Deluge

Planeswalker:
1 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon


Sideboard
2 All is Dust
4 Chalice of the Void
1 Grafdigger's Cage
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Ratchet Bomb
2 Trinisphere



Potential CHANGE LOG:
- 1 Temporal Aperture
+ 1 Candelabra of Tawnos
Yes, it hits the wallet a little hard. However, my own affinity to the spice of Temporal Aperture makes the list inefficient. Adding a Candelabra of Tawnos never seems to be a bad call. Other options suggested include Coercive Portal or Sensei's Divining Top.

[Jakobian1010]

IMO Temporal Aperture is probably more cute than actually good. It only lets you pay less mana for 5 cards in the deck (in the original list at least), which isn't really enough consistency to make it any better than something like coercive portal/bottled cloister. Two of the cards are 6 drops, so it's only really saving 1 mana from their casting cost. The card advantage of something like coercive portal just seems strictly better. Even sensei's divining top might be better suited, since it helps you filter draws at least a little bit.

Is there any reason this isn't just in the MUD thread? This is very similar to "legends MUD", as some people refer to it.

[Gheizen64]

IMO Temporal Aperture is probably more cute than actually good. It only lets you pay less mana for 5 cards in the deck (in the original list at least), which isn't really enough consistency to make it any better than something like coercive portal/bottled cloister. Two of the cards are 6 drops, so it's only really saving 1 mana from their casting cost. The card advantage of something like coercive portal just seems strictly better. Even sensei's divining top might be better suited, since it helps you filter draws at least a little bit.

Is there any reason this isn't just in the MUD thread? This is very similar to "legends MUD", as some people refer to it.

The good part of aperture is mana efficiency. You have often nothing to do T2 and on the other hand, the 4 mana slot can feel cramped at times.

Also the shuffle effect if you play top.

[(nameless one)]

Sphere of Resistance and Winter Orb can also help you. Typically Cloudposts will tap for 2+mana. They help make the resistors one sided.

The problem with this is your high end cards will be inconsistent as you rely on having them cheated onto the field or hope your opponent doesn't have wasteland.

I used to play a stax like list a long time ago. I haven't touch the deck in a while. The problem that I had with the deck after establishing a lock was winning the game. This was before Inventor's Fair, Hangarback Walker and Walking Ballista.

[Epeirogeny]

IMO Temporal Aperture is probably more cute than actually good. It only lets you pay less mana for 5 cards in the deck (in the original list at least), which isn't really enough consistency to make it any better than something like coercive portal/bottled cloister. Two of the cards are 6 drops, so it's only really saving 1 mana from their casting cost. The card advantage of something like coercive portal just seems strictly better. Even sensei's divining top might be better suited, since it helps you filter draws at least a little bit.

Is there any reason this isn't just in the MUD thread? This is very similar to "legends MUD", as some people refer to it.

I agree. It is why I put it under the "my spice" section. It would probably be better to just play another Candelabra or a card you mentioned like Coercive portal. I kind of like it for the "Timmy" roll the dice effect.


If we are talking about the same thread, it is because the other MUD lists generally rely on some type of Metal Worker combo for the ramp. This list is more akin to a Twelve Post deck, however it uses the MUD package of spells rather than an Eldrazi package.

[Epeirogeny]

The good part of aperture is mana efficiency. You have often nothing to do T2 and on the other hand, the 4 mana slot can feel cramped at times.

Also the shuffle effect if you play top.

Good point. Perhaps it is worth keeping in. More testing is required.

[Epeirogeny]

Sphere of Resistance and Winter Orb can also help you. Typically Cloudposts will tap for 2+mana. They help make the resistors one sided.

The problem with this is your high end cards will be inconsistent as you rely on having them cheated onto the field or hope your opponent doesn't have wasteland.

I used to play a stax like list a long time ago. I haven't touch the deck in a while. The problem that I had with the deck after establishing a lock was winning the game. This was before Inventor's Fair, Hangarback Walker and Walking Ballista.

Sphere of Resistance I could see being played in the Sideboard to help against combo decks. Winter Orb does scare me a little as it could prevent us from ramping as well. It would probably need to be a sideboard card against decks like Lands. Because it would be bad against Delver and other Tempo/Aggro decks.