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Thread: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

  1. #81
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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    I enjoy your reports too, Demonic_pact! I'm travelling since a month back but wanted to comment on some new cards for us such as Brightling and Arcane Artisan. More on that later. Also, the banning of Deathrite is probably good news for us. Pile is weakened, we can again play Meren and experiment with Scarab God, Loyal Retainers and Necrotic Ooze. I'll continue playing Leylines in the sideboard for the fast graveyard based decks and I suggest you consider it too, if there is an increase in those.

    I'm interested in testing Nicol Bolas, the Ravager too. I think I'll be playing 3 BoP's and 2 Nobles to start with, post-Deathrite, so the dragon should be castable too (not only vial-able). I like that it's a flying 4/4 for cmc 4, it comes with card advantage, it's a great late game mana sink and it's a tutorable planeswalker, kind of. And the weakness vs Karakas is kind of mitigated by it becoming a discard engine if they start bouncing it (with Vial in play it is a good exhange for us; with Vial you can also easily outplay the Karakas with hardcasting plus vialing on the same turn). I think it benefits from being played next to Knight of the Reliquary, Karakas and Gaea's Cradle but it might be hard to fit all of those into one list.
    Last edited by pettdan; 07-08-2018 at 01:29 AM.

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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    I updated the primer with the removal of Deathrite, also adding Brightling, Arcane Artisan, and Runic Armasaur to various sections.

    Demonic Pact: can you check the links you posted to recordings of your games? I'm getting error messages about recordings not being available. Not sure if there is anything you can do about it, doesn't hurt asking though.

    ---

    I had a nice 3-1 in the local weekly event last week. A few tight wins but nevertheless. The lost game was also tight. Here are a few brief comments, I'm trying to not spend too much time but still provide some input on experiments moving forward.

    I decided to try playing a few Swords to Plowshares, mostly worried about how to handle t1 Goblin Lackeys, but it's also good vs aggressive decks and they can sometimes be tough, so I think the expected resurgence of both RUG Delver and Reanimator makes StP seem better. Maybe there are better options. Academy Rector is one of the cards that make more sense moving forward, with the absence of Deathrite Shaman, and this would enable Moat as an alternative, but I think having 1 mana answers is probably a good idea. Back on track; I also tried a Brightling. StP was great, I played the right matchups for it to shine though. Brightling didn't get to do that much though it was certainly useful. I can imagine it shining more against control decks.

    R1: RUG Delver 2-1
    Tight game, I would have won during t5 of time but he concedes on t4 seeing that he can't win. However, he had two Lightning Bolts to finish the game but only 1 red mana source or he might have won.

    Card evaluation: I had good use of both Shalai, stabilizing vs Mongoose, Swords to Plowshares and Brightling gaining some life. Meren and Carpet of Flowers were very good. I've had problems with RUG Delver before, that's why the Carpet of Flowers is in the sideboard.

    R2: UW Eldrazi-Nought 0-2
    I'm quickly overrun both games. In G2 I'm close to stabilizing on 1 life with Meren, 4 experience counters, replaying chumpblockers every turn and a Merieke being played, bounced by Echoing Truth, etc, but I die to a timely Smasher (no 2) before I get Merieke active.

    Card evaluation:

    R3: Moon stompy 2-0
    I draw really well both games, crucial is G1 opening with a t2 Gaddock Teeg and in G2 he has a slow start with t2 Blood Moon, t3 Blood Moon + trinisphere, t4 Magus of the Moon and I can answer all and beatdown through an Ensnaring Bridge with a BoP equipped with Jitte and exalted.

    Card evaluation: Gaddock Teeg was great, Jitte too.

    R4: Death and Taxes, 2-0
    I drew great he didn't, he only drew 1 vial in the two games and I could answer it. In G1 I set up 2 Mothers + Scryb Ranger. In G2 he is a bit choked on mana and doesn't draw Karakas so I get to keep Meren in play which is followed by a Shalai and when I start activating Shalai's ability to place counters on all my creatures he calls it a day. First time I got to use Shalai's ability.

    List:
    1 Forest
    2 Tropical Island
    3 Savannah
    2 Bayou
    1 Tundra
    7 Fetches

    1 Dryad Arbor
    3 Green Sun's Zenith
    2 Noble Hierarch
    3 Birds of Paradise
    2 Scryb Ranger
    4 Fauna Shaman
    4 Aether Vial

    3 Mother of Runes
    1 Scavenging Ooze
    2 Qasali Pridemage
    1 Gaddock Teeg
    1 Orzhov Pontiff
    1 Brightling
    1 Spell Queller
    1 Peacekeeper
    2 Leovold, Emissary of Trest
    1 Meren of Clan Nel Toth
    1 Glen Elendra Archmage
    1 Shalai

    2 Swords to Plowshares
    1 Umezawa's Jitte
    2 Abrupt Decay
    4 Brainstorm

    Sb:
    1 Sanctum Prelate
    1 Gilded Drake
    1 Merieke ri Berit
    2 Leyline of the Void
    1 Reclamation Sage
    1 Swords to Plowshares
    1 Carpet of Flowers
    1 Kambal, Consul of Allocation
    2 Invasive Surgery
    3 Force of Will
    1 Magus of the Moon

  3. #83
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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    Thanks guys, always happy to report on my tournaments :)

    Quote Originally Posted by pettdan View Post
    Demonic Pact: can you check the links you posted to recordings of your games? I'm getting error messages about recordings not being available. Not sure if there is anything you can do about it, doesn't hurt asking though.
    Yeah, those were links to timestamps of a twitch video, unfortunately twitch only keeps vods for a limited amount of time (a month i think?) so not much I can do. I'll ask the store owner who runs the stream in case he stores the vods but I doubt it :/ I'll edit my post to reflect the fact the videos are no longer available...

    Nice you got to play again, results look good :)
    Swords will definitely have its moments. It can be awkward vs. RUG because sometimes they end up with just Mongeese and TNNs but it can also be great vs. Goyf etc.

    I still need to try Brightling. I imagine it's great with Vial and clunky otherwise. Also we won't always have a lot of White mana to use for it...but I can see its versatility and power so I'll give it a shot. Not looking at Nicol Bolas right now, mainly because I'm not red but also because the 4drop slot only has that much room and I don't believe it's good enough on the front side and having played with Shalai and basically never activated it I doubt I'd ever flip it. Also don't think Arcane Artisan is that great in our deck. I was super tempted to play Runic Armasaur but with DRS now banned it loses a lot of value, mostly just drawing from fetches :(

    Your list doesn't look too dissimilar from mine. I don't think you ever need 3 Savannah so running the 8th fetch instead probably gives you better mana. Some different singleton choices to mine but those really depend on the metagame. Please let me know how much work the FoWs do for you. I'm pretty sure your list runs too low of a blue card count to make them consistent (8 main and boarding in 5-7 including the FoWs depending on the matchup is 13-15 where I believe 18+ is recommended but I'm no expert on the card ^^)



    I went 3-0-1 at FNM on Friday and top8ed Sunday Legacy today. Reports below. Sadly never played on camera this weekend so no vods ;) Sunday decklist will hopefully show up on mtgtop8 some time next week :D
    decklist

    Friday:
    R1: 2-1 vs. Mono White Prison
    More or less a port of Martyr Proc to legacy. The fact he played multiple Wrath of God and Day of Judgment along with Path to Exile and Council's Judgement was annoying. Teeg and Prelate did work. Mother and Shalai too. Long, grindy, somewhat frustrating. Somehow got there during turns...

    R2: 1-1 vs. UWr Stoneblade
    G1 I removed the Jitte he got from Stoneforge but he drew the Batterskull after and managed to put it on a TNN. I raced it for a while with Jitte but couldn't find a way to remove the Skull or Atraxa to win the race so I eventually lost. G2 I had my own Jitte do work. Didn't finish G3, although I did mulligan to 5 but managed to stabilize. I again had a Jitte in play and would have probably won, but it's hard to say and time ran out...

    R3: 2-0 vs. Eureka Tell
    Basically Sneak and Show but without the Red removal post board. They do however have things like Elesh and Ugin which are suuuper hard to beat. But G1 I managed to Meddling Mage/Sanctum Prelate her off of actually getting fatties into play. G2 we both got stuck on 1 land for a bit. Eventually I had quite a few creatures in play and Sanctum Prelate on 4 because I had Show and Tell covered with an Ethersworn Canonist in play and both Reclamation Sage (for Omni) and Gilded Drake in hand. She cast Show and Tell and put in Elesh which killed my board...I took the Elesh with Gilded Drake and proceeded to win from there.

    R4: 2-0 vs. TES
    This matchup is pretty boring. Essentially your only decision is whether to mulligan or not, then you hope they don't kill you on T1 or T2 if on the draw. G1 he didn't kill me and then I had Teeg into Meddling Mage to lock him out. G2 he once again didn't kill me and I had Teeg + Prelate to lock him out.


    Sunday:
    R1: 0-2 vs. Infect
    G1 mull to 5, keep Double Abrupt Decay, Land, Pontiff, Vial. His only threat is an Inkmoth which is immune to Decay and he kills me on T3.
    G2 I have a Fauna Shaman in play. He once again has an Inkmoth as his only threat and I cast a Pridemage the next turn, which gets FoWd and then he kills me on T3. If I live I get to search for Peacekeeper on endstep and then play it since it's unbeatable for almost all Infect lists.

    R2: 2-1 vs. Eureka Tell (same friend as on Friday)
    G1 she has T2 Show and Tell. I put in Clique, she puts in Omni. I target her with Clique and her hand is Omni, Intuition, Karn so I have to take Intuition to not get Emrakuled. I have a Revoker in hand so can deal with the Karn and just hope she blanks for a few turns so I can find removal for Omni. She draws Ugin off the Clique so I lose.
    G2 and G3 I find enough hate/lock pieces to stop her from casting Show/Eureka and win.

    R3: 2-0 vs. Merfolk
    PSA: Scryb Ranger is a really, really good card.
    G1 I mulligan to 5 and keep 3 GSZ, Misty, Shalai. I GSZ for Dryad, then for Birds. I get Wastelanded. I then find a Scryb Ranger so I'm fine on mana despite not having any "lands" (Arbor doesn't really count). Manage to cast Shalai and Clique from there and swing through the air with Scryb doing some blocking as double duty.
    G2 I have Scryb Ranger get FoWd but find another and it helps a lot again, blocking, picking up my island to stop islandwalk, untapping Mother of Runes, etc. eventually find myself in a racing scenario vs. TNN and manage to win it by proactively using Mother of Runes to get through with ground creatures + my Scryb Ranger attacking.

    R4: 2-0 vs. Nic Fit
    G1 he has trouble killing off his Explorers. I find Revoker for Deed and Meddling Mage for Toxic so my board is fairly safe. Atraxa and flying friends close out the game.
    G2 I have Clique and Queller do work and a Faerie Macabre in hand after his Cabal Therapy that stops him from being able to go for Rector into Overwhelming Splendor. Flyers + TNN close out quickly.

    R5: ID

    Quarter finals: 1-2 vs. TES (same friend as on Friday)
    G1 he mulls to fine and doesn't kill me on T1 or T2. I find Teeg and he concedes.
    G2 he kills me on T2 on the play.
    G3 he goes Ad Naus on T1 but doesn't quite find the kill going down to 1 life. So he just makes 30ish Goblins. I went Trop+Birds on T1 so I have to draw Orzhov Pontiff to clear the Goblin Tokens or Noble Hierarch or GSZ for Noble to kill him with Birds. Unfortunately didn't get it (not that I had great odds :P)

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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    @Demonic Pact:

    Yeah, those were links to timestamps of a twitch video, unfortunately twitch only keeps vods for a limited amount of time (a month i think?) so not much I can do. I'll ask the store owner who runs the stream in case he stores the vods but I doubt it :/ I'll edit my post to reflect the fact the videos are no longer available...
    Regarding Twitch, that's really sad... I was assuming that saved broadcasts would be saved for a longer period of time.

    Nice you got to play again, results look good :)
    Swords will definitely have its moments. It can be awkward vs. RUG because sometimes they end up with just Mongeese and TNNs but it can also be great vs. Goyf etc.
    Yeah, the deck felt really good, I think being able to rely on Meren makes the deck so much stronger. Just a feeling. An old feeling though. StP seems counterintuitive for the deck, we don't want to load up on noncreature spells, but actually, in addition to RUG, Reanimator and Goblins that I mentioned as potential good decks now I guess there's also Infect, Eldrazi and Elves against which StP will be good. Maybe with Ezuri, Renegade Leader, that I think Julian Knab was testing, having spot removal is more important. And he regenerates creatures which makes StP better. Well it's all just loose assumptions... But being able to slow down an agressive deck by a few turns is potentially very valuable. Like UR Delver has been a tough matchup too.

    I still need to try Brightling. I imagine it's great with Vial and clunky otherwise. Also we won't always have a lot of White mana to use for it...but I can see its versatility and power so I'll give it a shot. Not looking at Nicol Bolas right now, mainly because I'm not red but also because the 4drop slot only has that much room and I don't believe it's good enough on the front side and having played with Shalai and basically never activated it I doubt I'd ever flip it. Also don't think Arcane Artisan is that great in our deck. I was super tempted to play Runic Armasaur but with DRS now banned it loses a lot of value, mostly just drawing from fetches :(
    Yeah, Brightling looks good, I'll keep testing it for a while. Like you mention, we don't have white mana for it always, which is part of the reason while I'm playing 3 Savannah (which you comment on further down), in addition to playing StP and Shalai I think it's a white-heavy list I'm trying now.

    Agree, of course, red in a casting cost is always a strong disadvantage.

    When it comes ot Arcane Artisan, the major advantage of this card is that it allows you to cheat a monster into play without using the graveyard. The best alternative I think is Loyal Retainers. Like we have discussed before here, this spring I think, we always consider what unfair elements we can build into our deck, since it is so easy for us to tutor for creatures. So both Artisan and Retainers let us cheat Emrakul into play without the opponent being able to interact on the stack (using Fauna Shaman to discard Emrakul and Aether Vial to put the enabler into play). With Artisan the opponent can't even interact in the graveyard to stop the effect, as opposed to Retainers and most other alternatives. Artisan has the advantage that it is blue, helping with blue count should we want it, and the impressive thing about it is that it provides card advantage. You can use it to dig for other cards, discarding excessive lands or just put an Emrakul token into play while drawing a card for your efforts. I haven't even considered which other creatures in the deck I may want to cheat into play at instant speed while drawing an extra card. I think in general you of course would rather let the physical card stay in the game so that you can get it back with Meren, but still even with this downside it's still an upside in relation to the much more limited of use alternative in Loyal Retainers. Also, Artisan has 3 toughness. That is about 2 more than any other 3 mana creature which lets you cheat creatures into play. Oh well, it is an interesting card that we can use in many different ways, it is not an obvious inclusion. Edit: forgot to mention that in addition to the above it is basically an extra Vial effect.

    Armasaur looks interesting yes, 5 toughness is a real benefit too. We'll see what the meta shapes into before we figure out what role it can play.

    Your list doesn't look too dissimilar from mine. I don't think you ever need 3 Savannah so running the 8th fetch instead probably gives you better mana. Some different singleton choices to mine but those really depend on the metagame. Please let me know how much work the FoWs do for you. I'm pretty sure your list runs too low of a blue card count to make them consistent (8 main and boarding in 5-7 including the FoWs depending on the matchup is 13-15 where I believe 18+ is recommended but I'm no expert on the card ^^)
    Yeah, I did follow your lead on the inclusion of Brainstorms, the 4th Vial and Tundra primarily, also trying the Spell Queller. I think the Brainstorms and Tundra are good additions, well I have played them before but it's so hard to figure out what works better with all the options we have.

    I have played FoW in the sideboard for a long time, with the amount of hatebears we have it seems to have a great strategic position in the deck by letting you survive until t2 when you can hopefully get a crucial hatebear into play. It's like playing Death and Taxes with FoWs (one main disadvantage of that deck is extremely limited t0-t1 interaction). Anyway, I didn't make an effort to increase the blue count in this list, as you observe it's a bit low.

    3 Savannah, well we commented on it above but anyway, my mana base is not perfect, maybe another fetch would be better...

    Good job in beating Nic Fit, it is one deck I don't want to see. But I don't play the Revoker and stopping Deed should be crucial in that matchup.
    Last edited by pettdan; 07-16-2018 at 09:19 AM.

  5. #85

    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    @Artisan/Retainers: Now that DRS is gone, i strongly believe that Retainers is way above other options. Simply because it's an istant effect, while Artisan has to be tapped: that's huge.
    Artisan is good bc it's not only a combo piece but a threat/engine by herself, and that's also good: but they have different roles and slots i fear (i also think that artisan is too cute/narrow).

    About the target, i was wondering if Emrakul is the best option, mainly because of its gv trigger that request 2 cards in hand with Fauna, where other options just need one card (discard that card, grab the target, discard target for retainers -> gg ).

    @For all: i think that in the meta that will come, probably Rip will be a strong sb option

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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    @Memories: That's not really correct, Retainers must be played kind of sorcery speed while Artisan can be activated at instant speed, meaning your opponent's end step, which is probably the main thing speaking in its favor right now.

  7. #87

    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    Quote Originally Posted by pettdan View Post
    @Memories: That's not really correct, Retainers must be played kind of sorcery speed while Artisan can be activated at instant speed, meaning your opponent's end step, which is probably the main thing speaking in its favor right now.
    Wait, i'm missing something.
    The activation part is relatively important, for me. The "pseudo-haste" ability of Loyal is, by far, more important, mainly because it means that you can be removal-proof.
    And that's a HUGE part

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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    Ah yeah, see your point. I don't like the idea of exposing Emrakul to sorcery speed interaction, in that sense Retainers acts at sorcery speed (Karakas untapping, recruiter for Flickerwisp[edit: irrelevant, nevermind], cast or just activate Jace etc), but maybe dodging removal pointed at the enabler is more important, and in that sense it acts at instant speed. Otoh, often Vial will offer pseudo haste and there will be a Mother around and other targets, but yeah, Retainers has that advantage. Either way I think the other advantages make Artisan better but I guess we are probably not going to play either of them. Except for testing. But I do feel like testing it, just got to figure out a rationale. And I think Emrakul is the best option to cheat into play since he rids the opponent of both creatures (important vs anything aggressive) and lands (important vs combo and mana intensive strategies like cloudpost). Now if playing a Cradle or some other heavy mana generator I can see choosing a hardcastable option.
    Last edited by pettdan; 07-16-2018 at 05:51 PM.

  9. #89

    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    Let's test =)
    I strongly believe that the "pseudo-haste" of Loyal is by far more important when our goal is to cheat in play a big threat (Iona?), while the Artisan is a good card by herself that doesn't need any specific card in combo to be a threat/engine, and that's awesome. Sad thing that she's not green and zenithable =/

    Edit: another important point is what has to be cut to make room for Loyal and Iona... Now i'll test this list

    4 Aether Vial
    1 Dryad Arbor
    4 Birds of Paradise
    2 Noble Hierarch
    4 Mother of Runes
    4 Fauna Shaman
    1 Scryb Ranger
    1 Gaddock Teeg
    1 Scavenging Ooze
    1 Qasali Pridemage
    1 Leovold, Emissary of Trest
    1 Renegade Rallier
    1 Spell Queller
    1 Sanctum Prelate
    1 Vendilion Clique
    1 Atraxa, Praetors' Voice
    1 Quirion Ranger
    1 Merieke Ri Berit
    1 Peacekeeper
    1 Shalai, Voice of Plenty
    1 True-Name Nemesis
    1 Loyal Retainers
    1 Iona, Shield of Emeria

    4 Brainstorm
    2 Abrupt Decay
    3 Green Sun's Zenith

    4 Misty Rainforest
    4 Windswept Heath
    2 Bayou
    2 Tropical Island
    2 Savannah
    1 Tundra
    1 Forest


    1 Sanctum Prelate
    1 Orzhov Pontiff
    1 Phyrexian Revoker
    1 Gilded Drake
    1 Palace Jailer
    4 Faerie Macabre
    1 Glen Elendra Archmage
    2 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
    3 Thoughtseize
    Last edited by Memories of the Time; 07-17-2018 at 09:32 AM.

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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    Re: Artisan/Retainers:
    Here's what it actually takes to pull this off in a game: You need to draw Fauna Shaman, resolve it, untap with it and activate it TWICE to get first Iona (or whatever), then discard it to get Retainers (or get Artisan then get Iona). How many games do you lose where you get to activate Fauna Shaman twice? It should be very close to zero.
    The downside is that drawing Iona/etc. is just a dead card. I've activated Shalai about twice in my life and can't imagine ever casting an 8drop...drawing Retainers might not be horrible since we do run 5ish legendaries, but most of the time it'll be dead too.

    I strongly believe that if I get 2 Fauna Shaman activations off in any given game I will win it. The only scenario I see losing after that is when a key piece you search for gets FoWd...in which case the Retainers/Artisan would also just get FoWd and you're not doing better either.

    Tl;dr: I'm pretty sure it's not worth it.

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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    @Demonic Pact: I sat next to you in the Top 8 (Dredge), you should post a pic of your deck! It has some beautiful cards iirc

  12. #92

    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    @Ahab: now i want the photo too =D I have many artworked cards for this deck (eyvind earle Fauna Shaman, Mucha Mother of Runes, Full art bops... ) ^^

    @Demonic: Half right, for me. I mean, one of the deck's problem is the part of closing the lock/game, where you reach a stabilized board that could be ruined by some topdecks or strange 1x (ironically). I've lost so many games for this reasons, and even if now we have Spell Queller (aka, an insurance) having the possibility of closing the game on the spot is huge. I've retaken the deck and i'm testing it on cocka in order to buy it on MTGO, and for now the tests are going extremely well (i've faced only tempo and control decks, especially esper blade control which's a very good mu for us) and i've closed the 80% of the game with Iona.
    It's just so easy, so safe, so "sudden" (the problem of 2 activations is rarely important, if Fauna survive to be activated one time probably she'll be there for another one).
    And i've naturally drawn Loyal winning a game reanimating another leggendary creature in the grave =)

    @For All, opinion on the new Ajani?

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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    We all know that combo elements are clunky, but we can still test them. Nothing new here I guess. The new thing is that one of the combo elements is a Vial+looter+card advantage engine with toughness 3 [edit: oh yeah, Deathrite's gone too which makes Retainers relevant again]. Maybe a more in depth discussion would be good regarding which matchups that might benefit from a combo finisher. I'll think it through later. First thought is that decks like Cloudpost and Big Eldrazi can be hard to race and interact with. But that's not quite enough to motivate the maindeck slots..

    Ajani, Wise Counselor is a bit expensive and effects are not that powerful. I still like Ajani, Caller of the Pride better than most alternatives. Comes down t2 [edit: with 5 loyalty], gives +1/+1 counters to counteract sweeper effects, easy to ultimate with game winning ultimate, playable through Gaddock. Still not worth it.
    Last edited by pettdan; 07-21-2018 at 07:08 AM.

  14. #94

    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    No, right, i was referring to Ajani, Adversary of Tyrants, especially the -2 is very strong in our deck i think

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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    Ah there were two Ajanis in the last set, what a surprise.. Well interesting, I don't know, I think coming down one turn earlier maybe makes Caller of the Wild better but the reanimate effect is sweet and double +1/+1 counters is a noticeable improvement. I'm a bit skeptical it will be worth it. There are creatures with similar types of effects and of course they gain so much by being creatures in this deck. What do you think.

    Ah yeah, you basically said what you think. The thing is that Meren is so much better at bringing back creatures.. We could run both. I think I'd rather use Shaman of the Great Hunt, Shalai, Nissa Voice of Zendikar and perhaps Ajani, Caller of the Wild. If playing this new Ajani he needs to fill a certain role in relation to the current meta to be wworth it. Like: a) pressuring slow control decks, b) building stronger board presence vs creature heavy decks, and c) recurring Qasalis vs artifact heavy decks. I don't think we need these effects that bad right now or that they are good enough at it.

  16. #96

    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    1 Forest
    2 Tropical Island
    3 Savannah
    2 Bayou
    1 Tundra
    7 Fetches

    1 Dryad Arbor
    3 Green Sun's Zenith
    2 Noble Hierarch
    3 Birds of Paradise
    2 Scryb Ranger
    4 Fauna Shaman
    4 Aether Vial

    3 Mother of Runes
    2 Leovold, Emissary of Trest
    1 Scavenging Ooze
    1 Orzhov Pontiff
    1 Qasali Pridemage
    1 Spell Queller
    1 Shalai

    2 Decay
    1 Jitte
    4 Brainstorm

    Seems to be the core of the deck, so that leaves 8 flex spots. I did want to ask why you guys like Spell Queller so much. Isn't Sanctum Prelate a bit better? The ability to proactively lock out some decks seems very strong. I don't know if I would skip playing Prelate as this deck, as you can set up some locks with Prelate+Mage/Teeg that are hard to get out of. I probably woudn't skip running Mage either, as he seems very strong. Brightling looks damn good, seems like a real house against fair-decks like Goblins, and it also looks very good against Miracles. Brightling vs TNN are probably fighting for the same spot. Even though Brightling is a house, TNN might just be better.

    As far as StP goes, it is also good against the menace that is Marit Lage, so you have some more reason to run it. I think it's a pretty solid include.

    edit: Why try to jam Force in the SB instead of running some number of Thoughtseize, or Flusterstorms? Being online t0 doesn't seem like the greatest upside.

    edit2: Would a miser Living Wish be good with a 10+ creature SB? Seems like a random 1-off Wish would not be bad at all as this decks SB is chock full of goodies. Also, why no more love for Tradewind? He seems damn good off a Show and Tell, and probably solid against anything as he can bounce lands or permanents. Why not run him over an Elendra?
    Last edited by Kanti; 08-01-2018 at 03:21 AM.

  17. #97
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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    Hello Kanti, much welcome if you're new here! I kind of recognize your username but not sure from which thread.

    I'll provide some feedback here, but remember that the deck sees so little play that nothing is predetermined or to be considered true. That looks like a good starting point for a list yes, but there are different styles of this deck.

    Spell Queller or Sanctum Prelate is a valid question, I tried it because I wanted to try it since it's printing but primarily because Demonic_Pact was putting up results with it. I could see someone trying Prelate over it, for sure. Prelate is a card that comes and goes for me, it seems great and then it didn't do enough and I change it into something else and then after a while it's back again.

    Regarding Brightling or True-Name Nemesis, I don't know really. Brightling can surviev a sweeper and provides lifelink, both are great advantages so I think it's valid to test him over TNN. Vs Miracles Brightling seems quite the MVP, but vs Lands you'd probably rather have TNN since it cannot be unmazed. If you play maindeck FoW's then blue count is obviously a consideration as well.

    StP: it's probably good enough, yes, but it comes with the cost of a lower creature count.

    FoW: This is another card that I change back and forth. When you meet t1 Blood Moon or Belcher, even a t2 Crop Rotation from Lands, you wish you had FoW. It also has utility vs both combo decks and control decks, it's hard to debate its utility. In practice the 1-mana spells are often good enough, like you say. One thing to perhaps consider is that now that Meren gives consistent access to graveyard creatures we have a reliable sorce of card advantage, so we may be able to better afford losing card advantage to FoW in order to secure an advantagous board position from a sweeper or just to protect against Jitte, Goyf, whatever. Well, it's just speculation... But, in a meta where for example Toxic Deluge is played in some very popular deck, the value of having access to FoW probably goes up a lot.

    Wishes: I have experimented with Glittering Wish, I hardly remember why. Wishes slows down the deck and you can't tutor for them with Fauna Shaman, so putting a relevant creature in the maindeck over a Wish is probably the way to go. You can try it of course.

    Tradewind Rider: Is probably not even that great to put in off a Show and Tell, even though that's a good spot to use him, chances are high that they'll put in Omniscience and then cast Emrakul with an extra turn. Tradewind Rider is good, I didn't play him for a few years due to Miracles being a very popular deck. You don't want to play into a sweeper effect, which is a good example of when you do want Glenn Elendra as it has quite the opposite effect when facing a sweeper. You also don't want to go through the effort of establishing control with a Tradewind Rider only to have the opponent drop a TNN and ignore your beautifully advanced game-state (such an interactive, fun card, TNN). Basically, once you have a vial on 4 and an active Fauna Shaman, many games are over because you get to instant speed tutor for Glenn Elendra and counter the next two non-creature spells of your choice. Especially vs combo decks this is basically game over, vs control decks it's very strong. If you instead put in a Tradewind Rider chances are you'll be dead next turn. In order to play Tradewind Rider, you would need to go through the popular decks of the format and decide which he'd be favorable in. Suppose Miracles, Stoneblade, DnT and RUG Delver are popular decks in the meta. I wouldn't really want Tradewind Rider vs any of those.

  18. #98
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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    Hi Kanti, thanks for posting :)

    What you describe as the core of the deck seems fairly accurate. I'd probably leave up even more flex slots, something like
    16 lands
    Arbor
    5 dorks
    3 GSZ
    4 Vial
    4 Brainstorm
    4 Fauna Shaman

    but the creatures you have in addition to these are basically universally run so you're not wrong ;)

    re: specific cards you mentioned, I mostly agree with pettdan but wrote some comments anyway...

    Seems to be the core of the deck, so that leaves 8 flex spots. I did want to ask why you guys like Spell Queller so much. Isn't Sanctum Prelate a bit better? The ability to proactively lock out some decks seems very strong. I don't know if I would skip playing Prelate as this deck, as you can set up some locks with Prelate+Mage/Teeg that are hard to get out of. I probably woudn't skip running Mage either, as he seems very strong.
    I currently run all of these in the main (Queller, Prelate, Teeg and Meddling Mage) as well as 2 additional copies of Prelate in the board...
    Queller gives you the option of playing reactively. This might be a playstyle thing, I do have a tendency to try and play around too many things so whenever I can I postpone decisions as long as I can (i.e. here until my opponent plays a spell)...but in situations where you have active Fauna Shaman and possibly even Aether Vial, you have so many options that you can really benefit from seeing what your opponents move is before choosing your own optimal one. That said, I definitely agree that setting up locks with Prelate/Mage/Teeg/Mom is my gameplan quite frequently so would also argue for the inclusion of those cards. Meddling Mage being the least "core" of all of them due to it only affecting a single card and lots of decks having a variety of removal or otherwise relevant cards...

    Brightling looks damn good, seems like a real house against fair-decks like Goblins, and it also looks very good against Miracles. Brightling vs TNN are probably fighting for the same spot. Even though Brightling is a house, TNN might just be better.
    Still haven't been able to try Brightling. I have some concerns, mainly the amount of white mana you want to sink into it (we don't often have that much W up) and how much mana in general it wants in a deck that doesn't really ever have spare mana due to a rather high mana curve (unless you have a Vial, with Vial Brightling is probably amazing).
    TNN plays some roles that are hard to replace (fogging equipment, attacking through board stalls/Maze of Ith, blocking big things like Angler,...

    As far as StP goes, it is also good against the menace that is Marit Lage, so you have some more reason to run it. I think it's a pretty solid include.
    Definitely a reasonable card. Solves some problems like large creatures (especially colorless ones)...not being a creature is a serious disadvantage to any card in the deck, Vial is the only non-creature I am certain is worth including...and Brainstorm because that's essentially at least one creature. I've considering cutting Decay too, but it's flexibile enough to stay atm (and hits Jitte which is huge)
    Against Marit Lage, getting a flyer and Mom into play is a very reasonable plan.

    edit: Why try to jam Force in the SB instead of running some number of Thoughtseize, or Flusterstorms? Being online t0 doesn't seem like the greatest upside.
    Possibly bias as I died a bunch of times on T0/T1 since the DRS ban but could just be a temporary meta thing or variance...for both TS and Fluster we only have 10-11 lands that cast them (2-3 duals + 10 fetch) which isn't the best odds for T1. Fluster especially requires you leaving up mana all the time in a deck that demands a lot of mana to be spent on your own main phase, especially in the first few turns). Force gives you the zero mana interaction that would fix a few problems the deck has (not interacting before T2, wanting to spend all its mana on its own turn)

    edit2: Would a miser Living Wish be good with a 10+ creature SB? Seems like a random 1-off Wish would not be bad at all as this decks SB is chock full of goodies. Also, why no more love for Tradewind? He seems damn good off a Show and Tell, and probably solid against anything as he can bounce lands or permanents. Why not run him over an Elendra?
    Living Wish sounds kinda clunky but decent. Although it's probably worse than something like the 4th GSZ. Only finding SB creatures is a bit meh as a lot of the toolbox is already in the MD...Living Wish gives you the advantage of effectively extending your toolbox to your sideboard...but in this deck it would also make the toolbox of Fauna/GSZ smaller by a card because it would most likely be displacing a creature.
    Tradewind is super slow. It also requires a board to do anything and if I have a board and can find/play a 4drop, I'm usually happier protecting the board with said 4drop, i.e. Shalai/Glen Elendra. Vs. S&T specifically, I'd rather drop something like Palace Jailer/Gilded Drake or Rec Sage to blow up Omni...

    Current decklist for reference:
    http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=19631&d=325837&f=LE

  19. #99

    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    I think my favorite thing about Prelate so far is that it protects itself. Even if your opponent does have an StP, or Bolt in hand, if they let that thing resolve chances are I am naming 1cc, and then it becomes very hard to get rid of it. Contrast this with having to have a MoM on board to make Spell Queller not become a Remand when it gets blasted off the field. I think TNN fogging Maze, and hitting a Jace no matter what makes it worth it's weight. Brightling looks very cool, but the power to bypass interaction is always nice in a format filled with so much interaction.

    edit: I see no love for Teeg. This deck already feels like it has a lack of GSZ goodies. Hierach, BoP, and Arbor isn't enough, and going Fauna Shaman->hatebear seems meh. t2 Teegs seem rather saucy.

    edit2: I can't help but feel like a Sylvan Library would be very nice somewhere in the MD. It's so damn good for Maverick.

    late edit: Why the love for Brainstorm as a 4-of? I kind of like it, but I can't help but feel the need to cut some non-creature spells to fit in X amount of Thalias, to increase the hate-bear density. The Swords have been MVP's for me so far, so I get nervous cutting them. Testing this creature package with a 2/2/2 split of BS/AD/StP:

    1 Dryad Arbor
    2 Noble Hierarch
    3 Birds of Paradise
    2 Scryb Ranger
    4 Fauna Shaman
    3 Mother of Runes
    3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
    2 Leovold, Emissary of Trest
    1 Gaddock Teeg
    1 Meddling Mage
    1 Scavenging Ooze
    1 Qasali Pridemage
    1 Sanctum Prelate
    1 Orzhov Pontiff
    1 True-Name Nemesis
    1 Shalai, Voice of Plenty
    1 Meren of Clan Nel Toth
    1 Glen Elendra Archmage
    Last edited by Kanti; 08-01-2018 at 01:20 PM.

  20. #100
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    Re: M.O.S.T. - Merieke, Opposition, (Survival), Tradewind Rider

    I agree with your points on Prelate and Teeg.
    I had some amount of issue with Prelate prior to the DRS ban, since there were a lot of 3-4c control decks with removal spells at CMC 1, 2 and 3...yet I still felt it was good enough to play. Now that these decks are mostly gone and we're facing a more streamlined removal suite of mostly Bolts and Swords it should be even better. So I feel the 1 main and 2 side I have are warranted.
    And I do play Teeg ;) I've always played it and can't imagine cutting it. Card is great.

    I have played a copy of Sylvan Library before and it has matchups where it shines and others where it sucks. I currently don't play it, but that seems like a meta call. I feel there's some overlap between what it does and what Brainstorm does for us though and I don't currently miss having it.

    If you've ever played with/against Brainstorm (of course you have ^^) you know how strong of a card it is. Likely the most powerful card in the format. And I have always been of the opinion that it's even better in this deck than almost any other deck in legacy. We have a lot of 1ofs for specific games/situations, thus drawing extra cards and getting rid of cards that don't fit the gamestate is even more powerful here than in most decks. Additionally, we have a very large amount of shuffle effects. 8 fetch, some number of GSZ, Fauna Shaman activations. Obviously the skill ceiling on the card is very high and it only adds more options to the deck which already ends up in tons of situations where you have a very large amount of options and you win/lose by the decisions you make. But that's part of the fun ;)

    That creature suite is very close to mine. You play the 3 Thalias and Meren where I play Queller, Clique, Revoker and Rallier. I can't fault you for your selection, it seems both consistent with a game plan and powerful. Giving up Queller and Clique in one go makes sense as it moves your gameplan (other than vial) entirely to Sorcery speed which usually is better/easier than having a mix of things you want to do and things you want to leave up. I am personally not too keen on Thalia in this deck. It loses quite a bit of its power compared to in Maverick lists as the extra time you get from her disrupting your opponent doesn't translate to a Knight smashing them in the face and isn't combined with Wastelands to really make them feel the tax. But which selection of creatures is better is always playstyle and metagame dependant...

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