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Thread: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

  1. #1
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    Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    This list just took down the SCG Modern open and didn't drop a single match over the weekend (he only conceded R15 to a friend after going 14-0):

    http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...?DeckID=116800

    I could see some variant of it being viable in Legacy as well. It packs tons of disruption.
    Currently working on: Infinity Stompy

  2. #2

    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    That deck is not playable in legacy. Wasteland eats it alive. Combo ignores it and combos out. It's basically a bad Maverick deck. And when is the last time Maverick made any waves in legacy?

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    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    Feel like an optimal list is likely just a worse version of death and taxes.
    Quote Originally Posted by iatee View Post
    I still have a strong suspicion that if 'Thalia, Heretic Cathar' had been named 'Frank, Heretic Cathar', people would be a lot more skeptical of it.
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    Ugh, there he goes again, talking about the girlfriend. We get it dude.

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    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    Quote Originally Posted by Pittplayer View Post
    That deck is not playable in legacy. Wasteland eats it alive. Combo ignores it and combos out. It's basically a bad Maverick deck. And when is the last time Maverick made any waves in legacy?
    My win-and-in for the Top 8 of Eternal Weekend was against Maverick, so it came really close to making waves.
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    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    Actually, I brewed a Human list for Legacy, a year ago, and have had a blast missing out on several top 8 from inches.

    My last build is in my signature (Rainbow SWAT aka Human Squad).

    And the primer (unfortunately in French but Google translate shall give you the general idea) can be found here:

    Human Primer

    Enjoy.
    Last edited by Ralf; 10-24-2017 at 11:26 AM.

  6. #6

    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    This just seems like a worse version of fish/merfolk/goblins. Not good enough for legacy.

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    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    Quote Originally Posted by Pittplayer View Post
    That deck is not playable in legacy. Wasteland eats it alive. Combo ignores it and combos out. It's basically a bad Maverick deck. And when is the last time Maverick made any waves in legacy?
    I don't know if its playable but this is just a very arrogant view...

    Combo "can" also struggle with DnTs Playset of Thalia as a Turn 2 Play. The modern brew already has 4x Kitesail Freebooter, 4x Meddling Mage, 4x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben as cc2 Maindeck cards to fight combo decks and also contains Thalia, Heretic Cathar and Reflector Mage against Creature-Combos (Elves have a hard time to deal with Thalia 2.0 and Refelctor Mage can fight S&S or Reanimator etc.). Yes Turn 2 can be to slow for legacy, but you can always try to find room for Mox&Petal Stuff for more free wins G1 (since combo have a hard time to fight permanent disruption G1 too).

    Wasteland eat many decks at legacy if you are able catch someone offguard with landdraws or have the right free counters in hand too. That 4c Pile is greedy as hell and was still the most played deck at EW (with no Lands, DnT top 8 in terms of mana disruption). 4 Noble + 4 Vial can also ignore Wastelands to some degree.

    I dont say the Human.pile is awesome for legacy but players should be more open for new ideas outside of a blue cantrip shell!
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    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    Quote Originally Posted by MD.Ghost View Post
    I don't know if its playable but this is just a very arrogant view...
    Don't bother mate. Haters gonna hate it anyway. Until they get properly spanked several times by it...

  9. #9

    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    I think that the creature base of this deck is arguably more powerful than DNT/Maverick (and in Legacy this would get to play Mother of Runes too, which is also a Human).

    A big strength of the Thalia/Vial decks though is their ability to play wasteland and I'm not sure if you can fit Wasteland in your 5c Mantis Rider deck without fucking up the mana too much.

    Saying that a Vial/Hierarch deck loses to wasteland, or that a 4x Meddling Mage 4x Freebooter 4x Thalia deck folds to combo is fairly ridiculous. The hardest matchup imo would probably be some kind of mondo value deck (shardless, jund etc)

  10. #10

    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    To survive in a format with wasteland you're definitely going to need a needle effect. Revoker fits the mold best, but this is legacy so you will probably can't afford to wait for 2 mana.
    Other than that I've always been skeptical about hatebears (But all humans so call it: Hate-mans? Pride and Prejudice? The Human Experience? (It's suffering. Suffering is the Human Experience)) in eternal formats, even if there's a proof of concept in vintage, death and taxes here in legacy, and this deck's own performance in modern.

  11. #11

    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    here, someone made a list and 5-0 today

    https://magic.wizards.com/it/node/1225251

  12. #12

    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    I tested it briefly yesterday, seems surprisingly strong. The player wrote on Reddit that the white Recruiter should probably be replaced with Imperial Rercruiters. This would also allow retrieving a Hostage Taker, which the player said he forgot about.

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    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    Quote Originally Posted by kombatkiwi View Post
    I think that the creature base of this deck is arguably more powerful than DNT/Maverick (and in Legacy this would get to play Mother of Runes too, which is also a Human).

    A big strength of the Thalia/Vial decks though is their ability to play wasteland and I'm not sure if you can fit Wasteland in your 5c Mantis Rider deck without fucking up the mana too much.

    Saying that a Vial/Hierarch deck loses to wasteland, or that a 4x Meddling Mage 4x Freebooter 4x Thalia deck folds to combo is fairly ridiculous. The hardest matchup imo would probably be some kind of mondo value deck (shardless, jund etc)
    You sum it up pretty well.

    You can't play wasteland. That's the point.
    This deck is no maverick nor D&T. It is much more a swarm deck ala Merfolk/Gob/Slivo based on permanents' interactions rather than stack's interactions.

    Actually, as you pointed out, the hardest MU is mondo value deck or any deck having access to a sweeper that leaves you in a very tight spot where it will take time to build a board again and where on a 1 to 1 basis all your creatures/draw are inferior to those of your oppo.

    Combo (save the T1 kill) and Tempo are not so bad. I would even say that with 4 MM 4 Freebooter 4 Thalia like in the modern's brew, combo should be a walk in the park.

    The deck, in my opinion, can go both way:
    - Vial +NH -> to power up a lot of CMC 3
    - Vial without NH -> to emphasis the swarm nature of the deck with a CMC 2

    Since Miracle's fall, I guess the NH version is viable again.

    A year and half ago when I came up with my brew, NH was ditched because it is a terrible top deck when you try to recover from a sweeper and you don't usually profit from the exaltation's trigger when your A plan is to attack with everything you have on the board.

    That's said "Mantis Rider" taught some respect to my opponents ala Serra Avenger. It is a "real" beat stick that should not be overlooked...


    The amount of "specialized skills" is so high among humans' creatures that I called the deck "SWAT". You need an effect/skill ? there is a human with it. Period.

    I would be very pleased if some players buy into this idea because I believe this archetype has leg.

  14. #14

    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralf View Post
    Combo (save the T1 kill) and Tempo are not so bad. I would even say that with 4 MM 4 Freebooter 4 Thalia like in the modern's brew, combo should be a walk in the park.
    You can also use Ethersworn Canonist and Kambal, though you probably don't play many of them and the latter doesn't come very early. Against Show and Tell you have access to at least Palace Jailer, Reflector Mage and Hostage Taker.

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    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    Quote Originally Posted by Icapica View Post
    You can also use Ethersworn Canonist and Kambal, though you probably don't play many of them and the latter doesn't come very early. Against Show and Tell you have access to at least Palace Jailer, Reflector Mage and Hostage Taker.
    Sure.
    My list is in my signature.

    I don't play the modern hatebear package MD but if you dig into the primer I wrote a year ago you will see that I was playing everything legal and existing at that time (between side and MD).

  16. #16

    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    Quote Originally Posted by kombatkiwi View Post
    I think that the creature base of this deck is arguably more powerful than DNT/Maverick (and in Legacy this would get to play Mother of Runes too, which is also a Human).

    A big strength of the Thalia/Vial decks though is their ability to play wasteland and I'm not sure if you can fit Wasteland in your 5c Mantis Rider deck without fucking up the mana too much.

    Saying that a Vial/Hierarch deck loses to wasteland, or that a 4x Meddling Mage 4x Freebooter 4x Thalia deck folds to combo is fairly ridiculous. The hardest matchup imo would probably be some kind of mondo value deck (shardless, jund etc)
    Except this deck has no selection. Either it's in your hand and you win, or you have to hope you survive long enough to cast a Recruiter?
    Edit: I Agree that's better than nothing, having two ways to do it, but it's not a slam dunk in a deck, say, running a hundred cantrips.

  17. #17
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    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    Quote Originally Posted by NegatorITA View Post
    here, someone made a list and 5-0 today

    https://magic.wizards.com/it/node/1225251
    Caleb Durward just 4-1'ed with the list on his stream. He could have 5-0'ed if he hadn't thrown away his mom G3 in the match he lost.
    Currently working on: Infinity Stompy

  18. #18

    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    Is there any justification for testing out something like Shardless Agent? It's a human so it should be easily playable with the mana base, and it generates card advantage on cast.

  19. #19
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    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    Quote Originally Posted by silly View Post
    Is there any justification for testing out something like Shardless Agent? It's a human so it should be easily playable with the mana base, and it generates card advantage on cast.
    Question is how much CA the deck needs. And would it really be better than Recruiter? Agent gets a random thing on cast (so no synergy with Vial), while Recruiter can grab what you need, at the cost of requiring Vial/more mana and having a worse body.

    Other things that might be worth to look into, be it as Recruiter target or otherwise:

    - Mirror Entity - can make your group of dorks into powerful beaters. Bonus points for stacking with +1/+1 counters.

    - Mirran Crusader - highly relevant protections, fast clock, synergizes with both Exalted and +1/+1 counters to bring the pain.
    Last edited by Barook; 10-29-2017 at 03:09 PM.
    Currently working on: Infinity Stompy

  20. #20

    Re: Humans (SCG Modern Open Winner, undefeated)

    There's also Dark Confidant, though you'd be taking close to two damage per turn on average.

    Edit - https://go.twitch.tv/videos/185778032?t=04h33m55s Human deck against Grixis Delver on SCG. There's Confidants in the deck. The player seems to be the same guy who won the modern tournament.
    Last edited by Icapica; 10-29-2017 at 03:16 PM.

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