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Thread: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

  1. #261
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    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    So minor update.. Went 2-1 in both side events. Faced a total of 4 out of 6 possible chalice decks. I liked the tutor package to find answers and really it worked most of the time but I really looked for surge node but never found one at the gp. Is that the way to go?

    Overall there were so many chalice decks I was a bit discouraged at the prospect of playing this in that kind of meta. What do you guys think?

    Edit: Went 3-0 in the last side event today. The deck is a blast to pilot.

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    Last edited by Manroe; 06-17-2018 at 07:49 PM.
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  2. #262

    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    4-0 train keeps rolling. Same list as previously but -1 karn +1 prelate in main. Since Karn was printed I'm 16-0 in matches which is pretty nutty.

    4 Chalice of the Void
    4 Urza's Bauble
    4 Mishra's Bauble
    4 Lotus Petal
    4 Mox Opal
    4 Lion's Eye Diamond
    1 Engineered Explosives
    1 Lodestone Bauble

    4 Walking Ballista
    4 Auriok Salvagers
    4 Monastery Mentor
    1 Sanctum Prelate

    2 Karn, Scion of Urza

    4 Ancient Tomb
    3 City of Traitors
    4 Cavern of Souls
    4 Plains
    2 Karakas
    2 Inventors' Fair

    Sideboard:
    3 Tormod's Crypt
    2 Sorcerous Spyglass
    1 Ensnaring Bridge
    1 Containment Priest
    2 Sanctum Prelate
    1 Cast Out
    2 Seal of Cleansing
    3 Swords to Plowshares

    As mentioned earlier in the thread, I wanted to try Prelate main to hedge against combo. I don't think it's entirely necessary to go overboard with them though, so 1 in main and 2 more in sb seemed like it'd be strong enough. Didn't end up playing vs combo so still unsure of that direction.

    R1: Elves!
    Both games played out pretty similar -- I control the board with an early ballista, then he nat orders for hoof, puts me at a low life, then I chump with mentor tokens until I can combo. G1 was pretty crazy as he had 2 hoofs with me at 1 life. Mentor is a great card.

    R2: Maverick
    She mulligans both games -- g1 I put chalice on 1 and 2, then make 2 3/3 ballistas. g2 I combo out quickly.

    R3: Nether Shamans
    Weird deck, vial + cavern + nether void. game 1 i have a t1 vial off city but pretty anemic afterwards with only ballista on 1. I eventually draw combo but salvagers gets spell quellered. Luckily 2 turns later I find an EE and get him back for the win. g2 I lose to leovold/clique and prelate on 0. I had an EE but not enough petals/opals. g3 turn 1 mentor on the play kills him in 2 turns.

    R4: Punishing Dack
    g1 I combo pretty quickly, g2 I get wrecked by a pernicious deed and then misplay a prelate (I know he has push in hand so name 1, but i also know he has snapcaster in hand and his gy kcommand kills prelate and discards my topdecked salvagers), g3 I play tomb,spyglass on t1 and see drs and 4 different planeswalkers (dack, lili, chandra, jace) -- I name DRS then next two turns go plains, tomb, salvagers, win.
    Last edited by Kaono; 06-22-2018 at 11:45 AM.

  3. #263

    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    Great stuff! Kaono I'm still really curious about the mana - is Metalcraft reliable enough without the Ancient Dens in your mana base? How do the Mox Opals overall "feel" to you?

  4. #264

    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    Quote Originally Posted by ChemicalBurns View Post
    Great stuff! Kaono I'm still really curious about the mana - is Metalcraft reliable enough without the Ancient Dens in your mana base? How do the Mox Opals overall "feel" to you?
    Well, from a stats standpoint, below is the probability of having 3 artifacts in hand for each turn based on # of artifacts. Looks good so far. However, this doesn't really look at the whole picture.

    ____ _10 __11 __12 __13 __14 _15 _16 __17 _18
    Turn 1 31% 38% 45% 52% 59% 65% 71% 76% 81%
    Turn 2 40% 48% 55% 62% 69% 75% 80% 84% 88%
    Turn 3 49% 57% 64% 71% 77% 83% 87% 90% 93%

    Tweaking the hypergeometric distribution probability we can get a bit of a better idea of how that shapes up in our opening hand given the fact that the other mox opals don't count. So that said, with a sample of 6 (assuming an opal in hand) a success rate of 2 (other artifacts) and a # of success = 18 (remaining non opal/ballista/chalice artifacts) we have a probability of success (opal + 2 non opal artifacts) at around 59%.

    Adding 4 den bumps that # to 72%. 2 den is 66%.

    Personally I find that the additional resiliency vs wasteland/moon that basic plains gives us is worth more than the % increase in turning on an early mox opal, especially since in postboard games I'm often siding out fast mana but can see an argument for both sides.

    As for the general "feel", I do find that I leave some baubles uncracked to account for keeping metalcraft on.

    Speaking of sideboarding, I'm curious if anyone has put together a fleshed out guide given the current meta. I feel like I'm still haphazard in my strategies and just follow a few general rules.
    Last edited by Kaono; 06-20-2018 at 10:57 AM.

  5. #265

    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaono View Post
    Well, from a stats standpoint, below is the probability of having 3 artifacts in hand for each turn based on # of artifacts. Looks good so far. However, this doesn't really look at the whole picture.

    ____ _10 __11 __12 __13 __14 _15 _16 __17 _18
    Turn 1 31% 38% 45% 52% 59% 65% 71% 76% 81%
    Turn 2 40% 48% 55% 62% 69% 75% 80% 84% 88%
    Turn 3 49% 57% 64% 71% 77% 83% 87% 90% 93%

    Tweaking the hypergeometric distribution probability we can get a bit of a better idea of how that shapes up in our opening hand given the fact that the other mox opals don't count. So that said, with a sample of 6 (assuming an opal in hand) a success rate of 2 (other artifacts) and a # of success = 18 (remaining non opal/ballista/chalice artifacts) we have a probability of success (opal + 2 non opal artifacts) at around 59%.

    Adding 4 den bumps that # to 72%. 2 den is 66%.

    Personally I find that the additional resiliency vs wasteland/moon that basic plains gives us is worth more than the % increase in turning on an early mox opal, especially since in postboard games I'm often siding out fast mana but can see an argument for both sides.

    As for the general "feel", I do find that I leave some baubles uncracked to account for keeping metalcraft on.

    Speaking of sideboarding, I'm curious if anyone has put together a fleshed out guide given the current meta. I feel like I'm still haphazard in my strategies and just follow a few general rules.
    Kaono, I'm planning a big overhaul of the primer with recent developments moving forward. Will likely add matchups and sideboarding etc. there. Personally I am a big fan of trimming down LEDs (and trimming an Opal) and just grinding the opponent out with Karn/Mentor/Salvagers in fair matchups, and cutting Ballistas and fair cards like Karn in combo matchups and boarding in relevant combo cards.



    This is basically a Blue Mentor-ish card that doesn't die to Bolt, but doesn't have the obvious absurd damage output. It does lead to the drawing of our whole deck during the combo turn though, which is certainly interesting. I think this is worth trying to supplement Mentor?

  6. #266

    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    re: sideboarding I pretty much do the same thing

    Sai looks great -- I've found the deck has a big problem with opposing flying creatures. What I don't like is it takes us out of monowhite, is worse than mentor at our plan b, and an onboard mentor in a combo turn will typically win the game anyway so this replacing it doesn't necessarily speed up the kill.

    Space is tight so I'm curious what Sai's inclusion would make the deck look like. Those thopters do make Karn constructs huge though... I wonder if cavern/petal/opal is enough to splash a single Sai alongside mentor.

  7. #267
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    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    I mean, he is another human. The humans build a few posts above could slot him right in. Plus, you can recruiter for him. This may just be better than mentor in that build because he serves the purpose of the draw engine and the dudes in one card.
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  8. #268

    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    If we had a blue Auriok Salvagers or similar, to make infinite mana with LED, I would definitely switch to a mono-blue deck with this guy slotting in for Mentor. It's harder to kill and works better with Karn (except that casting Karn doesn't trigger him). The fact he doesn't make arbitrarily large tokens allowing one to get through for lethal is irrelevant since his draw ability allows you to kill immediately. That his tokens also fly is very relevant in the meta (e.g., lots of people siding Bitterblossom vs Marit Lage decks).

    I did like being able to build-your-own-scry w/ Mishra's Bauble and fetch lands in the BW version before Karn, but am also inclined to stay mono-W currently, though it's closer than you think.


    edit: the more I think about it, the more I'm convincing myself this guy is just way better than Mentor for this deck. I'm definitely going UW when M19 comes out.
    Last edited by f7eleven; 06-21-2018 at 03:07 PM.

  9. #269
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    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    Does playing the Thopterist mean we should also play a couple Karakas to protect him and shore up reanimator and lage?

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  10. #270

    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    Playing Sai probably means cutting some utility lands like Karakas/Inventor's Fair. For now I'll be sticking with monowhite build but am very curious to see how the testing goes for everyone.

  11. #271

    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    I've been on Bomberman in paper since October, and signed up for manatraders this week to play it online as well. Not every person will make me click through the combo, and clicking through it probably isn't that bad anyway... I told myself.

    Nope, 100% of your opponents in the league will not concede. And Nope, clicking through it IS really bad. Anyway, dropped from the league at 1-3, but would've been 3-1 IRL.

    I did get this out of it, at least... started the combo with just over 11 minutes on my clock, won the match with 11 seconds on my clock -- at least I got one of the bastards! Also, this was my first ever league - is it common to play vs a ton of jank? The 4 decks I faced were some kind of budget BUG control with maindeck Pernicious Deeds, Slivers, a deck with 4x Dack Fayden, and Phyrexian Unlife/Solemnity (which I had the Lodestone kill against, but not nearly enough time to generate 150 mana so I could make him draw 50 cards.

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  12. #272
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    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    Quote Originally Posted by ChemicalBurns View Post
    Kaono, I'm planning a big overhaul of the primer with recent developments moving forward. Will likely add matchups and sideboarding etc. there. Personally I am a big fan of trimming down LEDs (and trimming an Opal) and just grinding the opponent out with Karn/Mentor/Salvagers in fair matchups, and cutting Ballistas and fair cards like Karn in combo matchups and boarding in relevant combo cards.



    This is basically a Blue Mentor-ish card that doesn't die to Bolt, but doesn't have the obvious absurd damage output. It does lead to the drawing of our whole deck during the combo turn though, which is certainly interesting. I think this is worth trying to supplement Mentor?
    Thanks, as always, for the attention to our format and the ideas put forward on mtggoldfish.

    I have some possibly controversial thoughts about a U/W build and about Karn in general that i want to float.

    I think the best thing about Karn is that it enables a mono-white build of the deck, which comes with its one benefits (smoother mana) and drawbacks (no tutor effect than IF and no card draw other than the normal baubles and Karn). I don't think Karn has a place in versions other than mono-white.

    Here are my problems with the card:

    1. Any card that provides your opponent a choice as to how you benefit from it can be problematic. Sure, there will be times that both cards turned over to Karn are awesome, but our deck has a ton of air and there are plenty of times that "drawing a card" is "drawing a land" or "drawing a Lotus Petal." I don't think this ability is worth it outside of a mono-white build because a mono-white build has no other good option.

    2. The card is not a human, which means it can be countered without any way for us to ensure that it resolves, other than playing around Daze and having a Chalice on 1 for Spell Pierce. Yes, we are spoiled in being able to use Cavern to resolve our spells, but that is something we should abuse as much as possible.

    3. Compare this with Dark Confidant in black, which can be resolved on turn 1 (even uncounterably with a cavern) and immediately puts an opponent under pressure to kill it. Karn on turn 2-4 (or even later) doesn't have close to the impact in the early turns, which makes it more difficult to combo out an opponent in turns 1-3.

    3. It can actually set us behind if we flip the exact combo card we need and an opponent decides that we can draw the other card. Pure card draw is always going to be better than conditional card draw.

    4. The other modes on Karn are cute and awesome, but we don't need them. Other than against Chalice on 0 decks and DnT, we have a very favorable matchups against fair decks in my experience. We can win out of nowhere, which means opponents need to keep up removal for Salvagers (and not Bob). We can turbo out a combo before they cans set up any defense. We can already grind them out with Mentor and Auriok. I don't see the problem that Karn is solving, exceptcard draw in mono-white.

    The reason this matters (and that I bring it up) is that there is a huge amount to gain in a splash for either Blue or Black. With Black comes Dark Confidant and, if you're feeling frisky, Magus of the Will, which has been a house for me and yet another must-answer threat. The Blue splash brings Trinket Mage and Sai, which are both awesome. It also opens up playing Paradoxical Outcome instead of Karn, which has been much better in testing than Karn could ever be in a U/W build (plus being able to bounce Trinket Mage and redeploy is silly-good).

    Lastly, I think the right mana base for either of these splashes is not a traditional fetchland-dual setup but actually a playset (or close to it) of the artifact lands. It helps a bunch with turning on Opal and there is generally no drawback to making the switch except not being able to run a basic plains profitably, which is definitely a downside, but not a serious issue (honestly Dragon Stompy is already unwinnable, so a basic plains is far from sufficient to turn the matchup).

    As for Sai, I think it is an easy two-of in a U/W list, especially one set up to abuse Paradoxical Outcome to generate an army of Thopters. Here is what it could look like:

    Creatures:
    4 Auriok Salvagers
    2 Sai
    4 Monastery Mentor
    3 Walking Ballista (Thalia and a T1 Delver still needs to die)
    3 Trinket Mage

    Artifacts:
    4 Mishra's Bauble
    4 Urza's Bauble (zero Lodestone Bauble, given that Sai provides another win-con and the Lodestone-specific win-con is literally just Enchantress and decks that run Glacial Chasm)
    3 Mox Opal
    3 LED
    4 Chalice
    1 EE
    4 Lotus Petal

    Spells:
    3 Paradoxical Outcome

    Lands:
    4 Ancient Den
    3 Seat of Synod
    2 Inventor's Fair
    4 Cavern of Souls
    2 City of Traitors
    3 Ancient Tomb

    I would love to hear your thoughts. Again, I just want to push the conversation forward and not have us settle in to anything being dogma in a deck with a bunch of potential and so little testing.

  13. #273
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    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaono View Post
    Speaking of sideboarding, I'm curious if anyone has put together a fleshed out guide given the current meta. I feel like I'm still haphazard in my strategies and just follow a few general rules.
    I think the boards differ quite a bit between the Mono-white build and various other colors--not only because the other colors offer other sideboard cards, but because the weaknesses change drastically.

    For example in my U/W build, I only run 2 Crypts because I have three Trinket Mages. Trinket Mage also means a one-of sideboard EE is really a four-of, which is great. I don't think it's worth running in W/B because there are so few ways to find it.

    Other than that, I think W/B is the only build that offers a great sideboard card in the color that is splashed, which is Kitesail. I don't run anything blue in the U/W board after trying (and not being impressed) by Venser and Meddling Mage.

    The key, non-negotiable cards I see right now in the board are:

    Sanctum Prelate
    Containment Priest
    Ensnaring Bridge
    Tormod's Crypt

    Other white cards I have tried and abandoned (but I am not on mono-white, so I would probably play these if I was):

    Cast Out
    Ethersworn Canonist
    Swords to Plowshares
    Seal of Cleansing
    Disenchant
    Blessed Alliance
    Devout Witness

    Black:

    Kitesail Freebooter
    Orzhof Pontiff

    Blue:

    ...

    Have you tried anything else?

  14. #274

    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    I actually can't really agree on Paradoxical Outcome over Karn - PO does one thing: draw cards - and it does so conditionally as well. You mentioned that Karn gets slammed into countermagic, but so does PO. Karn is not just a card draw engine though - his ability to spew out creatures larger than Tarmogoyf and Angler often has made many matchups, particularly matchup where you need not fear Bolt, very, very easy, because it allows the deck to shift gears into a Mentor/Karn beatdown deck. This is particularly notable against decks like D&T and Maverick where flooding the board with aggressive creatures generally gets there, combo or otherwise. I think you are really overrating PO here - I tried many, many shells when I played UW, and when you are behind the card really, really sucks. Karn, on the other hand, can singlehandedly stabilise a board and pull you back ahead.

    I think compared to Bob though Karn definitely has less of a role in Black builds, because comparably it's counterable, comes out slower etc. So yes, I certainly agree on that point.

    In addition to Mono-White, I've been trying Blue-White and have been very happy with it so far.

    Lands: (19)
    4 Ancient Tomb
    4 Cavern of Souls
    2 City of Traitors
    4 Flooded Strand
    1 Inventors' Fair
    1 Karakas
    1 Plains
    2 Tundra

    Creatures: (15)
    4 Auriok Salvagers
    4 Monastery Mentor
    3 Sai, Master Thopterist
    2 Trinket Mage
    2 Walking Ballista

    Non-Creature Spells: (26)
    4 Chalice of the Void
    1 Engineered Explosives
    2 Karn, Scion of Urza
    4 Lion's Eye Diamond
    4 Lotus Petal
    3 Mox Opal
    4 Mishra's Bauble
    4 Urza's Bauble

    Sideboard: (15)
    2 Containment Priest
    1 Engineered Explosives
    2 Sanctum Prelate
    2 Seal of Cleansing
    2 Sorcerous Spyglass
    1 Surge Node
    2 Swords to Plowshares
    1 Tormod's Crypt
    2 Warping Wail

    I'm pretty impressed with Sai as "additional" Mentors, and does really help post-board when you care less about comboing and are aiming to beatdown more so. I've been umming and erring on the number of Ballistas and think two is probably best - you need to natural draw them vs. Elves, D&T and Maverick to put yourself in a strong position. Note that Sai himself has been very very sucky vs. D&T though.

  15. #275
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    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    Quote Originally Posted by ChemicalBurns View Post
    I actually can't really agree on Paradoxical Outcome over Karn - PO does one thing: draw cards - and it does so conditionally as well. You mentioned that Karn gets slammed into countermagic, but so does PO. Karn is not just a card draw engine though - his ability to spew out creatures larger than Tarmogoyf and Angler often has made many matchups, particularly matchup where you need not fear Bolt, very, very easy, because it allows the deck to shift gears into a Mentor/Karn beatdown deck. This is particularly notable against decks like D&T and Maverick where flooding the board with aggressive creatures generally gets there, combo or otherwise. I think you are really overrating PO here - I tried many, many shells when I played UW, and when you are behind the card really, really sucks. Karn, on the other hand, can singlehandedly stabilise a board and pull you back ahead..
    I completely agree that PO has some downsides that are problematic for Karn as well. I guess I have never felt that making large creatures to compete with Goyf/Angler is that important. We can chump block to buy time fairly easily and often Mentor is sufficient to attack for the win without Karn, particularly when looping Petals. The reason I focused on the card drawing mode of Karn is because that is what I see that he provides that the deck actually needs as opposed to the other modes, which are certainly good but unnecessary. I continue to think that providing an opponent a choice as to what you draw is important to add to the equation when assessing the pros and cons for Karn, even if you and others still think Karn is the best choice. Karm is good, but I don't think he is unquestionably the right call in a U/W shell. PO and Thoughtcast both provide ways to dig for the combo that might make sense in some number.

    I also think Sai makes PO better because it provides another payout for replaying the artifacts that are bounced back to hand.

    Also, what is the surge node for (just Chalices on zero?).
    Last edited by cosmiccoil; 06-24-2018 at 11:39 AM.

  16. #276

    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    Finished 4th in a 61-player tourney for a Timetwister. The finish was good for 2x Tundra, which is nice since I was looking to get these in order to play Sai when M19 comes out!'

    I beat Burn, Grixis Delver, Maverick, and Grixis Delver again to get to 4-0, then double-drew into top 8. Beat Czech Pile in the quarters, then lost to BR Reanimator in 3 close games in the semis. Games 1 and 3 each (on the draw) I had 6+ draws to find a Salvagers for the win but it wasn't to be. The delver/pile match ups have gotten so much better for us since Karn.

    my current list:

    4 Ancient Den
    4 Ancient Tomb
    4 Cavern of Souls
    4 City of Traitors
    2 Karakas
    1 Plains
    4 Auriok Salvagers
    4 Chalice of the Void
    4 Karn, Scion of Urza
    4 Lion's Eye Diamond
    1 Lodestone Bauble
    4 Lotus Petal
    4 Mishra's Bauble
    4 Monastery Mentor
    4 Mox Opal
    4 Urza's Bauble
    4 Walking Ballista

    SB:
    2 Cast Out
    2 Containment Priest
    1 Engineered Explosives
    3 Ensnaring Bridge
    2 Ethersworn Canonist
    1 Lodestone Golem
    2 Sanctum Prelate
    2 Sorcerous Spyglass

  17. #277
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    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    Top 4'd a high payout event yesterday and cashed out with 70 bucks. I was again on the humans build. Lost to lands for the second time in as many weeks. Counting GP Vegas side events my match record for the last two weeks with the deck is 14-5.

    I really like the deck but I'm curious if the U/W version is better or not. Will try eventually. Sideboard options in the U/W version seem more manageable. In the humans build, I mostly have to have colorless hate unless it is stapled to a human body.

    Sai should even out the lands matchup considerably, but Tabernacle and Punishing Fire could still be an issue.



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  18. #278
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    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaono View Post


    Another "fun-of" for the humans build perhaps?
    He's interesting, but I'm not seeing it. The intent of running the human build is leaning on the Combo Game 1, and then giving yourself the option to lean a lot harder on a Grindy fair-game post-board. He doesn't seem like the best value card, so I don't think he has a logical place.

    Also, good to see you back and tearing it up with the deck again.

    Quote Originally Posted by Manroe View Post
    I mean, he is another human. The humans build a few posts above could slot him right in. Plus, you can recruiter for him. This may just be better than mentor in that build because he serves the purpose of the draw engine and the dudes in one card.
    Sai is interesting from the Human-Colored perspective, but I'm still a little skeptical. The primary concession of the Unclaimed Territory / Humans build is that you're less concerned over land-hate (Blood Moon/Wasteland) and want to make the tradeoff of running all non-basics to optimize the cards to steal game 1 off the Combo and give the most flexibility post-board.

    If he's a sideboard card to bring in, he strikes me as a 5th, underpowered Mentor. I don't know if that's really desirable over something like a Quicksmith Rebel or a Karn.

    If he's a mainboard card, he's inevitably taking the place of something that provides consistency in some way (A Confidant or a Tutor), and that seems to undercut the entire point of going for the Human Build. If I just wanted to fill my deck with good grindy cards and hope that I draw an appropriate combination off the top, why aren't I mono-W? There's plenty of good-enoughs without dipping into other colors now with Karn. Ditching the plains means you're really confident you want some specific ones, and I don't feel a big "specific" pull to this card.

    I'm not trying to hate on Sai, and without testing I could of course be off-base, but I'm struggling to see why you would include him in a Humans build. Running Unclaimed Territory presumably means that you've made the decision that you don't want to give yourself the extra points versus Moon/Wasteland, and instead want to run the best cards you can for every individual spell-slot. That simply doesn't sound to me like a scenario that 5th Weaker Mentor would enter. I'm not 100% that I'd want a Real 5th Mentor.

    Quote Originally Posted by cosmiccoil View Post
    I think the best thing about Karn is that it enables a mono-white build of the deck, which comes with its one benefits (smoother mana) and drawbacks (no tutor effect than IF and no card draw other than the normal baubles and Karn). I don't think Karn has a place in versions other than mono-white.
    A bit anecdotal given how short a time I'm basing this on, but Karn has actually been very good out of the sideboard in the Humans build as the deck often wants to be able to pivot to a much more fair-plan out of the board. I'm only running him as a 1-of though sideboard.

    Quote Originally Posted by cosmiccoil View Post
    I think the boards differ quite a bit between the Mono-white build and various other colors--not only because the other colors offer other sideboard cards, but because the weaknesses change drastically.
    This is strikes me as spot on.

    At the end of the day, all of the "variants" we are talking about are fundamentally the same deck. We're all 4x Salvagers/Mentor/LED/Chalice/Opal/Petal/Cavern + a Ton of Baubles. No one here, I think, is disputing the core. All the variants are primarily doing is "calling our shots" on what we want to be weaker against and what we want to be stronger against, so sideboards are definitely color-choice specific.

    Or, rather, the rest of the deck outside of the core is functionally an extension of your sideboard, because it is the deck positioning itself more so than a defining element.

  19. #279
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    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    Quote Originally Posted by Manroe View Post
    Top 4'd a high payout event yesterday and cashed out with 70 bucks. I was again on the humans build.
    Congrats on the Finish.

    I've also been on the Humans build for quite a while now; I'm curious as to what matchup you're finding it hard to board against (other than Lands, which is always going to be a bit of a bear, honestly.).

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    Re: Chalice Bomberman/Bomberman Stompy

    Quote Originally Posted by Rationalist View Post
    Congrats on the Finish.

    I've also been on the Humans build for quite a while now; I'm curious as to what matchup you're finding it hard to board against (other than Lands, which is always going to be a little harder, honestly.).
    Maybe I should clarify slightly what I meant. I don't think boarding decisions are all that hard. I actually board much like I used to with Elves when I played that awhile back. I just shave down numbers of combo pieces slightly, leaving all of the tutors and go from there. If I'm bringing in bridges, I likely want to hedge on Bob and etc. What I meant was more along the lines of colored mana for non-creature spells isn't always guaranteed and I'm not always confident I'll have it. I think this can be limiting in what exactly makes up the sideboard.

    For example, something like abrade doesn't seem terrible to me on paper but between accelerating out my pieces and a lot of chalices on 0 game 2 and 3, I can't always expect to have red with my current mana base. I hope that makes sense.

    Also as far as Sai goes, perhaps I'm too bought into the hype, but wouldn't he be about as good as mentor in this deck or perhaps even better? Am I reading too far into the fact that he has two parts of the combo stapled onto a body that can't be bolted, K-commanded or abraded in response?

    EDIT : And that 1/1 fliers attack much easier through bridge post board.

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