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Thread: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

  1. #901
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by tired_papasmurf View Post
    http://www.starcitygames.com/decks/131272

    Got 11th in an SCG Classic running 4/4 Welder/Engineer split feat 4 Astrolabes as Welder food + fixing. Beat 4c Control, Miricles, Grixis Delver, Turbo Depths, Stoneblade, and Infect. Lost to Lands (with a spicy sideboard) and UR Delver. Managed to dodge Chalice decks and SnS, and looking around it seemed like Post was everywhere.

    I'm big on Engineer. It was gas and I felt like it was allowing me to keep threatening to combo way more than before we had it. Recruiting it to get a Grindstone was 👌, and with the full 8 Welders the yard was pretty live. I didnt see any Surgicals all day, so I not sure if they're just low in the meta right now or I got lucky; only gravehate I saw was New Ashiok out of the Stoneblade or Miricles list.

    4 Bolts in the side is very correct imo, especially for Arcanist which just runs a train on whoever's sitting across from it.

    Changes I would have liked to make is go back to 20 lands with +1 Great Furnace (felt like I had very little mana all day) and +1 ETutor (2 felt like too few), not sure what I would want to take out. With 4 Petals, 4 Labes, and 3 Grindstones, I feel like I had just enough cheap artifacts to get the Welders started, I dont know if you should go lower if you're running the full 8.
    Just want to say that I'm a big fan of this list. It does seem from looking at it that it's a bit more all in on combo than normal lists though. Beat down plan looks incredibly weak. I also would be a tad bit worried about grave hate, but I think it's a good list. I like that you get to incorporate an extra moon in the current meta and labe helps you still make white. Good run by you it sounds like though. Interested to hear how some matches played out
    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
    I've been taking shitty brews and tier 2 decks to tournaments and losing with them for years now. Welcome to the club. We meet for cocktails after round 6.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevestamopz View Post
    Top quality german restraint there.

    If I'm at the point where I'm rage quitting, you can bet your kransky that I'm calling everyone involved a cunt.

  2. #902
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Megadeus View Post
    Interested to hear how some matches played out
    Well it's just like you theorized, the deck is much more in on the combo and that's how i won all but 1 game. Whichever deck played the Ashiok against me had me beating down, mostly because I couldn't search my library. I was threatening to combo consistently T3 almost every game, which felt great.

    The Lands player did a great job at controlling the board and an early Tabernacle followed by Loaming + Ghost Quarter really put the breaks on me. He used Crop Rotate into the GQ btw to counter my ETutor for Grindstone, since I needed the red mana more.

    Against UR the Arcanist was disgusting G1 and drew him a bunch of cards and also meant I couldn't play a Welder since he had a bolt in his yard. I feel like you really need to prioritize an answer to Arcanist the most out of the deck, even more than Pizzy probably.

    In the matches I won it was mostly me playing Welder after Welder and eventually getting there. The one W6 out of the 4c deck didnt really do much and I just combo'd T3 or 4. I super lucksacked my way out of the Turbo Depths match though: he T1 on the play Thoughtseized my ETutor and I immediately topdecked the second which got me the Bridge. Grixis Delver matchup was super close where I needed him to fade a bolt for the last two turns or something both games I won; i think the sheer amount of Welders he had to bolt throughout the game might have made a real difference there. Having Engineer's second toughness to block tokens is super relevant btw.

  3. #903
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    @papasmurf: So as you may or may not know I've been tinkering with a snow/astrolabe version of this deck for quite a while now, so I'm keenly interested in your experience with the deck. First, I'm glad that you are having success with the high welder/engineer count; and I totally agree, they are sick when in multiples. If you just play 2-3 total then it's typically easy for your opponent to just keep that threat off the table. But when you play 7-8 then the redundancy makes it very difficult. My only concern is that as people get more access to the newer cards such as W6 and plague engineer, the welders could be hard to keep on the table.
    Also, I'm surprised that you aren't playing any LEDs, especially with 4 Karn in the deck. I do like the increase in blood moon. I'm actually at 3 main now. I think the top 2 decks in the last challenge were both Red stompy, so that tells you how good blood moon is in the current meta (online). I'm also having a difficult time completely getting off smuggler's copter and am still at 2. Did you miss that card at all? I would consider going to 1 so you could potentially find it with tutor or engineer when needed. I am also at 2 e.tutor again. With 3 blood moon main it doesn't feel as important. Although I do miss the 3rd one against fast combo where you really want canonist early. I do agree that 20 land is where this deck needs to be, especially if you are running 4 x karn (which I also think is right). Also, you thought a full play-set of astrolabe was where to be huh? That seems excessive but I do agree that it is good welder food; and the card advantage that you can generate by welding them in and out can certainly add up.

    Anyway, nice to see this version of the deck do well. Looking forward to hearing more about your experience.

    p.s. also no e.e or ratchet bomb in the 75? Did you ever use the needle?

  4. #904
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by drude1 View Post
    newer cards such as W6 and plague engineer, the welders could be hard to keep on the table.
    I agree, though with this specific build it's just the Welder that eats it to those cards, Painter and Engineer don't really care. Plus against the W6 decks I imagine I'm bringing in some number of Bolts anyway, so I might be able to deal with it or the Plague.

    Quote Originally Posted by drude1 View Post
    I'm surprised that you aren't playing any LEDs
    Would you be as surprised when I remind you that they're $200? I got to the tournament early to talk myself into buying one, but it didn't work. After this tournament I'm definitely gonna pull the trigger on at least one. There was a game where I directly lost because I couldn't Karn for an LED to empty my hand for Bridge, so if you own them you absolutely 100% be playing 1 main and 1 side.

    Quote Originally Posted by drude1 View Post
    I'm also having a difficult time completely getting off smuggler's copter and am still at 2. Did you miss that card at all?
    Never at all during the day did I find myself wishing I had a Coptor. Plenty of times I found myself wishing I had some kind of free discard effect. At least with this build, the Coptor would probably be crewed by a Welder, but at that point the Welder is tapped and I can't use it to immediately get what I pitched. But if I could just selectively pitch cards without tapping my Welders then we're on a cruise. If they printed an Astrolabe that looted instead of color fixed, I'd love that.

    Aside from just the tapping creatures thing, my games were almost all finished in the early turns. With Engineers, Recruiters, Tutors, and Karns, I was comboing so quick and using almost all my mana every turn that I can't imagine when I would have cast a Coptor. It definitely seems like that card would bring the speed way down.

    Quote Originally Posted by drude1 View Post
    Also, you thought a full play-set of astrolabe was where to be huh? That seems excessive but I do agree that it is good welder food; and the card advantage that you can generate by welding them in and out can certainly add up
    The whole day I only got to Weld out and back in a single Labe once for a card draw, usually because if the Welders were turned on I was just winning at that point. The welder-food that replaces itself I think is most important, followed by color fixing. There were a bunch of times where I was relying on Petal as my only artifact to start Welding things back. I wouldn't want to go lower than the 8 <1 CMC artifacts I had. They're not great in multiples, but they at least cantrip. I always wanted to see at least one during every game, to either have a good Weld target or to color fix.

    Quote Originally Posted by drude1 View Post
    p.s. also no e.e or ratchet bomb in the 75? Did you ever use the needle?
    I brought the Needle onto the maindeck for any deck that looked like it had Walkers (W6, Jace, etc) and also for the Lands-related decks (Lands, Turbo). I never drew it though. The EE/Bomb choice was me seeing how much I could rely on Karn to clear out the Chalices, but I could probably put an EE back on the side. Changes to the side I'll probably make is -1 Wurmcoil +1 LED, -1 Grafdiggers +1 EE. I know that the second I take off Cage I'll start getting paired against Dredge, Reanimator, etc Į\_(ツ)_/Į

  5. #905

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Has anyone recently experimented with Prismatic Vista and basic Plains in the manabase? I used to dislike Plains in the deck, but now between Arid Mesa and Prismatic Vista I believe we have enough "on-color" fetchlands to support it. If we are going to lean more on Blood Moon, it should work well - I firmly believe Blood Moon is the way to go now with Wrenn and Six everywhere (I am now on two but will be going up to three copies).

  6. #906

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Unfortunately, Iíve been trying 4 arid Mesa, 2 red fetch, 4 snow mountains and 1 snow plains, 2 plateau, and have never really thought about the vista. It seems good though; but feels a bit silly when Iíve a tutor and engineer in hand, and only 1 vista as a red/white source.

    On the other hand, with 4 astrolabes, I can see it being better than red fetches.




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    Legacy decks: mono U painter, strawberry shortcake, imperial painter, solidarity, burn
    EDH decks: zedruu voltron, rakdos the defiler, persistent petitioners, blind seer

  7. #907
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    I like the thought of basic plains, especially with Astrolabes, but I don't know if I'd rather have Vista over random red fetch next to 4 Mesa. With so many hands that want red and white but you're on like fetch + tomb as your only lands I think you need to be able to get Plateau
    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
    I've been taking shitty brews and tier 2 decks to tournaments and losing with them for years now. Welcome to the club. We meet for cocktails after round 6.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevestamopz View Post
    Top quality german restraint there.

    If I'm at the point where I'm rage quitting, you can bet your kransky that I'm calling everyone involved a cunt.

  8. #908

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    What do these 3-Moon, 20-land, 4-Karn, Astrolabe-Snow versions look like? Seems like a tight squeeze for slots, especially if youíre upping the Goblin count. (Thatís not doubting it works; just not seeing where all the cuts are.)

  9. #909

    [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    If youíre going with 4 astrolabes, you need only 19 lands. They cantrip, Fox colours, and with the London mulligan, itís probably the way to go.

    All the cuts are all the silver bullets, shaving a tutor. So only 1 canonist and 1 bridge main. Dropping the revoker, cratermakers, or whatever youíd have as 1-of targets.

    The aim is to be less grindy, and to be a lot more combo-tastic.



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  10. #910
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by schweinefettmann View Post
    If youíre going with 4 astrolabes, you need only 19 lands.
    I think that you need 20 lands even with 4 Astrolabes. 4 Karn and 4 Engineer (that red mana activation is real sometimes) means that you are fine at 3 mana, but you really want to get to 4, if not 6.

  11. #911
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Went 3-1 tonight with Snowcake with 3 Blood Moon main. I think I used Astrolabe to filter once. I did get a turn where I got to break petal for Mana, weld away an Astrolabe for petal, them weld Astrolabe for Astrolabe to draw a card and get an engine going. It was pretty sweet. Beat Eldrazi (painter stopping Eldrazi lands is so nuts), RUG Delver, lost to Aggro Loam (game 3 I got moon against his W6 but couldn't find 4th land for Karn in 7 turns and he got to ultimate), and then beat soldier stompy. Soldier Stompy Painter being a 1/3 was so sick to block his Thalia, bolt his Daru Warchief, and crack back to get monarch and my engineer back. Deck felt solid. Karn is certified nuts. Killed a chrome Mox and I think 4 Chalices tonight.

    This was list fwiw. Kind of thrown together last minute

    Snowcake:

    Maindeck (60)
    4 Goblin Welder
    1 Ethersworn Canonist
    3 Goblin Engineer
    4 Painter's Servant
    3 Imperial Recruiter
    1 Simian Spirit Guide
    3 Karn, the Great Creator
    2 Enlightened Tutor
    4 Pyroblast
    1 Red Elemental Blast
    4 Lotus Petal
    3 Grindstone
    3 Arcum's Astrolabe
    1 Smuggler's Copter
    1 Ensnaring Bridge
    3 Blood Moon
    4 Ancient Tomb
    1 Bloodstained Mire
    3 City of Traitors
    2 Plateau
    5 Snow-Covered Mountain
    4 Wooded Foothills

    Sideboard (15)
    1 Walking Ballista
    2 Ethersworn Canonist
    3 Lightning Bolt
    1 Surgical Extraction
    1 Abrade
    2 Tormod's Crypt
    1 Grindstone
    1 Pithing Needle
    1 Relic of Progenitus
    1 Ensnaring Bridge
    1 Mycosynth Lattice
    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
    I've been taking shitty brews and tier 2 decks to tournaments and losing with them for years now. Welcome to the club. We meet for cocktails after round 6.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevestamopz View Post
    Top quality german restraint there.

    If I'm at the point where I'm rage quitting, you can bet your kransky that I'm calling everyone involved a cunt.

  12. #912

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    @megadeus: Good job! I like the direction your and other lists have been taking (Arcum's Astrolabe, more Blood Moons and a stronger combo-centric focus).

    I wonder how the single copy of Smuggler's Copter worked for you? One copy feels like a strange number to me - too unreliable to draw, while also hardly a silver bullet (I cannot imagine tutoring for this card). I am now starting to think we do not need the Copter in these builds as the Arcum's Astrolabes countrip by themselves and with 6 or 7 welders give us card advantage as well, effectively replacing Copter's looting effect. The only difficulty I am having in fully letting the Copter go are the Leylines of the Void in the sideboard. They have been great for me against any W6 deck, Reanimator or even AK Miracles and I want to keep them, they just feel even better when you have an outlet to get rid of redundant copies...

  13. #913
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by peko View Post
    @megadeus: Good job! I like the direction your and other lists have been taking (Arcum's Astrolabe, more Blood Moons and a stronger combo-centric focus).

    I wonder how the single copy of Smuggler's Copter worked for you? One copy feels like a strange number to me - too unreliable to draw, while also hardly a silver bullet (I cannot imagine tutoring for this card). I am now starting to think we do not need the Copter in these builds as the Arcum's Astrolabes countrip by themselves and with 6 or 7 welders give us card advantage as well, effectively replacing Copter's looting effect. The only difficulty I am having in fully letting the Copter go are the Leylines of the Void in the sideboard. They have been great for me against any W6 deck, Reanimator or even AK Miracles and I want to keep them, they just feel even better when you have an outlet to get rid of redundant copies...
    Honestly I only saw it once and that was to bin it with engineer. I definitely can see why this version would want 4 Karn because the main beat down plan is much worse with less Copter. Also I played against 3 chalice decks so last night may have just been an anomaly. Just having essentially an alternate win condition is nice. And yeah I've never played leyline, but I've been seriously debating it recently as like a 2-3 of for all the reasons listed above. I could see skimming the Karn wish board a bit and playing them
    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
    I've been taking shitty brews and tier 2 decks to tournaments and losing with them for years now. Welcome to the club. We meet for cocktails after round 6.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevestamopz View Post
    Top quality german restraint there.

    If I'm at the point where I'm rage quitting, you can bet your kransky that I'm calling everyone involved a cunt.

  14. #914

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    How is 8 welders going against gy hate?

  15. #915
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Daize View Post
    How is 8 welders going against gy hate?
    Probably sucks cause you now have 8 cards that just anemically beat instead of tutoring and providing redundancy. But aside from making 8 cards worse, you're just on the normal Painter plan then of topdecking the Grindstone/Karn/ETutor, which obviously might just get there anyway.
    Last edited by tired_papasmurf; 07-26-2019 at 11:18 AM. Reason: typo

  16. #916
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by tired_papasmurf View Post
    Probably sucks cause you now have 8 cards that just anemically beat instead of tutoring and providing redundancy. But aside from making 8 cards worse, you're just on the normal Painter plan then of topdecking the Grindstone/Karn/ETutor, which obviously might just get there anyway.
    Yeah I mean you still have plenty of ways to just find your pieces. I think grave hate is less problematic than just making your plan B of beat down weaker. That's my problem with the 7-8 welder plan personally
    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
    I've been taking shitty brews and tier 2 decks to tournaments and losing with them for years now. Welcome to the club. We meet for cocktails after round 6.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevestamopz View Post
    Top quality german restraint there.

    If I'm at the point where I'm rage quitting, you can bet your kransky that I'm calling everyone involved a cunt.

  17. #917
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    I think it also depends on the grave hate. Surgical or crypt type effects aren't a problem because you can usually get more than one goblin going and you can just out maneuver those cards. Cards like leyline are obviously more problematic so you either play around that type of hate or get rid of it first. And like everyone else is saying you still have recruiters, e.tutor and Karn to find pieces as well. The goblins are just insurance. If our opponents are diluting their deck with all sorts of grave hate I'm totally fine with that.

  18. #918
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by drude1 View Post
    I think it also depends on the grave hate. Surgical or crypt type effects aren't a problem because you can usually get more than one goblin going and you can just out maneuver those cards. Cards like leyline are obviously more problematic so you either play around that type of hate or get rid of it first. And like everyone else is saying you still have recruiters, e.tutor and Karn to find pieces as well. The goblins are just insurance. If our opponents are diluting their deck with all sorts of grave hate I'm totally fine with that.
    And Karn can get surgical pieces back too. Grave hate can certainly be annoying, but it's pretty nice when your opponent over boards and then you just kill them anyway
    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cheese View Post
    I've been taking shitty brews and tier 2 decks to tournaments and losing with them for years now. Welcome to the club. We meet for cocktails after round 6.
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevestamopz View Post
    Top quality german restraint there.

    If I'm at the point where I'm rage quitting, you can bet your kransky that I'm calling everyone involved a cunt.

  19. #919
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Every time I play against KCommand decks, I end up totally frazzled. How do I handle hyper removal on top of normal Legacy power? My only guesses are a 4th Karn or a Ichor Wellspring from the SB. Neither see much acceptance. Is there another solution?
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    Every time someone drops a Chalice against me I think of the Family Guy episode where the guy in jail stabs himself with the knife to see how it feels and then he says, "My God! Is this what I've been doing to people? I belong in here!"
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  20. #920
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    @MirrisLegend: early Blood Moon worked well for me the last two times I played against Grixis Control, nb this was a few months ago. I play a Karn SoU and I expect it to be great in this matchup, the more the better, and that's in addition to 4 Great Creators. You could also experiment with RiP Helm, perhaps.

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