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Thread: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

  1. #321
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Megadeus View Post
    Maybe it's been discussed and tried already, but what about some number of Experimental Frenzy? It's great with ETutor and this deck has the mana to play it quickly if need be. I could see a 4 Welder version with Maybe a number of LED to make it even better. Also the deck has a decent amount of shuffle effects/copter to loot and try again for a new top card. It can't win on its own like a 4 mana walker, but it feels like it might warrant consideration
    I agree, I suggested it in the Discord a while ago. It doesn't play so well with Recruiter, but better with Ballista (can cast it for 0 if you're digging for other cards) and as you say E Tutor and LED. It would be nice to get som Mox Opals in too but that may be too hard to make work.. At least it changes the deck a lot. I tried one copy of Frenzy once at the LGS but never drew it in the matchups where it would have mattered. I'll surely try it again, here or in Grixis. It is a shame it doesn't work with Auriok Salvagers / Bomberman though..
    Last edited by pettdan; 11-29-2018 at 12:42 PM.
    Currently playing/brewing: Painter, Tezzeret, Bomberman, Planeswalker Nic Fit, Bizarro Stormy, MOST and then some.

  2. #322

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Mirrislegend View Post
    How well does this deck handle budget restrictions? I own one Plateau and zero City of Traitors, but everything else is manageable. I have a feeling the missing Plateaus will be okay, but the City of Traitors seem pretty critical to many lines of play.

    Is it worth playing the deck without City or should I stick to other decks until I can skip enough meals to buy Cities of the Traitorous variety?
    I'm in the exact same position. At the moment I'm using sacred foundry as a replacement plateau and a pair of crystal veins. They both feel pretty bad, but they do a passable imitation on critical turns

  3. #323
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Kap'n Cook View Post
    The deck will work, it just won't be as fast. The 4th city has never felt too necessary as you only really want one and double city hands are usually mulls unless they have the combo or fast mana. Additional white sources come up a decent amount too as a lot of times you just have to fetch white into Wasteland to tutor. The third was only added recently, so two plateau should be okay. You can't run hedge-mage without two or three though. If you aren't going to run cities, maybe you can get away with a plains, although everyone here knows my feelings about a plains as one of the 19 mainboard lands lol


    Over the last two months since Baltimore I've only been able to play about 30-ish matches (2 challenges, 3 leagues, 1 monthly maybe?). The results have been bad, losing probably half of the games. Granted, it is a small sample size, but the losses have been a combination of testing different boards with weird cards, playing really poorly, and even a feeling of unluckiness in close game 3s. I've punted a lot, and in general am still learning a lot about Copter and how strange it makes the lines. Either way, I'll just post what I am planning to test more in depth moving forward and thoughts.


    4 Ancient Tomb
    3 City of Traitors
    3 Plateau
    3 Mountain
    1 Great Furnace
    2 Wooded Foothills
    3 Bloodstained Mire

    4 Lotus Petal
    1 Simian Spirit Guide

    4 Imperial Recruiter
    4 Painter's Servant
    3 Goblin Welder
    3 Ethersworn Canonist
    1 Walking Ballista
    1 Goblin Cratermaker

    4 Grindstone
    4 Smuggler's Copter

    1 Ensnaring Bridge
    1 Engineered Explosives
    1 Blood Moon

    3 Enlightened Tutor
    4 Pyroblast
    2 Red Elemental Blast


    Sideboard:

    4 Surgical Extraction
    1 Tormod's Crypt
    1 Containment Priest
    1 Duergar Hedge-Mage
    1 Ethersworn Canonist
    2 Sulfur Elemental
    1 Blood Moon
    2 Red Elemental Blast
    2 Karn, Scion of Urza


    Surgical has been very good, as the graveyard decks are just too fast now. I wish I could just jam 4 Rest in Peace and a Helm as that would make the Grixis matchup a bye, but Reanimator being Black-Red instead of Black-Blue means there isn't enough time and blasts can't delay careful studies. Surgical keeps us alive just often enough against Reanimator and Dredge to find the Crypt or Priest. More importantly, Surgical gives us more viable alternatives to fighting Show and Tell and Miracles, which is another reason I wanted to max out the blasts. I have also experimented with starting to bring some in against grixis, as you will probably get two for one'd by the first k-command, but removing that with Surgical lets you fight the Snapcasters more readily through normal blasts and canonists, and lets you try to trade 1 for 1 long enough to win. Again, it's been a really small sample size, but it has felt a little bit better recently. As for boarding against these control decks, I have been chopping all petals/tutors, and usually don't even bother with trying to Blood Moon them anymore. Play/draw there could be an argument to switching slightly, but on the whole this has been the plan.

    Sulfur Elemental. Initially I was running all the pyroclasms (and was going to consider whipflare eventually), but DnT has felt very winnable without them. The hope was that there would be more random creature decks popping up with the bannings, but since then it has settled into the usual Miracles/Chalice/Ape Combo meta we all expected. I'm really not sure what Wizards thought would happen when they banned Top. So as the pyroclasm numbers went lower after cratermaker got a spot, I tried two Swords to Plowshares, for cross-hate against Reanimator/Shadow/Goyf/Angler, but then got ran over by Mentor tokens enough to want to switch back to Sulfur. It's also just a generally good anti-control card and can crew at instant speed, which isn't nothing. Obviously there can be the random blowouts against off-beat decks where you name white with Painter too. I do worry about the Elves/Infect matchups by dropping Swords/Clasms/Bolts/etc, but those matchups have always felt very coin-flippy regardless of what build you run, and the hope is that 4 Canonist can slow them down enough to do your thing. At the end of the day, Mentor and DnT are more likely to show up, where Sulfur is much better, than these other small creature decks, so I am okay with taking the hit there.

    Hedge-Mage, Moon and Karn. These are the two flex spots I guess. The second moon is mainly for lands/loam/post and random monstrosities, since there are usually ways to destroy the first one. Having the backup copy has been just good enough, and if you ever want to play roulette against some of these three color decks you can always just board the second in on the play with all the fast mana and all the tutors to try to land one on turn 1 or likely turn 2. Hedge mage is back mostly for counterbalance and chalice, as having the etb ability complements Cratermaker and EE nicely. It also gives you a varied mana curve against Chalice. Plus you might just blowout Omni or sneak one out of every 20 games. Revoker could be here too if sneak attack is too prevalent, but I don't think it does enough outside of that matchup, as ANT is very favorable now anyways. For Karn, I just keep coming back to him. Like Dan said, he is just raw card advantage and will take over the game if allowed to live. It really does feel like the best card available that leverages the other shitty 73 cards we have to play.


    Anyways, this list is more defined in what it wants to fight, mainly snapcaster and combo. It definitely gives up percentages against the middle tier stuff like shadow and chalice, but the hope is that we have enough to navigate those matchups as it is. As always, thoughts appreciated.

    -jack
    So a couple things....

    First, do you really think RiP/helm is that strong against grixis? Is that just because they have essentially no answer to enchantments? What about leyline/helm then? What if you were playing black? I keep going back and forth on this. Leylines are obviously fast enough vs the graveyard decks as long as they are in your opening hand. Then the only issue is are surgicals that important in other match ups such as miracles.
    Speaking of which, given how much you are on sulfur elemental, if you were playing black would you play dread of night?

    A couple more observations...
    I think leyline of sanctity is playable online. It's iffy but I've been seeing a ton of discard centric decks online lately. Thoughtseize is everywhere. Leyline is actually pretty good against grixis. I would not bring them to a paper tourney though.
    I also think sphere of law is playable. This is mostly due to the mono red stompy and goblin match ups. Stompy in particular seems to really be gaining popularity again.
    And finally, I am admittedly on the bandwagon of only running 1 blood moon main and therefore cut one petal for the twentieth land. I am still definitely running more moons in the board though, for the exact reasons Jack mentioned. And I actually still hold it as a priority in the grixis and bug control match ups. And as you can probably tell, I am still splashing black for daretti.

    Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

  4. #324
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by drude1 View Post
    So a couple things....

    First, do you really think RiP/helm is that strong against grixis? Is that just because they have essentially no answer to enchantments? What about leyline/helm then? What if you were playing black? I keep going back and forth on this. Leylines are obviously fast enough vs the graveyard decks as long as they are in your opening hand. Then the only issue is are surgicals that important in other match ups such as miracles.
    Speaking of which, given how much you are on sulfur elemental, if you were playing black would you play dread of night?

    A couple more observations...
    I think leyline of sanctity is playable online. It's iffy but I've been seeing a ton of discard centric decks online lately. Thoughtseize is everywhere. Leyline is actually pretty good against grixis. I would not bring them to a paper tourney though.
    I also think sphere of law is playable. This is mostly due to the mono red stompy and goblin match ups. Stompy in particular seems to really be gaining popularity again.
    And finally, I am admittedly on the bandwagon of only running 1 blood moon main and therefore cut one petal for the twentieth land. I am still definitely running more moons in the board though, for the exact reasons Jack mentioned. And I actually still hold it as a priority in the grixis and bug control match ups. And as you can probably tell, I am still splashing black for daretti.

    Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

    Grixis feels like a Blue Jund deck of the previous meta, where instead of Bloodbraid cascading into decay/bolt/hymn it's snapcaster, and angler/goyf. I haven't played any RIPs so this idea is basically just theory, but RIP answers their biggest beater by making it uncastable, and after taking care of snapcaster you can start trying to trade 1 for 1 with blasts/removal, and gives you an autowin with etutor when the game goes long. Welders would probably need to be boarded down to 1 though in this case, which is another weird thing to consider.


    Leylines are definitely the very best hate, but my main question would be the manabase. I would think since we are a sol land/petal deck, we can reasonably expect to hardcast drawn leylines turn 2 or 3. But does that mean playing a Scrubland and 2 Badlands on top of Plateaus and basics? I wouldn't really know where to start on a list along those lines, but what is your most recent list? Curious of a few things.

    For dread of night, how often are you using it for painter name white against stuff like elves or infect? Seems worse than sulfur against Mentor since its not a threat on its own/copterable, although better against DnT being tutorable and cheap. Leads to the scrubland question again. Are you playing an Engineered Plague?
    Last edited by Kap'n Cook; 12-01-2018 at 10:54 AM.
    Strawberry Shortcake

    http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...erry-Shortcake

    What a brainstorm do? Draw card and activate on draw effects fix hand, removing woods
    #FreeNedleeds

  5. #325
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Our combo plan, in game 1, is completely dead against Sneak and Show or any variant that plays original Emrakul, right? I just want to be certain.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tacosnape
    <Dallieza> your mom uses the stack
    <System> Player Lost
    Quote Originally Posted by Tacosnape
    Every time someone drops a Chalice against me I think of the Family Guy episode where the guy in jail stabs himself with the knife to see how it feels and then he says, "My God! Is this what I've been doing to people? I belong in here!"
    Referring to the art on Stasis:
    Quote Originally Posted by Pinder View Post
    Well, uh...the mime, you see, is....um...

    God, is that furry bondage?

  6. #326

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    If I ran Leyline, I would run some Chrome Moxen. Not only can you imprint them (non-artifact or land, of course) with Painter in play and gain speed like you would with Lotus Petal, but Leyline doesn't become an entirely dead draw should you choose to play it in your sideboard.
    When youíre down and out, and there seems no hope at all
    But if you just believe, thereís no way we can fall.

  7. #327
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Keller View Post
    If I ran Leyline, I would run some Chrome Moxen. Not only can you imprint them (non-artifact or land, of course) with Painter in play and gain speed like you would with Lotus Petal, but Leyline doesn't become an entirely dead draw should you choose to play it in your sideboard.
    If painter is out and you imprint Leyline does the mox add blue? Does painter work on exiled cardscards?
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    I've been taking shitty brews and tier 2 decks to tournaments and losing with them for years now. Welcome to the club. We meet for cocktails after round 6.
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    Top quality german restraint there.

    If I'm at the point where I'm rage quitting, you can bet your kransky that I'm calling everyone involved a cunt.

  8. #328

    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Megadeus View Post
    If painter is out and you imprint Leyline does the mox add blue? Does painter work on exiled cardscards?
    Yup, it will work. In the short lived splash for intuition version this was a cool detail of playing chrome Mox.

    And yes the combo does not work game 1 vs sneak and show, probably not game 2 and 3 either lol. I board out all but one grindstone and stick to the beatdown plan. Might not be right but it always seems easier than the three card combo. The good thing is that if you resolve bridge game 1 they usually donít have an answer for it unless itís a wish version. Iíll play against sneak and show all day over grixis control though. That matchup has just been terrible. Iíve been away from Mtgo for awhile and Iím hoping it has taken a down turn.

  9. #329
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by SDBobPlissken View Post
    Yup, it will work. In the short lived splash for intuition version this was a cool detail of playing chrome Mox.

    And yes the combo does not work game 1 vs sneak and show, probably not game 2 and 3 either lol. I board out all but one grindstone and stick to the beatdown plan. Might not be right but it always seems easier than the three card combo. The good thing is that if you resolve bridge game 1 they usually donít have an answer for it unless itís a wish version. Iíll play against sneak and show all day over grixis control though. That matchup has just been terrible. Iíve been away from Mtgo for awhile and Iím hoping it has taken a down turn.
    So does SnT join Eldrazi and Depths as the primary reasons for more than 1 Bridge in the 75?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tacosnape
    <Dallieza> your mom uses the stack
    <System> Player Lost
    Quote Originally Posted by Tacosnape
    Every time someone drops a Chalice against me I think of the Family Guy episode where the guy in jail stabs himself with the knife to see how it feels and then he says, "My God! Is this what I've been doing to people? I belong in here!"
    Referring to the art on Stasis:
    Quote Originally Posted by Pinder View Post
    Well, uh...the mime, you see, is....um...

    God, is that furry bondage?

  10. #330
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Mirrislegend View Post
    So does SnT join Eldrazi and Depths as the primary reasons for more than 1 Bridge in the 75?
    I haven't found the need for more than 1 Bridge in the SnT or Eldrazi matchups (especially Eldrazi since Moon and Painter mess with their mana heavily), but it might be a consideration for Depths, since they can usually remove your Bridge.

    I've been considering a 2nd Bridge mostly because I've found people to be dusting off their Death's Shadows again online. Maybe I'll give Meekstone a go instead.

    Also, I guess I forgot to post this here (what I've been working on putting back together in paper since I quit the deck post-Top-ban):







    Still need to find JPN Portal Pyroclasms that aren't insanely expensive (for a Pyroclasm).

  11. #331
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Holy shit that's gorgeous.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tacosnape
    <Dallieza> your mom uses the stack
    <System> Player Lost
    Quote Originally Posted by Tacosnape
    Every time someone drops a Chalice against me I think of the Family Guy episode where the guy in jail stabs himself with the knife to see how it feels and then he says, "My God! Is this what I've been doing to people? I belong in here!"
    Referring to the art on Stasis:
    Quote Originally Posted by Pinder View Post
    Well, uh...the mime, you see, is....um...

    God, is that furry bondage?

  12. #332
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by 8bit9mm View Post
    Also, I guess I forgot to post this here (what I've been working on putting back together in paper since I quit the deck post-Top-ban):

    Needs a playmat upgrade asap haha
    Strawberry Shortcake

    http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...erry-Shortcake

    What a brainstorm do? Draw card and activate on draw effects fix hand, removing woods
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  13. #333
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Kap'n Cook View Post
    Needs a playmat upgrade asap haha
    Well, I did pick up this one recently:



    I've also got the Unlimited art Plateau mat as well.

  14. #334
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Went 5-2 in the challenge this past Sunday. I beat DnT, 5c Humans, Mentor-Bomberman, Black Reanimator, and Smalldrazi, while losing to Miracles and Show and Tell. The list I played is the same one I posted earlier, although I switched the sideboard blood moon for a revoker, solely for Sneak Attack. I still used Sulfur Elementals, which helped vs the mentor deck, but I am still going back and forth on it vs pyroclasm. I guess the answer is that neither are amazing, and it's just a hedge against what you expect to play and want more help with. I probably will switch up more of the numbers/sideboard moving forward, I just don't know what should be in there. For show and tell, I don't think it matters. The matchup is just horrible and I am not sure if its even worth adding in more pieces beyond the canonist-blast plan.

    At the end of the day, all you can really do is just thank Aaron Forsythe for keeping the fun stuff in the format like Counterbalance and Omniscience. Top was definitely the card sucking the life out of legacy.
    Strawberry Shortcake

    http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...erry-Shortcake

    What a brainstorm do? Draw card and activate on draw effects fix hand, removing woods
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  15. #335
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    So i had a quick question, when did this deck go away from Viashino Heretic as its maindeck answer to chalice?
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  16. #336
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by merfolkotpt View Post
    So i had a quick question, when did this deck go away from Viashino Heretic as its maindeck answer to chalice?

    My thinking was that Cratermaker provides enough random incidental value in being able to shoot creatures/emrakul while still killing chalice and without needing to live a turn too. Granted, Painter messes with your ability to do that every so often which can cost you games. I wouldn't really fault anyone for wanting the heretic over it either, just depends on what you want to fight harder.
    Strawberry Shortcake

    http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...erry-Shortcake

    What a brainstorm do? Draw card and activate on draw effects fix hand, removing woods
    #FreeNedleeds

  17. #337
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    I'm going over the Matchups summary on the first page and I'm asking myself the same question over and over:

    Against Grixis Control, could we again name White with Painter and bring in Sulfur Elemental? Increasing the power on Gurmag Angler sucks, but removing Strix and Snap as blockers seems very valuable (despite allowing for K Command to reuse the now dead value creatures).

    Against Grixis Pyromancer, the same plan kills off Pyromancer, his tokens, and True Name Nemesis.

    Naming White and bringing in Sulfur Elemental robs us of Welder utility. Is it worth the price to hold down opponents' threats? If not, in which matchups is Painter on White + Sulfur Elemental worthwhile?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tacosnape
    <Dallieza> your mom uses the stack
    <System> Player Lost
    Quote Originally Posted by Tacosnape
    Every time someone drops a Chalice against me I think of the Family Guy episode where the guy in jail stabs himself with the knife to see how it feels and then he says, "My God! Is this what I've been doing to people? I belong in here!"
    Referring to the art on Stasis:
    Quote Originally Posted by Pinder View Post
    Well, uh...the mime, you see, is....um...

    God, is that furry bondage?

  18. #338
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Mirrislegend View Post
    I'm going over the Matchups summary on the first page and I'm asking myself the same question over and over:

    Why name Black with Painter against Miracles? Naming White allows Sulfur Elemental to kill their Mentor tokens.

    Against Grixis Control, could we again name White for the same reason? Increasing the power on Gurmag Angler sucks, but removing Strix and Snap blockers seems very valuable (despite allowing for K Command to reuse the now dead value creatures).

    Against Grixis Pyromancer, the same plan kills off Pyromancer, his tokens, and True Name Nemesis.

    Naming White and bringing in Sulfur Elemental robs us of Welder utility. Is it worth the price to hold down opponents' threats? If not, in which matchups is Painter on White + Sulfur Elemental worthwhile?
    To the first one, it still kills mentor tokens right?

    For the others i think against blue deck, personally, I would rather have the live welder?

    It is SUPER good against elves.
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  19. #339
    Victory Dance ftw?
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by merfolkotpt View Post
    To the first one, it still kills mentor tokens right?
    Doh. Yes. I'll fix that.

    Quote Originally Posted by merfolkotpt View Post
    For the others i think against blue deck, personally, I would rather have the live welder?
    Even against Miracles, where important artifacts are much less likely to end up in the graveyard when they are answered?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tacosnape
    <Dallieza> your mom uses the stack
    <System> Player Lost
    Quote Originally Posted by Tacosnape
    Every time someone drops a Chalice against me I think of the Family Guy episode where the guy in jail stabs himself with the knife to see how it feels and then he says, "My God! Is this what I've been doing to people? I belong in here!"
    Referring to the art on Stasis:
    Quote Originally Posted by Pinder View Post
    Well, uh...the mime, you see, is....um...

    God, is that furry bondage?

  20. #340
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    Re: [Deck] Strawberry Shortcake

    Quote Originally Posted by Mirrislegend View Post
    Even against Miracles, where important artifacts are much less likely to end up in the graveyard when they are answered?
    You wouldn't name white against Miracles anyways.
    I feel that Miracles is actually favored for us now, but one of the ways they can really climb out of the hole against us is with Mentor.
    Everything else that matters out of them gets answered by our 6+ blasts.

    Plus, bringing in extra bodies against Miracles is just a good idea anyways.

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