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Thread: UW Enduring Ideal

  1. #41

    Re: UW Enduring Ideal

    The Enchantment Volrath's Stronghold ('Heliod's Hall of Generosity') looks like a really good option for this deck
    Not only does it perform a similar role as Mistveil Plains for reloading your combo pieces, but against control decks you can use it to put threatening cards like Dawn of Hope back on top of your library if they counter or remove them.

    'On thin Ice' is also interesting as an easier-to-cast Chained to the Rocks, it could be a good option for main or side

    Edit: I'm thinking of playing Suppression Field again because it has a relevant effect against the Hogaak deck (Tax Altar of Dementia / Carrion Feeder) as well as being an ok card against planeswalkers and such.
    Because of the way that this interacts with Dawn of Hope I would probably go back to the red splash for Assemble the Legion / SB Alpine Moon. The RW Horizon Canopy [Sunbaked Canyon?] could also be a good include (even though it's a nonbo with Suppression Field it doesn't have much opportunity cost to include it in the deck, and in the lategame if you're mana flooded with Nykthos you can still easily pay for it)
    Last edited by kombatkiwi; 06-17-2019 at 08:40 AM.

  2. #42

    Re: UW Enduring Ideal

    Did a little G1 testing with the following list:

    1 Mistveil Plains
    1 Hall of Heliods Generosity
    1 Arch of Orazca
    4 Wx Temple
    4 Nykthos
    11 Plains

    4 Enduring Ideal
    4 Lotus Bloom
    1 Form of the Dragon
    1 Phyrexian Unlife
    1 Dovescape
    1 Overwhelming Splendor
    1 Sphere of Safety
    1 Dawn of Hope
    4 Wall of Omens
    4 Runed Halo
    4 Nevermore
    4 Stasis Snare
    4 Cast Out
    4 Leyline of Sanctity

    Notes:
    1) Maindeck cast out x4 seems important for consistency reasons. Some of the lands should maybe be Horizon Canopy or the WR/WB ones depending on which splash color is chosen (or the UW cycling land for blue)
    2) The Heliod land is a nice little boost for the deck
    3) 4 Maindeck Nevermore actually seemed pretty solid, 2x Devotion is good plus it stops many things in the format if you know what to name (Humans is still playing maindeck Meddling Mage). It also avoids the need to play some of the more narrow Ideal bullets (for example rather than get Greater Auramancy to protect Phyrexian Unlife you can just get Nevermore and name Decay, or against Tron you can name Ulamog which is pretty significant
    4) Leyline of Sanctity can maybe go to the sideboard, I often thought that this card was a maindeck staple due to the double devotion for 0 mana but depending on the metagame maybe it should be moved to the SB in exchange for some Ghostly Prison or something. Possibly Gideon's Intervention is also a good option
    5) I thought about playing On Thin Ice but only adding 1 Devotion and only being useful against creature decks made me not want to play it main, it definitely could be a worthwhile sideboard card though. If the metagame is almost all Hogaak/Phoenix/E Tron etc then maybe it's fine maindeck
    6) The deck definitely also wants some anti-control options in the SB because Lotus Bloom is awful against Time Raveler. I expect the correct move involves 1-2 Boseiju and then some cheap permanents that can threaten PWs like History of Benalia or Luminarch Ascension etc. Silence/Veil of Summer could also be an okay option but I think I would rather have more winconditions rather than rely on Ideal 100%. [Edit: Grand Abolisher could be really good, adding WW devotion, stopping all counterspells, and coming down early to pressure opposing Narset/Teferi. It seems likely that the opponent would board most of their removal out and unlike e.g. Silence it doesn't get stopped by Force of Negation / Dovins Veto]

    I could take this list to the modern MCQ this weekend because these are the only modern cards I own at the moment, but I'm pretty unfamiliar with modern in general ATM and most likely the deck isn't competitive at all. Enduring Ideal is still a fun card though
    Last edited by kombatkiwi; 07-30-2019 at 01:57 AM.

  3. #43
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    Re: UW Enduring Ideal

    After taking a bit of a break from this deck, I felt compelled to come back and give it a try in the post-Hogaak/Modern Horizons world. Modern Horizons brought two pretty significant additions that I think really go a long way toward helping the deck compete, namely the "snow package" of Arcum's Astrolabe and On Thin Ice. Here's my updated list:

    Enduring Ideal
    CREATURES
    1 Heliod, God of the Sun
    SPELLS
    4 Lotus Bloom
    4 Arcum's Astrolabe
    3 On Thin Ice
    1 Porphyry Nodes
    1 Greater Auramancy
    1 Peace of Mind
    3 Runed Halo
    2 Spreading Seas
    1 Copy Enchantment
    1 Detention Sphere
    3 Ghostly Prison
    1 Phyrexian Unlife
    1 Story Circle
    3 Leyline of Sanctity
    1 Dovescape
    1 Enduring Ideal
    1 Form of the Dragon
    1 Overwhelming Splendor
    LANDS
    4 Flooded Strand
    1 Hall of Heliod's Generosity
    1 Hallowed Fountain
    1 Mistveil Plains
    4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
    1 Snow-Covered Island
    7 Snow-Covered Plains
    4 Temple of Enlightenment

    On Thin Ice provides early/inexpensive removal that still adds toward the devotion count while Arcum's Astrolabe serves as a cantrip that also offers mana fixing, allowing for a more resilient mana base while maintaining the 23 land count I had been running previously. To fit these cards, I cut the less efficient removal, including all but one copy of Porphyry Nodes from the main deck. While I do still think Nodes is a powerful card, there are a number of matchups where it either doesn't do much or is too slow to reliably deal with the threats you need to target; specifically the resurgence of GW Eldrazi made Nodes rather poor, as you'd have to eat through Noble Hierarchs before you could get to the bigger threats. On Thin Ice happens to be really effective against Reality Smasher, avoiding the need to target it with a spell, and Ghostly Prison often negates the Smasher's haste. I kept a single copy of Nodes in the main deck for the situational utility and the combo potential with Heliod.

    Hall of Heliod's Generosity is another new addition from MH1. I wouldn't say the card has been an all star, but it serves its purpose. Like Mistveil Plains, it can be used to put key enchantments back into the deck so you can search them up with Enduring Ideal or you can rebuy something (like a previously sacrificed Porphyry Nodes) for immediate redeployment.

    I believe the only other "new" addition to the main deck since my last posted list is an old card in the form of Story Circle. It's a great card against Burn or mono-colored decks and can be used generally to build your "pillow fort" until you're able to establish a hard lock.

    Sideboard Options[cards]
    Aura of Silence - Artifact/enchantment hate that provides a powerful static taxing ability, adds to devotion, and can be bought back with Heliod's Hall
    Boseiju, Who Shelters All - for forcing Ideal through counterspells.
    Grafdigger's Cage - Graveyard hate, shuts off Neoform, Collected Company, etc.
    Rule of Law (will be Deafening Silence with the release of Throne of Eldrane) - Hate for Storm, Izzet Phoenix, or other cantrip heavy strategies.
    Nevermore - A catch all for cards that I can't otherwise beat (e.g. Karn, the Great Creator + Mycosynth Lattice).
    Oblivion Ring - catch all removal
    Porphyry Nodes - An extra copy for the matchups where it's good.
    Solemnity - Hate for Infect and Hardened Scales, also opens up a combo with Phyrexian Unlife; nice in that both pieces are low cost enough to play out naturally, but Solemnity being a complete blank against most of the field means it's not worth a main deck slot.
    Spreading Seas - Hate for Tron and decks with greedy mana bases.
    Supreme Verdict - An uncounterable sweeper for when you need to get things dead; effective against some Stoneblade builds.
    Teferi, Time Raveler -Shuts off opposing counterspells to allow you to resolve Ideal and can also generate value and dig early (bouncing Astrolabe or an On Thin Ice that exiled a token).
    Terra Eternal - Protection against land destruction. This used to be Sacred Ground, but with On Thin Ice, you don't want the land to be destroyed at all, so I'm trying this out.
    Torpor Orb - Hates on Humans, Bant Soulherder, and creature toolbox decks.
    Wheel of Sun and Moon - Graveyard hate that can even be used as protection on yourself and adds two pips of devotion to boot.

    Notable omissions:
    Rest in Peace - As graveyard based decks are a bit less prevalent at the moment, I've moved to Grafdigger's Cage and the one-sided Wheel of Sun and Moon to avoid potential dis-synergy. If graveyard decks become more prominent, RIP could again find itself in the board in multiples. Note with Cage that it will prevent you from putting Heliod into play with Ideal.
    Stony Silence - I had previously hoped that a suitable replacement for Lotus Bloom would allow me to avoid playing any artifacts in the main deck, so I could leverage this powerful hate card, but the inclusion of Arcum's Astrolabe only furthers the anti-synergy of this card. That, combined with the fact that there has been a general down-tick in artifact decks, makes me feel more comfortable leaving this out of the list for now. It would be nice to have against the Whirza deck, but graveyard hate can work against their combo and Torpor Orb can shut off Sword of the Meek recursion as well.
    Last edited by CaptainTwiddle; 09-16-2019 at 11:32 AM.

  4. #44

    Re: UW Enduring Ideal

    Terra Eternal can also be Privileged Position
    I agree that Teferi is good if you have the Blue splash

    From Throne of Eldraine I'm going to add 1 of the new land:
    CIPT unless you control a plains
    T: add W
    2WW, T: Make a 1/1

    There is also an Assemble the Legion variant that costs 2WWR that is kind of interesting.

    I thought about playing Stoneforge in the deck lol
    It's just a good card, makes W devotion, you can even play Godsend if you want for another WW

  5. #45

    Re: UW Enduring Ideal

    I will be taking this deck to a free local tournament in a couple of weeks
    Haven't played modern for a very long time.
    There are still some decent prizes (weird arrangement) so I'm aiming to do a reasonable job with the cards I do have

    Main:

    4 Enduring Ideal
    4 Lotus Bloom

    4 Wall of Omens

    4 Runed Halo
    4 Nevermore
    4 Stasis Snare
    4 Leyline of Sanctity
    4 Cast Out
    1 Phyrexian Unlife
    1 Form of the Dragon / Solemnity (still unsure, leaning towards Dragon atm)
    1 Sphere of Safety
    1 Overwhelming Splendor
    1 Dawn of Hope
    1 Dovescape

    1 Castle Ardenvale
    1 Arch of Orazca
    1 Hall of Heliod's Generosity
    1 Mistveil Plains
    4 Wx Temple
    4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
    10 Snow-Covered Plains

    Still thinking about the SB and whether I want to splash or not. Tron still seems like the biggest problem (the big Green build being far harder but the small Karn/Ugin from the Eldrazi version still somewhat annoying).
    Wondering if there is an anti-tron white hatebear but it seems like there isn't (Arbiter kind of, but it needs to be backed up with Ghost Quarters)
    Splashing Teeg would be near-perfect but obviously it can't be done because it makes Enduring Ideal uncastable
    Lavinia is almost great but it doesn't really do anything against Oblivion Stone. (I guess this is also a problem with Teeg)
    Maybe the aim can be to assemble some soft lock like Lavinia + Nevermore
    Damping Sphere is ok, disables Nykthos, but it's probably the best option for monoW
    Immortal Sun has a good effect but probably too expensive

    Also unsure about the best plan for the Urza decks
    RIP/Stony/Abolisher all seem ok in small numbers
    Some alt-wincons could be ok as well (but probably requires a splash like Assemble the Legion etc, Suns Champion seems maybe a bit slow. Sigil of the Empty Throne could be ok maybe)

  6. #46

    Re: UW Enduring Ideal

    (Sorry for the multi-post)
    Played the list in the previous post (with 1 Dragon 0 Solemnity) at FNM and another tournament this weekend
    SB:
    4 Grand Abolisher
    4 Rest in Peace
    4 On Thin Ice
    3 Stony Silence

    Results
    FNM:
    2-0 Hardened Scales
    2-0 Burn
    2-0 Grixis Deaths Shadow
    Sunday:
    (I switched to a build with -2 Cast Out -1 Nevermore -1 Stasis Snare +4 Suppression Field -1 Dawn of Hope +1 Assemble the Legion -1 Ardenvale +1 Rugged Prairie)
    0-2 Hardened Scales
    0-2 Naya Zoo
    At this point I was out of contention for extra prizes and the event had no decklists so I swapped back all the above changes
    2-0 Izzet Phoenix
    2-0 Bant Spirits
    0-2 Bant Midrange/Control
    1-1-1 Jund (Timed out after Enduring Ideal resolved and my opponent was totally locked but I needed like 3 more turns to kill them with form of the dragon)

    I think Form of the Dragon is better than Solemnity, in a lot of spots the Moat effect is really important
    The maindeck feels really solid. Suppression Field didn't seem like the right place to be. Because you give your opponent so much time its easy for them to get mana to play around it, and it's hard to e.g. totally lock their fetches under it because it doesn't come down until turn 2. Then it's very annoying with your own cast outs (cycling tax) and also makes things like Dawn of Hope, Castle Ardenvale, Hall of Heliod, Arch of Orazca all much worse. And compared to other options like more Stasis Snare / Nevermore it only adds 1 devotion instead of 2. The 'flex slots' in the maindeck I think are the Stasis Snare and the Nevermore but there aren't many cards I would be tempted to replace them with. Gideons Intervention is a possibility but I'm not sure how many copies would be correct. Apart from that the only option I am interested in trying is swapping some of the On Thin Ice to the maindeck or adding 1 copy of Privileged Position

    Grand Abolisher is an ok card, the idea being that against fair decks with counterspells they will board all their removal out, the problem is it seems that most fair decks these days will still have Oko to nullify it. On Thin Ice is also really good, but Stony Silence and RIP were underwhelming.

    One card I didn't consider for the SB was Generous Gift (White version of Beast Within) to act as Stone Rain against Tron. Also, a good choice for the kind of "midrange threat" option (in the vein of Assemble the Legion, Sun's Champion etc) could be Cavalier of Dawn. Approach of the Second Sun is interesting (and works with Boseiju) but is probably way too slow

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