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Thread: Ruby Storm

  1. #1541

    Re: Ruby Storm

    Unfortunately I think that splashing blue is a requirement for this deck to have a shot at being genuinely competitive. I - and most others, I'm sure - stick to mono red largely for budget reasons. There are some arguments to be made in favor of mono red besides budget but I don't think they outweight the pros of splashing blue.

  2. #1542
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    Re: Ruby Storm

    Right now, I agree with you. Light up the Stage might change that dynamic slightly. The biggest loss was Gitaxian Probe so something along those lines is needed to get it back to par in a mono-red shell. A one mana Manamoprhose would probably do it.
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  3. #1543

    Re: Ruby Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by mistercakes View Post
    Hi Cakes!

    I have a doubt: in this version, your sideboard isnt too vulnerable to combos like storm and controls? I mean, do you cut blood moons, defense grids and REB/pyroblast to put 3 gutter and 3 ghirapur: worth it?
    And I dont have the LEDs in the moment, what do you suggest me: I was thinking in -4 leds + 2 bolts and +2 desperate. What do you think? Im open to suggestions.

    Cyah,

    Lammina
    Keep Walking, Voidwalker! - Use bugs with moderation -

  4. #1544

    Re: Ruby Storm

    Another interesting one:


    Might not make the cut, but the fact it is an instant and allows for the casting of spells outside the normal timing window (I think.... IANAJ), could allow for some fun tricks. Thinking something like opponent's EOT Seething song -> this -> drop guttersnipe, then untap and rock and roll. Probably too fringe and cute but figured I'd share it anyway.
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    Look at the bright side, if Legacy becomes like Vintage all of us old dudes can get together, drink whiskey, and smoke cigars while we play the gentleman's format. Like an MtG speak-easy.
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    I kept hearing random people around the room saying "manaless dredge!" like a sort of "hide your wives and your daughters, grab your pitchforks, say your prayers, the Beast is back" reaction.

  5. #1545
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    Re: Ruby Storm

    What is this referencing
    -rob

  6. #1546

  7. #1547

    Re: Ruby Storm

    Worth noting that this gives us the possibility of playing Ancestral Vision and Wheel of Fate. At instant speed even.
    Maybe a playset of those and a playset of Kari Zev's Expertise would make it reliable enough to give it a try.

  8. #1548
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    Re: Ruby Storm

    wondering how this works with act on impulse. act says until end of turn, does this mean after the end step, or does this trigger at some timing after the end step, like after the discard step?

    anyway, i would only see it being relevant with some kind of end step cast it for burning wish, for act on impulse, or for the new card light up the stage.

    outside of that i think you're bordering too much on unplayable cards.
    -rob

  9. #1549

    Re: Ruby Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by mistercakes View Post
    wondering how this works with act on impulse. act says until end of turn, does this mean after the end step, or does this trigger at some timing after the end step, like after the discard step?
    Since the cards are exiled and not in your hand I don't think there is any notable interaction here.
    EDIT:
    Actually I think I misread what you wanted to know: The end step is still part of the turn, and usually "at the end of your turn" is short-hand for "At the end step, after the active player passes me priority" so if you used this spell to cast Act on Impulse you could still play the revealed cards. Normal timing restrictions apply to the revealed cards.

  10. #1550
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    Re: Ruby Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit View Post
    Since the cards are exiled and not in your hand I don't think there is any notable interaction here.
    EDIT:
    Actually I think I misread what you wanted to know: The end step is still part of the turn, and usually "at the end of your turn" is short-hand for "At the end step, after the active player passes me priority" so if you used this spell to cast Act on Impulse you could still play the revealed cards. Normal timing restrictions apply to the revealed cards.
    yea i was trying to understand if i got those 3 exiled cards until my end step if i cast it on their end step.
    -rob

  11. #1551
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    Re: Ruby Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by Lammina View Post
    Hi Cakes!

    I have a doubt: in this version, your sideboard isnt too vulnerable to combos like storm and controls? I mean, do you cut blood moons, defense grids and REB/pyroblast to put 3 gutter and 3 ghirapur: worth it?
    And I dont have the LEDs in the moment, what do you suggest me: I was thinking in -4 leds + 2 bolts and +2 desperate. What do you think? Im open to suggestions.

    Cyah,

    Lammina
    Hiya,

    With no LED's I'd probably approach it like this:


    // 60 Maindeck
    // 8 Artifact
    4 Lotus Petal
    4 Ruby Medallion

    // 2 Creature
    2 Guttersnipe

    // 12 Instant
    4 Manamorphose
    4 Seething Song
    4 Desperate Ritual

    // 14 Land
    4 Ancient Tomb
    4 Sandstone Needle
    6 Mountain

    // 24 Sorcery
    4 Rite of Flame
    4 Burning Wish
    2 Past in Flames
    4 Bonus Round
    4 Act on Impulse
    4 Light up the Stage
    2 Reforge the Soul


    // 15 Sideboard
    // 2 Artifact
    SB: 2 Tormod's Crypt

    // 3 Creature
    SB: 3 Hope of Ghirapur

    // 2 Instant
    SB: 2 Pyroblast

    // 8 Sorcery
    SB: 1 Tendrils of Agony
    SB: 1 Grapeshot
    SB: 1 Empty the Warrens
    SB: 1 Past in Flames
    SB: 1 Fiery Confluence
    SB: 1 Hazoret's Undying Fury
    SB: 1 By Force
    SB: 1 Reforge the Soul


    feel free to tinker with it a bit. by no means is this list set in stone. you can also try to fit in bolts if you'd like. if so you can do the 2 maindeck bolts like you said and move the guttersnipes to the sb. guttersnipe is very good vs miracles post board. i haven't tested hope much, but it's probably pretty good vs a lot of the field + it works well with light up the stage.

    i've also been considering moving away from a reforge build in testing, but it's still not 100%:

    // 61 Maindeck
    // 12 Artifact
    4 Lotus Petal
    4 Ruby Medallion
    4 Lion's Eye Diamond

    // 11 Instant
    4 Manamorphose
    4 Seething Song
    3 Desperate Ritual

    // 14 Land
    4 Ancient Tomb
    4 Sandstone Needle
    6 Mountain

    // 24 Sorcery
    3 Rite of Flame
    4 Burning Wish
    2 Past in Flames
    4 Bonus Round
    4 Act on Impulse
    4 Light up the Stage
    3 Hazoret's Undying Fury


    // 15 Sideboard
    // 6 Creature
    SB: 3 Hope of Ghirapur
    SB: 3 Guttersnipe

    // 9 Sorcery
    SB: 1 Tendrils of Agony
    SB: 1 Grapeshot
    SB: 1 Empty the Warrens
    SB: 1 Past in Flames
    SB: 1 Fiery Confluence
    SB: 1 Hazoret's Undying Fury
    SB: 1 Rite of Flame
    SB: 1 By Force
    SB: 1 Reforge the Soul


    main reasoning behind this is that with 4 act and 4 stage, hazoret's is a much better card than hoping to hit reforge the soul. this opened up too many chances to give opponents what they need. usually hazoret's with bonus round won't matter if you hit a reforge or not, but without bonus round hazoret's in this configuration might be better. will need to test more after the new card comes out.

    led also used to only work really well off hazoret's with wish/act/pif (and reforge, but it's always a bit risky after sb with that card - game 1 always great), but with stage you have another legit card. tapping out for hazoret's is relatively safe in terms of trying to get enough mana to play your exiled cards.

    main advantage for reforge is that hitting the miracle is really great vs a lot of decks and can steal games pretty easily.

    reforge would have this build:


    // 61 Maindeck
    // 13 Artifact
    4 Lotus Petal
    4 Ruby Medallion
    4 Lion's Eye Diamond
    1 Scroll Rack

    // 9 Instant
    4 Manamorphose
    4 Seething Song
    1 Desperate Ritual

    // 14 Land
    4 Ancient Tomb
    4 Sandstone Needle
    6 Mountain

    // 25 Sorcery
    3 Rite of Flame
    4 Burning Wish
    2 Past in Flames
    4 Bonus Round
    4 Act on Impulse
    4 Light up the Stage
    4 Reforge the Soul


    // 15 Sideboard
    // 2 Artifact
    SB: 2 Tormod's Crypt

    // 5 Creature
    SB: 3 Hope of Ghirapur
    SB: 2 Guttersnipe

    // 8 Sorcery
    SB: 1 Tendrils of Agony
    SB: 1 Grapeshot
    SB: 1 Empty the Warrens
    SB: 1 Past in Flames
    SB: 1 Fiery Confluence
    SB: 1 Hazoret's Undying Fury
    SB: 1 Rite of Flame
    SB: 1 By Force


    i'm still torn a bit about the sb and really do like bolts in the deck, just not sure how to fit them.
    -rob

  12. #1552

    Re: Ruby Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by mistercakes View Post
    yea i was trying to understand if i got those 3 exiled cards until my end step if i cast it on their end step.
    You'll have them through their end step, but once you untap it's your turn and not theirs anymore so Act is over. To do the end-of-turn trick the card needs to say "until the beginning of the next end step" Compare the text to Through the Breech to see what I mean.

  13. #1553
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    Re: Ruby Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by FourDogsinaHorseSuit View Post
    You'll have them through their end step, but once you untap it's your turn and not theirs anymore so Act is over. To do the end-of-turn trick the card needs to say "until the beginning of the next end step" Compare the text to Through the Breech to see what I mean.
    yep that makes sense. that's what i feared! definitely doesn't make the cut then.

    i goldfished that hazoret's build a bunch and i think the reforge is still a better build. the 61st card (scroll rack/desperate ritual) is great. scroll rack is a must answer when vs control decks and it smooths out the ancient tomb / no red source hands.
    -rob

  14. #1554

    Re: Ruby Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by mistercakes View Post
    yep that makes sense. that's what i feared! definitely doesn't make the cut then.

    i goldfished that hazoret's build a bunch and i think the reforge is still a better build. the 61st card (scroll rack/desperate ritual) is great. scroll rack is a must answer when vs control decks and it smooths out the ancient tomb / no red source hands.
    Hi everyone.
    I just made an account to comment about this deck. I really like how the deck plays, the decisions making and how powerful it is for a budget deck. I am still in the process of acquiring cards, but I have proxied the deck and tested it against friends.

    Regarding the rules question, as a level 1 judge I want to confirm this. If you play Act on Impulse during the end step the cards are only availble til the end of that turn, not during the next.
    Mister Cakes if you would take Act on Impulse out of the deck, what would you replace them with? I like the card, it interacts so well with many other cards in the deck, and I am not sure if Light up the Stage is better than it, probably not I think.
    I also have a few questions about your choice to play 61 cards and about the deck in general. Do you not feel an impact on your mana with another nonland in the deck? I play 15 lands atm and it feels right, but a lot of lists have 14 lands. But then again I don't have LEDs.
    And what's important to look for in a starting hand? Of course I want hands that have a good balance of lands, rituals and draw spells. But are there more subtle things about the mulligan and how important is it to have specific cards?

  15. #1555

    Re: Ruby Storm

    Personally I'm interested in Light Up The Stage specifically because it lets you play the cards on your next turn. IMO the biggest downside of Act On Impulse (and of the deck in general) is that you cannot use it to sculpt your hand like you can with blue cantrips. When you cast Act you have to be able to use the cards immediately or else they are lost forever. LutS actually enables you to set up your next turn.

  16. #1556
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    Re: Ruby Storm

    tbh i've used act on impulse as a "cantrip" many times. in this case it's most useful for digging for a land. the best part about AoI is late game, when you have a Ruby out and 3-4 lands, it can often mean game over for a blue deck who has already spent a lot of cards blocking your combo. scroll rack is also useful for playing the slow game.

    to speak to trigunner's points (and thanks for joining):

    also thanks for confirming on AoI. (i've been playing for a long time and remember the old shenanigans with waylay, so just wanted to make sure.)

    if you would take Act on Impulse out of the deck, what would you replace them with?

    my thoughts on this are probably if you are cutting AoI, then LED gets a lot worse. I would highly recommend trying out Josef's version which is using UR and adds brainstorm and ponder. You can very likely get away with just shock lands with this deck if you don't own volcanic islands, although any number of volcanic islands will be better than steam vents. (1 and 3 could be okay maybe).

    I like the card, it interacts so well with many other cards in the deck, and I am not sure if Light up the Stage is better than it, probably not I think.

    AoI is generally a lot better than Light up the Stage in testing. Having both in a single deck with LED is invaluable. My consistency for turn 2 kills has increased a bunch. (I haven't run numbers, but it's pretty solid.) If you do cut AoI and LED, I don't think that LutS makes the cut either.

    I also have a few questions about your choice to play 61 cards and about the deck in general. Do you not feel an impact on your mana with another nonland in the deck? I play 15 lands atm and it feels right, but a lot of lists have 14 lands. But then again I don't have LEDs.

    I enjoy playing 61 cards because I like 14 lands and would really like to go to 13, but I think it's safer to add the 47th non-land instead of cutting the 14th land. Sandstone Needle plays a pretty big role here in making sure your land drops can catch up a bit better. Also the Scroll Rack can make up for those awkward multiple Ancient Tomb hands as I've mentioned earlier.

    And what's important to look for in a starting hand?

    I think with this deck you really want a red land or Tomb+Petal in your opening 7. There's a few all in hands that would consistent of something like LED, LED, PiF, RoF, RoF, Seething Song, Burning Wish that you can maybe steal if you know your opponent isn't running FoW. (this would make 16 goblins on the play)

    You can also keep the hands with Tomb + Scroll rack even though it's a bit risky if you don't have a 2nd mana source.

    Of course I want hands that have a good balance of lands, rituals and draw spells. But are there more subtle things about the mulligan and how important is it to have specific cards?

    I'll answer with some goldfishing hands:

    Hand 1:
    LED, LP, MTN, MTN, SN (sandstone needle), BW, PiF
    (i'd keep on both play and draw)

    Hand 2:
    RtS, MM (manamorphose), LeD, SS, RM (ruby medallion), LutS, SN
    (i think this is an easy keep, even though it's weak to wasteland it looks like a turn 2/3 kill (turn 2 if you draw a land, turn 3 if not).

    Hand 3:
    AoI, SS, BW, BW, BW, LutS, LP
    (easy mull)

    Hand 3.5
    it mulled into:
    LP, RoF, RoF, BR, LutS, LED.
    (this is kind of tough, i would keep on the play vs an unknown opponent especially with the scry (the scry was Desperate Ritual which would scry to the bottom))

    Hand 4:
    SS, RM, LP, LED, BW, LutS, AT (Ancient Tomb)
    (I'd keep this, although I think to play it safer you might just want to play Tomb -> RM and pass. Having two additional mana the following turn and another card should ensure a better chance of winning, although it does open you up to wasteland a bit.) On the draw vs a Thalia deck or a combo deck where speed matters maybe just go for it.

    Hand 5:
    LutS, MM, MM, RoF, AoI, RM, PiF
    (pretty straight forward mulligan)

    hand 5.5:
    BW, BW, RM, BR, SN, LP
    (i'd keep this, the scry was reforge the soul. I'd be pretty happy playing out SN and Petal here, then trying to miracle the following turn. If it gets countered you get an additional draw, so then just play it by ear.

    Hand 6:
    MM, MM, AoI, RtS, BW, SS, Mtn
    (this is a tough one. on the draw I'd keep, but on the play it's pretty risky, I'd probably mull on the play.)

    Hope this was somewhat helpful. Again if you don't have the LED's it's probably better to run the cantrip version, since this way you can reliably hit your 2nd and 3rd lands. Brainstorm and Ponder also set up Reforge rather well.

    If you did want to run a Non-LED version without blue I'd probably try to max out on Ritual Effects (except keep 1 RoF in the sb).

    You can try this in goldfishing and let me know how it goes:

    // 60 Maindeck
    // 8 Artifact
    4 Lotus Petal
    4 Ruby Medallion

    // 1 Creature
    1 Guttersnipe

    // 12 Instant
    4 Manamorphose
    4 Seething Song
    4 Desperate Ritual

    // 14 Land
    4 Ancient Tomb
    4 Sandstone Needle
    6 Mountain

    // 25 Sorcery
    3 Rite of Flame
    4 Burning Wish
    2 Past in Flames
    4 Bonus Round
    4 Act on Impulse
    4 Light up the Stage
    4 Reforge the Soul


    // 10 Sideboard
    // 3 Creature
    SB: 3 Hope of Ghirapur


    // 6 Sorcery
    SB: 1 Tendrils of Agony
    SB: 1 Grapeshot
    SB: 1 Empty the Warrens
    SB: 1 Past in Flames
    SB: 1 Fiery Confluence
    SB: 1 Hazoret's Undying Fury
    SB: 1 Rite of Flame

    5x whatever. you could also swap the guttersnipe spot for a Helm of Awakening, Lightning Bolt, or Scroll Rack. I think all 3 are fine. Maybe Helm could be good to help make up for lack of LED's.

    you could also move 1 AoI to the sb, and run 2 helm of awakening. I'd give that a shot actually. Could be really fun. It's more all in, but I think with this list you can get away with it:

    // 60 Maindeck
    // 11 Artifact
    4 Lotus Petal
    4 Ruby Medallion
    3 Helm of Awakening

    // 12 Instant
    4 Manamorphose
    4 Seething Song
    4 Desperate Ritual

    // 14 Land
    4 Ancient Tomb
    4 Sandstone Needle
    6 Mountain

    // 23 Sorcery
    3 Rite of Flame
    4 Burning Wish
    2 Past in Flames
    4 Bonus Round
    3 Act on Impulse
    4 Light up the Stage
    3 Reforge the Soul


    // 15 Sideboard
    // 2 Artifact
    SB: 2 Tormod's Crypt

    // 4 Creature
    SB: 2 Hope of Ghirapur
    SB: 2 Guttersnipe

    // 9 Sorcery
    SB: 1 Tendrils of Agony
    SB: 1 Grapeshot
    SB: 1 Empty the Warrens
    SB: 1 Past in Flames
    SB: 1 Fiery Confluence
    SB: 1 Hazoret's Undying Fury
    SB: 1 Rite of Flame
    SB: 1 Act on Impulse
    SB: 1 Reforge the Soul

    (not sure if stage should be the sb card or not, i think aoi might be a better sb card as a wish target).
    Last edited by mistercakes; 01-06-2019 at 05:08 PM.
    -rob

  17. #1557

    Re: Ruby Storm

    Just for the heck of it, Commune with Lava is a thing. I still jam it in my version, Light up the Stage would be in addition to it, maybe replace it, but probably not. Commune with a Bonus Round gets ridiculous, and really feels like Ad Nauseam on steriods.

    I've greatly enjoyed Guttersnipe in times gone by, but they've been replaced by Lightning Bolts. I dislike turning on creature removal, and there's so much of it, some of it specific to critters. Why turn those cards on? I'm likely to add Sandstone Needle, tried them on Cockatrice and enjoyed them.

    MD - Ruby Storm - Lightning Bonus
    4 Ruby Medallion
    4 Lotus Petal
    4 Lion's Eye Diamond
    4 Seething Song
    4 Manamorphose
    2 Lightning Bolt
    3 Commune with Lava
    10 Mountain
    4 Ancient Tomb
    1 Past in Flames
    4 Rite of Flame
    4 Act on Impulse
    4 Burning Wish
    2 Faithless Looting
    2 Overmaster
    3 Bonus Round
    1 Fiery Confluence

    SB
    3 Defense Grid
    1 Past in Flames
    1 Reforge the Soul
    1 Tendrils of Agony
    1 By Force
    1 Cave-In
    1 Shattering Spree
    1 Chain Lightning
    1 Banefire
    1 Bonus Round
    1 Empty the Warrens
    1 Grapeshot
    1 Fiery Confluence

  18. #1558

    Re: Ruby Storm

    @ahg113
    For me the by far most wished for card in my sideboard is rite of flame #4. I have such hard time seeing how the deck can work without it, so i am intrigued how it seemingly does work for some.
    One very common line for me is:
    Seething song -> bonus round -> manamorphose -> burning wish for RoF + PiF, cast them, replay RoF SS Bonus round manamorphose for 4 cards and 8 mana. Without additional useful cards in hand what can you get in that situation?
    If i have desperate ritual instead of manamorphose i just get RoF and Hazoret.
    Having RoF in the sideboard makes a bonus rounded burning wish into a wincondition if you have at least 3 mana (3 mana gets you a Empty). Do you never get in that situation?

    Another thing entirely but I've been thinking about the hard matchups lately and that they all get hosed pretty good by Chalice of the void. As i play 11 1 drops i don't think i can run it, but if i were forced to play mono red, i would definitely consider running 4. Stops discard/spell pierce/surgical as well as stopping cantripping and makes it really hard for BR-reanimator to get a creature to the graveyard. Man, i think i talked myself into playing it even with the blue splash!

  19. #1559
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    Re: Ruby Storm

    I tried chalice a little bit in the beginning when I was running Chandra, but the deck has evolved a bit since then!

    Feel free to try it out. I suppose a turn 1 chalice steals enough games. A storm deck that can maindeck chalice could be good, but would need more testing.

    Not sure what I would cut for them though. (should be worth noting that it's not very useful with a resolved bonus round.)
    -rob

  20. #1560

    Re: Ruby Storm

    Quote Originally Posted by JosefK View Post
    @ahg113
    For me the by far most wished for card in my sideboard is rite of flame #4. I have such hard time seeing how the deck can work without it, so i am intrigued how it seemingly does work for some.
    One very common line for me is:
    Seething song -> bonus round -> manamorphose -> burning wish for RoF + PiF, cast them, replay RoF SS Bonus round manamorphose for 4 cards and 8 mana. Without additional useful cards in hand what can you get in that situation?
    If i have desperate ritual instead of manamorphose i just get RoF and Hazoret.
    Having RoF in the sideboard makes a bonus rounded burning wish into a wincondition if you have at least 3 mana (3 mana gets you a Empty). Do you never get in that situation?

    Another thing entirely but I've been thinking about the hard matchups lately and that they all get hosed pretty good by Chalice of the void. As i play 11 1 drops i don't think i can run it, but if i were forced to play mono red, i would definitely consider running 4. Stops discard/spell pierce/surgical as well as stopping cantripping and makes it really hard for BR-reanimator to get a creature to the graveyard. Man, i think i talked myself into playing it even with the blue splash!
    There's a big difference in playing a blue splash or not. By flipping over so many cards with Act or Commune, I can often over power with mana not needing the 4th RoF in the board. Plus there's LED to help the mana fixing as needed.

    Red Storm and Purple Storm feel like very different concepts about threat density versus proactive/reactive interaction. I often play this deck passively until I feel I have the nuts to just win. Small exception if I can parlay a decent Commune (~4/5 cards) to untap with sufficient lands and a ruby the following turn.

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