[BBD] Battlebond

[JDK]

Interesting card, but likely much worse than Ad Nauseum or cheating out Griseltard like a goddamn monkey. If Legacy had any room for brewing I'd be doing some goofy shit with this and Final Fortune effects, but alas.

Esper Ad Nauseam with Cunning Wish, Stunning Reversal, Ad Nauseam and Angel's Grace. Kinda like a Legacy Version of the Modern Ad Nauseam.dec

[Claymore]

The problem with Arena Rector in Legacy is that jumping through the hoops you've laid out to get [Name A Planeswalker] into play is still worse than having Griselbrand on the battlefield.

A Nic Fit deck generally can wipe the floor with Delver decks. Plugging in 8x Rectors that can each grab artillery off of a Show and tell to nullify Griselbrand or Emrakuls (Sandwurm Convergence), or fetch out massive Walkers against Miracles that already have trouble with Garruk Relentless (Garruk, Apex Predator or Big Karn). It isn't restricted by something like Karakas on the field when you can just tutor up a Turn 2 board wipe on a...not stick...against DnT (Ugin). Not sure about the Lands tools for walkers, although there's still Cruel Reality or Overwhelming Splendor that Lands cannot beat. Ugin of course does double duty against Red Stompy by being colorless and capable of cleaning out all the Moons.

Little harder to accomplish than Show and Skill for GriselApe, for sure, but the deck can pack enough ways to get a Rector out and sack outlet online. I think the deck can get flexibility advantages.

In my brief playing of Nyx Fit, you can have difficulty closing the game when you can't find Academy Rector. That's one reason they included Evolutionary Leap. Putting in Arena Rectors to double the bomb fetchers seems very promising. I think put in enough nukes in the deck and you can overload a lot of countermeasures...at the expense of loading the deck with a bunch of garbage though.

The Storm combo match up is still terrible unless you go Blue for Force of Will, of course.

[Megadeus]

Also you need blue for brainstorm because you need to put back pieces you need to find with rector or just clunky hands

[JackaBo]

I think i'm too addicted to FOW to think of making the deck anything other than Esper :/ - that said I think best bet is to treat it like this:

1st turn - Land + Cabal Therapy (or other 1CMC sac outlet that is not a land . . Viscera Seer?)
2nd turn - Sol Land + Accel + Rector --> Sacrifice (get Big PW or get Omniscience, then hopefully have big PW/draw other rector/sacrifice in your hand already?)

Thinking like that we need around 9 lands/8 Sac outlets/8 Sol land /8 Accel/8 Rector/8 Big PWs

If we slow down a turn, then something like my first list make a bit more sense with more protection/draw. It could still maybe use more PWs (I was aiming for blue PW's to count for FOW pitch).

Dont forget that you cannot resolve any rector-trigger against an opposing death rite shaman. I think you need about 7 spot removal to push through your combo safely.

Edit: Less than 7 if you run cantrips of course

[Echelon]

Dont forget that you cannot resolve any rector-trigger against an opposing death rite shaman. I think you need about 7 spot removal to push through your combo safely.

Edit: Less than 7 if you run cantrips of course

You don't necessarily just need spotremoval. 4 spotremoval + 3 sweepers works just fine, especially when combined with stuff like Mirri's Guile or Sylvan Library to manipulate the top of your library. Between the fetchlands and GSZs you have a lot of shuffle effects, so you'll probably see more cards than the average blue deck. That way you can just cherrypick whatever you need (generally speaking).

[JackaBo]

You don't necessarily just need spotremoval. 4 spotremoval + 3 sweepers works just fine, especially when combined with stuff like Mirri's Guile or Sylvan Library to manipulate the top of your library. Between the fetchlands and GSZs you have a lot of shuffle effects, so you'll probably see more cards than the average blue deck. That way you can just cherrypick whatever you need (generally speaking).

Yes sweepers works of course. 7 in total sound fine, that was what i was getting at.

Yes the selection is a green deck is usually fine as long as you draw your selection cards. I play 3 mirri and about 13 shuffle-effects, so theres a bit of inbalance there. No mirri in opening hand means no selection no mater how many shuffflers i draw. Perhabs i should run 4 mirri.

[bruizar]

Ok so Arena Rector is high potential. One that caught my attention that isn't as obvious is Pir, Imaginative Rascal and Toothy, Imaginary Friend.

You can get Pir with Green Sun's Zenith, then you get a Toothy in hand (blue card) so you can get your FoW online with a GSZ. Pir is essentially a stronger constrictor that negates the drawback that certain sagas have (Flame of Keld) because it places an extra counter on it INSTEAD. So no discard your hand with Pir and Flame. It also works on ALL permanents. Useful with walking ballista, Jace (+0 ability gives +3/+3 on Toothy and 3 cards when it dies, +4/+4 with Pir in play), but also useful with cards like Umezawa's Jitte.

Toothy is also an interesting card because it works well with brainstorm. It is potentially a grindy finisher that can draw you a lot of cards, OR you just replace a toothy that you just got with Pir for FoW or Brainstorm, leading you to no card disadvantage. Toothy triggers also on exile or bounce (Jace -1 to draw you into gas).

[Zombie]

re:Toothy, Lorescale Coatl is a card.

[Echelon]

Yes the selection is a green deck is usually fine as long as you draw your selection cards. I play 3 mirri and about 13 shuffle-effects, so theres a bit of inbalance there. No mirri in opening hand means no selection no mater how many shuffflers i draw. Perhabs i should run 4 mirri.

I run 10 fetchlands and 4 GSZ w/ 3 Guiles and a Sylvan Library

And then there's Evolutionary Leap activations that move cards away and Veteran Explorer/Any Rector triggers that happen.

[Tylert]

re:Toothy, Lorescale Coatl is a card.

I don't think you can compare them. Toothy draws cards when it leaves the battlefield. Lorescale coalt is just a dumb beater. I uderstand that coatl is less expensive, but it's still just a card that does not replace itself.

[kombatkiwi]

I don't think you can compare them. Toothy draws cards when it leaves the battlefield. Lorescale coalt is just a dumb beater. I uderstand that coatl is less expensive, but it's still just a card that does not replace itself.

Chasm Skulker is probably much better than Lorescale Coatl (you get a really good death trigger in exchange for starting as a 1/1 rather than a 2/2 and not requiring a 2nd colour)
The trigger on Toothy is probably better (drawing cards is usually better than making 1/1s and it's a leaves play trigger rather than 'dies'), but Toothy costs 1 mana extra and 4 vs 3 is a pretty big difference
If "GSZ A blue card into your hand" was so desirable then people would have probably found a way to do it with Fierce Empath or something and Pir is really not a good card

[BenBleiweiss]

Ok, this card has to fit somewhere. Just saying.

[Dice_Box]

Ok, this card has to fit somewhere. Just saying.

Pity thats not common.

[Barook]

Wouldn't Spellseeker be even better in Vintage, given stuff like Ancestral, Time Walk and Demonic Tutor?

[BenBleiweiss]

Wouldn't Spellseeker be even better in Vintage, given stuff like Ancestral, Time Walk and Demonic Tutor?

Our in-house Vintage players think it's stealth filthy in Vintage, but it's got a ton of targets in Legacy - Brainstorm, Extraction, Probe, Cabal Therapy, STP, Thoughtseize, Bolt, Pyro/Hydroblast, GSZ, etc.

[Lemnear]

Ok, this card has to fit somewhere. Just saying.

Our in-house Vintage players think it's stealth filthy in Vintage, but it's got a ton of targets in Legacy - Brainstorm, Extraction, Probe, Cabal Therapy, STP, Thoughtseize, Bolt, Pyro/Hydroblast, GSZ, etc.

As an old Vintage player: I can't even see it relevant, if you have Demonic, Mystical, Merchant Scroll, Vampric and Imperial already.

In Legacy, it has to compete with an established core. 3cc is a lot for a Tutor effect and running it to fetch your usual 1cc MD 4-offs seems counterintuitive. Edit: I admit it interacts well with Therapy.

[Barook]

Any ideas which decks could use this?

[Megadeus]

Someone suggested high tide. Seems decent. Dunno if you need it though with merchant scroll existing already.

[Cire]

You don't necessarily just need spotremoval. 4 spotremoval + 3 sweepers works just fine, especially when combined with stuff like Mirri's Guile or Sylvan Library to manipulate the top of your library. Between the fetchlands and GSZs you have a lot of shuffle effects, so you'll probably see more cards than the average blue deck. That way you can just cherrypick whatever you need (generally speaking).

Guess it depends when you want "to go off". I think we're just stuck at the stage of any such deck . . . is it better than just playing S&T or Reanimator?

[rufus]

...

Any ideas which decks could use this?

Most of the time it seems like you'd be happier with one more of the thing you're copying instead.