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Thread: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

  1. #181
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    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    Quote Originally Posted by Johanovich View Post
    Although there's no real excuse for playing like a baboon, I do have to point out that I was pretty exhausted at the time and we were both warned by the judge between G1 and G2 that he would start giving out warnings and game losses for slowplay from then on, and every time we paused for more than four seconds or so the judge would whip out his watch and started timing us. Gary actually got a warning during game 2 I believe.

    Oh well, everybody makes mistakes I guess. Still very happy with how the deck performed and still really happy with the configuration.
    I completely understand, as I am usually completely exhausted after just, say, 5-6 rounds of playing. It was a rather complex situation and being rushed isn't going to help. Congratulations on the good run and I think the Etched Champion is probably the 3 drop that works out the best, if they are going to play a 3 drop.
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  2. #182
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    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    Quote Originally Posted by Johanovich View Post
    You are both absolutely right, the second game was one massive tilt from my part. I should have either blocked the rabblemaster with the ravager earlier and put the counters on champion, which would have made it a three turn clock, or I should have made it a 12/12 at the end, keeping mox but losing metalcraft, then play an artifact in my turn to gain protection and swing for lethal. The third game was pretty unwinnable I think, there's an argumant for immediately making a token with karn, but it was impossible to guess that he would topdeck spyglass there. Gary actually gave me a fighting chance by abrading the first opal and imprinting the second abrade instead of going for the spyglass and using hazoret to kill me quicker. What really did me in that game was the magus, shutting off my lifegain and tutoring ability from fair.

    Although there's no real excuse for playing like a baboon, I do have to point out that I was pretty exhausted at the time and we were both warned by the judge between G1 and G2 that he would start giving out warnings and game losses for slowplay from then on, and every time we paused for more than four seconds or so the judge would whip out his watch and started timing us. Gary actually got a warning during game 2 I believe.

    Oh well, everybody makes mistakes I guess. Still very happy with how the deck performed and still really happy with the configuration.
    Hi Johan,

    Congratz on your great performance! Really puts the deck on the map.

    I had a few questions if you don't mind:
    - Why choose Darksteel Citadel over Vault of Whispers? Is the indestructible that important? In my, MUD-experience, it doesn't really help because they'll just waste another land and you're still often low on mana then.
    - Is the Phyrexian Metamorph in to copy Steel Overseer or Arcbound Ravager mostly or to copy creatures of the opponent?
    - I remember you really liked (we actually met briefly in Belgium, you probably don't remember) Crucible of Worlds in the deck but you took it out, it didn't work out as you would've liked?
    - Would you change anything in the list or go with the same 75 if you were to compete with it again?

    Great innovation on the Etched Champion, I'm going to try that one as well, the evasion is nice

  3. #183

    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    Quote Originally Posted by Airwave View Post
    Hi Johan,

    Congratz on your great performance! Really puts the deck on the map.

    I had a few questions if you don't mind:
    - Why choose Darksteel Citadel over Vault of Whispers? Is the indestructible that important? In my, MUD-experience, it doesn't really help because they'll just waste another land and you're still often low on mana then.
    - Is the Phyrexian Metamorph in to copy Steel Overseer or Arcbound Ravager mostly or to copy creatures of the opponent?
    - I remember you really liked (we actually met briefly in Belgium, you probably don't remember) Crucible of Worlds in the deck but you took it out, it didn't work out as you would've liked?
    - Would you change anything in the list or go with the same 75 if you were to compete with it again?

    Great innovation on the Etched Champion, I'm going to try that one as well, the evasion is nice
    Hi,

    I think I do remember our talk. I cut crucible because it did turn out to be winmore in the end.
    The darksteel citadel is the most reliable way to turn on metalcraft and keep it active. If you play vault you give them an extra way of manascrewing you by opening it up to spell based removal.
    Metamorph is there as a catch-all. So far I've mainly used it to copy leovold, marit lage, true-name and gurmag angler but in some situations copying your own stuff is good as well. As a matter of fact the first game against Takahashi featured a metamorph copying leovold which won me the game but they didn't show that game unfortunately.

    I think I might experiment a bit with karn maindeck and with a lower number of thorns (or cut them from the main) as they have proven to be very lackluster in a lot of games and there is a lower amount of combo for the moment. I might also try out an abyss because it just sounds juicy.

  4. #184

    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    So i have posted this on the Discord before but i figured i might as well post it here: How would you guys feel about a red splash (using 2 Great furnace) in order to run blood moons in the sideboard. It hits Lands and turbodepths while also hosing Delver & Pile. ( i run 4 petals 3 opals resulting in a 70-80% chance to have a red source by turn 2-3)

  5. #185

    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    Quote Originally Posted by Johanovich View Post
    Oh well, everybody makes mistakes I guess. Still very happy with how the deck performed and still really happy with the configuration.
    I see that you played Ensnaring Bridge against Grixis Delver. I don't know why you do that, but I'm curious to see your sideboarding strategies. There is a place on the internet where I can found them? Are you thinking to write an article for some website to explain your sideboarding?

  6. #186

    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    I was at GP Toronto this weekend. Didn't played Steel Stompy for the main event, but brought it to a couple of side events. Overall, 3-0, 2-1, 2-1, 2-1, 2-1.

    I mostly played Johan De Gruyter list, with some change to the main/sideboard. One change I made to the main deck was playing Blinkmoth Nexus over Mishra's factory. I was really impressed with Blinkmoth nexus and will keep them instead of factories. Flying was relevant in a lot of matches, flying over a stalled board with a bridge, or just equiping a jitte/SoFi and getting there.

    Otherwise, I really liked Etched Champion and Darksteel citadel. Champion is kind of a True-Name Nemesis most of the time, and clearly gave me a couple of victories in close games (just think about equiping jitte/SoFi on Etched champion - yeah).

    Lodestone golem was unimpressive and I'm thinking about replacing them. I saw some earlier posts talking about it - what are you playing instead of Lodestone ?

    Deck is great, lot of fun.

  7. #187

    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex_UNLIMITED View Post
    I see that you played Ensnaring Bridge against Grixis Delver. I don't know why you do that, but I'm curious to see your sideboarding strategies. There is a place on the internet where I can found them? Are you thinking to write an article for some website to explain your sideboarding?
    To be honest I wasn't thinking about writing an article, but if people want to know I guess I could write something small.
    During testing against grixis delver I found that bridge can often be a life-saver in the matchup, buying you enough time to stabilize before they can destroy it of before you get rid of it yourself.

  8. #188

    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    Quote Originally Posted by Johanovich View Post
    To be honest I wasn't thinking about writing an article, but if people want to know I guess I could write something small.
    During testing against grixis delver I found that bridge can often be a life-saver in the matchup, buying you enough time to stabilize before they can destroy it of before you get rid of it yourself.
    Yes, please! A quick guide about the sideboarding would be great! I see that you also side in a lot of cards against Czech Pile (at least Sorcerous Spyglass and Ratchet Bomb, other than Karn, Scion of Urza, but I didn't see Spellskite, even if maybe you side in it too), but I have some doubt about what to side out.
    I was (and maybe still I am) a MUD player and I buy this deck after your result at GP, even if I already knew Steel Stompy.

  9. #189
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    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex_UNLIMITED View Post
    Yes, please! A quick guide about the sideboarding would be great! I see that you also side in a lot of cards against Czech Pile (at least Sorcerous Spyglass and Ratchet Bomb, other than Karn, Scion of Urza, but I didn't see Spellskite, even if maybe you side in it too), but I have some doubt about what to side out.
    I was (and maybe still I am) a MUD player and I buy this deck after your result at GP, even if I already knew Steel Stompy.
    I play more MUD still than this deck, which is more of a preference choice than anything else. I feel like both get equally wrecked by btb, although the faster start of stompy occasionally just gets there underneath it if they cannot find terminus in time. Crucible does appear a win more in this deck, as it is very different than MUD. This deck ive found dies a little harder to null rod, but is slightly more resilient to k command. Thorn and Chalice is still great in either MUD or Stompy. Thoughts across both, so far.
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  10. #190
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    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    Ps, i really like metamorph in either. How many people play it in this deck?
    We speak for no one, we hear no one, we see no one

  11. #191

    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    Just went 12-3 in mtgo leagues with the following list (including a 5-0 league):



    This was a proof of concept, to test (a) that 8 creature lands can be played (b) that if such deck was viable, then Karn can be maximized in there. So far seems to have yielded some good anecdotal results. A lot more testing is required.

    A few changes needed:

    Mainboard:
    -1 Ghost Quarter
    +1 Darksteel Citadel
    Sideboad:
    -1 Ghost Quarter
    -2 Crucible of Worlds
    +3 Thorn of Amethyst


    Individual card discussion:

    Ghost Quarter. I had tested with Vault of Whispers and I really liked it; but the fact that Citadel is immune to Wasteland is a much greater bonus than tapping for black. Ghost Quarter on the other hand was irrelevant for most of the games where I had it. There was only one instance in which it function as a worse wasteland. Otherwise, it was not worth sac'cing.

    Crucible of Worlds. Just like GQ, didn't seem like the right choice in many matches. Maybe in a Lands heavy metagame is a good choice, but not right now.

    Thorn of Amethyst. My initial feel is that I don't want Thorn in a deck with 4 Karns. Now I feel that Thorns in the SB is needed, otherwise I concede too much to Storm, and other combo decks. And for those decks, Karn may not be the right choice.


    Karn, Scion of Urza. I think Karn is good; but I also think it is very overhyped. It's not backbreaking, but it is a Planeswalker and as such is difficult for opponents to deal with. I have learned that in our deck its best ability is the -2, and I often found myself only using this ability. On the other hand, I sometimes wonder if playing Master of Etherium would be just as good. I guess I'll never know because I'm not going to test that ;P. Anyhow, I wouldn't cut any Karns, the creatures it spits out grow very fast and trade with other big creatures in the format. And redundant Karns are pretty acceptable. So I'm sticking with 4x

    Welding Jar This card was the MVP. I would play 3 or 4 if it wasn't a dead card on its own. But being able to protect Overseer or Chalice, ANY OTHER ARTIFACT is just so amazing. I guess the best part was having opponents losing their minds with such an obnoxious card on the field. But for now, I'll stick with 2, and will perhaps test out 3.

    Lodestone Golem. I think 2x of them is OK. I woudn't cut them unless I think Storm is nonexistent in the metagame. If I were to play 3, then I would cut 2 Karns; if I were to play 4 then I would play 0 Karns in the mainboard. So I think 2x is the max number with 4x Karns.

  12. #192

    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    Guys, what's your sideboarding strategy against Grixis Delver and Czech Pile?
    Grixis Delver: what are the bad maindeck cards against them? I think Phyrexian Revoker and Karakas, but maybe also other cards?
    Czech Pile: what are the good sideboard cards against them? Karn, Scion of Urza, Spellskite, Sourcerouss Spyglass and Ratchet Bomb are all good cards, but how can I find a space to put all of them in g2?

  13. #193

    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    Is anyone else finding mox opal a bit lack luster? I'm finding that it's not often 'on' until turn 2 or 3, and easily shuts off when the opponent kills off our creatures, so it ends up being a... worse land? With this deck, there aren't any/many 0-drops that we can play to use it to cheat out a turn 1 thorn or chalice... which should be the whole point of playing the card in the first place

    I think we can cut it, and replace it with mox diamonds (which would require a higher land count) or crystal veins. Thoughts? Am I in the minority in seeing how slow mox opal really is?

    EDIT: edited for grammar

  14. #194

    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    Quote Originally Posted by mambosong View Post
    Is anyone else finding mox opal a bit lack luster? I'm finding that it's not often 'on' until turn 2 or 3, and easily shuts off when the opponent kills off our creatures, so it ends up being a... worse land? With this deck, there aren't any/many 0-drops that we can play to use it to cheat out a turn 1 thorn or chalice... which should be the whole point of playing the card in the first place

    I think we can cut it, and replace it with mox diamonds (which would require a higher land count) or crystal veins. Thoughts? Am I in the minority in seeing how slow mox opal really is?

    EDIT: edited for grammar
    In those builds without artifact lands, the expectation is that Mox Opal would normally be available mostly turn 3 and on; sometimes turn 2. Which is why some builds have cut to 2 of them. In the version with artifact lands, having 3 should be the standard, with sometimes able to jump to 4. So far, I'm very happy with Mox Opal. Perhaps you have set your expectations too high?

    Mox Diamond is an alternative, but your land count should be above 24, so maybe 25-26. But I would supplement Mox Opals and Petals, rather than replacing them. I personally would not do it mostly because I believe the deck is already very high variance, and Mox Diamond just adds more of it.

    In addition to artifact lands, you may want to test into zero cost artifacts. Right now I have had success with Welding Jar, but Baubles may be another potential way of activating Opals.

  15. #195

    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    Quote Originally Posted by Johanovich View Post
    To be honest I wasn't thinking about writing an article, but if people want to know I guess I could write something small.
    During testing against grixis delver I found that bridge can often be a life-saver in the matchup, buying you enough time to stabilize before they can destroy it of before you get rid of it yourself.
    Where do you find the space to put those sideboard cards? What are the worse maindeck cards against Czech Pile and Grixis Delver?

  16. #196

    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    Another iteration with a decent success. The new player is Thought-Knot Seer:



    After heavily testing with Karn I really came to appreciate having threats that are not vulnerable to artifact destruction. Further, I wanted to have more disruption in the main and honesty I didn't think Lodestone Golem was not cutting it with the Thorns moved to the SB. Long time ago I tried TKS in MoS, but without success.

    I think what's different in this new iteration is the diversity in threats.

    Karn continues to be a force to reckoned, and I hesitated cutting down their number, but on the other hand I cannot have a top-heavy curve.

  17. #197

    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    No love for Inventor's Fair and Jitte?
    I found Fair very cute and quite convenient when you can tutor up Metamorph, Jitte, or Ballista in late game to break stalemate.
    You almost doubled (or tripled if Hangarback Walker counts) the number of creatures with evasion so Jitte should be a thing here.

  18. #198

    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    What do you think about Sorcerous Spyglass against Grixis Delver? Death & Taxes players prefer to not play Phyrexian Revoker against Grixis Delver in g2 (the only target is maybe Deathrite Shaman). Do you prefer to play both Phyrexian Revoker and Sorcerous Spyglass against Grixis Delver?

  19. #199

    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex_UNLIMITED View Post
    Where do you find the space to put those sideboard cards? What are the worse maindeck cards against Czech Pile and Grixis Delver?
    Quote Originally Posted by Alex_UNLIMITED View Post
    What do you think about Sorcerous Spyglass against Grixis Delver? Death & Taxes players prefer to not play Phyrexian Revoker against Grixis Delver in g2 (the only target is maybe Deathrite Shaman). Do you prefer to play both Phyrexian Revoker and Sorcerous Spyglass against Grixis Delver?
    Revoker is the first thing to go out against grixis delver and czech pile. It dies to everything they have and is pretty weak on it's own. I also find thorn pretty lackluster against grixis and czech after game 1. Games tend to go longer after game 1 so the effect of a thorn is quickly mitigated (especially with deathrite). Grixis is also very capable of playing a longer game, much better than UR delver or RUG delver where thorn stays good after game 1. You're boarding in mostly noncreature spells which is also kind of a nonbo with thorn.

    Spyglass or not depends a bit on how they boarded. If they board in stuff like lili the last hope, lavamancer or staticaster you might want to bring one or both in. I you can't shut them down these cards pretty much wreck the deck.

    I'll write how I sideboarded against the decks I faced next week together with a report of the GP. I'm in the middle of writing a paper so I don't have much time for now.

  20. #200

    Re: Steel Stompy 2.0 / Ravager Shops

    Working on a new variation. Here's a little teaser:


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