Yea overall shreds is useful, it does need a rock in play for it to be good, otherwise with a seething song you net - 1 mana.
Compacta, thanks for the list. My only main concern with your list is its rather cold to a turn 2 Leovold. It's not unbeatable, but quite difficult if they know what they're doing. You can still steal games vs baddies.
It's nice that you have your own build, I'm a little hesitant to run only ten initial sources (excluding petals).
Hopefully I'll be able to get some practice in. I think I'll be going to eternal weekend in Paris. It's a bit cheaper than the UK grand prix and less a logistical nightmare.
-rob
Oh that is why I dropped a tomb for a mountain. It's been a balance of red.
Faithless looting helps smooth things out actually.
leovold is probably the worst thing for this deck overall. Act on Impulse gets around it obviously, and reforge isn't 100% necessary. SB kill slots help.
Reforge also works as a discard spell. Probe, see Leo, go into reforge to make them ditch it, even if you don't combo that turn.
BUG packing abrupt decay, DRS, Leo, -/- effects, counterspells, and hymn is the hardest matchup. I played your original list at EW and got wrecked by that specifically. Czech pile as well as straight up bug control.
Flame slash, Pyroblast, and Abrade out of the SB are for Leo almost specifically.
Mr. Safety- if you like Shreds, try Mizzix's mastery ;)
I have made a few small adjustments to my list, mostly because Shreds was only giving me a sorcery most of the time. The adjustments are really not significant, other than I think overall it makes the deck better. In short: -1 SSG, -1 Shreds of Sanity, +2 Desperate Ritual. So that leaves one Shreds, which I feel is better than the singleton Gamble I was playing. The DRituals are better during the storm turn (I was leaning on SSG to occasionally get me a t1 Ruby/Helm.)
So my new list goes like this, and I'm actually really pleased with it so far.
4x Rite of Flame
4x Seething Song
3x Desperate Ritual
4x Manamorphose
4x Lotus Petal
4x Ruby Medallion
1x Helm of Awakening
4x Burning Wish
3x Past in Flames
1x Hazoret's Undying Fury
2x Empty the Warrens
4x Gitaxian Probe
3x Overmaster
4x Act on Impulse
1x Shreds of Sanity
10x Mountain
4x Crystal Vein
Sideboard
1x Tendrils of Agony
1x Empty the Warrens
1x Grapeshot
1x Past in Flames
1x Goblin War Strike
1x Reforge the Soul
1x By Force
1x Cave-In (this might become Pyroclasm, empty-handed its better)
2x Blood Moon
2x Scab-Clan Berserker
1x Ensnaring Bridge
1x Tormod's Crypt
1x Guttersnipe
Debating on sideboard Pyroblasts again, just because I'm not sure how good the singletons of Bridge/Crypt/Guttersnipe are now that Gamble is out of the mix. Flame Slash seems tech as well, just because I need a way to handle Leovold.
Brainstorm Realist
I close my eyes and sink within myself, relive the gift of precious memories, in need of a fix called innocence. - Chuck Shuldiner
the one major case that i think is relevant is that pyroclasm can kill gaddock teeg, and cave-in cannot. other than that it makes not much difference. if you have a guttersnipe in play, then burning wish for cave-in is 6 damage total. could be helpful. also if no ruby in play, cave-in is actually 2 mana cheaper, this might be the difference between dying vs a storm deck that's made a bunch of goblins and your hand is kind of still shaping up, or maybe it got therapied like crazy.
-rob
I was playing against a deck playing Liliana of the Veil and I was down to one card a turn. I top-decked a Burning Wish, which could have wiped out a Dark Confidant and Deathrite Shaman with Pyroclasm...but I didn't have enough mana, nor did I have a red card to pitch to Cave-In. It's a corner case, but I could see Pyroclasm being better simply because it will always cost 1R or R. Cave-In will always cost a red card in hand or 3-5 mana. Again, corner case, but I could see it being relevant against some decks.
Against Storm it would better with Cave-In of course, but again, my point was that pyroclasm is better empty handed.
Brainstorm Realist
I close my eyes and sink within myself, relive the gift of precious memories, in need of a fix called innocence. - Chuck Shuldiner
Just run one of each.
my latest build is running both. on the primer.
Last edited by mistercakes; 01-26-2018 at 06:05 AM.
-rob
That's probably correct. I'm having trouble stuffing everything into the board is all. I think some of the singletons can go, like Bridge. Without a lot of real tournament experience it might be correct to drop the Blood Moons, not sure.
Sideboard could look like this (want to get a Flame Slash in there as well):
1x Tendrils
1x EtW
1x Pif
1x Grapeshot
1x War Strike
1x Reforge
1x By Force
1x Cave-In
1x Pyroclasm
1x Flame Slash
2x Scab-Clan Berserker
3x metagame guesses (TCrypt, Blood Moon, Pyroblast, EBridge)
Cool new primer BTW. I wasn't surprised at Guttersnipe...but I was surprised with Lightning Bolt. I wasn't sure it was really worth the slots, but apparently Deathrite Shaman is a real issue. Also, it would probably be a nice (but not totally necessary) addition to say that without LED players can still build it with additional Rituals/SSG/Helm of Awakening. Budget versions are much more reliant on Empty the Warrens, and are in general about 1/2 a turn slower.
Brainstorm Realist
I close my eyes and sink within myself, relive the gift of precious memories, in need of a fix called innocence. - Chuck Shuldiner
Also if you can kill their clock, it's quite valuable as this deck gets quite nasty if you have seen 12+ cards.
It also kills Leovold, which can be a real pain point.
-rob
In the debate between Mizzium Mortars, Bolt, Flame Slash, etc is cut to ribbons worth a thought? Is it conceivable to burn someone out with it?
I'm guessing not, because if you have that much mana it's probably easier to just find a second burning wish.
I've come across this card a few times during my gatherer searches. I haven't had the balls to try it. I bet it's fine as. Perhaps I'll try one over one of the bolts. I like that it can kill TKS as well.
-rob
Hi, new to the site and deck. I've read through the thread but am still waiting on cards to play.
Wouldn't flame slash be as good as cut/rubbon? With tendrils we don't need ribbon and Flame Slash hits for the same as cut for1 less without medallion.
Also, do you recommend the full playset of guttersnipes? I plan on running two to start with and see how I like him. I love him in Mono Red Storm edh with Zada, Hedron Grinder.
Anyone still playing blood moon in the SB? Seems good vs greedy mana bases but otherwise doesn't really fit the decks game plan.
I plan on running two surgical for by hate, should I run something else as well?
Thanks and can't wait to sleeve this beauty up. Oh, and my pet name for the deck is Burning Tide.
You can read the primer :)
-rob
I did read the primer, as I said I've read the entire thread. That's why I'm asking these questions. They aren't mentioned in the primer.
Flame slash is mentioned, blood moon isn't really that useful. You can run surgical but Crypt or gravestone is better.
Cut ribbon dodges chalice and provides a win condition, but hasn't been tested. I don't care for slash and would rather run mizzium mortars or nothing. I run 2 bolts right now.
Snipe is mentioned in the primer as well.
-rob
That makes sense with chalice and flame slash, and that was my feeling on blood moon as well. Thanks. I really don't like gravestone's symmetrical effect but I could be wrong there and i like that surgical can be used turn 1 on the draw.
I'll probably go up to the full 4 of snipe. He's a beast in my EDH deck which is very similar to this decks game plan.
The gravestone ability to turn off DRS, snapcaster and surgical is a big selling point, and stopping reanimate + animate dead is pretty great.
If you have a local meta with lots of storm and reanimator, play Crypt. It's better off of act on impulse.
-rob
I know that it should never get to this point but sometimes games tend to get grindy; this deck can't beat a chalice on 2 right?
Once you go Legacy...
But vs Storm as far as sb goes you're all in on berserker and keep in mind it doesn't stop exhume.
-rob
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